The official Borderline Personality Disorder thread [Merged]

KontrollerX

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"One thing we should all keep in mind that BPD individuals only account for between 1 and 2 percent of the population... at least as far as the qualify under the "official" designation of having 5 out of 9 symptoms. That's not very much, people, so we can't go about labelling every overly-emotional girl a BPD chick."

The 1 and 2 percent of the population is only counted from those that seek out treatment. The real number is probably far more than we could ever imagine since many of these people tend to not know they have a problem and think of themselves as normal until later in life they finally have the thought after all of their failed relationships that something might be wrong with them.

Also no one is labelling every emotional girl as a BPD or some other Cluster B here just for the sake of doing it.

The fact of the matter is the guys that come here came here from a severely beta pvssy like AFC mindset and this is the kind of mindset that Cluster B loves the most as its AFC's they can get the most out of and use with impunity.

So its no surprise that the vast majority of forum goers here have had a run in with one or two.

This kind of post you've made annoys me to no end as its easy to tell depression or bipolar from something far more severe such as Cluster B and I'm not even really attacking you but I see this ignorant claim brought up time and time again here from guys who don't stop and consider the vast AFC population we have on this board and their prediliction for running into and being prime candidates of victimization by Cluster B.

AFC's love to let women come to them as they don't have the balls to approach, well Cluster B's love to seek out attention and will throw themselves all over a guy who has somehow captured their interest and what better luck an AFC thinks to himself than this Cluster B chick thats all over him for reasons he can't explain...he's just happy some girl has shown him attention so he doesn't have to do any approach work and risk rejection.

"BPD is also not infrequent in men, though it is something like 75% women."

Yeah a lot of men have it too probably in equal number but this is completely irrelevant to bring up as this is a forum for talking about women.

"As for being evil, that just doesn't help. You can't classify someone with a scientifically-based term like BPD and then say they CHOSE to become that way. BPD, it's believed, comes from an absence of caring by the parents or outright abuse."

No one is saying they choose to become BPD what we are saying based on psychologist testimony from Al Bernstein that despite being a BPD they know right and wrong like someone without BPD ie a normal human and because of this they can be held accountable for their actions.

Also BPD and mental health issues in general aren't an exact science.

Many professionally written books about these people say that the conditions are suggested only after a lot of testimony from friends, family and partners as well the patient themselves and most importantly that there isn't an official type questionairre that has been designed to 100% accurately be able to tell what type of Cluster B a person is after they fill out the form (save for the psychopathy checklist developed by Robert Hare to tell if someone is a psychopath today known as Anti Social Personality Disorder.) Its a lot of guess work from professionals as well testimony from the person about their life as well friends and family if they are allowed to be involved in the process. Its really not a lot different from how we make a guess of a poster's nightmare likely being a BPD. We wait until we see a large number of signs and its then not hard to suggest BPD or HPD as the culprit.

"I'm not saying that "they just can't help it" and we should just let them revel in terrible behaviour, but it's not as simple as that. We can applaud the ones who fight against it by seeking counselling or therapy or drugs or whatever, and deride those that use their condition continually as an excuse. I'm also sure that a lot of BPD women have no idea that they have a condition, as they're probably averse to admitting that they have a problem quite frequently."

Some know, some don't. The percent that is counted as being the number among the population are the ones that know. The ones that don't likely outnumber the ones that do vastly whether its by denial or literally not knowing.

Society feels their effects nevertheless via broken homes, suicides, the horrible teacher you just couldn't reason with, the corrupt politician, the unreasonable drill instructor, the abusive prison guard, the violent cop, the manipulative lawyer etc. Cluster B is in my estimation responsible for the greatest horrors committed by humanity on this planet. Their numbers increase every 50 years and always bring with the increase more devastation.
 

Aenigma

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DonS said:
Just imagine what Anegima went through; he impregnated and married a full blown borderline.

I haven't heard if he's fully healed yet, but damn! Talk about playing with fire.

So I'm glad you escaped, but a word to others: If you are caught in the web of one of these psychotics, there is still a small chance of escape.
I'm not sure it's possible to become "fully healed" after an expirence like that- I'm not even sure what "fully healed" would mean in terms of mentality after a BPD expirence.

I can tell you this though- if you have an ounce of intelliegence or sense in you then you're always going to be at least somewhat suspicious and distrustful of women after going through a relationship with a BPD.... which is probably a good thing- in a sense I think that this is a consequence of the ordeal. The mental wounds fill in with scar tissue and even though you're "fully healed" you're not the same as you were before hand, the trust and faith you place into partners of the female gender is forever destroyed.... oh well... on the plus side- chicks dig scars, even if they're mental ones that affect your behavior. :D
 

Nutz

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Excellent thread. Subscribed for future reading in the event I need slapped across the face for being stupid.
 

realsmoothie

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Kontroller:

Actually, no, that 1-2% is the percentage of people OVERALL that are estimated to have BPD. Look it up.

But the one guy is right, that 1 in 50 BPD girl can certainly do some damage in her life. The one that I know has wrangled her way through me, one of my best friends, and I know at least three or four other local guys who are semi-obsessed with her. That doesn't even count two other guys in other cities.

My main point regarding being careful with labelling people BPD is this: it's better to underreact than overreact. If we start labelling every girl who occasionally freaks out as BPD we're not helping anything at all... this is why I read about the term a lot on this board for a while but assumed it was just some local slang for b*tch.

The one girl I know that has BPD most definitely has it. I looked up the list of 9 symptoms, she has ALL of them. So I'm pretty confident that I can label her this and use it to understand why she does what she does.

A question I have is... what's "cluster B"?
 

KontrollerX

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"Actually, no, that 1-2% is the percentage of people OVERALL that are estimated to have BPD. Look it up."

Estimates are not accurate and you can't trust Wikipedia/various online sites about these people like you can trust a copy of the DSM among other professional research manuals I have in front of me that are not subject to random user edit.

Also there are conflicts of opinion on them among professionals.

James F. Masterson disagrees with the majority of the psyche profession on how to treat them as well likely how vast they number among society as do others.

"My main point regarding being careful with labelling people BPD is this: it's better to underreact than overreact. If we start labelling every girl who occasionally freaks out as BPD we're not helping anything at all... this is why I read about the term a lot on this board for a while but assumed it was just some local slang for b*tch."

And my main point is its ignorant for you and others to assume that Jophil or myself or other people who have been affected by Cluster B's just throw out the diagnosis flippantly for posts on the board. Though you didn't specifically target us by name we do offer the most frequent help for people that are wondering about if their significant other was one of them so its reasonable to assume you may have been indirectly calling us out. Also from what I've seen many others who help out for topics concerning this don't throw out the diagnosis flippantly either. Everyone watches for the proper signs and behavior carefully on this board so there's absolutely no reason to suggest that people just want to write off their ex's as BPD's to feel better. For most guys it would feel better if their BPD or HPD ex wasn't one of them as then it would mean the girl had a real personality and who that guy loved was actually real instead of a fake put on act based on mirroring of the guy's best qualities.

Trust me dude. People who've been through this experience can easily spot another one as the stories tend to be so cookie cutter. Read more BPD stories on the board and elsewhere online and in books and you'll see.

"A question I have is... what's "cluster B"?"

Its a personality disorder category that includes sociopaths/psychopaths now known as Anti Social Personality Disorderd, Borderline Personality Disordered, Histrionic Personality Disordered and Narcissistic Personality Disordered.

These are all the people who tend to become the worst scum of society.

Think horrible politicians, Enron CEO's, Madoff, George W. Bush, Bill Clinton, the control freak teacher or boss you've had, the worst of the worst that fill our prison system, the smooth operator manipulator like Dexter who society sees as a hero but inwardly is a viscious murderer that rationalizes all of his crimes as being good for society. They are the lover that left you at the alter to go run off with Miguel the UPS man, the girl that gets AFC's to fight other guys for them putting the poor AFC saps in the hospital or the morgue and taking no responsibility for their actions, the worst of the worst and its my opinion they are legion and no small number like the estimates you found would have us believe.

Basically the personality's are in a category together because they all have many commonalities such as pathological lying, narcissistic grandiosity, lack of empathy etc.
 
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realsmoothie

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KontrollerX said:
Estimates are not accurate and you can't trust Wikipedia/various online sites about these people like you can trust a copy of the DSM among other professional research manuals I have in front of me that are not subject to random user edit.
Actually, I got that number from the National Institute of Mental Health. I would say they are pretty respectable and probably a good general way of seeing things. Of course, there certainly appears to be a lot of discussion on the matter... as is often the case with brain-related issues!

http://www.nimh.nih.gov/health/publications/borderline-personality-disorder-fact-sheet/index.shtml

It says 2%, though it does qualify that by saying many are young women.

To be clear, I did not want to imply that EVERYONE here was overusing the term or using it incorrectly. I want to specify that my own personal experience with the term on this board is that it appears overused and misused frequently, and just wanted to clarify that on this thread since it seemed appropriate. I apologize if it appears that I was singling you or anyone else out.

As for the cluster B stuff, that is certainly a big group of people. I wonder just what percentage of the population fits under that umbrella.
 

jophil28

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KontrollerX said:
Basically the personality's are in a category (Cluster B) together because they all have many commonalities such as pathological lying, narcissistic grandiosity, lack of empathy etc.
These personality's (Cluster B disorders) are often called the "abusive disorders". THis is where you find those amongst us who will compulsively and repeatedly lie, cheat and steal with little regret (if any).
 

jophil28

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This how I see the BPD label debate--

Consider the disorder of ALcoholism as a parallel. When alcohol misuse has progressed to the stage where it is adversely affecting a persons' ability to function, then damage is being done. That person may be fired or passed over for a promotion, his health may be affected, his personal relationships likely have been impacted negatively. His marrige may have failed or teetering on the brink.. His reputation may have suffered and his respect from his peers has probably dissolved in rumor and a whispering campaign.
All these consequences start to occur long before he walks though the doors of AA or consults a psychiatrist who offers a positive diagnosis of Alcoholism.
And the damage occurs whether he seeks treatment or not.

Similarly with Cluster B's. It matter little whether a formal diagnosis has been made. BPD women are vampires who will suck the essence of life out of you. However there are MANY women who may demonstrate only a few Cluster B symptoms but who still are damaging to you.

Learn to assess them EARLY before they set the hook.
Take their history if you have doubts. Their past will tell you what you need to know about your future with her.
 
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KontrollerX

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"Is this normal? Or is it inevitable that she will come back to try and hoover me in again after hurting her that badly?"

Its normal.

She's paying you back in childish childlike fashion for your perceived slight of her.

She will hoover you eventually as long as she is not completely convinced that you care about her.

The less you care, specifically the less she thinks you care, the more you can expect a hoover from her.
 
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I have noticed that when a BPD gets very upset because one of her men slighted her, she will go out and bang a few guys in anger.

I made mine angry once and that's what she did.

Is this normal?
 

jophil28

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Vlad the Impaler said:
I have noticed that when a BPD gets very upset because one of her men slighted her, she will go out and bang a few guys in anger.

I made mine angry once and that's what she did.

Is this normal?
That is SOP for these wackos.
 

Aenigma

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The thing I noticed is that it takes forever to get over one- but, in a sense, its alot like a dog chasing a car: you wouldn't know what to do with her if you "had" her again (aside from sex I mean).

You can never have a meaningful trusting relationship with one of these creatures.
 

jophil28

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Never mind
 
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jophil28

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Aenigma said:
The thing I noticed is that it takes forever to get over one- but, in a sense, its alot like a dog chasing a car: you wouldn't know what to do with her if you "had" her again (aside from sex I mean).

You can never have a meaningful trusting relationship with one of these creatures.
Indeed, it does take forever.
Here is a question that I have trained myself to ask myself whenever my mind drifts back to those drama filled days with Ms BPD 2006.
" Apart from those moments when I was jumping on her, what else did I really like about being in a relationship with her? What was valuable about her apart from her body . What other qualites did she have ? "
 

Jitterbug

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Danger said:
Don't forget the endless string of medical problems.....mine had the following....

....

The point is, they are loaded with medical issues.
Man, my Cluster B ex is loaded with those - although upon careful inspection, half of them are faked by her for attention.

I was lucky that I got involved with her AFTER I found this forum and read up heaps on her type. Once my gut sensed that she could be a Cluster B, I broke it off swiftly. Events that unfolded months later confirmed my guess.
 

jophil28

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Jitterbug said:
I was lucky that I got involved with her AFTER I found this forum and read up heaps on her type. Once my gut sensed that she could be a Cluster B, I broke it off swiftly. Events that unfolded months later confirmed my guess.
You are one of the fortunate ones who acquired enough knowledge about Cluster B wackjobs to pull Eject when one came your way.
AS I have said before, it does not matter whether she has a positive clinical diagnosis. If her behavior presses your buttons, or resonates with what you read here about Cluster B's, then a silent retreat is a standing order.
 

Jitterbug

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Exactly! I care about my own mental well-being first & foremost. Whether she is clinically diagnosed as an emotional vampire matters not. If she's harmful to me, I'm getting the hell out of there!

That ex of mine, post break-up, wrecked havoc on one of her own circle of friends and they kicked her out of the group. She's highly socially skilled though and has already moved on to be best friends with another group, looking for her next victims. She's also pulling the moves on one of my groups so that she can still hang out & see me & my friends weekly. I wish there's a Delete button on her that I can press...
 

the-nighthawk

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KontrollerX said:
The less you care, specifically the less she thinks you care, the more you can expect a hoover from her.
Well KontrollerX but this is so hard to understand. Because at the beginning you're for a BPD the white knight and the rescuer..her personal hero and her one and only superstar.
She is wanting to "tie" you also by this feeling. So to fit this role you're doing at the beginning everything you can to take care about her. She is also appreciating this by her sweeter than sweet acting.. but then a change is happening by her inside and her "moody" phase is starting. She is feeling then just "pushed" by all these things and for everything what is going wrong between you and her and also in her life.. you're the reason! :yes: :trouble:
I think this is happening shortly before their hater "phase" is starting and you will be black painted. Right KontrollerX? :D
 
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Going back to BPD's and medical problems...

My cluster B last night was telling me she has an ulcer.

She had stitches in her hand from washing dishes and one broke she SAYS. I don't buy the story.

She said she has anxiety.

She is fitting the cluster B to a tee.

I also got the lines


"i have been so hurt I cant completely give myself to anyone ever again"

"he's just a friend"

She has a phone full of guys she has been with before but now they are "just friends"

LOL!

The funniest thing of all is she got me hot and bothered last night and then tried to hold out on me! I went to the sofa left her alone. I did the perfect move and didn't hold her all night.

She changed her tune in the morning! What kind of sh!t text was that?!

She was trying to frustrate me DELIBERATELY.

I'm not going to call her anymore. I'm going to see if she starts chasing.
 
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