An alternative nutritional outlook (or why bulking and cutting sucks)

[simon]

After 4 sessions in the gym, according to my scales I have put on 6lbs. Not sure if that's even possible. I think I may have measured my initial weight incorrectly.

 

[Not Quite There]

Originally posted by simon
After 4 sessions in the gym, according to my scales I have put on 6lbs. Not sure if that's even possible. I think I may have measured my initial weight incorrectly.

i think you have measured wrong there mate.

unless those 4 sessions where weeks apart and in the mean time you eat like a pig.

also, make sure your measuring at similar times of day, because I always way a few pounds more at nightime than i do 1st thing in the morning.

 

[Warboss Alex]

Ehhh.. you can put that kind of muscular weight on in a couple of weeks or even less (with diet and training in check), but remember some of it will be water weight thanks to increased food intake (carbs retain water, you should be drinking a couple of gallons of water a day to help with protein absorption); weigh yourself first thing in the morning after going to the toilet, that's your real weight.

In any case though, congratulations, and keep it up bro!

I've seen people put on like 20lbs in a month .. that's 5lbs a week, though admittedly a little was fat (not much though).

 

[simon]

Originally posted by Warboss Alex
Ehhh.. you can put that kind of muscular weight on in a couple of weeks or even less (with diet and training in check), but remember some of it will be water weight thanks to increased food intake (carbs retain water, you should be drinking a couple of gallons of water a day to help with protein absorption); weigh yourself first thing in the morning after going to the toilet, that's your real weight.

In any case though, congratulations, and keep it up bro!

I've seen people put on like 20lbs in a month .. that's 5lbs a week, though admittedly a little was fat (not much though).

I weighed myself after a huge **** before breakfast :cheer:

It must have been that teaspoon of creatine the day before that did it

I found out that a can of tuna is actually 35g of protein, so I've been eating more protein that I first thought. The unflavoured whey tastes ok with some cocoa powder mixed in.

Oh yeah, hanging leg raises are fun fun fun. Made my abs ache quite a bit this morning.

Time to take some pictures for my 'BEFORE' phase.

 

[Warboss Alex]

Ehhh.. you can put that kind of muscular weight on in a couple of weeks or even less (with diet and training in check), but remember some of it will be water weight thanks to increased food intake (carbs retain water, you should be drinking a couple of gallons of water a day to help with protein absorption); weigh yourself first thing in the morning after going to the toilet, that's your real weight.

In any case though, congratulations, and keep it up bro!

I've seen people put on like 20lbs in a month .. that's 5lbs a week, though admittedly a little was fat (not much though).

 

[simon]

Originally posted by Warboss Alex
Ehhh.. you can put that kind of muscular weight on in a couple of weeks or even less (with diet and training in check), but remember some of it will be water weight thanks to increased food intake (carbs retain water, you should be drinking a couple of gallons of water a day to help with protein absorption); weigh yourself first thing in the morning after going to the toilet, that's your real weight.

In any case though, congratulations, and keep it up bro!

I've seen people put on like 20lbs in a month .. that's 5lbs a week, though admittedly a little was fat (not much though).

I weighed myself after a huge **** before breakfast :cheer:

It must have been that teaspoon of creatine the day before that did it

I found out that a can of tuna is actually 35g of protein, so I've been eating more protein that I first thought. The unflavoured whey tastes ok with some cocoa powder mixed in.

Oh yeah, hanging leg raises are fun fun fun. Made my abs ache quite a bit this morning.

Time to take some pictures for my 'BEFORE' phase. Tomorrow is back/biceps day. Come on the chins!

 

[Warboss Alex]

More protein is never a bad thing.

Creatine does retain a lot of water so yes, it might be that. But I'm sure there's some muscle in there too!

 

[Not Quite There]

ok, i know nothing and will leave it to you alex.

 

[Warboss Alex]

Um.. sorry mate, didn't mean to undermine your intelligence or anything.

I'm just saying that weight fluctuates quite crazily, but it's possible to put on large amounts of muscle in a short time..

 

[Not Quite There]

Originally posted by Warboss Alex
Um.. sorry mate, didn't mean to undermine your intelligence or anything.

I'm just saying that weight fluctuates quite crazily, but it's possible to put on large amounts of muscle in a short time..

ha, no problem, that sounded well sarcastic but wasn't meaning to be.

Basically, until I really know what i am talking about, I should just leave it to those who do, and stop flooding the board with useless advice.

 

[Warboss Alex]

I'm still learning too mate.

I bet even old Arnie is ..

 

[Not Quite There]

Originally posted by Warboss Alex
I'm still learning too mate.

I bet even old Arnie is ..

yeah..

the 1 thing i've noticed about weight lifting is, i've never known any other activity that has so many conflicting ideas and rumours surrounding it!!


you really have to cut through the bull****!

A good example being a few weeks ago some mates of mine where trying to convince me that doing lots of cardio would make me bulk up.

 

[Warboss Alex]

There's conflicting reports because no two bodies are the same.. you've got to find what works for you. In general terms some things work for everyone, but this sport's so individual it's amazing.

 

[Sammo]

****! How did i miss this! Excellent work man,

Recently i went on a training camp with 2 of Australias best natural bodybuilders. They said alot about nutrition which agrees with this post! Notice I underlined natural? The average bodybuilders has the ability to lose massive amounts of fat while gaining muscle, mainly because they are juiced up to their eyeballs.

About bulking and cutting. I have known guys who came off a cutting cycle (after being incredibly depressed) and gone on to a bulking cycle straight away, the result? 21kg gains in 3 weeks, no ****, its happened. Now how much do you think of that was muscle? NOT MUCH! It was practically all fat. When you STARVE yourself of carbs and then start eating ****loads of carbs your body thinks its never gonna get them again so they put it in CARB DEBOSITS. Which are? You guessed it.. fat. Protein will not make you fat.

GET PROTEIN IN WITH EVERY MEAL. PROTEIN IS IMPORTANT. Especially after training! None of this protein shake when you get home ****, have it waiting in the locker. Also, have it with water, not milk. That way it gets digested quicker. AST's VP2 tastes good with water (the fruit punch flavour).

On carbs, its not so much how many you eat as when you eat them and what kind your eating. You DONT want to spike your insulin to many times, once a day maximum and that is when you train. High glycemic carbs should be eaten before you go to bed so your not digesting them in your sleep (your body doesnt need them when you sleep). This means no rice, pasta, bread, etc. after 6PM. Only carbs you should be having then is green vegies and salad, other then that it should be all protein baby. Also getting up in the middle of the night and having a protein shake helps. Drink a litre of water before you go to bed, then you will find yourself waking up in the middle of the night to take a piss.

With the cardio, go on an empty stomach, a walk will do. Don't want to burn to many calories and as WA said, you'll be hungrier later on. Train hard and eat smart. You'll be amazed the gains you can get.

Good post, im stickying this.

 

[MrS]

Fun having this cracker as a brother.
I suffer this all day
Nah, it's alright.
Nice post, bruv.

 

[Eulogy]

I didn't read the whole thread, but I have one thing to say.

Alex Warboss, you're a fucking CLOWN.

You ripped off, almost word-for-word DC (DoggCrapp)'s original philosophy on training. AND DID NOT give CREDIT where CREDIT IS DUE.

And you think you could actually get away with it because DC took his stickies down.

Shame on you man, shame on you...

 

[Crushed_Iron]

You see, the big problem with bodybuilding (especially nutrition) is that everything can be explained, and us guys out there looking for the Truth never can tell what's what.

Warboss Alex, you've said what I've been telling people for the past year. I came to all the same conclustions about carbs.

I saw with my own eyes that when I ate too many carbs (even good ones) I'd just get fatter, but they contributed nothing on my off days. I have a desk job and after a ton of trial and error and finally telling everyone else to get lost I did what felt right for me.

I cut my starchy carbs right down to 50g per day. I experimented over time and found that because of my sedantary job I can get away with 50g carbs at breakfast, then every meal after that (I have 7 meals/day) I could get just protein.

Guess what? Not only could I crank my protein way up (over 400g/day) but my gut was flat all day. And I discovered by not eating carbs I get hungry faster, so I can eat even more meals! I do add fats to my protein though with either flax or olive oil each meal. The oils keep the protein (chicken, steak, etc.) from drying up plus they add calories.

And guess what again? When I did that for several months the fat melted right off. So what about my training?

Well I carb up on training days. I eat anywhere from 150-300g carbs that day and it helps power my intense workouts. In fact I tried going back to 'what everyone else says' and all I did was get bloated and put on fat at an alarming rate. No matter how hard I trained the only diet that works is the super low carb off days, moderate carbs workout days.

So what's the downside of the super low carb off days? I noticed after the 2nd day or so on super low carbs my muscles go flat. They look hard from all the protein but not full.

But come workout day and the carb up and my muscles explode, and the pump is amazing and lasts into the next day.

Lest you think I'm a volume guy, I only train 2 days per week with big compound exericses like deadlifts, squats, rows, dips, etc.

I will say there is a place for volume. I did a few cycles of 5x5, 6x6 (Gironda style) or more and my whole body took on that polished bodybuilder look that I never quite got with the above minimalist training.

I have more to say about training but I'm sure this is an eyeful for a first post. Thanks for reading. -X-

 

[thefonz]

Bodybuilding is a science and everyone has their theories and focus areas (both are experimented with).....I like to go by the frame classifications perspective of the male body which is either ectomorph, mesomorph, and endomorph (the female body has more figures than men and I'm only concerned with the muscle building aspect)......Ectomorphs (Me) are the ones that usually need to train the most, with heavy weights low reps, and rest the most. A 4 day split with every other day a rest is ideal......Mesomorphs, the gifted ones, would benefit from supersets with heavy and low weights but generally have little to worry about....Endomorphs, have the potential to be the biggest of the somatypes with the right discipline but must do more cardio than the others. It's all relative but 1 general rule is true for everyone in muscle building.......protien, carbs, and water mixed with heavy weights.

 

[Warboss Alex]

Eulogy,

1. You admitted that you didn't read the whole thread, sooooo you missed the references. (at the bottom, where references go)

(References: DC training)

2. It's nutritional knowledge and an opinion on bulking and cutting; you'll find plenty of trainers out there with similar opinions. It's worded similarly because his post inspired me.

3. DC copyrighted his training protocol, not the fact that eating more protein makes you grow more muscle/increases your metabolism or that a carb cutoff helps you keep lean, being as those are, physiological truths - even the women's magazines tell you to eat protein with your meals when you want to slim down. I haven't, and would not, write anything about the training system because I'm not fully qualified to (even though I use it ).

4. Who's the clown now?

 

[smallcity]

dude

I hope this gets taken down