Fvck Fitness!

[Throttle]

Don't call me names, you jerk.

actually, WBA didn't call you any names, you moron.

he did criticize your attitude, but you're apparently so insecure that you'll read name-calling into a critique that hits the mark. and that's just sad.

 

[donjuanjovi]

I don't see the point to this inane reply. I mean, what is it exactly that you're hoping to accomplish with this?

Were you just venting your feelings about this thread to me, or are you trying to convince me or others that really, this thread is inane as you believe?

Perhaps you are just looking for some attention?

Could you please explain your reasoning for replying to a thread you see as inane? I don't think a reply is required "everytime" someone thinks a thread is inane. Because sometimes a thing can seem inane to you that inspires something useful in someone else.

Mmmmmmk?

*offers cherry coke*

If you don't like it, that is a valid feeling. I'm sure you have had personal experiences that make you feel that way. Or perhaps you like working out to impress women.

The point of this thread is to share and be mutually richer for the collective experience and thought of others. So share or if you don't feel like it, go away to a thread that inspires you more. If it's not for you, that's fine!

That's great that you disagree. Would you please tell me some personal experiences you've had that lead you to think this way? You have the right to your opinion, but just calling this thread names and questioning my motives doesn't help me or really anyone else. Maybe it helps you feel smarter than me.

Izza

First off. I'm an idiot, so I really don't feel smarter than most people. You seem to be a very intellegent guy and at no point was my reply meant as an insult.

Secondly. You answered my question, so thank you.

Thirdly. At no point did I say that I disagree with you, infact I strongly agree with you. If I hated lifting weights, I sure as hell wouldn't do it just for the fact that it could give me a six pack. Too many people in this world are doing things they don't like for menial rewards.

Fourthly. I was merely trying to fill my curiosity. That's all.

Fifthly. I don't drink cherry coke, but thank you for the offer. A bottle of water would be great though.

 

[izza]

First off. I'm an idiot, so I really don't feel smarter than most people. You seem to be a very intellegent guy and at no point was my reply meant as an insult.

I'm an idiot too, but I'm glad I give off an intelligent impression haha. You do too.

Secondly. You answered my question, so thank you.

You're welcome. Sorry if I seemed annoyed. I may have misread the tone of what you were saying. I apologize for that, and I'll try my best in the future.

Thirdly. At no point did I say that I disagree with you, infact I strongly agree with you. If I hated lifting weights, I sure as hell wouldn't do it just for the fact that it could give me a six pack. Too many people in this world are doing things they don't like for menial rewards.

Yeah, I feel sad about every time I went to the gym even when I didn't want to.

Fourthly. I was merely trying to fill my curiosity. That's all.

Yeah, I must have misread your tone. My mistake. Sorry about that.

Fifthly. I don't drink cherry coke, but thank you for the offer. A bottle of water would be great though.

*gives bottle of water*, *opens cherry Coke*

Cheers,

Izza

 

[Warboss Alex]

thanks Throttle, but I've had it with this thread. lol.. I should really stay away from answering non-fitness topics anyway

 

[izza]

actually, WBA didn't call you any names, you moron.

he did criticize your attitude, but you're apparently so insecure that you'll read name-calling into a critique that hits the mark. and that's just sad.

Throttle,

"You are hypocrital and superficial" sound like names to me, you moron.

I'm not even talking to you, but you're apparently so insecure that my asking WBA not to judge me bothers you so much, that you just have to respond. And that's just sad

*gives Cherry Coke*

Yeah, I totally and completely accept his criticism of my attitude. I mean, he makes a good point, and he may well be completely right. I don't like being judged, and that's ok.

But you're right with the feeling. I didn't ask for what I wanted in a clear or elegant way. I apologize for that.

I'm unsubscribing from this thread, if you have questions, PM box baby.

Izza

 

[Warboss Alex]

Throttle,
"You are hypocrital and superficial" sound like names to me, you moron.

And 'moron' isn't? What did I tell you about treating others like you want to be treated? You don't want people to call you names, don't call THEM names.

I'm not even talking to you, but you're apparently so insecure that my asking WBA not to judge me bothers you so much, that you just have to respond. And that's just sad

It's not a question of insecurity, it's called 'sticking up for a friend' and I appreciate it.

 

[Throttle]

I'm now taking bets on whether or not izza's account (as well as organized_confusion's) has been hacked by the notorious john_galt ... since both accounts laid dormant until j.g. got all pissy a couple weeks ago & tried desperately to spam these forums. now o.c. & izz come swarming through here starting threads that quickly balloon to 4 pages & rely heavily on formula & bluster.

 

[6-heads lewis]

I haven't read the threat yet, but the responses are easy to predict, Ill assume a bunch of ppl are insulting OP saying he's lazy, exercise is healthy, blah blah blah.

Heres the Holyfield:

Most people lift to improve their physical appearance. Lifting weights and watching your diet is the most efficient means to that end. And these same men have delusions of 'soulmates' and marriage and whatnot which really just mask sexual fantasy and perversion. Even if this longing for monogamy and love is sincere, its unlikely he will find a match with the same intentions.

This logic is flawed. While lifting weights and watching your diet is a good way to attain sex, there are better venues available. The man who invests 5 years into a career and becomes rich and famous will have an easier time getting a lifetime of sex than the devoted part-time bodybuilder/full-time warehouse guy.

I know a software engineer whose a pimply recluse, but he's filthy rich and a workaholic. When he gets horny, he goes to a strip club or calls an escort service, and sleeps with women WELL ABOVE the quality of most of our lays. While most men spend hundreds of dollars and lots of time (and risk indignity and rejection) going through the courtship process to POSSIBLY get sex with AVERAGE women, this guy just picks up his phone.

The OP has to recognize that women are RARELY going to have sex with him based on his personality, it would be EXTREMELY unwise to rely on it. He's not going to pick up HB supermodel by being '****y and funny', get real. He is correct in saying that going to the gym when you dont want to is a bad idea, that doesnt make him lazy or a bad person.



Put it this way: if you invest 500$/year in a gym membership, 500$/year on supplements, an extra 1000/year on food, and 300 hours of working out to get laid an extra 15 times, thats a TERRIBLE investment. That's $2000 and 300 hours (!) in exchange for 15 mediocre sexual encounters with average 'no anal, no bj' women.

 

[Rad]

I still don't see a point to this inane thread. What is it exactly that you are hoping to accomplish with this? Did you need a place to vent your feelings? Are you trying to convince others that they too might be lifting weights for the 'wrong' reasons? Perhaps just looking for some attention?

Could you please explain your reasoning for starting this thread. I don't think a thread is required everytime someone comes to some grave revelation about their life.

I think the point of this thread is to tell us that fitness does work to attract woman in a satrical kind of way..Look at the last line of the topic.

I just hate the notion of working out to impress women. The hardest, saddest thing for me about working out to get women...

... is when it works.

Well that's my interpretation of it at least and judging by some of the replies and his other topics, the OP does have a sense of humor which I like by the way:rockon:

 

[Kwello]

Put it this way: if you invest 500$/year in a gym membership, 500$/year on supplements, an extra 1000/year on food, and 300 hours of working out to get laid an extra 15 times, thats a TERRIBLE investment. That's $2000 and 300 hours (!) in exchange for 15 mediocre sexual encounters with average 'no anal, no bj' women.

OR it improves your sex life drastically with one woman that you care deeply about.

It's wonderful to turn on your woman with your personality... she wouldn't stay with you if that wasn't the case. But when you're turning her on with your body mind and soul... my god is that good sex.

Body, mind, soul. That is how you properly turn on a woman. That is how you make an unbreakable connection with a woman and that is how you fulfill all of her desires.

 

[mrRuckus]

Ok part of what you are saying might be right. But a man who takes care of himself (ie. six pack, big muscles) shows others that he has a sense of discipline and responsibility (ie. eating right, working out regularly), and that is something that chicks dig.

All i do is get a bigger and bigger ego and look down on their vices. So improving myself kind of sucks because it makes my standards even harder on the girl.

Hot, well behaved, respectful, cares about her health... nope.. not too many of them.

I'm getting pretty sick of talking to a hot girl for a while and then watch her pull out cigarettes.

 

[Kwello]

I'm getting pretty sick of talking to a hot girl for a while and then watch her pull out cigarettes.

So true... huge turn off. Huge.

 

[6-heads lewis]

Monster,

you are using one aspect of life to judge a person. Jus because someone has a six pack and goes to the gym, it doesnt make them a responsible and disciplined person. Maybe they neglect their kids and have promiscuous unprotected sex.

The arguments for weightlifting and fitness are ridiculous and fantastical more often than not. I can't understand why people add so many positive traits to fitness gurus, when in reality 90% of them are solely concerned with becoming better looking to improve their sex life.

----------

You have demonstrated the best pro-fitness argument: we are judged almost entirely on our appearance, it is wise to maximize this potential.

Arguing the merits of fitness is also a way for people to feel better about themselves and attribute great traits to their character, unjustifiably. Lifting weights does not make you some kind of responsible, dedicated, intelligent superman. It just makes you a guy who lifts weights. Being an MMA guy or a boxer does not make you a warrior, or a samurai or some other nonsense, it just makes you an MMA guy or a boxer.

A dose of reality, please.

 

[6-heads lewis]

OR it improves your sex life drastically with one woman that you care deeply about.

It's wonderful to turn on your woman with your personality... she wouldn't stay with you if that wasn't the case. But when you're turning her on with your body mind and soul... my god is that good sex.

Body, mind, soul. That is how you properly turn on a woman. That is how you make an unbreakable connection with a woman and that is how you fulfill all of her desires.

Ugh. As soon as someone introduces immeasurable variables into a debate, it all goes downhill. This is like a religious person saying 'God wont give you financial security, but he'll give you peace of mind and love!'

 

[izza]

It's not a question of insecurity, it's called 'sticking up for a friend' and I appreciate it.

I think you're right. I like what Throttle was doing. I like people who stick up for other people.

And 'moron' isn't? What did I tell you about treating others like you want to be treated? You don't want people to call you names, don't call THEM names.

I did treat Throttle how I want to be treated.

Last week, I got angry with a friend and called him an idiot. I made a mistake, but he called me an idiot right back. After that, things were even - no more, no less. Balanced.

Then we changed the subject and moved on.

Sure I could have avoided calling Throttle a moron... because I don't think he's a moron. But if I didn't call him a moron, I would be saying "I'm too good to insult you". I would take that as an insult in its own right, because I'm saying that I'm better than him. I'm not.

That is how I like to be treated in these matters. Throttle, I apologize if that's not your favorite way to regain "balance" between people. I didn't mean what I said at all, or the part about you being insecure.

I just want to move on from all of this. I pick really bad wording sometimes in these emails, and don't make things clear. And I also make mistakes, so I'm sorry about that.

Good luck with everything guys,

Izza

 

[izza]

I'm now taking bets on whether or not izza's account (as well as organized_confusion's) has been hacked by the notorious john_galt ... since both accounts laid dormant until j.g. got all pissy a couple weeks ago & tried desperately to spam these forums. now o.c. & izz come swarming through here starting threads that quickly balloon to 4 pages & rely heavily on formula & bluster.

I'll put a billion dollars on "Not john_galt." Any takers? (unless there are threads under Izza I don't know about, in which case, I'm about to be in debt for a long time).

Wow this thread is four pages? Oh my god...

You say my posts rely heavily on formula and bluster?

Formula? Really? Damn, I thought I left my mathematical proofs at home.

Less exercise x more personality = more women by a coefficient factor of 7?

I won't defend bluster. I'm from Chicago, we tend to be a bit windy.

Izza

 

[PersonalJesus]

I really don't like how you deal with other people here. Your whole manipulative "I'm happy for you" schtick is pretty inane, and I'm not sure about the people here, but I find your attitude and way of speaking rather condescending. You use a lot of words which describe touchy-feely emotions, why? Diplomacy? Are you scared to disagree with what other people are doing?

Your whole point is pretty half-assed. It's like saying something to somebody and apologizing right after because they get offended.

 

[izza]

Izza, I see what you are getting at... I´ve been doing that myself for some time, like sabotating myself while dating to focus on my game and only my game. I mean, like dressing shytty or not washing your hair before dating to be extra sure it was not your appearance what bagged the girl, if you succeed, but ONLY your game. That´s like putting on a weight jacket when running or giving your opponent at chess some pieces in advance. It´s a funny learning experience, everbody should try it some time... Dress like a moron and try to get the bytch only by spitting massive game at her.

But basically it is BS. It gives you nothing and leads you nowhere.

Attraction to your physique is part of the game. You cannot play the game without it because it is essential. In evolutionary terms, it gives lots of information to chicks (BTW never understood why fat isn´t attractive in evolutionary terms... fat means that you are alpha because the betas have to feed you and feed you more than enough while you can sit on your ace and do nothing... not true? =))))

So not trying to get your physique into the best of shapes is just blowing up your own game. It gives you nothing. It is like driving your car with only three wheels. You can prove how masterful you know how to drive on three wheels and not crash that car of yours... but what´s the point?

This is one of my favorite posts so far. I like the way you think, and the point you're getting at and the questions you ask.

Basically, I love your post. I'll do my best to respond to your questions. Again, I'm only speaking for myself here.

The idea of weight lifting must seem so strange to an alien. We live in a wondrous, vast world of life and beauty. Yet we go to a closed off room, we take heavy objects from their proper resting place. We move those heavy objects around, up and down, back and forth, in strange bodily positions. What an odd ritual.

The point is to use weights to increase the strength of our muscles. Our muscles get so much stronger for having weights there.

This is all well and good. I don't like lifting weights personally, but you enjoy it, I see nothing wrong with that.

Now I used to lift weights to attract women with my body. I'm not saying this doesn't work.

What I am doing in my life is a different kind of weight-training. I guess you could call it personality-training. The goal is to make my personality stronger, which obviously has effects that go beyond improving game. But if it improves my game, that's great too.

The point isn't to get one particular girl, but to keep improving my game. That is the muscle I want to exercise.

For me, personally, if a girl wants me for my body, I guess I don't mind. But at the same time, I don't take that as much of a compliment. What if I were paralyzed from the neck down. I suppose a lot of people would say "Goodbye to HB10s." Personally, I would say, "whoever I date should like me for who I am, no matter how beautiful she is." (Alex was kind enough to point out that I should judge women more on their personality, he's right. My assumption for now is that it's more than possible to get women armed with little but a great personality.)

What I really like is when a girl likes me for who I am, for my personality. Or even for the way I measure my floss on my arm or always miss this one spot on my back when I dry myself with a towel.

I guess what saying or at least trying to say is that being out of shape is a great opportunity to exercise the only muscle that really matters for me.

If I was an Adonis, I wouldn't need much personality to get women. Women would be interested in my body, they would just want to know I wasn't an axe-murderer, then I'd be in. It wouldn't take much to sell the girl, or at least, it would take a lot less.

If I'm a regular guy, I'm going to need a lot more personality to sell the girl, right? If I'm a guy in a wheelchair, or kinda fat, I'm going to need a whole hell of a lot to get women. Of course, some will say no outright, but that's ok. If I'm a guy in a wheelchair, some very pretty women will say yes, if I have an amazing personality. That's just the way I imagine it, but I think there is some truth to that.

So I guess I am saying that for me, I don't like the idea of working out to get women, because I think looking better impedes the development of true skill. And like I said, I want to attract a woman with my mind, not my body.

You're right that there will always be some element of both in there. And later on, in an LTR, I would hope she is attracted to both my body and mind, not just my mind.

When I was working out, I was using development of muscles as a crutch for my underdeveloped of personality. Ultimately, I was not improving my skills, I was improving my looks.

Looks work. The problem is, looks can go away far more easily than my mind can. Sure I would love to keep working out and looking great into my 90s. Sometimes, illnesses or car accidents or other things get in the way.

An Adonis at that point has nothing. He has nothing left, and no reason for women to love him.

I tell you almost anything can happen to me except brain damage, and I will still be macking the ladies.

I see developing my personality as a sort of insurance policy against life. A personality is a muscle that only very few things can take away.

Also, I look around me and I see bulky looking men everywhere. That's because anybody can go to the gym. I don't meet many people with personalities so powerful that they seem to give off a bright light from their head.

I see nothing wrong with working out for itself. Ultimately, I want to be both healthy and have a great personality. I would love to be the whole package, and I don't think we have to choose between looks and personality.

I have chosen in my life to pursue the strengthening of my personality right now. That may be through wearing an eye patch, letting my hair and beard grow. And yeah, I'm gaining a bit of weight. I'm getting there, but I don't look like a bear yet.

So I would disagree with you that by forgetting fitness and wearing an eye patch and ragged clothes, I am blowing up my game. All I am blowing up is any advantage I could have from physical attraction. Either the girl is less attracted to me. Or she is actively disgusted by my looks. Either is fine with me. My *game* as a whole is far from blown up. My game is stronger, because my personality has to fill in the difference.

That is the kind of fitness I am looking for.

I am considering joining a gym for myself. But I feel that developing my personality is more important for me right now than developing muscles. So long as I get some exercise here and there and aren't hurting my health down the road, I am content with that for now.

But you know, that's just me and the way I see it. If you like fitness, I really think that's fabulous. I feel you could probably improve your game more by letting the idea of attracting a woman with your body go. But that's just me, and I trust your judgment for your life more than I trust my judgment for your life!

Izza

 

[6-heads lewis]

Christ, I spend a lot of time constructing a thought-out post and even defending the OP, assuming he was coming from an intellectual perspective, and it turns out it's all a bunch of jibberish written by a hippie.

Your entire above post was retarded and nonsensical. That's what this topic was about? Having 'game' fitness? Exercising 'personality' muscles and self-actualization? Go live in a tree.

Ugh. I revoke all previous comments contributed to this topic.

 

[izza]

I really don't like how you deal with other people here. Your whole manipulative "I'm happy for you" schtick is pretty inane, and I'm not sure about the people here, but I find your attitude and way of speaking rather condescending. You use a lot of words which describe touchy-feely emotions, why? Diplomacy? Are you scared to disagree with what other people are doing?

Your whole point is pretty half-assed. It's like saying something to somebody and apologizing right after because they get offended.

Hey PJ,

I enjoyed reading your post. I like the way you brought an honest perception that was critical, but also fair and expressive. You probably think I'm saying that to manipulate your mind... muahahaha. Oh man, I'm good, eh?

I guess there's not really any way I can persuade you that "I'm happy for you" in not a schtick. All I can do is tell you it's not, and then it's up to you to decide what you believe.

Maybe I am appearing manipulative without realizing it. I'm not trying at all to manipulate. But you're entitled to your opinion. What I'm saying apparently does appear manipulative, without my meaning it to.

I really am happy for people that like working out. Those lucky punks. I hate it, and I'm wondering how the hell I'm going to live to be 87 (my target age) in good health without ever stepping in a gym again. Seriously, people who love that sort of thing have a huge advantage over me. Huge.

The purpose of this post was to spark other people to share their feelings about fitness, its utility for women, for improving game, for improving personality. I'm not really interested in truth or converting people as much as I am in hearing other people's thoughts, feelings, preferences, and experiences with this matter. Of course, I got a whole lot more than that lol, but that's ok too.

I don't like abstraction. I like expression. So I talk about my personal experience, and my personal emotions. I talk a lot about touchy-feely emotions, because that's just how I talk to everybody. I am extremely expressive. One of my mottos is "confidence not saying confident things. It is expressing *everything* confidently." So I just say how I feel to everybody, and I rather enjoy it.

Besides, all I know is myself. I really can't speak for anybody else. I don't feel I can tell you or anyone else what to think, because I don't know what you should think. I don't even know how I should think. All I can do is express what I do think and how I feel about things, and what my experience has been.

I suppose you probably won't believe me if I tell you that I am not very interested in other people agreeing with me, or changing the way other people think. I guess it feels kinda good, but how am I richer in the end? I am far more interested in sharing and hearing the experience of others. Especially people who disagree.

What I wish this board were, is a place where people just share their experience. I hate judgment, I hate flaming, I hate abstraction. I wish I felt more acceptance on this board. Like "you think differently than I do, but that's ok" kind of acceptance. I don't know. Maybe that impression is all in my head.

So yeah, I know my style is very, very different from a lot of people on here. I just don't give a crap about abstraction. It has very little value to me.

As for condescending, all I can say is I had no intention at all of appearing condescending. But I'm not a great writer, and quite often my writing takes a tone or meaning I don't intend. Gah, it drives me crazy! I just wish we could telepathically communicate. We spend so much time *Crafting words*, you know? Anyway, I don't think I'm any better than anybody else. All I have to go on is my own experience, just like everybody else. I guess somewhere deep down, I probably do still have a lot of condescension I need to work on. I guess you don't think it's so deep down, huh? Anyway, I apologize for my imperfections as a writer, and I didn't mean to seem condescending to anybody.

I see no reason why anyone should be offended. All I'm doing is expressing how I feel. But other people feel different ways than I do, and that's fine!

Out of shape and all,

Izza