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This is How Bad It's Getting Out There...

Spaz

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Don't hate on another for getting what he can get. Two, I call bullsh it on your "half dozen" girls that want to date you exclusively. Nice try dude. A for effort, A+ for being on cloud9.
Agreed.

With his mindset he ain't getting anything, not just pvssy, but just abt everything else he will be lacking and at the maximum, just mediocre success, if any at all.

This is what happens when men becomes cry babies.
 

BackInTheGame78

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Why is this surprising? He has chosen to remain average and not work on improving himself to allow him to stand out in some way. Would you want to date an average woman who has nothing really going for them? Yeah well neither do they.
 

BackInTheGame78

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Exactly. Same situation here, been single for 3 years now, but recently stopped caring about women; whenever I display that I like one and ask them out, it always ends up the same, they like me as a friend but no attraction. And I will definitely NOT "work on myself" in order to have better chances with women. I work on my craft that's bringing me the results and working on my financial independence in the future.
Then you are a dumbass plain and simple.
 
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I ran into a bro similar to average guy 1 just today. He, also, is now in a steady relationship (I'm making assumptions here, I didn't inquire too closely). Here's the catch: he's in his late 30's. She's in her mid 50's. Perhaps not shockingly, he's been pursuing her for well over 2 years, let's say 3. It could be longer than that.

She has a pretty face and a huge rack. But, she has that typical, weathered appearance of a middle aged woman. She's been an acquaintance who I've never pursued for obvious reasons. But he set his sights on her 100%, regardless of the near two decades age gap.

I'm legitimately happy for him.
 

Pandora

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You have to be avoidant attachment bare minimum to even survive in the Game that long as a woman. These women were never able to attach.
So this is the psychological term for what we are witnessing. Thanks Raider. I just read up on this term and it is fascinating. Any girl that can sleep with a male outside of a committed relationship is exhibiting avoidant attachment. It is not natural for a female to sleep with a man who she is not in a committed long term relationship with. This is why women require a backstory to pornography.

Any female who has casual sex even once is repressing her natural instinct of attachment to a man that enters her body. 15 yrs ago girls would get attached after sex. In todays world we have normalized this pathology of avoidant attachment. We have normalized insanity.

Much of this hypergamy can be neutralized if you date within a strong social circle. All bets are off if you see them frequently and are already vetted by the social circle. Girls are not that picky within the "tribe". The problem is that we live isolated lives devoid of social circles.
 

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Pandora

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View attachment 3447

Analysis paralysis sometimes seems to be the theme of things.

Certain aspects have changed the logistics over the years: social media, cell phones/texting, OLD...but I don’t think things have changed so dramatically as it is sometimes made out to be.

20-30 years ago if you didn’t have a large social circle with women in it, or didn’t have the balls to do stone cold approaches, you were pretty much screwed. And even if you had such recourse, you still had to compete heavily within your own social circles.

If anything, the technology should give guys a much broader resource base to work with, even if women have become more selective because of it.

If someone stuck a computer in front of me in 1992 and told me there’s a list of thousands of women I can look at and try to hook up with, I would have considered it a gold mine; a weapon of mass destruction...an invaluable resource that never dries up.

Women are 100 times more accessible these days by comparison. That’s a fact. And even if many become entitled without good cause, you’re still able to access so many more women now that it’s not hard to just keep passing until you hit something better. You don’t have to entertain sh*t.

30 years ago if you “Nexted” a girl, you might very likely have to break into whole new social circles just to get another shot at another one; competing with a whole new set of men.

It should be easier, even if b*tches are crazy. And that’s the scary part: women are so much more accessible yet men are complaining 10 fold about the difficulties of hooking up or relationships.

Yeah it’s getting bad out there, but I wouldnt put the blame entirely on women or technology like a lot of guys so readily do. More and more men seem incapable of competing even with the huge upswing in accessibility to women compared to 2 or 3 decades ago. Imagine how much worse they would have been back then with a limited social pool....
Idk man....a limited pool means limited options for HER also. I was 14 two decades ago and it was definitely easier to pull back then.
 

Pandora

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It's better that they do remain single. Or should those women settle with men they don't want and be miserable? Would you want to be one of those men? That to me sounds bleak.

The best thing for everyone's happiness is likely to be that those women stay single, and I mean that sincerely. People who are not suited to be in relationships, and especially those who are not suited to be parents, shouldn't be expected or pressured into being so. I say we should celebrate this development as good for everyone involved.
Interesting perspective....most of these CC riders would make horrible parents.
 

biggoal

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I ran into a bro similar to average guy 1 just today. He, also, is now in a steady relationship (I'm making assumptions here, I didn't inquire too closely). Here's the catch: he's in his late 30's. She's in her mid 50's. Perhaps not shockingly, he's been pursuing her for well over 2 years, let's say 3. It could be longer than that.

She has a pretty face and a huge rack. But, she has that typical, weathered appearance of a middle aged woman. She's been an acquaintance who I've never pursued for obvious reasons. But he set his sights on her 100%, regardless of the near two decades age gap.

I'm legitimately happy for him.
And I'm getting torn up over someone who's younger, a 50 year old. The 50 year old teacher though has a very similar personality and a perfect face though and is in shape and looks young for her age.

Some 50 year olds are not bad looking. Look at Melania Trump. You can't say she's not hot.
 

Pandora

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The frame is guys attribute masculinity to their ability to chase, as if it is some great life conquest. But in reality it's pathetic. Real men climb mountains and conquer social environments. Compare that to the ability to "cold approach," and it's laughable to see where these guys' values are at. A first grader can cold approach.

Dominate your social environment, cultivate value and influence, and have all women chasing you, and now we are talking.

The real masculine guy is the guy who is so dominant that reality skews towards his favor and all women supplicate to him.

They don't understand this power.

They'd rather be Johnny Bravo than Leonardo DiCaprio.

There is a Leo in every social environment that cleans up with zero effort. Infinite validation. That's how it's supposed to be.
It took me 34 yrs to finally realize that women are supposed to chase men. We have been brainwashed into thinking it was the other way around. They give off the signals and we just capitalize on it. The PUA movement had it backwards. I was a huge cold approach guy and I was good at it. But it was very inefficient. If I had real value I would not have had to approach dozens of girls.

The thrill of cold approaching can be fun though. The adrenaline rush of going up to a beautiful stranger and making her succumb to you charisma is addictive.
 

da storm

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It took me 34 yrs to finally realize that women are supposed to chase men. We have been brainwashed into thinking it was the other way around. They give off the signals and we just capitalize on it. The PUA movement had it backwards. I was a huge cold approach guy and I was good at it. But it was very inefficient. If I had real value I would not have had to approach dozens of girls.

The thrill of cold approaching can be fun though. The adrenaline rush of going up to a beautiful stranger and making her succumb to you charisma is addictive.
When I was in high school I had over 100 girls crushing on me. My friends told me the same things puas are trying to tell you now.

“Man all you do is wait around for girls to come to you. That’s passive and feminine. Real men make the first move.”

But Let’s look at it objectively. I never paid attention to girls. Only my hobbies, friends, and grades. Girls were an afterthought, which raised my attractiveness/mystery/challenge even more. Somehow this simple logic escapes puas.

My friends who hated on me were absolutely girl crazy. They spent every waking moment thinking about game, what to wear, how to act, what to say, etc. They were completely molded by chicks.

Their entire high school life revolved around petty romance. So who was the feminine one? Lol.

As the dominant guy in a social environment, women are the seducers and the dominant guy doesn’t even have to think about them.

Hes looking at the horizon. Planning his move to get to the next level in life - a level where women remain a backdrop and nothing more.

There is no part of me that wants a woman to succumb to my charm. My attitude is more like “it’s an insult to my ego if she isnt ALREADY overtaken by my charm.”

If I felt like I had to do something to charm her, I would automatically dismiss her for failing to recognize my natural charm In the first place.

I’m 35 and still have this attitude. It normalizes my behavior in front of women. There is no part of me that is calibrating, seducing, or walking on eggshells. I don’t remember what I say to women on text because everything is a blur. And I never blow myself out with a woman who has high interest. I could be belligerent drunk and it still wouldnt matter.

There is no such thing as a dominant guy gaming women. Women game him. They calibrate to him. They try to figure out what works with HIM, not the other way around.

There are no such things as rules, tactics, tachniques, or whatever. They only exist in the backwards reality of puas.

If you ever become a dominant guy in a social environment with women in it, you will see what I mean. You would be like “oh sh1t, I can do whatever I want. I can be a delusional a$$hole and these women will just calibrate to me because they have no actual power. I’m actually the judge of all matters. All this time, I though it was women. How foolish was I. How foolish are puas.”
 

ImTheDoubleGreatest!

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People blame social media. I blame PUA's/pickup movement. There was a time where females would try to seduce me 24/7. Now it's once a blue moon. At most I get eye contact and open windows but I still have to put in some effort.

Even 6's are putting themselves in my vicinity and thinking eye contact is enough for me to do something.

There was a time where women had to work much harder to get guys they were attracted to.

Now the average chick thinks guys like me will go out of our way to chase/validate them.

It's like a mexican standoff. I'm too lazy to do anything. And she is too entitled because she got validated by 1000 simps.

It shouldn't be this easy for women. It is their job to seduce. All the desperate PUAs collectively lowered the value of all guys' validation in general. They pretty much saturated the market and created unrealistic expectations.

Even my reality is started to seem weird sometimes. I'm not going to be an attractive guy AND be a seducer/chase on top of that. I ain't giving these spoiled h0es their cake and letting them eat it too like you PUA's with no boundaries/standards.

This is why I avoid meat markets and stay in social environments. At least there, women still act submissive and natural and go for the king of the tribe. I'm not gonna be the king and chase. There is no such thing in the natural world.

Guys becoming unnatural seducers is what's contributing to this unnatural reality.
So in other words, it’s because dudes are chasing. But that’s more so because of having a weak mindset/frame, and I’d wager that it’s more attributable to simps rather than PUAs tbh. PUAs at least have some form of strength in that they’re not gonna bend over backwards for a woman and will accept a loss when it happens. Your typical lost boy simp would likely have a much harder time getting over her and would keep trying in an attempt to ‘win her over’. Those 2000ish era PUAs didn’t advocate for that. And whether anyone here wants to admit it or not, we all have some similarities between ‘us’ and ‘them’. The whole manosphere really. Anyone aware of the nature of women (the dynamics in regards to how you shouldn’t be a supplicating wimp, how you should always strive to be better, how you shouldn’t be affected by a woman, etc. ) all have some overlap whether it’s the PUAs and MGTOWS or dudes here and incels or guys over at Roosh V vs Rollo’s blog. I don’t really follow any of those at all tbh, I just know of them in relation to us based off of other users referencing them on here, but I’m pretty sure to some extent we all share some commonalities between these different ‘groups’.

Interestingly enough, when you ask most women why ‘people are so much more depressed’ and suicidal than ever before, and why a lot more people have anxiety than ever before, etc. many of them will say it’s because of social media. A lot of them do have the self-awareness that it’s bloating their ego up but will admit that it’s addicting and so they stay on anyway. Whenever you look outside, you don’t really see too many guys out there ‘cold approaching’, and many of these younger gals have their egos inflated to the point of no return even though these younger chicks don’t really get cold approached like women back before. At most maybe cat calls, but I haven’t seen that happen in forever lol.
 

ImTheDoubleGreatest!

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Never understood these Chad, Stacey, names. Seems high schoolish. My question was, what does the the person I quoted consider average and above in his mind.
I saw someone link a wiki page that was exclusively for incels and blackpill info on here. The entire website was just one big ****ing meme, it was honestly hilarious. I checked it out just because it kept me laughing irl. They did have some scientific literature in there with some real dark stuff though, which is always a good slap in the face for another wakeup call.
 

MatureDJ

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It took me 34 yrs to finally realize that women are supposed to chase men. We have been brainwashed into thinking it was the other way around. They give off the signals and we just capitalize on it. The PUA movement had it backwards. I was a huge cold approach guy and I was good at it. But it was very inefficient. If I had real value I would not have had to approach dozens of girls.
The problem is that normie-tier and below men don't get IOI from decent women. Oh sure, we get them from the fatties and the single mommies (especially when we're careermaxing), and thus we have to be the aggressor to have any hope. PUA is just a cope and a way to maximize bad odds.
 

MrWood

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Oh sure, we get them from the fatties and the single mommies
my experience is quite different...

fatties typically look down and refuse eye contact, compared to HB8+ to which I always get smiles, eyes and hello's
 

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da storm

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So in other words, it’s because dudes are chasing. But that’s more so because of having a weak mindset/frame, and I’d wager that it’s more attributable to simps rather than PUAs tbh. PUAs at least have some form of strength in that they’re not gonna bend over backwards for a woman and will accept a loss when it happens. Your typical lost boy simp would likely have a much harder time getting over her and would keep trying in an attempt to ‘win her over’. Those 2000ish era PUAs didn’t advocate for that. And whether anyone here wants to admit it or not, we all have some similarities between ‘us’ and ‘them’. The whole manosphere really. Anyone aware of the nature of women (the dynamics in regards to how you shouldn’t be a supplicating wimp, how you should always strive to be better, how you shouldn’t be affected by a woman, etc. ) all have some overlap whether it’s the PUAs and MGTOWS or dudes here and incels or guys over at Roosh V vs Rollo’s blog. I don’t really follow any of those at all tbh, I just know of them in relation to us based off of other users referencing them on here, but I’m pretty sure to some extent we all share some commonalities between these different ‘groups’.

Interestingly enough, when you ask most women why ‘people are so much more depressed’ and suicidal than ever before, and why a lot more people have anxiety than ever before, etc. many of them will say it’s because of social media. A lot of them do have the self-awareness that it’s bloating their ego up but will admit that it’s addicting and so they stay on anyway. Whenever you look outside, you don’t really see too many guys out there ‘cold approaching’, and many of these younger gals have their egos inflated to the point of no return even though these younger chicks don’t really get cold approached like women back before. At most maybe cat calls, but I haven’t seen that happen in forever lol.
Good point, I think @Amante Silvestre touched on it.

15 years ago a man had to build his roots in social circles and rise to power and attain social acuity. With it, develop a frame of reference that would allow him to qualify women.

With the invention of social media, guys Became lazy and skipped the step of social power creation. So what you have now is a bunch of manchild simps who don’t really have the social acuity to atttact women because all they know is spamming women. Spamming women in the clubs and OLD.

The right way to do it is to play the game like an politician. Developing social skills in environments with a lot of women in it. And rising in power and influence. This will autocorrect your frame and give you the “manual” as pook would say.

Inside your brain is both a king and a simp. Your brain knows how to be both. If you are not a dominant man of any social environment, it is rare for you brain to allow you to access the king frame. Unless you have really high self esteem.

What guys do is they try to skip the entire rites of passage of cultivating social circles and connections, aka access to resources and women, and just spam approach.

But their brains refuse to give them the manual and they end up as simps/puas.

I’ve preached about this for years and years. As soon as I took over a tribe that had women in it, it was as if I became self actualized. I magically started to carry the king frame and automatically qualified and dismissed every woman. It wasn’t even a conscious thing. My frame was completely embedded into my presence and every woman submitted to me right away nonverbally.

I even carried this frame into the night clubs. It was just dismiss dismiss dismiss for all the entitlement girls have going on. And when I hooked, it was hard. Like total supplication and admiration. Make out on the spot.

Seems like only a few men in this forum know what I am talking about. Probably because most guys skipped the whole “become a dominant leader of tribes” part when growing up.

It’s a rites of passage that you cannot skip if you want to access your highest frame. Unless of course, you have an incredible sense of sovereignty.
 
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user252009

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What guys do is they try to skip the entire rites of passage of cultivating social circles and connections, aka access to resources and women, and just spam approach.

But their brains refuse to give them the manual and they end up as simps/puas.
Guys are just getting sick of it, because females don't have to do jack shiet to get the guys, while guys have to kick their own ass - more and more, to even get a shot - screw that. That's why MGTOW is growing - in today's environment, fewer and fewer guys have time to get into these social-focused circles of interest (if they're not interested in those activities by default, which many of us aren't), so we'd rather spend that time on our own passions, making more money and live a more independent and happier life.
 

da storm

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Guys are just getting sick of it, because females don't have to do jack shiet to get the guys, while guys have to kick their own ass - more and more, to even get a shot - screw that. That's why MGTOW is growing - in today's environment, fewer and fewer guys have time to get into these social-focused circles of interest (if they're not interested in those activities by default, which many of us aren't), so we'd rather spend that time on our own passions, making more money and live a more independent and happier life.
The problem with MTGTOW is that they try to separate women and life.

Women and life are one. I view them as resources.

So does the rest of the world.

The same way I seek to make money and develop professional connections so that I can rise in power and status, I seek access to women as they are a part of resources.

The same way I wouldn’t complain about how hard it is to rise to the top of the corporate or political world, I wouldn’t complain about how hard it is to gain access to women.

I don’t expect women to love me like my mother did. This is where the bitterness comes from.

If you just view women as part of the environment that goes for guys in power ( a game you are already playing anyway), then there is really no separation.

Become the most fit guy at the gym -bang, there’s women to give you attention. The best dancer at the clubs- every woman wants to take you home. The most popular man in town - there’s a bunch of women wanting to go along for the ride. The top guy in the company - every intern chick wants to bang you.

Unless you work in the tech field, there’s always going to be females in your immediate environment who reward the dominant guys. High school never ended.
 

zekko

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When I was in high school I had over 100 girls crushing on me.
That is not the average guy's experience, however. If most men "pay no attention to women", most women won't even notice. You have to be on their radar to begin with. Either because of looks, status, or as you say, dominance.

"Game" and cold approaching isn't for guys who have 100 girls crushing on them. It's for guys who aren't getting enough options and are wanting to choose some of the women they are dating. Because the ones who are coming to them aren't coming frequent enough or aren't high quality enough.
 

da storm

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That is not the average guy's experience, however. If most men "pay no attention to women", most women won't even notice. You have to be on their radar to begin with. Either because of looks, status, or as you say, dominance.

"Game" and cold approaching isn't for guys who have 100 girls crushing on them. It's for guys who aren't getting enough options and are wanting to choose some of the women they are dating. Because the ones who are coming to them aren't coming frequent enough or aren't high quality enough.
Game and cold approaching is actually a "marketed" option for guys who aren’t getting enough options. What I mean by that is the clever PUA marketers found a demographic that they could sell snake oil too.

Pay attention to guys who do well cold approaching and it is still the guys who have 100 options.

That’s what the meat market is actually for.

The dudes lacking options would have their self esteem killed by the lack of positive feedback loop in the unforgiving meat market.

The right option for guys who lack options is actually social circles/environments that have a lot of women in it.

There, the women are less picky, you can easily elevate your status through reputation, and you would internalize female behavior through the process of osmosis.

Simply existing around women will erase a lot of your social awkwardness.

It would also make you less needy. Neediness is perpetuated by the fact that we live in big cities and no longer exist small clusters. It can crate an isolated feeling.

Basically, all the benefits for middling guys who lack options exist in social environments that has a lot of women. The barrier of entry is a lot lower.

But what do these guys do instead? They go to the clubs, accumulate hundreds of rejections, become disillusioned and jaded, and end up joining the priesthood, aka MTGTOW.

Don’t worry middling status guys – nature didn’t forget about you. Nature created a perfect design.

Within a tribe, you can climb the social ladder through credibility, leadership, and reputation. It does most of the work for you. And the older you get and the more credibility and merit you accumulate, the more social circles will open up for you. Soon you would be connected to tons of circles and invited to tons of social events where all you would have to do is warm approaches.

I figured it all out so that you guys don’t have to.

The meat market is for guys who have meat. It is very unforgiving. And the amount of time a guy takes to have just enough success where he can internalize what women are all about, he could have easily accomplished it in 1/100th the time in social circles.

That’s how quickly a guy can internalize women in a social environment full of women. It takes like a month.

But meat market game will take years and years, maybe even decades. By the time he hits pay dirt, he will be worn out and jaded.
 
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