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Should we de-fund/abolish the police?

Should we de-fund the police?


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ShePays

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I find it ludicrous. You want to talk about how cops treat black people, but refuse to acknowledge crime statistics in said city.

If a cop is busting people left and right in a certain part of town, and constantly getting resistance, he's going to plan ahead for it. Like all intelligent humans do.

Are cops overly aggressive? Yes. Do they have a reason to be in this day and age?

Get rid of cops in downtown Minneapolis. Please. Let's see what happens.
The funny thing is that there were four cops involved in the Floyd fiasco, and only three touched him, and only one was directly responsible for his death, according to the autopsy commissioned by the Floyd family....yet, they were all charged with murder.

We're told that this was a racially motivated murder, and cities are burning to pay for this KKK lynching. However, the races of the four cops were 2 White, 1 Asia, and 1 Black, and, apparently, it was the Black cop on Floyd's back, not the White one on his neck, who was responsible for Floyd's "death by asphyxiation," according to the family-commissioned independent autopsy.

So, are we supposed to believe that "killing a ****er in plan sight" was part of the Black cop's KKK initiation....or was this just a fuuck up? I'm leaning towards the latter, but ain't it great that we live in a country where everyone instantly assumes the worst, and automatically starts BLM-ing(Burning, Looting, and Murdering) in response to every perceived slight? SMH

You know, I've even heard BLM-er say that the Black cop shouldn't have been charged, and that only the cop/s responsible for Floyd's death should be charged. I wonder how the BLM-ers who've expressed that sentiment will respond, when they finally realize that it was actually the Black cop who caused Floyd's death. Any guesses?
 
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logicallefty

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I'd like to see some of the big, blue cities defund the police. Give them a dose of reality.
I as a cop completely agree with this. Let’s do a pilot test in Some of the big blue cities and see how it goes. Establish a physical perimeter wall around the police area and non-police area with military keeping things separate. I think it would be fun to watch from a drone in the sky.
 

Spaz

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The truth of the matter is that people given an excuse for failure will fail, and those for whom failure isn't an option will succeed.
Of course it is.

People who have darker skin color, for example blacks, faces the most discrimination and it becomes a cycle for them, and for society at large.

In all seriousness, who exactly is at fault?

From my observations, there are 2 kinds of blacks in the case of Asia, Nigerians, Tamil Indians, Rohingya, Bangladeshi, etc are often looked down upon mostly because of their collective character : dirty, smelly, snakish behaviour, laziness, uneducated, criminal activities, etc.

Then you're got blacks from Northern India or those Singh's who are widely respected within Asia simply because they are educated, well mannered, cultured and project worthiness.

Some of these communities need to buck up and surpass their current level to gain the respect that everyone deserves BUT they do need a helping hand too as change will take a long time, decades even. Yet they themselves MUST take the initiative to start it off.

For now, the police force needs to inject some professionalism, clear cut rules of when to use of deadly force and clear penalties for non compliance.

The perception of the entire world is that American police are too trigger happy, as to why they are like that, there could be a multiple reasons; racism, fear of being shot, police culture, etc. Those reasons doesn't really matter, what matters is that right now they have to evolve and keep up with world standards, American police is looking like they're only at the level of 3rd world policing and that's sad for a develope country.
 
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Epicenter

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The perception of the entire world is that American police are too trigger happy, as to why they are like that, there could be a multiple reasons; racism, fear of being shot, police culture, etc. Those reasons doesn't really matter, what matters is that right now they have to evolve and keep up with world standards, American police is looking like they're only at the level of 3rd world policing and that's sad for a develope country.
Yes it is expected more from the USA but it is relatively weak in some areas as far as I can remember. For example regarding the most homicides is the US at place 94 from 220 countries. That is quite a high rate. That makes the job of the police tough and dangerous I guess.

Interestingly they get quite some trust from the people:

" Americans trust police officers, military leaders and local public officials more than members of Congress, tech leaders and journalists, according to a study published by the Pew Research Center on Thursday. "

 

Spaz

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Yes it is expected more from the USA but it is relatively weak in some areas as far as I can remember. For example regarding the most homicides is the US at place 94 from 220 countries. That is quite a high rate. That makes the job of the police tough and dangerous I guess.

Interestingly they get quite some trust from the people:

" Americans trust police officers, military leaders and local public officials more than members of Congress, tech leaders and journalists, according to a study published by the Pew Research Center on Thursday. "

This whole issue about race relationships can also be viewed or tied to what's going on in Sosuave.

The vast majority of men here don't want to evolve BUT still comes on here complaining abt how women are BAD to them.

And the worse part is, it's the men themselves that gives PERMISSION for women that's in a relationship with them to BULLY them endlessly.

YES BULLY!

YET they take no responsibility whatsoever AND that's the core problem - because when you don't admit it you WILL never change.
 

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EyeBRollin

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Yes it is expected more from the USA but it is relatively weak in some areas as far as I can remember. For example regarding the most homicides is the US at place 94 from 220 countries. That is quite a high rate. That makes the job of the police tough and dangerous I guess.

Interestingly they get quite some trust from the people:

" Americans trust police officers, military leaders and local public officials more than members of Congress, tech leaders and journalists, according to a study published by the Pew Research Center on Thursday. "

In the United States, trust with police has a huge discrepancy by race. Black people are the only major demographic group where a majority do not trust the police. The explanation for that is tied to police relationship throughout American history. While we appreciate commentary from folks outside the USA, these are uninformed opinions. This is a complicated topic even for those who actually live here, so it’s impossible for those who don’t to understand.

This whole issue about race relationships can also be viewed or tied to what's going on in Sosuave.
There is no such thing as “race relationships.” Children aren’t born with a desire to separate by skin color; it is a learned behavior. As I said before, you’re likening the issue of American police brutality to self-help propaganda which about sums up your credibility on this topic.
 

samspade

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There is no such thing as “race relationships.” Children aren’t born with a desire to separate by skin color; it is a learned behavior.
Your second claim doesn't prove your first. I was born illiterate, but that doesn't mean there's no such thing as literacy.
 

ShePays

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Your second claim doesn't prove your first. I was born illiterate, but that doesn't mean there's no such thing as literacy.
What EBR espoused also isn't the position of prominent Black identitarians, who profess to believe that Whites are born inherently racist, that there's nothing Blacks can do to encourage White racism, since it's endemic, and that there's nothing Blacks can do that can be considered racist....since, according to their lore, Whites are just a devil race, whose continued existence is the only obstacle to Global peace, harmony, brotherhood, and equality.

Anyone who wants to know why there are still so many Blacks who behave in nonsensical ways, ways that make zero effort to mend fences, nor to reform the stereotypes which contribute to the treatment they claim to hate needs only to understand that the above nonsense is drilled into their heads, from a young age: they complain about bad service at restaurants, but most still feel under no obligation to tip; they complain that White women cross the streets to avoid them, but are either oblivious to the intimidation factor of groups of animated, loud, unfamiliar men to a lone female, or they dress like their favorite rapper, which is to say as either a crack dealer or a pimp, with their pants sagging below their asses; they complain about being abused by the cops, and then want to violently resist arrest, or mouth off, as if that's going to improve the situation. I wish the Black man who gave me the lecture about how to act around the police were still alive, but if he were, I get the feeling he'd wish he hadn't lived to see the current backwards march of the progress he'd worked so hard for. SMH

Of course, it goes without saying that the above doesn't apply to everyone, but even many of the ones to whom it doesn't necessarily apply have gotten into the toxic habit of making excuses for their worst element.
... with few notable exceptions.
 
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ShePays

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I as a cop completely agree with this. Let’s do a pilot test in Some of the big blue cities and see how it goes. Establish a physical perimeter wall around the police area and non-police area with military keeping things separate. I think it would be fun to watch from a drone in the sky.
A real life Escape from New York
 

ShePays

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Of course it is.

People who have darker skin color, for example blacks, faces the most discrimination and it becomes a cycle for them, and for society at large.

In all seriousness, who exactly is at fault?

From my observations, there are 2 kinds of blacks in the case of Asia, Nigerians, Tamil Indians, Rohingya, Bangladeshi, etc are often looked down upon mostly because of their collective character : dirty, smelly, snakish behaviour, laziness, uneducated, criminal activities, etc.

Then you're got blacks from Northern India or those Singh's who are widely respected within Asia simply because they are educated, well mannered, cultured and project worthiness.

Some of these communities need to buck up and surpass their current level to gain the respect that everyone deserves BUT they do need a helping hand too as change will take a long time, decades even. Yet they themselves MUST take the initiative to start it off.

For now, the police force needs to inject some professionalism, clear cut rules of when to use of deadly force and clear penalties for non compliance.

The perception of the entire world is that American police are too trigger happy, as to why they are like that, there could be a multiple reasons; racism, fear of being shot, police culture, etc. Those reasons doesn't really matter, what matters is that right now they have to evolve and keep up with world standards, American police is looking like they're only at the level of 3rd world policing and that's sad for a develope country.
Not everyone gets his head screwed on right by mommy and daddy. But, there comes a time when you can no longer blame your parents for your behavior, and it's time for some tough-love type self-parenting. The same goes for blaming history for fuucking you up. Tough shiit. We all have problems. Suck it up. Do your best. And, stop crying about the hand you were dealt. Everyone wants a royal flush, but most of us just have to make do with "two of a kind"(ballls)
 

Spaz

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There is no such thing as “race relationships.” Children aren’t born with a desire to separate by skin color; it is a learned behavior.
Try sending ur black toddler into a rural Chinese or Jap kindergarten.

I'm sure those Eastern toddlers will enjoy that ONE singularity.

Then you can come up here and talk c0ck.
 

Spaz

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Not everyone gets his head screwed on right by mommy and daddy. But, there comes a time when you can no longer blame your parents for your behavior, and it's time for some tough-love type self-parenting. The same goes for blaming history for fuucking you up. Tough shiit. We all have problems. Suck it up. Do your best. And, stop crying about the hand you were dealt. Everyone wants a royal flush, but most of us just have to make do with "two of a kind"(ballls)
The blacks in America are actually in a much better situation as compared to other blacks in many parts of the world.

They have access to education.

They have access to healthcare.

They have access to liberties that other races in other countries would die for.

They even have social security which no one in Asia has.

I'm sure there are many other benefits.

And yet what do most of them do with all these benefits ?

I'm sorry, I can't find it within me to have sympathy for a group of people who are just plain lazy.

But you will have my sympathy with regards to police brutality.
 

ShePays

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The blacks in America are actually in a much better situation as compared to other blacks in many parts of the world.

They have access to education.

They have access to healthcare.

They have access to liberties that other races in other countries would die for.

They even have social security which no one in Asia has.

I'm sure there are many other benefits.

And yet what do most of them do with all these benefits ?

I'm sorry, I can't find it within me to have sympathy for a group of people who are just plain lazy.

But you will have my sympathy with regards to police brutality.
You know, if the Joe Biden of the 1994 "super predator " crime bill were running, today, he might actually have a chance against Trump. But, that guy is dead and buried. He wasn't wrong when he said he didn't care about their excuses, but he wouldn't dare say the same thing, today. This Joe Biden's sack is in his wife's purse, next to his Alzheimer's pills.

If we did set up a temporary cetralized task force on policing, we should let Giuliani run it. Maybe, set a 10 year non-renewable sunset on the task force.
 

samspade

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You know, if the Joe Biden of the 1994 "super predator " crime bill were running, today, he might actually have a chance against Trump. But, that guy is dead and buried. He wasn't wrong when he said he didn't care about their excuses, but he wouldn't dare say the same thing, today. This Joe Biden's sack is in his wife's purse, next to his Alzheimer's pills.

If we did set up a temporary cetralized task force on policing, we should let Giuliani run it. Maybe, set a 10 year non-renewable sunset on the task force.
I wouldn't put too much stock in what any of these nutsacks say to get votes.
 

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Epicenter

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This is a complicated topic even for those who actually live here, so it’s impossible for those who don’t to understand.

Yes most topics are complicated. That doesn't mean an outside perspective is uninformed. It may look that way to you. Most people don't do self improvement that is why they have sometimes a different world view. So their views are biased. All the information will be bend to fit into their agenda. So it does not mean that much that one is from the country.

Though I see your viewpoint but I am not new to the topic. The conversation should have the benefit for us all to dive deeper into the topic and become better informed.
There is a reason USA imports intellectuals on the highest level because their drive and intelligence are needed to better life. So outsiders are not automatically worse.
 

Epicenter

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This whole issue about race relationships can also be viewed or tied to what's going on in Sosuave.

The vast majority of men here don't want to evolve BUT still comes on here complaining abt how women are BAD to them.

And the worse part is, it's the men themselves that gives PERMISSION for women that's in a relationship with them to BULLY them endlessly.

YES BULLY!

YET they take no responsibility whatsoever AND that's the core problem - because when you don't admit it you WILL never change.
I agree. On a lower level first thing people do is blaming others. Some evolve from that stage and put in the work some don't.

(On a philosophical level I am a determinist that means there is no free will people have no choice. So they don't have "real responsibility". It's nature doing it's thing)
 

zekko

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On a philosophical level I am a determinist that means there is no free will people have no choice. So they don't have "real responsibility". It's nature doing it's thing
That's interesting, I don't think I've ever heard anyone else say they are a determinist on this forum. It seems to blow against the DJ idea that you can "will" yourself into being a top 3% male (or whatever percentage it is this week. I've been seeing 1% mentioned more lately). I wouldn't go so far as to say there is no free will, but I do think it is true to a certain extent - most people are prisoners of their behaviors. I know there are studies that show people's personalities are formed at a certain age, for example. I suppose some people can change, but if it's against their nature it's extremely, extremely difficult.
 

Spaz

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I agree. On a lower level first thing people do is blaming others. Some evolve from that stage and put in the work some don't.

(On a philosophical level I am a determinist that means there is no free will people have no choice. So they don't have "real responsibility". It's nature doing it's thing)
Philosophy can be equated with how you think.

How you think + how you do things = the results you see in ur daily life.

So if you change ur philosophy, would the results also change?
 

Epicenter

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Philosophy can be equated with how you think.

How you think + how you do things = the results you see in ur daily life.

So if you change ur philosophy, would the results also change?

Philosophy as action:
The word philosophy is used in different contexts. On a narrower level like when you say: "This is the philosophy of our company". In this context it can be used as "way to think". So if you change your philosophy of your company your results change. In this context I would agree.


Philosophy as a question:
On a higher level "philosophy" means to deal with the mystery of life. Do we really exist the way we think we exist? Is life deterministic? Even if life is deterministic is it better to act like it's not most of the time? If free will exists, how is it even possible? Are the laws of science real or just historical patterns? What is the value of life? and so on.
 
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