Sleep for Working Professionals 2

[nicksaiz65]

Hey, guys. But of a rant incoming… I made a thread like this in the past, but I was still a student at the time and I didn’t really know what I was doing with myself. I have more experience now, so I’d like to touch on this topic again.

So, the balance of sleep and achieving a very high level of success. I’ve seen two separate philosophies on this on SS, and in general.

On one hand, you have people like Eric Thomas who promote “don’t sleep when you’re tired, sleep when you’re done.” Then, you have the camp of people who recommend that you must make sleep a priority.

I’ve had experience with both, and I don’t know which one I choose to achieve the high level of success I want in life while keeping my sanity for the most part.

When I did the “don’t sleep when you’re tired, sleep when you’re done” camp of things, I got so much work done that it was actually insane. I remember when I was in undergrad struggling through Operating Systems, I said eff it and decided to follow an Eric Thomas philosophy. I would stay up as late as it took to get the work done, even if that meant watching the lectures three times over.

I remember one particular night, I had a few Bangs, put on some good music, and I stayed up for literally ten hours just watching the lectures and doing practice problems instead of going to sleep.

The result of that was, my grades freaking skyrocketed. I was so proud of my hard work, and it paid off well(by letting me get a well paying software job in the future.)

I did a similar thing while I was an adult, and the results were great. I got literally so much done in my my passion(music), career, and in my fitness as well(my cardio went up a ton because of all those late night runs.) I was even able to keep my house in great shape because I always had time to clean it. I felt like such a hard worker, and the results were pretty damn noticeable. It felt great, because I ALWAYS had time to get the work done that I wanted, to achieve what I wanted.

However, there were some serious drawbacks to this as well. The main one would have to be my mental health, or lack thereof. While I was getting a ton of stuff done, it nearly felt like I was in a waking nightmare 24/7. I remember thinking, “I’m so sick of this, I just want this to end, if I can just make it to March 15th, I can finally escape this hell.” It was really affecting my mental health, and the amount of caffeine I had to consume to stay up and get all that work done was wild, even though it really increased productivity. At one point, I was probably drinking 3-4 energy drinks a day, not too far away from Brandon Carter’s caffeine intake

I loved the productivity and how much I got done, but in some ways I don’t want to feel like that ever again.

After a while, I got sick of living in that state, and I decided to get as much sleep as I wanted essentially. I felt like a completely different person. I didn’t get as much done, but I felt like my head was clearer, I was in so much of a better mood, and I didn’t feel like I was in a waking hell 24/7. Also, my left eye wasn’t constantly twitching from the admittedly excessive caffeine intake.

However, the productivity from that first phase was lacking, and I did miss that. I didn’t accomplish nearly as much in my life. It always felt like a constant battle with time management, because when getting enough sleep was a requirement, I wasn’t 100% sure if I was going to be able to get all my stuff done, even though I wasn’t wasting any time during the day. This was stressful in its own way.

I suppose a relevant part of this conversation could also be not overloading myself, or refusing to take on a workload that makes me feel overwhelmed.

But for this one, I don’t think there’s really a middle ground. I’d need to choose a philosophy/camp and stick with it, tbh.

With the Eric Thomas philosophy, is this just what it feels like to be a successful adult? I’m not sure.

Wanted to get some thoughts/opinions on this issue, because this drastically affects how I will attack my goals in the future.

 

[BackInTheGame78]

Hey, guys. But of a rant incoming… I made a thread like this in the past, but I was still a student at the time and I didn’t really know what I was doing with myself. I have more experience now, so I’d like to touch on this topic again.

So, the balance of sleep and achieving a very high level of success. I’ve seen two separate philosophies on this on SS, and in general.

On one hand, you have people like Eric Thomas who promote “don’t sleep when you’re tired, sleep when you’re done.” Then, you have the camp of people who recommend that you must make sleep a priority.

I’ve had experience with both, and I don’t know which one I choose to achieve the high level of success I want in life while keeping my sanity for the most part.

When I did the “don’t sleep when you’re tired, sleep when you’re done” camp of things, I got so much work done that it was actually insane. I remember when I was in undergrad struggling through Operating Systems, I said eff it and decided to follow an Eric Thomas philosophy. I would stay up as late as it took to get the work done, even if that meant watching the lectures three times over.

I remember one particular night, I had a few Bangs, put on some good music, and I stayed up for literally ten hours just watching the lectures and doing practice problems instead of going to sleep.

The result of that was, my grades freaking skyrocketed. I was so proud of my hard work, and it paid off well(by letting me get a well paying software job in the future.)

I did a similar thing while I was an adult, and the results were great. I got literally so much done in my my passion(music), career, and in my fitness as well(my cardio went up a ton because of all those late night runs.) I was even able to keep my house in great shape because I always had time to clean it. I felt like such a hard worker, and the results were pretty damn noticeable. It felt great, because I ALWAYS had time to get the work done that I wanted, to achieve what I wanted.

However, there were some serious drawbacks to this as well. The main one would have to be my mental health, or lack thereof. While I was getting a ton of stuff done, it nearly felt like I was in a waking nightmare 24/7. I remember thinking, “I’m so sick of this, I just want this to end, if I can just make it to March 15th, I can finally escape this hell.” It was really affecting my mental health, and the amount of caffeine I had to consume to stay up and get all that work done was wild, even though it really increased productivity. At one point, I was probably drinking 3-4 energy drinks a day, not too far away from Brandon Carter’s caffeine intake

I loved the productivity and how much I got done, but in some ways I don’t want to feel like that ever again.

After a while, I got sick of living in that state, and I decided to get as much sleep as I wanted essentially. I felt like a completely different person. I didn’t get as much done, but I felt like my head was clearer, I was in so much of a better mood, and I didn’t feel like I was in a waking hell 24/7. Also, my left eye wasn’t constantly twitching from the admittedly excessive caffeine intake.

However, the productivity from that first phase was lacking, and I did miss that. I didn’t accomplish nearly as much in my life. It always felt like a constant battle with time management, because when getting enough sleep was a requirement, I wasn’t 100% sure if I was going to be able to get all my stuff done, even though I wasn’t wasting any time during the day. This was stressful in its own way.

I suppose a relevant part of this conversation could also be not overloading myself, or refusing to take on a workload that makes me feel overwhelmed.

But for this one, I don’t think there’s really a middle ground. I’d need to choose a philosophy/camp and stick with it, tbh.

With the Eric Thomas philosophy, is this just what it feels like to be a successful adult? I’m not sure.

Wanted to get some thoughts/opinions on this issue, because this drastically affects how I will attack my goals in the future.

If you are going to do this, get it all out of your system now while you are young before 27.

It gets increasingly more difficult to pull this off as you get older.

Also realize that you are basically trashing your body, killing your T levels, spiking your cortisol, spiking blood sugar, causing insulin resistance, weight gain, disrupting it's normal circadian rhthym and setting yourself up health problems increasingly the more you do it as lack of sleep is the number one stressor on the body. There is a reason why 3rd shift workers have a lot more health issues and that's not even with them trying this strategy.

Short term, you can get some good results. Long term you destroy your body and the results will fade as you become more and more tired at all times of the day.

For the first time in my life I have prioritized my sleep for the past 4-5 months and have felt a huge difference.

 

[nicksaiz65]

If you are going to do this, get it all out of your system now while you are young before 27.

It gets increasingly more difficult to pull this off as you get older.

Also realize that you are basically trashing your body, killing your T levels, spiking your cortisol, spiking blood sugar, causing insulin resistance, weight gain, disrupting it's normal circadian rhthym and setting yourself up health problems increasingly the more you do it as lack of sleep is the number one stressor on the body. There is a reason why 3rd shift workers have a lot more health issues and that's not even with them trying this strategy.

Short term, you can get some good results. Long term you destroy your body and the results will fade as you become more and more tired at all times of the day.

For the first time in my life I have prioritized my sleep for the past 4-5 months and have felt a huge difference.

Yeah, I’m thinking that this low sleep stuff is not sustainable.

I’ve been sleeping until I feel rested without an alarm even recently, and I feel incredible. It’s like I’m living on a different planet.

If I had to re-do it all, I wouldn’t overload myself with these 17 hour semesters in college. I’d take 13 max, and take summer courses every semester so I could have more time to sleep and thus retain my mental.

 

[BillyPilgrim]

Look up Adrenal Fatigue/HPA axis dysfunction OP. That's the part Eric Thomas is leaving out...

 

[BillyPilgrim]

Oh and a LOT of rock stars died at the age of 27...the ol' body stopped working they way they thought it would...

 

[EyeBRollin]

Sleep is not optional. Sleep is far more important than an extra couple hours of work.

 

[Ricky]

The book… Matthew walker- why we sleep really explains why sleep is so important

read it right before the pandemic

 

[SW15]

Prioritize sleep. Sleeping 7-9 hours a night will do wonders for your health.

 

[Machine10033]

You need sleep...

I developed overtraining syndrome multiple times and pretty much shut my immune system down twice. In college I was working at UPS.. loading trucks.. 3am-8 or 9.. popping ephedra... lifting, running... classes... then playing a ton of intramural sports... home.. study... bed at 11... repeat. I ended up with a bunch of nagging injuries and colds. I kept pushing through... the one cold kept getting worse... eventually walking to class I collapsed. My oxygen levels were horrible and I had double pneumonia. Spent two weeks in the hospital and it took almost 6 months to fully recover. Your body will eventually make you rest. Through injury... or illness.

the best approach is minimize all wasted time and prioritizing what you need to get done while keeping your health and well being the number 1 priority at all times.

 

[BillyPilgrim]

You need sleep...

I developed overtraining syndrome multiple times and pretty much shut my immune system down twice. In college I was working at UPS.. loading trucks.. 3am-8 or 9.. popping ephedra... lifting, running... classes... then playing a ton of intramural sports... home.. study... bed at 11... repeat. I ended up with a bunch of nagging injuries and colds. I kept pushing through... the one cold kept getting worse... eventually walking to class I collapsed. My oxygen levels were horrible and I had double pneumonia. Spent two weeks in the hospital and it took almost 6 months to fully recover. Your body will eventually make you rest. Through injury... or illness.

the best approach is minimize all wasted time and prioritizing what you need to get done while keeping your health and well being the number 1 priority at all times.

People need to realize time management is as much health management as it is being organized.

 

[RazorRambo24]

Simply put, if you're not getting enough sleep, you won't be able to operate at maximum efficiency/capability. Your brain won't be able to operate the same, etc.. you just won't have a good work output.

HOWEVER, sometimes when you are sleep deprived, you almost get these creative ideas that seemingly come outta nowhere.. Because your mind is teetering into that magical theta gamma state every so often where really creative, innovative and even mystical ideas take place.

What I learned about staying up and working and not sleeping enough though, is your brain after some time gets used to staying up and you feel like you need less sleep to be able to think and process information or come up with ideas. This can be dangerous though because it can affect your overall sleep.. So then when you sleep your brain is not fully at rest.. the brain is still firing off constantly while your eyes are closed, even if you drift into a sleep, it ends up being more of a active brain sleep than a real deep HGH releasing muscle repairing tissue rebuilding sleep.

As a final little added note: Look up the importance of circadian rythyms . The best guy to listen to who talkss about this stuff more than anyone I know of is Dr Andrew Huberman of Huberman Labs.

 

[Machine10033]

[

People need to realize time management is as much health management as it is being organized.

At 35 years old I got a journal/planner. I map out my days, weeks and months. It has made life so much easier... I build in rest time and plenty of sleep. I also have a garmin forerunner watch.... does an amazing job of keeping tabs of my fitness levels... and if I am over taxed/ over training. I learned the hard way that life shouldn’t be one endless grind.. filled with pain and exhaustion.

 

[BillyPilgrim]

[


I learned the hard way that life shouldn’t be one endless grind.. filled with pain and exhaustion.

The "work hard, play hard" mentality will lead you to that.

 

[nicksaiz65]

You need sleep...

I developed overtraining syndrome multiple times and pretty much shut my immune system down twice. In college I was working at UPS.. loading trucks.. 3am-8 or 9.. popping ephedra... lifting, running... classes... then playing a ton of intramural sports... home.. study... bed at 11... repeat. I ended up with a bunch of nagging injuries and colds. I kept pushing through... the one cold kept getting worse... eventually walking to class I collapsed. My oxygen levels were horrible and I had double pneumonia. Spent two weeks in the hospital and it took almost 6 months to fully recover. Your body will eventually make you rest. Through injury... or illness.

the best approach is minimize all wasted time and prioritizing what you need to get done while keeping your health and well being the number 1 priority at all times.

I agree that this is the way to do it, excellent time management.

In retrospect, how would you have handled it in college to get your rest if you had to do it all again?

I’m assuming you needed the money to pay for college, so you couldn’t work less hours.

The best solution I could think of, is to take 12 hour semesters in addition to classes every summer. That, and using every second of every day that you have available (time management)

 

[nicksaiz65]

Simply put, if you're not getting enough sleep, you won't be able to operate at maximum efficiency/capability. Your brain won't be able to operate the same, etc.. you just won't have a good work output.

HOWEVER, sometimes when you are sleep deprived, you almost get these creative ideas that seemingly come outta nowhere.. Because your mind is teetering into that magical theta gamma state every so often where really creative, innovative and even mystical ideas take place.

What I learned about staying up and working and not sleeping enough though, is your brain after some time gets used to staying up and you feel like you need less sleep to be able to think and process information or come up with ideas. This can be dangerous though because it can affect your overall sleep.. So then when you sleep your brain is not fully at rest.. the brain is still firing off constantly while your eyes are closed, even if you drift into a sleep, it ends up being more of a active brain sleep than a real deep HGH releasing muscle repairing tissue rebuilding sleep.

As a final little added note: Look up the importance of circadian rythyms . The best guy to listen to who talkss about this stuff more than anyone I know of is Dr Andrew Huberman of Huberman Labs.

Andrew Huberman has a lot of good information

 

[Machine10033]

I agree that this is the way to do it, excellent time management.

In retrospect, how would you have handled it in college to get your rest if you had to do it all again?

I’m assuming you needed the money to pay for college, so you couldn’t work less hours.

The best solution I could think of, is to take 12 hour semesters in addition to classes every summer. That, and using every second of every day that you have available (time management)

looking back I would have cut back some on the physical activities. I would have hit the weight room 3 times a week... definitely cut out a ton of cardio..I could have probably held up if I wasn’t ripping down my body 5-6 days a week with no sleep to repair it. It took me 20 some years to realize less is often more.

weekends I would have focused on relaxing and recovery... instead I was going out with my friends... often until 2am.

 

[nicksaiz65]

looking back I would have cut back some on the physical activities. I would have hit the weight room 3 times a week... definitely cut out a ton of cardio..I could have probably held up if I wasn’t ripping down my body 5-6 days a week with no sleep to repair it. It took me 20 some years to realize less is often more.

weekends I would have focused on relaxing and recovery... instead I was going out with my friends... often until 2am.

I have considered taking some weekends off just to catch up on sleep, whenever I have an insane week.

You can still get in a good amount of approaches overall by going out every other weekend.

I felt fvcking phenomenal after the days I got 10-11 hours of sleep

 

[Machine10033]

You can still get in a good amount of approaches overall by going out every other weekend.

honestly I often found gaming useless when I was exhausted. I would go out with my buddies and would keep thinking about How horrible I felt. I still remember girls coming up to me and saying man... you don’t look like your having a good time... or asking me if I’m alright ... I was like yeah... i need sleep... but bought into the ridiculous grind mentality.

 

[BillyPilgrim]

honestly I often found gaming useless when I was exhausted. I would go out with my buddies and would keep thinking about How horrible I felt. I still remember girls coming up to me and saying man... you don’t look like your having a good time... or asking me if I’m alright ... I was like yeah... i need sleep... but bought into the ridiculous grind mentality.

Work hard, play hard, die young.

 

[MatureDJ]

Sleep is the activity we have evolved to regenerate, and a good night's sleep is the best thing you can do for your health. If you're the type of person that can simply rest his head on a pillow and go to sleep, be thankful for it. If not, first try everything that doesn't require a Rx, like Melatonin & herbs like Valerin (Alteril is a good formulation that has this), or Benadryl, if your prostate can take it , but don't be shy in getting an Rx for something like Zolpidem to help out.