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Which coaches are the real deal?

RangerMIke

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So I think you're not a fan of NLP I made a post a while ago about that.
NLP is a useful tool when trying to treat fears as a tool set in therapy, and can be helpful for people to change the way they think about things though use of language which can subconsciously change the way you view things (like the difference between 'want' and 'need'), but there is a great deal of scientific study that indicate that the success rate is marginal, and certainly does not work on someone not open to being influenced.

NLP when it comes to gaming chicks almost certainly doesn't work unless the woman is already open to you, and if that happens you can get desired results by acting like a normal human being and not fvcking up. However, if you are not a trained psychologist, and know what you are doing... then trying to run a NPL game on anyone will come off immediately as manipulation... which is a turn off.

NLP appears to work with people like Tony Robbins is simple... When he is running seminar, people have already paid money to see him, they want what he is teaching to work, they are already conditioned to be open to influence. You can say the same thing about great sermons in a church by pastors... the people in the pews are already open to manipulation... so by the strength of words, he/she can get people crawling down the aisles. Put that same preacher in a gym full of atheists and you will not get the same result. Locker room speeches by football coaches, Generals before a battle, car salesmen....

But when it comes to women... well... the simple truth is that if she is NOT open to you, NOTHING you do will work... nothing. All you can do is fvck it up.
 

Chilimili

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women manipulate men they don't respect. they wear a mask around these guys. if she is being herself around you then she respects you.
A woman’s drive is manipulation. That means everything she says is by the purpose of her selfishness and manipulation, whether she respects you or not. There is a difference between a guy who is asking you for your age just for a friendly conversation and a difference between a girl asking you for the age for the means of manipulation/ by using it against you later on. Women are never interested in you, they are only interested in how you make them feel. So why would she care then about your age? It’s because manipulation. Women are deceptive by nature and manipulation is their primary weapon. That’s why we look at woman’s actions and not their words
 

SW15

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Do not pay a dime to any coach. There's more free material out there than any man could absorb in 10 lifetimes. Find some friends who are into game and share experiences, both successes and failures.
A combination of free materials + low cost books can do enough. I thought buying The Rational Male was useful. Mystery Method/The Game could still be useful.
 

Snag87

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A combination of free materials + low cost books can do enough. I thought buying The Rational Male was useful. Mystery Method/The Game could still be useful.
Fair. A book is $20 bucks. Coaches want $500+ for a one hour consultation and 3k+ for a boot camp. It's absurd.
 

RSDCharlie

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So have been chomping down the red pill this last while and lately am seeing evidence that is turning me off from these coaches that have got good advice from.

R Cooper: charges $2000/hr for coach calls. Got defensive when someone called him out on it saying I only deal with high end ppl to the guy who already spent $20k on his course. Although he sometimes gives some good advice on his vids. He mainly rehashes the same stuff as Rollo in his book.

Rollo: While enjoyed his books. He rants on for 4 hour video streams with endless graphs. He's married for all his life too.

AMS: comes across as strong no bull**** alpha dudes in streams but in his infield footage was a total ***** and couldn't approach women while acting all tough.

There are many others that make this whole red pill stuff just a business to fleech as much as they can from desperate beta dudes.

While everyone is got to make money it shouldn't be the focus.

Here are the coaches I like and feel bring good value:

Coach Corey Wayne: has great content with life and well as dealing with women. Calls out the red pill bull**** too and doesn't get involved with any drama crap that other coaches who pit against each other. Need to read book few times again.

Darius M: good content on his videos and gets straight to the point.

A. G. Hayden: good coach with lots of infield footage and advice.

Jack Denmo: prob my fave out of them all. No red pill agenda just chilling and talking. It's just seems natural way he talks and interacts with women. Not trying to force things and has great conversation skills.


What are your thoughts on which coaches have helped you the most?
If someone has 20000 $ to spend on a coach to learn pickup, why would he waste time in learning it anyways? Why not travel the world and have fun sexcapades in different countries?
 

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eli77

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NLP is a useful tool when trying to treat fears as a tool set in therapy, and can be helpful for people to change the way they think about things though use of language which can subconsciously change the way you view things (like the difference between 'want' and 'need'), but there is a great deal of scientific study that indicate that the success rate is marginal, and certainly does not work on someone not open to being influenced.

NLP when it comes to gaming chicks almost certainly doesn't work unless the woman is already open to you, and if that happens you can get desired results by acting like a normal human being and not fvcking up. However, if you are not a trained psychologist, and know what you are doing... then trying to run a NPL game on anyone will come off immediately as manipulation... which is a turn off.

NLP appears to work with people like Tony Robbins is simple... When he is running seminar, people have already paid money to see him, they want what he is teaching to work, they are already conditioned to be open to influence. You can say the same thing about great sermons in a church by pastors... the people in the pews are already open to manipulation... so by the strength of words, he/she can get people crawling down the aisles. Put that same preacher in a gym full of atheists and you will not get the same result. Locker room speeches by football coaches, Generals before a battle, car salesmen....

But when it comes to women... well... the simple truth is that if she is NOT open to you, NOTHING you do will work... nothing. All you can do is fvck it up.
Don't know if you know but one of the most famous NLP practitioners was special forces like yourself is that a common occurrence in the military?
 

eli77

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NLP is a useful tool when trying to treat fears as a tool set in therapy, and can be helpful for people to change the way they think about things though use of language which can subconsciously change the way you view things (like the difference between 'want' and 'need'), but there is a great deal of scientific study that indicate that the success rate is marginal, and certainly does not work on someone not open to being influenced.

NLP when it comes to gaming chicks almost certainly doesn't work unless the woman is already open to you, and if that happens you can get desired results by acting like a normal human being and not fvcking up. However, if you are not a trained psychologist, and know what you are doing... then trying to run a NPL game on anyone will come off immediately as manipulation... which is a turn off.

NLP appears to work with people like Tony Robbins is simple... When he is running seminar, people have already paid money to see him, they want what he is teaching to work, they are already conditioned to be open to influence. You can say the same thing about great sermons in a church by pastors... the people in the pews are already open to manipulation... so by the strength of words, he/she can get people crawling down the aisles. Put that same preacher in a gym full of atheists and you will not get the same result. Locker room speeches by football coaches, Generals before a battle, car salesmen....

But when it comes to women... well... the simple truth is that if she is NOT open to you, NOTHING you do will work... nothing. All you can do is fvck it up.
I've always said it takes a combination of looks initiative and persistent in the game
 

RangerMIke

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Don't know if you know but one of the most famous NLP practitioners was special forces like yourself is that a common occurrence in the military?
Yeah... it is part of SERE and interrogation training. But again, it only works on people that are open to manipulation. Depending on the state of mind of the POW, it can be effective given time to manipulate the person being questioned. Someone that is SERE trained will take MUCH longer to manipulate, but eventually everyone talks, you just can not help it, the only thing SERE training will do is withstand interrogation for as long as possible so hopefully the information you give the enemy is no longer useful.

Most of these Hollywood movies that show the hero withstanding all the manipulation and torture and never saying anything is complete BS. There was a movie called "Hart's War", about 20 years ago, it was mostly just stupid but there was one part that was accurate. When the character played by Colin Farrell was captured and put under interrogation, eventually he talked and spilt the beans, but when he was placed in the POW Camp the character played by Bruce Willis asked him if he talked, Farrell lied and said he didn't. At that point Willis never trusted him... the reason is that he knew Farrell lied because Willis knew EVERYONE eventually cracks... and if you are at the point where you are lying about that, then you never really withstood interrogation long enough.

If after interrogation you still have the capacity to lie, then you were never really broken. I broken person will be honest with everything, they will admit they have cracked and what they said, and how long it took for them to be broken. You can always tell when a POW is about to break, they will be honest about everything you ask them, including things that are personally embarrassing. This is why interrogators will ask seemingly stupid questions, they are gauging the level of honesty. They will ask questions that they already know the answer to, and if the prisoner is not being honest... well they but start trying to break them down more.

The difference between a skilled interrogator and one that isn't it that they know when someone is lying. Someone being tortured will tell you anything you want to hear once they are broken... but you also have to know when they are not being truthful with what they are telling you. If the purpose of the interrogation is to break a person, well this is actually easy and getting confessions isn't all that hard. The hard part is getting them to be honest.
 

eli77

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Yeah... it is part of SERE and interrogation training. But again, it only works on people that are open to manipulation. Depending on the state of mind of the POW, it can be effective given time to manipulate the person being questioned. Someone that is SERE trained will take MUCH longer to manipulate, but eventually everyone talks, you just can not help it, the only thing SERE training will do is withstand interrogation for as long as possible so hopefully the information you give the enemy is no longer useful.

Most of these Hollywood movies that show the hero withstanding all the manipulation and torture and never saying anything is complete BS. There was a movie called "Hart's War", about 20 years ago, it was mostly just stupid but there was one part that was accurate. When the character played by Colin Farrell was captured and put under interrogation, eventually he talked and spilt the beans, but when he was placed in the POW Camp the character played by Bruce Willis asked him if he talked, Farrell lied and said he didn't. At that point Willis never trusted him... the reason is that he knew Farrell lied because Willis knew EVERYONE eventually cracks... and if you are at the point where you are lying about that, then you never really withstood interrogation long enough.

If after interrogation you still have the capacity to lie, then you were never really broken. I broken person will be honest with everything, they will admit they have cracked and what they said, and how long it took for them to be broken. You can always tell when a POW is about to break, they will be honest about everything you ask them, including things that are personally embarrassing. This is why interrogators will ask seemingly stupid questions, they are gauging the level of honesty. They will ask questions that they already know the answer to, and if the prisoner is not being honest... well they but start trying to break them down more.

The difference between a skilled interrogator and one that isn't it that they know when someone is lying. Someone being tortured will tell you anything you want to hear once they are broken... but you also have to know when they are not being truthful with what they are telling you. If the purpose of the interrogation is to break a person, well this is actually easy and getting confessions isn't all that hard. The hard part is getting them to be honest.
My mentor in high school was veteran he's a big fan of the movie tigerland but then again none of these movies are 100% accurate of course.
 

DEEZEDBRAH

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Read the book tribe of mentors that's why I say the local library and here is all you need i've heard nothing but good things of anthony robbins but then again i've never brought any of his books just borrowed from the library
The library is great. Why the F would anybody audible or buy when the library is GREAT. FREE TOO.

THE 1st experience with self help and inner game was after senior year summer before college and I read Anthony Robbins awaken the giant.
 

thermodynamic

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Does anyone here have any experiences with in-field coaching?
Just try and make freinds with someone who is good at talking to girls and learn from them.

obviously without a doubt Mystery Method...
dude was a genius and the only coach to actually explain what creates attraction - microcalibrations in behaviour which signal higher value
**** that. If you are the real thing you do not have to "attempt" to signal higher value. You will do that naturally. Become someone such that you can honestly believe and know you have higher value.
 

Lifeman

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I think we probably have similar opinions in terms of who to listen too and coaches etc.

Lots of the guys people rave about (corey wayne, robert greene, ross jefferies, that rationalmale dude etc etc) are just dudes who wrote books, but do I honestly think any of them are gonna be able to pull the girls in a bar or whatever that I want? Of course not. Writing about different types of 'seducers' or about psychology etc is one thing, but actually being able to pull hot girls is something entirely different, and I wouldn't be scared at all if I was gaming some hot 19 year old, and then one of them guys stepped in whilst I was in the bathroom. I know the reaction they'd get and how it would go

Lots of PUAs who I thought were great back in the day and when I was new, I no longer am impressed when I re-watch their infields.

Basically nobody is blowing my mind or doing much that actually impresses me or that I cant do. Or that any of my friends can't do! They're approaching lots of girls, and when they approach a girl who thinks he's cute or whatever, they have enough game to seal teh deal. Great. But lets not throw them a parade.

Of course there are some that are better than others. I do think Julien is one of the best, personally. I also think Vadim from honest signals is worth a mention. AMS is scared to cold approach and made excuses to not approach a group of young girls who he seemed to be interested in. Just talks a good 'alpha game'. Same with most of the redpillers from what i've seen. Just manly waffle.

But as I say, even the guys who are the very very best, aren't out there doing what much of the material says one can do with game. (effectively 'seduce' whoever they want, in spite of initial attraction) THAT has never been caught on camera, or anywhere else.
Vadim has some good tips, especially with night game.
 

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BadBoy89

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A woman’s drive is manipulation. That means everything she says is by the purpose of her selfishness and manipulation, whether she respects you or not. There is a difference between a guy who is asking you for your age just for a friendly conversation and a difference between a girl asking you for the age for the means of manipulation/ by using it against you later on. Women are never interested in you, they are only interested in how you make them feel. So why would she care then about your age? It’s because manipulation. Women are deceptive by nature and manipulation is their primary weapon. That’s why we look at woman’s actions and not their words
Good post. I would just change the sentence below.

Women are never interested in you, they are only interested in how you make them feel. what you can do for them.
 
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