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Girls lose interest after dates and communication fizzles out..Help!?

SW15

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Shirtless pic= fuc boy.
@G-Unit wants to be a fucck boy. He said that he wants a solid rotation of plates. He said he is sick of LTRs.

I'm quite direct and "abrasive". How do I get a more "Chad" type persona? I think Chads are more chill, not too serious and relaxed, positive generally.

Also, about money. I actually do have it, but I don't flaunt it. I don't have top tier apartment (yet, but plans in future), I don't even have a car. I have significant holdings, but girls don't see that and I don't talk about it. Basically my wealth is stealth and I want to keep it that way for now. Otherwise, I have very expensive clothes, tech, so they can tell I have money and I never complain about money
Direct and "abrasive" plays poorly in regions of the USA other than big cities in the Northeast. You can't be direct and "abrasive" if you wish to succeed in Western and Southern regions of the USA.

Your apartment isn't doing you any favors either. I got laid in an adequate one bedroom apartment but realized I needed to upgrade so I got a better than average but not exceptional one bedroom apartment.

Flaunting wealth is better for getting vag than stealth wealth. Height, hair, and money is a winning combo.

Do you have a Rolex?
 

Howiestern

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My guess is something is off with the vibe you project. At first glance, you come across as pretty vanilla personality wise. You need some depth, intrigue, and passion to you. You need to let a girl see that you have some character and emotions. You aren't communicating that or its not there. I'm not sure. You need these things to build a connection. You need to seek out commonalities to build bonds.

Maybe you spend too much time listening. 60/40 is a good split. Let her talk 60% of the time.

I can tell from what you have shared that you are way into your looks, and you worry about physical things(body & voice) too much. People like that tend to lack self confidence and have insecurity issues. You stated you take xanax and antidepressants. This is girl stuff right here.

Your manly exterior, doesn't match your interior. This is why there is no spark.
 

G-Unit

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You aren’t a Chad personality. All you can change is becoming better at speaking, social awareness, and acting masculine. Charisma itself cannot be taught.

I’ll use myself as an example. I’m not hard, thuggish, nor am I a Pookie. I can’t “learn” how to be one because it isn’t me. So I shouldn’t advertise myself that way. Women are socially aware enough to sniff this out every time.
Neuroplasticity dictates that brain changes over time.
I need to know what changes to make and I will make them.
Just tell me what to change specifically.
Right now it seems, my communication is straight, abrasive and to the point and extremely logical.
To lessen this, I should focus on intrigue, being more vague and spiking her emotions via texts (since that is usually where it all fails, the dates themselves are fine).

OP do you sext at all via text? If a Tinder girl is hooked by your shirtless pic, it wouldn't hurt and helps establish a connection, along with opening up a little bit emotionally.
I never sext via text, no. I probably should learn that skill.

You aren’t necessarily arrogant but people still assume.
This is true. I've been told I'm arrogant at times, even though I feel like I am not necessarily.

Interesting advice from @BeExcellent
I have indeed been on dates with REALLY hot women, like model tier.
But they never worked out. I think I just wasn't used to that level.
But now even more average girls are bailing on me. Idk, I will see how I can learn to calibrate better, how to read her better.
I'm kind of cold and abrasive in general, very systematic, logical, but at least I learned to observe and listen. I guess I might lack funny flirting skills, my sexualization is almost always physical not with words.
 

G-Unit

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Direct and "abrasive" plays poorly in regions of the USA other than big cities in the Northeast. You can't be direct and "abrasive" if you wish to succeed in Western and Southern regions of the USA.
But I'm from Europa, not from USA. I'm from a completely different culture. From a culture where people don't smile on street or stores.
Your apartment isn't doing you any favors either. I got laid in an adequate one bedroom apartment but realized I needed to upgrade so I got a better than average but not exceptional one bedroom apartment.
I will upgrade. Apartment upgrade is in plans, but I don't think its the apartment, since they never get that far lol..
Do you have a Rolex?
No, but at numerous times seriously considered getting one.
I would rather get a better apartment and then get Rolex as finishing touch instead of setting her high expectations with ROlex and bring her to mediocre apartment.
 

G-Unit

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You need some depth, intrigue, and passion to you.
I hide any depth, because it's all incredibly sociopathic and harmful. I'm really not a good person, so I can't express my true feelings openly. I'm pretty much a sociopath :( so I have to learn to be an actor and wear a mask.

Your manly exterior, doesn't match your interior. This is why there is no spark.
Possibly, but I was very unstable without drugs, so I have to take them to become more "chill" and "normal". This instability has netted be a lot of good things in life, but it makes me volatile also.

Still, on dates, I make sure to be "normal" and listen and ask questions, make observations and basically be "chill". My psychopathy only showed off in LTRs after 6 months or so, I don't reveal my powerlevel to normal people, so I don't scare them off immediately (but they seem to pick up something anyway).

One girl said. "Are you stressed out?" during date.
I wasn't. "Guys clench their jaws when they are nervous".
I just clench my jaw out of habit lol
 

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SW15

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But I'm from Europa, not from USA. I'm from a completely different culture. From a culture where people don't smile on street or stores.
I'm not sure how Europe plays compared to certain USA regions.

Apartment upgrade is in plans, but I don't think its the apartment, since they never get that far lol..

I would rather get a better apartment and then get Rolex as finishing touch instead of setting her high expectations with ROlex and bring her to mediocre apartment.
You're correct that you're not having an apartment problem. "One date, no sex, no second date" problems are difficult to figure out.

Apartment upgrade would be a higher priority than a Rolex.

Your manly exterior, doesn't match your interior. This is why there is no spark.
This is it! Women do not like incongruence.
 

Howiestern

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I'm kind of cold and abrasive in general, very systematic, logical, but at least I learned to observe and listen. I guess I might lack funny flirting skills, my sexualization is almost always physical not with words.

The way into a womans panties is thru her brain. Its almost always mental. You have to flip all the right switches first. Cold, abrasive, systematic, and physical is not going to work. Doing those things I mentioned earlier regarding verbal in person communication is how you create that spark.

You'll need to expose yourself somewhat. You want the girl to expose herself, yet you aren't willing? Its what a $tripper faces at a topless bar. That exposing starts with a two way conversation. But it takes confidence in who you are to put yourself out there and not worry about what others think.
 
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G-Unit

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This is it! Women do not like incongruence.
I tried to be congruent by being "the strong silent masculine type", but instead I think I came off as "boring type" lol.
I really don't know what the issue is.
I think MAYBE the girls expect me to be more interested in them and write to them after the date or show more affection.
But when I did it, I got immediately ghosted (those girls were hot).
Maybe if you message girl once a week, the message has to carry a strong emotional impact and not just "Hey, when you free, let's meet up"?
I"m trying to figure out this puzzle.
 

G-Unit

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I'm kind of cold and abrasive in general, very systematic, logical, but at least I learned to observe and listen. I guess I might lack funny flirting skills, my sexualization is almost always physical not with words.

The way into a womans panties is thru her brain. Its almost always mental. You have to flip all the right switches first. Cold, abrasive, systematic, and physical is not going to work. Doing those things I mentioned earlier regarding verbal in person communication is how you create that spark.
I read what you said.

You said I have to have
At first glance, you come across as pretty vanilla personality wise. You need some depth, intrigue, and passion to you. You need to let a girl see that you have some character and emotions. You aren't communicating that or its not there. I'm not sure. You need these things to build a connection. You need to seek out commonalities to build bonds.
I have "depth", but those are mostly interests no girls care about. Those are deep topics that I talk with specific mates. I have very high goals and specific aspirations and ideas, but I don't talk about them with others. A lot of that sounds incredibly vague.

What you said about intrigue, actionable could be making the date sound more fun by building intrigue like "You know, I just thought of a fun idea for us". And she will be like "What, what did you think of?" Or something more than just "let's go meet at x". I think something in post-date communication might be the issue, since women often seem quite into me during dates. Dates often exceed an hour. It's not like its boring, we talk a lot. I think I just don't have that flirty chill player vibe nailed down. That is my suspicion.
 

EyeOnThePrize

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@G-Unit
We have similar metrics, except my first date lay rate is almost 100%. It sounds like your charm is weak. Also why do you think you're a bad person? I've probably done worse than you lol.

From reading all this there are two things that come to mind given your goals of casual fun without LTRs.

1. It's called a rotation for a reason. Most hot women worth fuucking aren't content with just being fuucked unless it's a one off convenience, they want a trophy husband or otherwise something deeper. Hot girls can't go down the street without tripping over c0cks wanting to fuuck them. If they just want to fuuck it's easy. You have to be worth the inconvenience of waiting or going to your place, which is why that first convenience fuuck you have to really blow their minds.

The women that are confident enough to just be FWB are less common, and in the back of their minds they're still trying to pick one guy to have something more serious with. If an LTR is really not something you want then embrace the playboy vibe and quit dates after the first solid date. Meet up for a quick coffee outside your place or invite them over. Or if you're driving by their place tell them you're stopping by to give them a nice stretch. Ideally they can communicate their desire for something deeper, and many of the women that take care of themselves will likely pass on you when you say you want to keep it casual. Some will continue seeing you but randomly drop off as they find the LTR they were looking for.

Some that are head over heels for you will continue your game and try to strap you down. But after a while of no progress they'll cut ties out of frustration. This all just comes with the territory of keeping things casual.

Some will love spending time with you and you'll end up seeing them more often because they're just so fun and easy. This is likely the girls you'll naturally fall into committed open or closed relationships with. It will not feel like a pain, it will feel fun, organic, and like a natural next step.

2. You haven't mentioned your hammer or performance and how girls react to sex. If you're laying pipe for hours, sweating all over them, twisting them up, and you've got a decent hammer women should be going absolutely nuts when you fuuck and happy to give you more at the drop of a hat. Since you only want casual fun this is where you have to outshine all their other prospects (since those guys will offer things you won't). If you're selfish during sex or you're not fuucking her for hours or until she taps, then you're likely nothing special to her and worth a pass or little effort.

I could go on but would prefer more info on the above.
 

Howiestern

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I have "depth", but those are mostly interests no girls care about. Those are deep topics that I talk with specific mates. I have very high goals and specific aspirations and ideas, but I don't talk about them with others. A lot of that sounds incredibly vague.
If You aren't willing to share the depth you have, and you assume women see no value in it, then how do you expect to captivate a womans mind enough so she goes out with you a second time?

Women are fully aware that guys who are super into looking good are too vain,boring, and lack substance. Its the substance you need to get you to the second date.
 

G-Unit

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If You aren't willing to share the depth you have, and you assume women see no value in it, then how do you expect to captivate a womans mind enough so she goes out with you a second time?
That "depth" is psychopathic to a normal human and involves delusions of grandeur and basically things that I would get destroyed for in society if I ever mentioned them out loud. That "depth" is something I will take to my grave.

Women are fully aware that guys who are super into looking good are too vain,boring, and lack substance. Its the substance you need to get you to the second date.
I'm not "THAT" good looking. My body is great, my height is great, my clothes are great. My face is ABOVE AVERAGE. It's OK, it's good, it's fine, it's "cute". It's not "Hollywood" or "model tier". My hair is fine and thick. I'm solid, but not like a superChad.

how do you expect to captivate a womans mind enough so she goes out with you a second time?
I guess I have to just speak little, remain mysterious, but isntead of just listening, flirt more and draw some images in her mind like the fun stuff we could be doing together. Would that work?

2. You haven't mentioned your hammer or performance and how girls react to sex. If you're laying pipe for hours, sweating all over them, twisting them up, and you've got a decent hammer women should be going absolutely nuts when you fuuck and happy to give you more at the drop of a hat. Since you only want casual fun this is where you have to outshine all their other prospects (since those guys will offer things you won't). If you're selfish during sex or you're not fuucking her for hours or until she taps, then you're likely nothing special to her and worth a pass or little effort.
My sex game is nothing special, but I must say that 100% of the girls I ****ed want to see me again and start to chase. 100%, I'm not joking. So they obviously enjoyed sex with me a great deal even though to me it wasn't that good. I don't have a big **** and I often don't even get that hard due to porn induced erectile dysfunction, but something the way I handle their bodies and dominate during sex and also my body makes them really intrigued and they want more than one time.

The problem is it never gets to sex! And mostly never gets to them coming to my apartment.
I've often heard "do you always invite girls to apartment at second date?". "I don't go to apartment on first date", etc...
 

BillyPilgrim

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I guess I have to just speak little, remain mysterious, but isntead of just listening, flirt more and draw some images in her mind like the fun stuff we could be doing together. Would that work?
I would say yes.

Also, depth to a woman be can simply relating emotionally on fluff talk/small talk. Depth is different to a man than it is to a woman.
 

EyeOnThePrize

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That "depth" is psychopathic to a normal human and involves delusions of grandeur and basically things that I would get destroyed for in society if I ever mentioned them out loud. That "depth" is something I will take to my grave.


I'm not "THAT" good looking. My body is great, my height is great, my clothes are great. My face is ABOVE AVERAGE. It's OK, it's good, it's fine, it's "cute". It's not "Hollywood" or "model tier". My hair is fine and thick. I'm solid, but not like a superChad.


I guess I have to just speak little, remain mysterious, but isntead of just listening, flirt more and draw some images in her mind like the fun stuff we could be doing together. Would that work?


My sex game is nothing special, but I must say that 100% of the girls I ****ed want to see me again and start to chase. 100%, I'm not joking. So they obviously enjoyed sex with me a great deal even though to me it wasn't that good. I don't have a big **** and I often don't even get that hard due to porn induced erectile dysfunction, but something the way I handle their bodies and dominate during sex and also my body makes them really intrigued and they want more than one time.

The problem is it never gets to sex! And mostly never gets to them coming to my apartment.
I've often heard "do you always invite girls to apartment at second date?". "I don't go to apartment on first date", etc...
Sounds like you're wasting time on prudes looking for something deeper or need to work on the charm.

It pays to treat the date like a test for them, are you going to invite them to your place? Hm let's see how they act, do they smell good, are they polite and turning you on? Are they high maintenance? On the first date you should be on the fence and never really reveal that you want them at your place even when you decide so. Finesse it so that it comes across as her idea.

Regarding Chad status, imo a Chad doesn't obsess about game this much, and thus there's no chads on this forum. A Chad imo is just living life and taking all the free pus$y that falls in his lap while he's out doing the stuff he really enjoys and is in love with. Think James Bond, well old James Bond anyway. His lay count may be lower than someone actively trying to fuuck every woman in sight, but that's because he hardly has to do anything to get laid and has higher aspirations anyway.
 

G-Unit

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Here we go.
So I messaged one girl out of curiosity. I dated her we kissed, went on 4 dates, she seemed flakey and non-responsive.
I was like. "It's very hard to get a meeting with you. It seems you are uninterested?"
And she was like. "No, I'm not uninterested. Rather, I'm not quite sure how interested you are :)"

This makes me believe that many of these girls might expect more interest from me.
This girl is a 7/10 in my eyes due to her relative youth, but she is not very fit or a type of fitness babe you see with gymdudes. That combined with my rare texting once a week probably gave her idea that I'm not really into her.

Why I never show much emotions?
I am afraid to be seen as beta, needy or weak. Basically, I'm afraid to wear my heart on my sleeve.
So I appeal more distant, cold. Maybe that is the problem?
 

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Gamisch

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Here we go.
So I messaged one girl out of curiosity. I dated her we kissed, went on 4 dates, she seemed flakey and non-responsive.
I was like. "It's very hard to get a meeting with you. It seems you are uninterested?"
And she was like. "No, I'm not uninterested. Rather, I'm not quite sure how interested you are :)"

This makes me believe that many of these girls might expect more interest from me.
This girl is a 7/10 in my eyes due to her relative youth, but she is not very fit or a type of fitness babe you see with gymdudes. That combined with my rare texting once a week probably gave her idea that I'm not really into her.

Why I never show much emotions?
I am afraid to be seen as beta, needy or weak. Basically, I'm afraid to wear my heart on my sleeve.
So I appeal more distant, cold. Maybe that is the problem?
You need a complete mindset shift. What's your age btw?

4 dates just kissing...nah bro. 1st date kiss. 2and date fck. That's should be the law. By the 3rd date you already dig yourself DEEP into some weird brother/friendzone type situation. I cant imagine going on 4 dates while lot knowing of she likes me. 1 date, quick coffee date. I am in this shyt long enough to understand if that click is there or not.

What you got to lose now anyway? Definition of insanity is...you gotta be less vanilla, dont be afraid to express yourself. Maybe some of these " dark traits " of you is what's lacking.

@Howiestern drops gold on you bro.

@G-Unit
We have similar metrics, except my first date lay rate is almost 100%. It sounds like your charm is weak. Also why do you think you're a bad person? I've probably done worse than you lol.

From reading all this there are two things that come to mind given your goals of casual fun without LTRs.

1. It's called a rotation for a reason. Most hot women worth fuucking aren't content with just being fuucked unless it's a one off convenience, they want a trophy husband or otherwise something deeper. Hot girls can't go down the street without tripping over c0cks wanting to fuuck them. If they just want to fuuck it's easy. You have to be worth the inconvenience of waiting or going to your place, which is why that first convenience fuuck you have to really blow their minds.

The women that are confident enough to just be FWB are less common, and in the back of their minds they're still trying to pick one guy to have something more serious with. If an LTR is really not something you want then embrace the playboy vibe and quit dates after the first solid date. Meet up for a quick coffee outside your place or invite them over. Or if you're driving by their place tell them you're stopping by to give them a nice stretch. Ideally they can communicate their desire for something deeper, and many of the women that take care of themselves will likely pass on you when you say you want to keep it casual. Some will continue seeing you but randomly drop off as they find the LTR they were looking for.

Some that are head over heels for you will continue your game and try to strap you down. But after a while of no progress they'll cut ties out of frustration. This all just comes with the territory of keeping things casual.

Some will love spending time with you and you'll end up seeing them more often because they're just so fun and easy. This is likely the girls you'll naturally fall into committed open or closed relationships with. It will not feel like a pain, it will feel fun, organic, and like a natural next step.

2. You haven't mentioned your hammer or performance and how girls react to sex. If you're laying pipe for hours, sweating all over them, twisting them up, and you've got a decent hammer women should be going absolutely nuts when you fuuck and happy to give you more at the drop of a hat. Since you only want casual fun this is where you have to outshine all their other prospects (since those guys will offer things you won't). If you're selfish during sex or you're not fuucking her for hours or until she taps, then you're likely nothing special to her and worth a pass or little effort.

I could go on but would prefer more info on the above.
Great post. I've slept with women when I haven't spoken much , didn't say more then 10 sentences to them. What's up, number, let's meet. Go over, escalate, job done. Now, I am not on dates weekly , but when I do date a woman it's almost always a done deal.


Edit;@ OP. women language translation: 4 dates no escalation = uninterested. Maybe no physical attraction. Maybe your ex was an HB 11 super model.

But I most definitely would advice you to try what works for you. Maybe 8 dates and more good nights good mornings and s3x after marriage lol;) let us now if that was the missing key element.
 

G-Unit

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You need a complete mindset shift. What's your age btw?
In 30s.

4 dates just kissing...nah bro. 1st date kiss. 2and date fck. That's should be the law. By the 3rd date you already dig yourself DEEP into some weird brother/friendzone type situation. I cant imagine going on 4 dates while lot knowing of she likes me. 1 date, quick coffee date. I am in this shyt long enough to understand if that click is there or not.
I'm not in USA. I have had 2nd date ****s with a few girls. I can do it. But that's not all girls that will do that.
I will invite her to my apartment on 2nd date. I will offer that as transition so she won't see me as beta.
Russian girls especially want you to court them a bit more.

What you got to lose now anyway? Definition of insanity is...you gotta be less vanilla, dont be afraid to express yourself. Maybe some of these " dark traits " of you is what's lacking.
I've had 1st date lays, but that girl was a super slut alcoholic drug addict millionaire lol. When travelling, I got 2nd date ****s.
In general, I need more dates.
Current girl I'm seeing, I had to take her on 4 or 5 dates.

Edit;@ OP. women language translation: 4 dates no escalation = uninterested. Maybe no physical attraction. Maybe your ex was an HB 11 super model.
I do escalate. Escalation is not the problem. I do touch her sexually, I do try kisses, I do escalate.

Edit;@ OP. women language translation: 4 dates no escalation = uninterested. Maybe no physical attraction. Maybe your ex was an HB 11 super model.
My ex wasn't a super model, but she was very hot I agree. The girls I'm seeing now are less hot.

I think I am just afraid to text more due to fear of appearing too beta, needy, supplicating, etc..
 

BillyPilgrim

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Here we go.
So I messaged one girl out of curiosity. I dated her we kissed, went on 4 dates, she seemed flakey and non-responsive.
I was like. "It's very hard to get a meeting with you. It seems you are uninterested?"
And she was like. "No, I'm not uninterested. Rather, I'm not quite sure how interested you are :)"

This makes me believe that many of these girls might expect more interest from me.
This girl is a 7/10 in my eyes due to her relative youth, but she is not very fit or a type of fitness babe you see with gymdudes. That combined with my rare texting once a week probably gave her idea that I'm not really into her.

Why I never show much emotions?
I am afraid to be seen as beta, needy or weak. Basically, I'm afraid to wear my heart on my sleeve.
So I appeal more distant, cold. Maybe that is the problem?
This is good feedback - she could just be wanting you to chase her, but imo I think this is valid. I would try "wearing the heart on your sleeve" in increments, don't do a full 180 since you don't want to do that anyway, but you at least want to do limited doses. Over time you will learn your sweet spot, and how to calibrate with each individual girl.
 

BackInTheGame78

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I'd advise you to stop having rigid rules and going by what everyone else said.

Following the only text to set up a date rule got me a bunch of flakes and not many dates. Once I started using my texting skills to my advantage is when I started having a lot more success in terms of dates, lays, plates and LTRs when I wanted them.

If something isn't working for you it's up to you to change it. I'm not sure where the issue is on your part is but you need to do a deep dive on these interactions and figure it out. Look for commonalities in these interactions.

Where do you feel the interaction starts going the wrong way? If I had to guess you are doing something in person that is turning them off to you.
 

BillyPilgrim

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Sounds like you're wasting time on prudes looking for something deeper or need to work on the charm.

It pays to treat the date like a test for them, are you going to invite them to your place? Hm let's see how they act, do they smell good, are they polite and turning you on? Are they high maintenance? On the first date you should be on the fence and never really reveal that you want them at your place even when you decide so. Finesse it so that it comes across as her idea.

Regarding Chad status, imo a Chad doesn't obsess about game this much, and thus there's no chads on this forum. A Chad imo is just living life and taking all the free pus$y that falls in his lap while he's out doing the stuff he really enjoys and is in love with. Think James Bond, well old James Bond anyway. His lay count may be lower than someone actively trying to fuuck every woman in sight, but that's because he hardly has to do anything to get laid and has higher aspirations anyway.
An older Chad, presumably dating some women who are over 33, is still going to have some issues. Even the Tom Brady and Brad Pitts of the worlds get dumped and Tom Cruise had three wives divorce him when they were 33 (true story). Now if these guys were dating 20 something women, it would be a different story.

While the archetype of James Bond is a good one, it's important to remember he operated in a pre-feminist world.
 
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