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Being nice has gotten me so much further with women

stringpuller

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Yes by all means be kind.

Yes some “nice guys” have issues with being “fake” to try to win women over.

But most of the time, when she complains about a guy being “too nice” or a “nice guy,” she’s being disingenuous. She doesn’t find him physically attractive, but she will sound “less shallow” if she appears to be disqualifying him based on personality traits rather than looks.
Yes and the type of guys she says is a great guy and her super cool friend is her way of saying male girlfriend
 

RangerMIke

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I notice a lot of guys on these forums do this push/pull thing with girls, act arrogant, act like a jerk, but for some reason that never seems to work for me. I get laid much more when I'm a nice guy, hold doors, have manners and stuff like that.

I have browsed this forum forever and enjoy it, but it's interesting to me that 90% of the advice is the exact opposite of what I do and I still get laid quite a bit. Can anybody shed some light on why that is? It's almost like guys are afraid that being nice is viewed as weak.
There is a difference between being 'nice' and being a push-over. I am 'nice' to women, I treat everyone with respect unless they otherwise indicate through their actions they are not worthy of respect. I treat everyone the same, and if people are respectful and pleasant I will reciprocate. This has served me well.

Being a pleasant person without any expectation of reciprocity builds trust. Trust is important.

The "Nice Guy" pejorative is reserved for men that expect something in return for their behavior. Typically when a 'nice guy' isn't rewarded for good behavior, he gets butt hurt. It's like the child that didn't get a cookie from his mom when he was a good boy, throwing a tantrum. A person that is willing to twist themselves into a pretzel in a futile attempt to be liked is not attractive. Too many women have had men it their lives try to manipulate them with nice behavior, and it turns them off.
 

oldmanofthesea

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This ^^^

To expand a bit on some other nice-guy behaviors:
1. Changing their opinion on things in order to align with the woman's, or to align with what they THINK the woman will want to hear
2. Have no entitlement that a woman should be doing things for him, in-kind to what he does for her. It's not so much tit-for-tat, but most nice-guys are SO focused on pleasing women, they literally expect nothing in return (other than hopefully her permission to have sex with her). If I do things like cook her dinners or give her a ride somewhere, I'm going to expect the same from her. I'm not going to keep track and I'm not going to get butt-hurt if she doesn't do it, but if she doesn't, I'm not going to keep doing things for her like that. I'm going to scale back to whatever level of investment she is providing, even if that means fading away until we are no longer talking/dating.
3. Do not have clear boundaries
4. Do not hold women accountable for anything
5. Are anti-confrontational and afraid to disagree (often related to the above two points)
6. Are afraid to challenge women
7. Agree with everything she says and are over-complimenting. "WOW, you like to ride bicycles? No way! So cool!"
8. Await the woman to give him a lit-up neon sign inviting him to escalate physically with her

Women don't like d-bags. Women like certain good characteristics that D-bags possess from the above list. Sadly, D-bags have a lot of other bad traits that women do NOT like, but they go for the guy anyway because they can almost never find the good traits listed above in nice guys. To me, this is a CORE part of being a good DJ..... because if you can be nice, and also do the opposite of the list above, you are in the top 1-2% of all men and women CRAVE this.
 

mrgoodstuff

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This ^^^

To expand a bit on some other nice-guy behaviors:
1. Changing their opinion on things in order to align with the woman's, or to align with what they THINK the woman will want to hear
2. Have no entitlement that a woman should be doing things for him, in-kind to what he does for her. It's not so much tit-for-tat, but most nice-guys are SO focused on pleasing women, they literally expect nothing in return (other than hopefully her permission to have sex with her). If I do things like cook her dinners or give her a ride somewhere, I'm going to expect the same from her. I'm not going to keep track and I'm not going to get butt-hurt if she doesn't do it, but if she doesn't, I'm not going to keep doing things for her like that. I'm going to scale back to whatever level of investment she is providing, even if that means fading away until we are no longer talking/dating.
3. Do not have clear boundaries
4. Do not hold women accountable for anything
5. Are anti-confrontational and afraid to disagree (often related to the above two points)
6. Are afraid to challenge women
7. Agree with everything she says and are over-complimenting. "WOW, you like to ride bicycles? No way! So cool!"
8. Await the woman to give him a lit-up neon sign inviting him to escalate physically with her

Women don't like d-bags. Women like certain good characteristics that D-bags possess from the above list. Sadly, D-bags have a lot of other bad traits that women do NOT like, but they go for the guy anyway because they can almost never find the good traits listed above in nice guys. To me, this is a CORE part of being a good DJ..... because if you can be nice, and also do the opposite of the list above, you are in the top 1-2% of all men and women CRAVE this.
Expecting nothing in return for giving your energy, thought and time is a form of disrespectful behavior to yourself. Aren't you worth something?
 

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BeExcellent

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This ^^^

To expand a bit on some other nice-guy behaviors:
1. Changing their opinion on things in order to align with the woman's, or to align with what they THINK the woman will want to hear
2. Have no entitlement that a woman should be doing things for him, in-kind to what he does for her. It's not so much tit-for-tat, but most nice-guys are SO focused on pleasing women, they literally expect nothing in return (other than hopefully her permission to have sex with her). If I do things like cook her dinners or give her a ride somewhere, I'm going to expect the same from her. I'm not going to keep track and I'm not going to get butt-hurt if she doesn't do it, but if she doesn't, I'm not going to keep doing things for her like that. I'm going to scale back to whatever level of investment she is providing, even if that means fading away until we are no longer talking/dating.
3. Do not have clear boundaries
4. Do not hold women accountable for anything
5. Are anti-confrontational and afraid to disagree (often related to the above two points)
6. Are afraid to challenge women
7. Agree with everything she says and are over-complimenting. "WOW, you like to ride bicycles? No way! So cool!"
8. Await the woman to give him a lit-up neon sign inviting him to escalate physically with her

Women don't like d-bags. Women like certain good characteristics that D-bags possess from the above list. Sadly, D-bags have a lot of other bad traits that women do NOT like, but they go for the guy anyway because they can almost never find the good traits listed above in nice guys. To me, this is a CORE part of being a good DJ..... because if you can be nice, and also do the opposite of the list above, you are in the top 1-2% of all men and women CRAVE this.
Give me an arrogant douch ebag over a spineless or disingenuous “nice guy” all day.

I can manage the ass hole. There is substance there to push against; edge; bravado. Push over fraidy cat dudes just trying to get by? Can’t do it. If I push they tip over. No challenge, no edge, no polarity to push against. I’m a woman with passions not a porcelain doll. But I’m also a kind person. I do not mince words. I will tell a man I do not feel physical attraction if it needs to be said. And on occasion I’ve said it. It is crystal clear. It breaks a guy texting endlessly trying to negotiate desire in me. No desire? NEXT! But I am always kind at the same time. I do not use men for free stuff and think women who do are abominable.

Current guy? Kind. Transparent (brutally so at times), Respectful. Caring. Sexy AF. Openly a playboy type. Tall. Handsome face. Occasional ass hole. Unapologetically himself. Good at chess (seriously). He’s also able to be vulnerable and emotive. Self assured; secure. No fxcks given.

He’s also not the usual body type I’m generally drawn to (he’s trim) but he is such a rock solid force of personality coupled with bravado and vulnerability that he’s very appealing.

The “nice guy” borders on creepy. He’s too timid to be congruent in what he wants or desires and therefore always seems fake but in a sugary off putting way. But he’s convinced he’s “nice” (aka has drunk his own Kool Aid) so when he fails he’s that much angrier.

“Nice guys”, if they have any characteristics that actually appeal to women (handsome face, fit body, fat wallet) are the ones most likely to suddenly flip places on the spectrum. They become the angry uber jaded d icks who learn to use women because they always felt used. That’s a dark nasty hole to climb out of. A few guys do climb out. Many do not.

But that’s the subset of the “nice guys” who grow a pair and see TRP at some point. Many never do. And they whimper along miserably wondering why they only get scraps...

It’s brutal.

Nothing wrong intrinsically with “nice” so long as it’s akin to kind. I’ll take kind with backbone all day long. But those are men who typically had to be forged in some sort of fire to arrive at such a place...takes time in many instances to evolve to such a place...
 

Glassguy

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You can "act nice" and still have high standards, put up with ZERO bullshyt, have a strong frame and make decisions that are for YOUR best interest.

I don't know any women that are really attracted to people who are mean and miserable.

Enthusiastic, positive, ****y, confident and on your purpose. That's what higher value women want.

Be your own man when out in public with a women and you can be a little more "caring" when alone with a woman.

But if you dont have boundaries that she can clearly identify or you wont walk asap over disrespect, you are in fact too nice.
 

Georgepithyou

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I was talking about fake nice on women. Its more common there. There are alot of nice men who don't understand women. They want to love them and treat them well. They just don't know that she's attracted or not and they use nice men. It's better to share that kindness with women who are attracted to you.
I've seen this mostly with Japanese women, rhey are nice to you because their culture demands It of them.

Everything about them is so artificial and fake
 

Lynx nkaf

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Give me an arrogant douch ebag over a spineless or disingenuous “nice guy” all day.

I can manage the ass hole. There is substance there to push against; edge; bravado. Push over fraidy cat dudes just trying to get by? Can’t do it. If I push they tip over. No challenge, no edge, no polarity to push against. I’m a woman with passions not a porcelain doll. But I’m also a kind person. I do not mince words. I will tell a man I do not feel physical attraction if it needs to be said. And on occasion I’ve said it. It is crystal clear. It breaks a guy texting endlessly trying to negotiate desire in me. No desire? NEXT! But I am always kind at the same time. I do not use men for free stuff and think women who do are abominable.

Current guy? Kind. Transparent (brutally so at times), Respectful. Caring. Sexy AF. Openly a playboy type. Tall. Handsome face. Occasional ass hole. Unapologetically himself. Good at chess (seriously). He’s also able to be vulnerable and emotive. Self assured; secure. No fxcks given.

He’s also not the usual body type I’m generally drawn to (he’s trim) but he is such a rock solid force of personality coupled with bravado and vulnerability that he’s very appealing.

The “nice guy” borders on creepy. He’s too timid to be congruent in what he wants or desires and therefore always seems fake but in a sugary off putting way. But he’s convinced he’s “nice” (aka has drunk his own Kool Aid) so when he fails he’s that much angrier.

“Nice guys”, if they have any characteristics that actually appeal to women (handsome face, fit body, fat wallet) are the ones most likely to suddenly flip places on the spectrum. They become the angry uber jaded d icks who learn to use women because they always felt used. That’s a dark nasty hole to climb out of. A few guys do climb out. Many do not.

But that’s the subset of the “nice guys” who grow a pair and see TRP at some point. Many never do. And they whimper along miserably wondering why they only get scraps...

It’s brutal.

Nothing wrong intrinsically with “nice” so long as it’s akin to kind. I’ll take kind with backbone all day long. But those are men who typically had to be forged in some sort of fire to arrive at such a place...takes time in many instances to evolve to such a place...
Congrats on this good new man
 

Spaz

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If I had a daughter, I'd trained her up to never ever trust a nice guy and to promptly dismiss such men.

I'd even teach her on signs a nice guys would display, such as these;

1. Complimenting her too much.
2. Confessing his feelings for her too soon.
3. Begging for her attention.
4. Always available to her.

Ain't no way is my bloodline gonna be tainted by these weak men through my own hypothetical daughter.
 

mrgoodstuff

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I've seen this mostly with Japanese women, rhey are nice to you because their culture demands It of them.

Everything about them is so artificial and fake
Dude, when a gold digger is using a man for money or dates, that's "fake nice". Underneath that outer layer persona they have a growing hate and contempt for those gentleman who help them and who are kind to them. There's a large percentage of that going on in our culture, even in MARRIAGE. It always was a "fake nice" to get what she wanted.
 

RangerMIke

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Dude, when a gold digger is using a man for money or dates, that's "fake nice". Underneath that outer layer persona they have a growing hate and contempt for those gentleman who help them and who are kind to them. There's a large percentage of that going on in our culture, even in MARRIAGE. It always was a "fake nice" to get what she wanted.
Women are great actresses. I know a lot of women that can fool most men into believing she cares about them, when in fact these dudes are just being used. There is a way to sniff them out.... and it's simple. Be selfish. That's it, put yourself first and these women won't have anything to do with you. This causes her to put in effort... and if she really doesn't like you, she won't do it. Why? Because it's just as easy to find another chump, that she really doesn't care about, to use. This is why I really don't give a fvck if a woman wanders off... I just chalk it up to low interest and move on.

I will be willing to bet that maybe 1/3 of all women I know, married their husband and she didn't really love him. No way I can prove this statistic, but you can just freaking tell by watching couples. The reason this happens is because most men really do not care about how a woman feels, he is completely blinded by this own attraction to her... so he makes excuses for the way she treat him.
 

mrgoodstuff

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Women are great actresses. I know a lot of women that can fool most men into believing she cares about them, when in fact these dudes are just being used. There is a way to sniff them out.... and it's simple. Be selfish. That's it, put yourself first and these women won't have anything to do with you. This causes her to put in effort... and if she really doesn't like you, she won't do it. Why? Because it's just as easy to find another chump, that she really doesn't care about, to use. This is why I really don't give a fvck if a woman wanders off... I just chalk it up to low interest and move on.

I will be willing to bet that maybe 1/3 of all women I know, married their husband and she didn't really love him. No way I can prove this statistic, but you can just freaking tell by watching couples. The reason this happens is because most men really do not care about how a woman feels, he is completely blinded by this own attraction to her... so he makes excuses for the way she treat him.
We nailed all the bullet points!

Not being aware that your wife or gf doesn’t give a sh1t because your blinded by your attraction is a dangerous place to be.
 
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stormrider

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I notice a lot of guys on these forums do this push/pull thing with girls, act arrogant, act like a jerk, but for some reason that never seems to work for me. I get laid much more when I'm a nice guy, hold doors, have manners and stuff like that.

I have browsed this forum forever and enjoy it, but it's interesting to me that 90% of the advice is the exact opposite of what I do and I still get laid quite a bit. Can anybody shed some light on why that is? It's almost like guys are afraid that being nice is viewed as weak.
I don't remember the last time I read anything on this forum that tells you to act arrogant, do push pull, or act like a jerk.

Most advice I see is about being a strong person. This forum is not even a pickup forum, although it is often mistaken for one.

Most of the quality advice is just telling you to be masculine and authentic.

With a few newbie posts here and there telling you to run "game." Those are the lost cause posts and are to be ignored.

Your two choices aren't being supplicating (nice guy) vs being an a$$hole.

There is only one choice. Being a powerful man. And being kind just is part of that power. When you have value, it naturally flows out of you and you give instead of take.
 

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mrgoodstuff

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You can "act nice" and still have high standards, put up with ZERO bullshyt, have a strong frame and make decisions that are for YOUR best interest.

I don't know any women that are really attracted to people who are mean and miserable.

Enthusiastic, positive, ****y, confident and on your purpose. That's what higher value women want.

Be your own man when out in public with a women and you can be a little more "caring" when alone with a woman.

But if you dont have boundaries that she can clearly identify or you wont walk asap over disrespect, you are in fact too nice.
ALL women aren't so uncontrolled that they will behave disrespectfully... That is a certain type.
 

mrgoodstuff

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I don't remember the last time I read anything on this forum that tells you to act arrogant, do push pull, or act like a jerk.

Most advice I see is about being a strong person. This forum is not even a pickup forum, although it is often mistaken for one.

Most of the quality advice is just telling you to be masculine and authentic.

With a few newbie posts here and there telling you to run "game." Those are the lost cause posts and are to be ignored.

Your two choices aren't being supplicating (nice guy) vs being an a$$hole.

There is only one choice. Being a powerful man. And being kind just is part of that power. When you have value, it naturally flows out of you and you give instead of take.
If she's intentionally disrespectful to "test your boundaries"?
 

mrgoodstuff

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There is a difference between being a nice guy and a strong gentleman. James Bond isn’t a jerk
Oh,he can be if he needs to. I guarantee he responds in just if a lady disrespect him. He doesn't miss a queue.
 

BadBoy89

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I notice a lot of guys on these forums do this push/pull thing with girls, act arrogant, act like a jerk, but for some reason that never seems to work for me. I get laid much more when I'm a nice guy, hold doors, have manners and stuff like that.

I have browsed this forum forever and enjoy it, but it's interesting to me that 90% of the advice is the exact opposite of what I do and I still get laid quite a bit. Can anybody shed some light on why that is? It's almost like guys are afraid that being nice is viewed as weak.
Women don’t care so much about niceness, they care about utility. Granted no women really wants to be with a jerk all the time, but a woman will sacrifice it if a man is useful to her. The love and kindness and emotion is reserved for Disney movies, music, and tv. The media loves to sell this because it’s good for the system and society. Terrible for the individual man.

Remember men, women NEED things from you.
This is what makes them run day to day, week to week, month to month. You have to be useful for them and they have to GET something out of you. In exchange they give up their body.

If that‘s not prostitution, I don’t know what is.
 
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