Closing Tips

[nicksaiz65]

Hey guys,
So I ended up going out to the bar again and doing some more approaches. I've gotten good at opening, vibing/rambling, touching, flirting, and so on.

I met a 22 year old HB8 who goes to the same school as me. She seemed decent interest because she was very touchy with me, calling me buff af, listened to my bull****, etc.

I screwed up and only ended getting her number. If there's one thing in Game that I've learned this semester, it's that numbers at night are worthless. You have to close the deal that night or the odds are very high that you'll never see her again.

But I just wasn't sure how to close the deal here. First of all, my friend who I rode with was ready to go home. Secondly, her parents were visiting with her this weekend so going to her place wasn't really a great option. She had already been drinking a while so she didn't even want to go to the bar to do another shot lol. The logistics really weren't there. And there's a really good chance I'll get flaked on because you have to strike while the iron is hot. Which is fine because this is a numbers game, and you have to be outcome independent. But I figure I may as well improve my Game too while I keep raising my SMV.

I was wondering if you all had some general closing tips I could use at Night to get that Same Night Bang? I'd appreciate it.

 

[cola]

It’s rare. To pull off same night lays on a consistent basis you would have to have some type of serious social status. Local celebrity, college sports star headed to pros, Instagram influencer, well know party promoter or something of that nature. The other time it’s common is vacation destinations, you can pull this off in Vegas, Mardi Gras in New Orleans etc etc.

Otherwise, it has less to do with you and more to do with the chick being a complete sl*t and you were just the hottest guy around at the moment.

The third way is the chick is just so utterly drunk she has no idea what’s even going on. If you go out often you see that chick.. drunk, stumbling, falling all over the place. Friends can’t control her so they just say f*ck her and bail on her.
This chick you don’t want, because she comes with a rape charge after she sobers up.

 

[nicksaiz65]

It’s rare. To pull off same night lays on a consistent basis you would have to have some type of serious social status. Local celebrity, college sports star headed to pros, Instagram influencer, well know party promoter or something of that nature. The other time it’s common is vacation destinations, you can pull this off in Vegas, Mardi Gras in New Orleans etc etc.

Otherwise, it has less to do with you and more to do with the chick being a complete sl*t and you were just the hottest guy around at the moment.

Yeah the logistics aren't usually lined up and it's not always practical. I'm wondering if this is my fault and I could be doing something more to close, or if that's just the way the cookie crumbles.

Roosh says that without the prospect of the same night bang, night game would be basically worthless because of the annoyingly high flake rate. I agree with him. It's a grave mistake to just get the number of the girl who shows IOIs for fvcking you that night. He also says to always keep a condom in your pocket cause banging in the car or bathroom is lower compliance usually than meeting for a date later in the week lol.

 

[cola]

Yeah the logistics aren't usually lined up and it's not always practical. I'm wondering if this is my fault and I could be doing something more to close, or if that's just the way the cookie crumbles.

Roosh says that without the prospect of the same night bang, night game would be basically worthless because of the annoyingly high flake rate. I agree with him. It's a grave mistake to just get the number of the girl who shows IOIs for fvcking you that night. He also says to always keep a condom in your pocket cause banging in the car or bathroom is lower compliance usually than meeting for a date later in the week lol.

Yea I’m not saying it can’t be done it’s just so rare it’s not worth banking on. Day game is your bread and butter. 1st date lays are way more likely to happen. I’d say unless you have the social status I mentioned above or like top 5% movie star good looks(which you may if you are as buff as the chick says.. a chiseled body goes a long way) dont even chase it. Just go out with friends when invited with no preconceived outcome in mind.

 

[BackInTheGame78]

Grab her hand once all this is going on and place it on your junk. If she enjoys it you know she wants the D and if she pulls her hand away you know she doesn't.

 

[nicksaiz65]

Grab her hand once all this is going on and place it on your junk. If she enjoys it you know she wants the D and if she pulls her hand away you know she doesn't.

That's actually an escalation strategy in the bedroom lol

 

[nicksaiz65]

Yea I’m not saying it can’t be done it’s just so rare it’s not worth banking on. Day game is your bread and butter. 1st date lays are way more likely to happen. I’d say unless you have the social status I mentioned above or like top 5% movie star good looks(which you may if you are as buff as the chick says.. a chiseled body goes a long way) dont even chase it. Just go out with friends when invited with no preconceived outcome in mind.

Yeah unfortunately I don't have top 5 or even ten percent looks lol. So I take it you've had better results with Daygame over NightGame? I plan on going hard on Daygame over my Winter Break.

 

[BackInTheGame78]

That's actually an escalation strategy in the bedroom lol

Trust me it works well out in public places while making out.

 

[samspade]

OP, I don't go for same night lays much so take what I say with a grain of salt. But a venue change is always a good bet. You take control, suggest you both "get out of here" and lead her to another bar you know. It's like two dates in one and you can better isolate.

Otherwise, the lean in/penis press is not a bad strategy. Or just go for the makeout and escalate. But if you don't bring her home, don't sweat it. Enjoy your nights out. If you live from lay to lay it's like paycheck to paycheck...there's more to life than that.

 

[nicksaiz65]

All of that flirting stuff is completely worthless and inconsequential for a man of experience. For me it doesn’t even start until she touches my penis. Otherwise you are just entertaining them. Women love entertainment. But then act like your penis is the physical embodiment of AIDS.

You can save yourself from a lot of useless interactions by simply placing your crotch on her. Push up against her butt, her thigh, whatever. See how she reacts. If she doesn’t run away then your penis gets to feel good. If she does run away then you’ve just saved yourself a lot of wasted time.

I have a theory that most guys only have a limit of 500 interactions with women. I know so many guys who used to be super pua fanatics that completely burned out. One guy looks like Leonardo DiCaprio but he’s meditating in India now trying to find enlightenment.

So use your time wisely. If you keep wasting your time with women going nowhere you run the risk of burning out and joining the priest hood......aka MTGTOW. LOL.

The best way to cut through all the bullsh1t is to see if they react positively to your penis. You’re not going to see these bar h0es again anyway so what have you got to lose?

You know, I see what you're saying. The Blue Pilled White Knight Cucks would probably freak if they read this. But I realized, frat boys do the same thing when you think about it. And you know how girls love frat boys. I see them escalating like this all the time. Hell, this weekend, I even heard the line "Want a tour of my bedroom?"

I think that what you all are describing is just advanced kino. It's even a compliance test. If she treats your c0ck like hot iron you're not getting laid lol.

Hm, I hope I don't burn out. I'm going to compress a ton of approaches into very little time. It'll be way more than 500.

Lmao @ MGTOW being the priesthood. Although, they make some good points.

 

[nicksaiz65]

OP, I don't go for same night lays much so take what I say with a grain of salt. But a venue change is always a good bet. You take control, suggest you both "get out of here" and lead her to another bar you know. It's like two dates in one and you can better isolate.

Otherwise, the lean in/penis press is not a bad strategy. Or just go for the makeout and escalate. But if you don't bring her home, don't sweat it. Enjoy your nights out. If you live from lay to lay it's like paycheck to paycheck...there's more to life than that.

In this case, I couldn't venue change unfortunately. Well, now that I think of it, I could've walked with her to a different bar down the street or something lol.

They say you have to use your own ingenuity to close effectively cause there are so many different situations. There's no book or video that can teach you all the infinite situations.

I've never really tried the penis press outside of the bedroom, but I'll give it a shot. I'll bet it'll be especially effective when dancing.

Since we have a mutual friend, I'll just hit her up in a month when I get back into town. Never throw away pvssy as they say.

That check to check analogy... I really like it. Gotta stay on that purpose.

 

[nicksaiz65]

Grab her hand once all this is going on and place it on your junk. If she enjoys it you know she wants the D and if she pulls her hand away you know she doesn't.

I forgot to mention. This is probably a great way to fight back against attention wh0res. If she treats your c0ck like a hot stove? Either you haven't built enough comfort or she's an attention wh0re. If she won't jump through your compliance tests and fails the penis press? Definitely an attention wh0re.

Just little tests to make sure you don't get used for your nonsexual attention.

 

[nicksaiz65]

Yea I’m not saying it can’t be done it’s just so rare it’s not worth banking on. Day game is your bread and butter. 1st date lays are way more likely to happen. I’d say unless you have the social status I mentioned above or like top 5% movie star good looks(which you may if you are as buff as the chick says.. a chiseled body goes a long way) dont even chase it. Just go out with friends when invited with no preconceived outcome in mind.

I thought about what you said and it makes a lot of sense. Even Roosh says that lots of the time, a same night Bang will not be feasible. Even so, you need to at least try because of the awful flake rate. If you hit a wall, get her number. But numbers at night are a joke. You'll be lucky if you get a 15% conversion rate.

You're more likely to meet up with a girl that you've kissed as opposed to one that you haven't.

So from what I've extrapolated... I should always try to kiss the girl by the end of the night. And go for the same night Bang, but if I can't get it fine.

And then to make NightGame work, I just need to play a Numbers' Game so vicious that the horrendous flaking doesn't even matter, right?

 

[nicksaiz65]

I just did another batch of approaches. Not whining at all here cause abundance mindset, but I now agree with Roosh 100%. You DEFINITELY need to go for the same night Bang in NightGame. If you wanna get numbers, you should do DayGame or OLD. Numbers at night are basically worthless.

I met a 23 year old college student at the bar yesterday. She was extremely attractive to me, an HB8. I did my usual routine. Open, vibe, ramble, tease, kino escalation, all of that good stuff. She was really getting into it. She sh*t tested me and I passed those tests effortlessly.

At the end of the night when I told her goodbye, she said "Can I be real? I really like you. And I want to see you again. You have my number, right? You need to hit me up so we can hang out." She was even moving to my hometown in two days, so I thought I could get away with not going for the Same Night Bang. I then talked a bit more, wished her goodbye, and ended up kiss closing her. I thought it was pretty promising.

And then I hit her up on 7 PM two days later and I couldn't even get a text back lol.

I'm not complaining, I'm just saying that this proves my point. Numbers at night are basically worthless. I totally agree with you on this one @Young OG . A girl could tell you that she loves you at night. But her emotions are extremely fickle and fleeting. You need to close the deal that night, even kissing isn't good enough tbh. I thought I could break my rule with the Same Night Bang cause the connection seemed very strong, but you can't break that rule whatsoever. I'd say this applies to first dates too: you must assume you'll never see her again, so go for the Bang.

More proof of this is that lately, every number I've successfully set up a date with has been from DayGame. Never NightGame.

The logistics were kind of spotty since we both lived far away. But what I should've done is grabbed the bottle of tequila I had, venue changed with her some more, kept on spending time with her, and then Bang her that night by watching a movie at her place or something. I even had a condom in my pocket lol. I suppose this is what they mean when they say "killer instinct." You must be aggressive with women to succeed. And it HAS TO be developed in the field. Mystery says the 7 Hour Rule. But honestly, I kinda agree with RSD Derek more on this: he says, talk for 40 minutes to an hour. After that, you need to be closing/venue changing. More time is not your friend in this case. I think we were talking about this earlier @DEEZEDBRAH lol.

My point is, if a girl from at night who is touching all over me and giving me crazy IOIs like she was, plus flat out stating(ostensibly) that she likes me flakes like that? No point in getting numbers at night. My previous experience in the field says that, and Roosh confirms it.

So sorry about the wall of text. But I'm just gonna cap this post off with a few quotes:

"The best phone game to play is the one that uses the phone as little as possible"
- My Natural Friend

"We cannot expect a girl to come through simply because she thinks we’re interesting or attractive. This is not enough to ensure future dates with her. Instead, she must invest her body into the interaction. This means you have to push the intimacy as far as she allows."
-Roosh V

"If I can't Bang a girl that night, then that's not the girl for me"
-RSD Derek

 

[Young OG]

I just did another batch of approaches. Not whining at all here cause abundance mindset, but I now agree with Roosh 100%. You DEFINITELY need to go for the same night Bang in NightGame. If you wanna get numbers, you should do DayGame or OLD. Numbers at night are basically worthless.

I met a 23 year old college student at the bar yesterday. She was extremely attractive to me, an HB8. I did my usual routine. Open, vibe, ramble, tease, kino escalation, all of that good stuff. She was really getting into it. She sh*t tested me and I passed those tests effortlessly.

At the end of the night when I told her goodbye, she said "Can I be real? I really like you. And I want to see you again. You have my number, right? You need to hit me up so we can hang out." She was even moving to my hometown in two days, so I thought I could get away with not going for the Same Night Bang. I then talked a bit more, wished her goodbye, and ended up kiss closing her. I thought it was pretty promising.

And then I hit her up on 7 PM two days later and I couldn't even get a text back lol.

I'm not complaining, I'm just saying that this proves my point. Numbers at night are basically worthless. I totally agree with you on this one @Young OG . A girl could tell you that she loves you at night. But her emotions are extremely fickle and fleeting. You need to close the deal that night, even kissing isn't good enough tbh. I thought I could break my rule with the Same Night Bang cause the connection seemed very strong, but you can't break that rule whatsoever. I'd say this applies to first dates too: you must assume you'll never see her again, so go for the Bang.

More proof of this is that lately, every number I've successfully set up a date with has been from DayGame. Never NightGame.

The logistics were kind of spotty since we both lived far away. But what I should've done is grabbed the bottle of tequila I had, venue changed with her some more, kept on spending time with her, and then Bang her that night by watching a movie at her place or something. I even had a condom in my pocket lol. I suppose this is what they mean when they say "killer instinct." You must be aggressive with women to succeed. And it HAS TO be developed in the field. Mystery says the 7 Hour Rule. But honestly, I kinda agree with RSD Derek more on this: he says, talk for 40 minutes to an hour. After that, you need to be closing/venue changing. More time is not your friend in this case.

My point is, if a girl from at night who is touching all over me and giving me crazy IOIs like she was, plus flat out stating(ostensibly) that she likes me flakes like that? No point in getting numbers at night. My previous experience in the field says that, and Roosh confirms it.

So sorry about the wall of text. But I'm just gonna cap this post off with a few quotes:

"The best phone game to play is the one that uses the phone as little as possible"
- My Natural Friend

"We cannot expect a girl to come through simply because she thinks we’re interesting or attractive. This is not enough to ensure future dates with her. Instead, she must invest her body into the interaction. This means you have to push the intimacy as far as she allows."
-Roosh V

"If I can't Bang a girl that night, then that's not the girl for me"
-RSD Derek

You should have hit up that 23 yr old the next day. It might not of made it different but women have so many options nowadays, especially at that age. They have short attention spans. She probably forgot who you were.

 

[nicksaiz65]

You should have hit up that 23 yr old the next day. It might not of made it different but women have so many options nowadays, especially at that age. They have short attention spans. She probably forgot who you were.

Yeah. I'm sure a college girl like that has c0ck for days lol. Throw in alcohol too and you've got a losing game.

I'm still glad I had this interaction though. This just solidifies the NightGame issue in my head. So therefore, my "Killer Instinct" has improved a bit.

I meant to hit her up the next day but I got busy and forgot lol. But Roosh advocates to text her the next evening starting at 7 or later as well.

 

[nicksaiz65]

A lot of women view casual sex as a social taboo. They view it the same way closet gay guys view sex with guys. A closet gay guy might be turned on enough in the moment to be open. But a few days later, his social conditioning would kick back in and she’ll want to avoid any feelings of cognitive dissonance.

It’s the same way with women. If it’s just casual meaningless sex, she might be open in the moment, but her social conditioning will kick in when she sobers up. And then randomly 3 weeks later she’s drunk and horny again and hits you up out of the blue.

If you combine the fact that women don’t really value casual sex and then add on their social conditioning on top of it, you will see just how ridiculous getting phone numbers in night game is. You are literally going against the grain.

And let’s not forget that it is much easier for women to sleep with guys in their social circles. So that’s like 3 strikes against you.

In truth night game/day game doesn’t matter. What really matters is context. I’ve met many women at night that I saw again. But the difference was the context. The women I saw again from night game had a connection with me and committed to me right away. They weren’t strangers trying to figure me out or just open to sex.

We were planning to be long term friends because we had a lot in common, and we were in the same wavelength. And sex JUST HAPPENS to be one of the perks of that friendship. Sex is like a perk, not a goal. The goal is genuine connections.

I’m at the point where I can attract that type of connection anywhere. But for newbies I recommend day game/social environment game until you have enough experience and know what a genuine connection looks like.

Women on your wavelength are more compelled to reach out to you because they don’t run into that type of connection every day.

Yeah I see what you mean. Numbers at night just aren't worth it. It's an uphill battle to say the least.

I imagine if you met some girl at Night through a mutual friend it'd be a different story though. That's social circle.

That explains why women act so erratically. Some women would hit me up for sex, and we'd fvck one night. Then I'd hit her up a couple days later, and she'd flake or ignore me. Then she'd randomly hit me up 2 weeks later for sex. That puts words to why that would happen.

So you gotta strike while the iron is hot.

At night, the Same Night Bang. I don't think this is really feasible in DayGame though, or social circle game. But the flake rate in those isn't as horrendous so that's good. You also have the option of an "Insta Date."

When you say "women don't value casual sex," you mean that since they have a constant abundance of c0ck to choose from it means nothing to them, right?

Yeah I'm definitely gonna get in copious amounts of Daygame this Winter Break. I'm aiming for 120 Approaches total. That can easily be done in a month.

I've had sex with a handful of girls. But by definition, I'm still considered a ”beginner." In one year, I want to be intermediate. I've played with some Daygame. But I'll go hard on it this break and report back. I definitely want to be using it next semester in school.

 

[MessedUpLearner]

Yeah I'm definitely gonna get in copious amounts of Daygame this Winter Break. I'm aiming for 120 Approaches total. That can easily be done in a month.

I've had sex with a handful of girls. But by definition, I'm still considered a ”beginner." In one year, I want to be intermediate. I've played with some Daygame. But I'll go hard on it this break and report back. I definitely want to be using it next semester in school.

I should definitely do that too Nick.
However, I'm a complete beginner.

How would you approach it?
What should be the action plan?

 

[nicksaiz65]

I should definitely do that too Nick.
However, I'm a complete beginner.

How would you approach it?
What should be the action plan?

Yo. By definition I'm still a beginner too... but if you specifically wanna do DayGame? Do all the Self Improvement stuff here on Sosuave for starters. I'm doing that too. Also, buy the books Day Bang and Game by Roosh V. If you have those two books, it'll give you a high level of understanding of women, it's pretty comprehensive. And you'll have a full action plan for executing/learning Game. He has a Chapter called "The Roosh Program" which is designed to get you out of the beginner phases. I'm doing cycles of that program myself.

You'll have to buy those directly off his website, I believe. They're not on Amazon.

 

[MessedUpLearner]

Yo. By definition I'm still a beginner too... but if you specifically wanna do DayGame? Do all the Self Improvement stuff here on Sosuave for starters. I'm doing that too. Also, buy the books Day Bang and Game by Roosh V. If you have those two books, it'll give you a high level of understanding of women, it's pretty comprehensive. And you'll have a full action plan for executing/learning Game. He has a Chapter called "The Roosh Program" which is designed to get you out of the beginner phases. I'm doing cycles of that program myself.

You'll have to buy those directly off his website, I believe. They're not on Amazon.

Well I've read Bang, and DayBang, I wrote a post on the DJ Discussion that explains my situation a bit more. However, I haven't read Game nor that Chapter so I'll check that out. I don't really mind DayGame or NightGame I just want to practice and get out more.
Specially since guys I know don't want to go partying so it's all on me. I need to learn how to go out and approach by myself.

What's your take on that Nick?