What do you think to this workout split?

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EyeBRollin

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Dude, stop putting your limitations on everyone else here. It's not possible for YOU, without drugs.
It's not possible for YOU either, or the OP. Do you look like that? Nope.

The physique in the pic is shredded more than he is huge.
No, he's huge and shredded. Natural lifters can either be extremely lean and somewhat muscular, or be big and somewhat lean. They can't be both huge and shredded.

I've had one buddy that wrestled at a division II college that lived off of ground beef and pony kegs that looked just as big and shredded as this pic.
No, he didn't. And if he did, there's about a 100% chance he was doping. PEDs are rampant in college athletics.

Several friends that were bigger, but not as cut living off of beans and bologny sandwiches in the penitentiary.
Thanks for proving my point.

Gaining the mass is the easy part compared to reducing bf% to this level, something that takes more mental focus and sacrifice, than anything else.
His abdominal definition suggests no more than 7% body fat. That is impossible to achieve with that much muscle mass without drugs. Body builders only stay super lean for a few hours for competitions. The human body cannot adequately function with low levels of body fat for extended periods. Not only is his body fat level low, he looks huge. Natural humans at that body fat percentage look depleted.

Take your defeatist attitude and p!ss poor genetics elsewhere.
When you know you're wrong, attack the messenger. Stop lying to the OP. The guy in the picture is obviously juiced.

Well if i can look similar to that im fine, still not going to limit myself
Fitness is about having a healthy body image. The only way you will look like a steroid abuser is through drug use. You can have an aesthetic natural physique without drugs, but it will never have the level of mass and leanness he has. Don't model your body goals after fitness models, actors, or high level athletes. If their body is their source of income, best believe they are "enhanced."
 
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Macaframalama

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It's not possible for YOU either, or the OP. Do you look like that? Nope.
Not as long as I would rather enjoy eating chitty food, than do what it takes to cut down to this level of bf%.
No, he's huge and shredded. Natural lifters can either be extremely lean and somewhat muscular, or be big and somewhat lean. They can't be both huge and shredded.
:rofl::rofl::rofl: Whatever Lol.
Body builders only stay super lean for a few hours
Very few are able to. No dispute. This isn't even a bodybuilder physique. Not even a natural bodybuilder competitors physique. This is most likely a physique competitor, that has cut down for a comp or photo op as his periodization allows, but you understand jack chit about that, because you've been doing the same chit for years and still wonder why you can't achieve anything near this level. Juiced, natty, bodybuilder, physique, regardless walk around like this year round.
When you know you're wrong, attack the messenger. Stop lying to the OP. The guy in the picture is obviously juiced.
LMAO! Dude, you are a joke and I'm probably debating a 140lb twig that eats like a bird on the other end.
 
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Macaframalama

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No, he didn't. And if he did, there's about a 100% chance he was doping. PEDs are rampant in college athletics.
Never met said guy in question, but he's 100% for sure doping. But no he didn't and if he did. Sounds legit.
Thanks for proving my point.
The penal system isn't exactly known for their healthy food options, moron. Lol
 

ImTheDoubleGreatest!

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Dude, stop putting your limitations on everyone else here. It's not possible for YOU, without drugs. The physique in the pic is shredded more than he is huge. I've had one buddy that wrestled at a division II college that lived off of ground beef and pony kegs that looked just as big and shredded as this pic. Several friends that were bigger, but not as cut living off of beans and bologny sandwiches in the penitentiary. Gaining the mass is the easy part compared to reducing bf% to this level, something that takes more mental focus and sacrifice, than anything else. Take your defeatist attitude and p!ss poor genetics elsewhere.
Well it’s not that it isn’t possible. It’s just that the guy in the picture definitely is on steroids (most fitness models are) and the level you need to be at in order to get to that point is something else entirely. What I mean by that is you will ONLY look like the guy in the picture does naturally if you NEED to. As in you need to put of survival or something. That’s the type of mindset you need to have. Ordinary people can’t maintain that though; they don’t know how to. There’s a reason why people get bigger and stronger when they get released from prison. It’s the mentality they had over there. They HAD to be that way or else the next guy would be able to walk all over them. It was felt on a subconscious level so their bodies forced itself to become that way. Basically epigenetics. That’s just one example. You can definitely get to the point of the dude in the picture, but you won’t be able to hold that state forever for one thing, and secondly you will have to change pretty much your entire lifestyle and persona (particularly when at the gym) to get it. It’s just not efficient. Plus, it’ll take years, if not decades. And by then, your body will begin to deteriorate from age or your CNS will fry way before you can get there. Most people who ever get that lean and muscularly naturally anyway have been doing physical activity their whole life, as in while going through puberty. This means that their body was needing to adapt to the stress while growing and changing, and so it also changed to become stronger and more powerful too.

It’s just not feasible to think one can get there when they’re still a beginner too. All people who are just starting out a beginners program want to look like big and ripped but in reality they’re so far away from that physique that they don’t realize they may never get there. Especially because those same people often times want results FAST, and things just don’t work that way. They end up just giving up or not sticking with it because they think it’s not worth their time. Little do they know that because they’re beginners, they’re making gains faster than anyone else in the gym who is big and strong themselves lol
 
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PeasantPlayer

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if i can get strength and muscle and get down to 10-15 percent body fat I will be fine.

I know its going to take years and a massive overhaul of my lifestyle and diet. But I am willing
 

Macaframalama

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but you won’t be able to hold that state forever for one thing
That's the point. They don't walk around at this level of bf% year round. With all the craze of bulking and cutting it looks like more people would get that. It's the same concept as powerlifters gaining mass and strength in the off-season and cutting to make a weight class for competition. It's called periodization.
What I mean by that is you will ONLY look like the guy in the picture does naturally if you NEED to.
Competition?.?.
Ordinary people can’t maintain that though;
I wouldn't exactly call individuals who have spent a decade + in the iron game ordinary. It requires sacrifice, dedication and it is just downright painful at times.
It’s just not efficient.
Not sure what the point is here?.?. Bodybuilding is the definition of inefficient, other than maintaining higher levels of mass and lower bf%'s. The whole concept of BB'ing is to constantly disrupt homeostasis. Not sure who ever called that efficient.
or your CNS will fry way before you can get there.
The method of the majority of bodybuilders is to train in a way that promotes sarcoplasmic hypertrophy (higher volume@lower intensities, longer TUT, suck pump), especially after novice and intermediate levels and CNS fatigue isn't as prevalent with training at lower intensities relative to limit strength. You see more CNS issues with powetlifters and anaerobic athletes (hammer throw, Oly weightlifting, sprinters, etc.).
It’s just not feasible to think one can get there when they’re still a beginner too.
Scroll up and you will see where I stated about the photo taking years to accomplish.
 
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Macaframalama

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if i can get strength and muscle and get down to 10-15 percent body fat I will be fine.

I know its going to take years and a massive overhaul of my lifestyle and diet. But I am willing
https://jimwendler.com/blogs/jimwendler-com/101078918-building-the-monolith-5-3-1-for-size
Plenty of Q&A's answered, feedback and before and after photos out there on the tnation forum from average Joe's out there who have completed the program. I've ran quite a few of his templates in the past and can probably answer any questions you might have or you can find them yourself on the tnation forum. If you look at this and can get more specific with what you might be looking for as far as programming protocols (amraps, drop sets, whatever floats your boat) I can send you some templates in that direction. Here's a few more...
https://jimwendler.com/blogs/jimwendler-com/101075206-5-3-1-and-bodybuilding

https://www.t-nation.com/workouts/531-how-to-build-pure-strength

https://www.t-nation.com/workouts/westside-for-skinny-bastards-1

https://www.t-nation.com/training/the-best-damn-workout-plan-for-natural-lifters
 
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ImTheDoubleGreatest!

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That's the point. They don't walk around at this level of bf% year round. With all the craze of bulking and cutting it looks like more people would get that. It's the same concept as powerlifters gaining mass and strength in the off-season and cutting to make a weight class for competition. It's called periodization.
Most NORMAL people want to look reasonably good at all times. There is no bulking and cutting for them except maybe once when they get experience just to bulk up some and then cut to look like how they want to look like. The rest of the time is a slow recomp.
Competition?.?.
Again. Normal people. When I say normal, I mean a person who wakes up, goes to the gym, lifts, heads back home to shower and eat, then go to work, and then come back home and go to sleep. Most people don’t compete. Competition places a NEED to look good or be good which will invoke a physiological response if felt on the subconscious level. Your average Joe isn’t feeling that.
I wouldn't exactly call individuals who have spent a decade + in the iron game ordinary. It requires sacrifice, dedication and it is just downright painful at times.
Then everyone is a special snowflake. No, these people are ordinary unless it is their job to be fit (i.e personal trainer), they take steroids and/or compete, or some other need to be that way (i.e prison). Yes it takes sacrifice and hard work, but so does everything else in life. Nothing special there. Most weightlifters are just ordinary people. They just so happen to lift...
Not sure what the point is here?.?. Bodybuilding is the definition of inefficient, other than maintaining higher levels of mass and lower bf%'s. The whole concept of BB'ing is to constantly disrupt homeostasis. Not sure who ever called that efficient.
Stop diluting the argument. You keep changing it to people who dedicate their lives to this ****. That’s why EyeBRollin was saying how it’s not possible to look like that really. For normal people, it isn’t. And you keep saying it is because steroid abusing professionals do. You are also forgetting that it’s thier JOB to look like that. If it wasn’t, they wouldn’t look like that. For ordinary people, they can efficiently gain a great looking physique. Just not THAT great like the dude above. Make comparisons to normal people, not competition athletes.
The method of the majority of bodybuilders is to train in a way that promotes sarcoplasmic hypertrophy (higher volume@lower intensities, longer TUT, suck pump), especially after novice and intermediate levels and CNS fatigue isn't as prevalent with training at lower intensities relative to limit strength. You see more CNS issues with powetlifters and anaerobic athletes (hammer throw, Oly weightlifting, sprinters, etc.).
It comes from too much stress in general, it’s not discriminatory to power athletes or bodybuilders or endurance athletes.
Scroll up and you will see where I stated about the photo taking years to accomplish.
Scroll down and you’ll see how I said that most normal folks want results right away. For these people, it’s unattainable because they’ll give up too fast.
 
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EyeBRollin

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if i can get strength and muscle and get down to 10-15 percent body fat I will be fine.

I know its going to take years and a massive overhaul of my lifestyle and diet. But I am willing
Brad Pitt from fight club is totally achievable natty. The picture of the other guy is not.

I'd start with a 5X5 program - either Stronglifts 5X5 or Starting Strength. Do that until you've maxed your newbie gains. It should take 3-6 months to do that. Since your base of strength doesn't seem to be advanced, I'd stick with those programs and variations for an entire year before worrying about cutting and sculpting.
 

Macaframalama

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Most NORMAL people want to look reasonably good at all times. There is no bulking and cutting for them except maybe once when they get experience just to bulk up some and then cut to look like how they want to look like. The rest of the time is a slow recomp.
Again. Normal people. When I say normal, I mean a person who wakes up, goes to the gym, lifts, heads back home to shower and eat, then go to work, and then come back home and go to sleep. Most people don’t compete. Competition places a NEED to look good or be good which will invoke a physiological response if felt on the subconscious level. Your average Joe isn’t feeling that.
Idk what you're getting at here. No one on this thread has implied that achieving op's goal will be achieved by normal measures. I think that's actually the only thing we've all agreed SEVERAL times about now.
You keep changing it to people who dedicate their lives to this ****.
Jesus H, some do and for op to ever come close to realizing something like the photo, he would have to as well.
Stop diluting the argument.
It's only diluted, because you are ignorant to the facts.
Scroll down and you’ll see how I said that most normal folks want results right away. For these people, it’s unattainable because they’ll give up too fast.
Who cares what most people want. The thread isn't about most ppl. It's about the op and HIS goal and he seems to be aware, that something like this takes a huge amount of time and effort. You made the statement and your posts are like a dog running in circles trying to catch it's tail.
comes from too much stress in general, it’s not discriminatory to power athletes or bodybuilders or endurance athletes.
No, there is CNS fatigue and metabolic stress. Agreed stress is stress and yes both are systemic, but one to a greater degree. CNS fatigue. You are also right that they are not discriminatory depending on what mesocycle an athlete is in, but it is dependent on what energy system being emphasized and loads used. An Oly lifter or powerlifter will taper to higher intensities/lower volumes, closer to competition which will be more demanding neuraly. For a bodybuilder, these phases will be in reverse and for a lesser part of their overall programming. Metabolic stress can be monitored very easily with just a little bit of awareness and easier to dig yourself out of.
 

ImTheDoubleGreatest!

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Idk what you're getting at here. No one on this thread has implied that achieving op's goal will be achieved by normal measures. I think that's actually the only thing we've all agreed SEVERAL times about now.

Jesus H, some do and for op to ever come close to realizing something like the photo, he would have to as well.

It's only diluted, because you are ignorant to the facts.

Who cares what most people want. The thread isn't about most ppl. It's about the op and HIS goal and he seems to be aware, that something like this takes a huge amount of time and effort. You made the statement and your posts are like a dog running in circles trying to catch it's tail.

No, there is CNS fatigue and metabolic stress. Agreed stress is stress and yes both are systemic, but one to a greater degree. CNS fatigue. You are also right that they are not discriminatory depending on what mesocycle an athlete is in, but it is dependent on what energy system being emphasized and loads used. An Oly lifter or powerlifter will taper to higher intensities/lower volumes, closer to competition which will be more demanding neuraly. For a bodybuilder, these phases will be in reverse and for a lesser part of their overall programming. Metabolic stress can be monitored very easily with just a little bit of awareness and easier to dig yourself out of.
You lack the social skills to understand anything that I’ve written.
 

Macaframalama

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You lack the social skills to understand anything that I’ve written.
You mean comprehension? Says the kid who doesn't know his a$$ from a hole in the ground, but seems to manage to talk out of it quite well. You are arguing against decades of science and statistical data, not me kid. I can point you in the right direction if you are willing to learn though.
 
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ImTheDoubleGreatest!

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You mean comprehension? Says the kid who doesn't know his a$$ from a hole in the ground, but seems to manage to talk out of it quite well. You are arguing against decades of science and statistical data, not me kid. I can point you in the right direction if you are willing to learn though.
You’re fat. Why are you of all people trying to insult others or even talk about fitness? It’s CLEARLY not your thing lol.
 

Macaframalama

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You’re fat. Why are you of all people trying to insult others or even talk about fitness? It’s CLEARLY not your thing lol.
CTFU! Child please. You're not in highschool anymore. You are about to be exposed for the fraud you are. You talk as though you know, when you clearly don't. Like your dissertation on prison inmates and kids growing up doing physical labor, when you could have saved your time in writing that novel and mentioned GAS and would have saved me the time in having to read all that drivel. Then, you try to muddy up the conversation by injecting what "most" or "ordinary" or "normal" gym goers want, when this post has jack chit to do with what they want. You are attempting to turn a specific goal into a general one. Then you question my knowledge of fitness, when this post has zero to do with fitness. Fitness is the ability and measure of capability to complete a SPECIFIC task. You may be fit to clock an exceptional 1 mile run time, but lack adequate fitness to log a decent 500 meter row time. As for you, you're not fit to lace my shoes, much less this conversation and I see it's been a massive waste of time. Peace and fish grease sport.
 

ImTheDoubleGreatest!

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CTFU! Child please. You're not in highschool anymore. You are about to be exposed for the fraud you are. You talk as though you know, when you clearly don't. Like your dissertation on prison inmates and kids growing up doing physical labor, when you could have saved your time in writing that novel and mentioned GAS and would have saved me the time in having to read all that drivel. Then, you try to muddy up the conversation by injecting what "most" or "ordinary" or "normal" gym goers want, when this post has jack chit to do with what they want. You are attempting to turn a specific goal into a general one. Then you question my knowledge of fitness, when this post has zero to do with fitness. Fitness is the ability and measure of capability to complete a SPECIFIC task. You may be fit to clock an exceptional 1 mile run time, but lack adequate fitness to log a decent 500 meter row time. As for you, you're not fit to lace my shoes, much less this conversation and I see it's been a massive waste of time. Peace and fish grease sport.
The butthurt is real. But that’s because the truth hurts sometimes, doesn’t it?
 
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