Should we de-fund/abolish the police?

[EyeBRollin]

The blacks as a community too need to change and adjust their ways, its not a one way street that expects other races to pick up their slack.

It takes both hands to clap.

Black people hold no responsibility for the racial situation in the United States. It’s a topic you know nothing about, so let’s move on and leave it at that.

 

[zekko]

Black people hold no responsibility for the racial situation in the United States. It’s a topic you know nothing about, so let’s move on and leave it at that.

Unfortunately, I think there is a bit of a feedback loop going on. Black people certainly didn't start it, but racism breeds resentment, suspiciousness, hatred for the police, glorification of the thug culture - which encourages stereotypes and racial profiling, which creates more anger, hatred and resentment - which encourages more stereotyping and racial profiling, etc. etc.

 

[Xenom0rph]

Gents, let's keep things civil. This is an important discussion. There are strong emotions on all sides but reason must prevail.

I actually understand and sympathize with anger in the Black community because (real talk) historically Black folks have always been exploited whether it be the Arab slave traders that sold African slaves to Europeans, or the Chinese pillaging Africa's resources and imposing Debt Colonialism, or appropriation of Black music, culture and athletics to enrich the entertainment industry etc.... I get it......

But to say that Blacks are somehow absolved of all responsibility is asinine....how does anyone rationalize that Blacks engaging in rioting and looting businesses that were unrelated to George Floyd is somehow excusable and that accountability does not apply?

 

[Xenom0rph]

The third paragraph got you out of orbit, but cultural appropriation? Really? If it weren't for stupid White teens buying their albums, most rappers would still be on their knees hustling in a dark alley, in some de-industrialized shiithole. As far as history goes, my sympathy for the ancestors of rioting, looting mobs doesn't translate to their absolution. Fuuck those entitled punks.

My man, that was the message I was trying to say: anger doesn't absolve anyone of accountability for their actions. It is inexcusable to burn down businesses (that were already suffering due to COVID19) unrelated to George Floyd.

But having lived in Cali my whole life, and being around a lot of Black folks, I've come to learn that the word "accountability" elicits angry emotions amongst Black folks the same way the n-word elicits anger emotions.

Therefore, IMHO, civility is of the utmost importance when discussing the issue of accountability with the Black community otherwise it would just descend into emotional bickering and all constructive dialog breaks down.

 

[zekko]

I've come to learn that the word "accountability" elicits angry emotions amongst Black folks the same way the n-word elicits anger emotions.

Yeah, suggesting that minorities are responsible for the prejudice against them does not seem like the way toward a healthy dialogue. People in general do not like to be told they are responsible for the world's ills, including white people. Although some people eat it up, like these people:

I know I sleep better knowing that these celebrities are keeping watch.

 

[Xenom0rph]

That reminds me of that "Dear Woman" video a bunch of herbs made a few years back.

Yeah, I reposted that white knight cult video about a year ago to remind men to stop SIMPing.... here's a link if anyone is interested in how NOT to behave....

[Video] Remember that White Knight Cult video from the early 2000s?

Here it is again, to remind y'all what bluepill looks like......

www.sosuave.net

 

[zekko]

I don't think self-flagellation is productive or helpful. Neither is virtue signaling.

Perfect description, self-flagellation and virtue signalling. Not to mention narcissism and pomposity.

Yeah, I reposted that white knight cult video about a year ago to remind men to stop SIMPing.... here's a link if anyone is interested in how NOT to behave....

Yarrrgh, I couldn't watch much of that. I don't think there's an nanogram of testosterone in the whole video.

 

[Spaz]

Black people hold no responsibility for the racial situation in the United States. It’s a topic you know nothing about, so let’s move on and leave it at that.

Yes they do and you damn well know it deep down.

Even if u r white but dressed as a begger, walk like a begger, talk like a begger, smell like a begger, unkempt like a begger, you think he gets respect? He will be discriminated on.

It's not just in US but everywhere else too.

1st education, 2nd mannerisms, 3rd appearance and 4th body language - there's only 4 steps to get a positive perception AND this would change the PATH of people who are black.

 

[EyeBRollin]

Unfortunately, I think there is a bit of a feedback loop going on. Black people certainly didn't start it, but racism breeds resentment, suspiciousness, hatred for the police, glorification of the thug culture - which encourages stereotypes and racial profiling, which creates more anger, hatred and resentment - which encourages more stereotyping and racial profiling, etc. etc.

This is a mostly true statement that ultimately proves my comment. You are suggesting here that black people’s resentment towards America’s institutions justifies white people’s racist attitudes toward black people (I.e. “We’d respect black people if they stopped being mad about being treated poorly”) . That is a morally bankrupt position.

 

[user43770]

This is a mostly true statement that ultimately proves my comment. You are suggesting here that black people’s resentment towards America’s institutions justifies white people’s racist attitudes toward black people (I.e. “We’d respect black people if they stopped being mad about being treated poorly”) . That is a morally bankrupt position.

You are morally bankrupt, by claiming that I have less morals than you, while refusing to have an honest debate.

Ok, not you, but BLM.

 

[zekko]

You are suggesting here that black people’s resentment towards America’s institutions (which have been oppressive for 400 years) justifies white people’s racist attitudes toward them.

No, no no. That's not what I'm suggesting at all. I'm just observing what's going on, and I see a feedback loop at work. Some police brutalize some minorities, some minorities become resentful and suspicious of the police, which makes them more likely to react poorly when they encounter police, which leads to more brutality. Like the current case in Atlanta, with the man resisting arrest. Doesn't mean he should have been shot, but it was a factor. None of it is justified, but that doesn't mean there isn't a dysfunctional pattern at play here.

 

[EyeBRollin]

No, no no. That's not what I'm suggesting at all. I'm just observing what's going on, and I see a feedback loop at work. Some police brutalize some minorities, some minorities become resentful and suspicious of the police, which makes them more likely to react poorly when they encounter police, which leads to more brutality. Like the current case in Atlanta, with the man resisting arrest. Doesn't mean he should have been shot, but it was a factor. None of it is justified, but that doesn't mean there isn't a dysfunctional pattern at play here.

Got it, understood and agreed. Yes this feedback loop you describe is real.

As for Atlanta, there is simply no justification for police fatally shooting a man in the back who is fleeing.

 

[user43770]

He is an artful dodger, if nothing else.

I find it ludicrous. You want to talk about how cops treat black people, but refuse to acknowledge crime statistics in said city.

If a cop is busting people left and right in a certain part of town, and constantly getting resistance, he's going to plan ahead for it. Like all intelligent humans do.

Are cops overly aggressive? Yes. Do they have a reason to be in this day and age?

Get rid of cops in downtown Minneapolis. Please. Let's see what happens.

 

[logicallefty]

I'd like to see some of the big, blue cities defund the police. Give them a dose of reality.

I as a cop completely agree with this. Let’s do a pilot test in Some of the big blue cities and see how it goes. Establish a physical perimeter wall around the police area and non-police area with military keeping things separate. I think it would be fun to watch from a drone in the sky.

 

[Spaz]

The truth of the matter is that people given an excuse for failure will fail, and those for whom failure isn't an option will succeed.

Of course it is.

People who have darker skin color, for example blacks, faces the most discrimination and it becomes a cycle for them, and for society at large.

In all seriousness, who exactly is at fault?

From my observations, there are 2 kinds of blacks in the case of Asia, Nigerians, Tamil Indians, Rohingya, Bangladeshi, etc are often looked down upon mostly because of their collective character : dirty, smelly, snakish behaviour, laziness, uneducated, criminal activities, etc.

Then you're got blacks from Northern India or those Singh's who are widely respected within Asia simply because they are educated, well mannered, cultured and project worthiness.

Some of these communities need to buck up and surpass their current level to gain the respect that everyone deserves BUT they do need a helping hand too as change will take a long time, decades even. Yet they themselves MUST take the initiative to start it off.

For now, the police force needs to inject some professionalism, clear cut rules of when to use of deadly force and clear penalties for non compliance.

The perception of the entire world is that American police are too trigger happy, as to why they are like that, there could be a multiple reasons; racism, fear of being shot, police culture, etc. Those reasons doesn't really matter, what matters is that right now they have to evolve and keep up with world standards, American police is looking like they're only at the level of 3rd world policing and that's sad for a develope country.

 

[Epicenter]

The perception of the entire world is that American police are too trigger happy, as to why they are like that, there could be a multiple reasons; racism, fear of being shot, police culture, etc. Those reasons doesn't really matter, what matters is that right now they have to evolve and keep up with world standards, American police is looking like they're only at the level of 3rd world policing and that's sad for a develope country.

Yes it is expected more from the USA but it is relatively weak in some areas as far as I can remember. For example regarding the most homicides is the US at place 94 from 220 countries. That is quite a high rate. That makes the job of the police tough and dangerous I guess.

Interestingly they get quite some trust from the people:

" Americans trust police officers, military leaders and local public officials more than members of Congress, tech leaders and journalists, according to a study published by the Pew Research Center on Thursday. "

Americans Trust Police More Than Congress, Study Finds (Published 2019)

The most trusted leader of them all? The public school principal, according to a Pew Research Center study on Americans’ faith in powerful people and institutions.

www.nytimes.com

 

[Spaz]

Yes it is expected more from the USA but it is relatively weak in some areas as far as I can remember. For example regarding the most homicides is the US at place 94 from 220 countries. That is quite a high rate. That makes the job of the police tough and dangerous I guess.

Interestingly they get quite some trust from the people:

" Americans trust police officers, military leaders and local public officials more than members of Congress, tech leaders and journalists, according to a study published by the Pew Research Center on Thursday. "

Americans Trust Police More Than Congress, Study Finds (Published 2019)

The most trusted leader of them all? The public school principal, according to a Pew Research Center study on Americans’ faith in powerful people and institutions.

www.nytimes.com

This whole issue about race relationships can also be viewed or tied to what's going on in Sosuave.

The vast majority of men here don't want to evolve BUT still comes on here complaining abt how women are BAD to them.

And the worse part is, it's the men themselves that gives PERMISSION for women that's in a relationship with them to BULLY them endlessly.

YES BULLY!

YET they take no responsibility whatsoever AND that's the core problem - because when you don't admit it you WILL never change.

 

[EyeBRollin]

Yes it is expected more from the USA but it is relatively weak in some areas as far as I can remember. For example regarding the most homicides is the US at place 94 from 220 countries. That is quite a high rate. That makes the job of the police tough and dangerous I guess.

Interestingly they get quite some trust from the people:

" Americans trust police officers, military leaders and local public officials more than members of Congress, tech leaders and journalists, according to a study published by the Pew Research Center on Thursday. "

Americans Trust Police More Than Congress, Study Finds (Published 2019)

The most trusted leader of them all? The public school principal, according to a Pew Research Center study on Americans’ faith in powerful people and institutions.

www.nytimes.com

In the United States, trust with police has a huge discrepancy by race. Black people are the only major demographic group where a majority do not trust the police. The explanation for that is tied to police relationship throughout American history. While we appreciate commentary from folks outside the USA, these are uninformed opinions. This is a complicated topic even for those who actually live here, so it’s impossible for those who don’t to understand.

This whole issue about race relationships can also be viewed or tied to what's going on in Sosuave.

There is no such thing as “race relationships.” Children aren’t born with a desire to separate by skin color; it is a learned behavior. As I said before, you’re likening the issue of American police brutality to self-help propaganda which about sums up your credibility on this topic.

 

[Spaz]

There is no such thing as “race relationships.” Children aren’t born with a desire to separate by skin color; it is a learned behavior.

Try sending ur black toddler into a rural Chinese or Jap kindergarten.

I'm sure those Eastern toddlers will enjoy that ONE singularity.

Then you can come up here and talk c0ck.

 

[Spaz]

Not everyone gets his head screwed on right by mommy and daddy. But, there comes a time when you can no longer blame your parents for your behavior, and it's time for some tough-love type self-parenting. The same goes for blaming history for fuucking you up. Tough shiit. We all have problems. Suck it up. Do your best. And, stop crying about the hand you were dealt. Everyone wants a royal flush, but most of us just have to make do with "two of a kind"(ballls)

The blacks in America are actually in a much better situation as compared to other blacks in many parts of the world.

They have access to education.

They have access to healthcare.

They have access to liberties that other races in other countries would die for.

They even have social security which no one in Asia has.

I'm sure there are many other benefits.

And yet what do most of them do with all these benefits ?

I'm sorry, I can't find it within me to have sympathy for a group of people who are just plain lazy.

But you will have my sympathy with regards to police brutality.