Building Comfort but not Killing the Mystery?

nicksaiz65

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I've seen first-hand how much being a Mystery turns girls on. Crazy how it works like that. But this aspect has been something that I've struggled with for a bit.

I know that when you're on a date, you're flirting, touching, and building rapport/comfort. But if you're building rapport by talking about things you have in common, how do you avoid killing the mystery? I've learned that killing the mystery is essentially a fast track to the friendzone.

Going on a date tomorrow, so I'd like to hear your opinions.
 
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BJP1991

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Interested as well. Also curious about the difference of in-person mystery vs non-in person. Meaning, creating/maintaining mystery in person during conversation, and also maintaining mystery after the date as well.


Reason being, I actually had an hb8 recently tell me they weren’t interested in continuing to go out because I “didn’t reach out to her enough after dates” - basically that I wasn’t like the other losers who text a girl night of or day after a date telling them “how great of a time I had”...this girl was 23, I’m 28. Goes to show you what some women expect. Basically I ****ed her good (better than her last boyfriend, she said) but turned her off by not texting her for like 3 days after a date...I know I dodged a bullet there, but good lord can a girl go from high interest and wanting to **** your brains out to “not wanting to continue things” because you don’t validate them via text after a date...F that. Sounds like an insecure woman to me, if I’ve ever seen one. I’m onto the next already, but sweet Jesus it’s kind of annoying that some women literally expect you to text them that you “had a good time” and if you don’t, they can write you off and self-deselect from the process and move onto whatever other loser beta who will text them all day and night and validate their feelings without them having any anxiety over a guy they’re dating
 

stormrider

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Just show her appreciation. It will make any woman feel like you are coming from a validator frame and you will make her comfortable at the same time.

Drop all your game.

It’s all about presence. Show up with your dominant presence. And then Appreciation. Appreciate her feminine essence. You will create a space for her to flirt with you. And if she tries to play games, call her out on it. This is your leadership.

Presence, appreciation, and leadership.

I once showed a woman nothing but appreciation and she came over the next night. She actually called me too at close to midnight. She was looking for an excuse (plausible deniability) to come over.

Don’t mistaken appreciation for supplication. Guys supplicate and get rejected and vow never to show appreciation again. Because these two are so damn similar to each other. But one is an act of giving value and the other is an act of taking value.

Understand the difference and you will create a space for women to come into your sphere to try and have sex with you because they know you will ravish them in bed (your appreciation is a precursor to ravishing).
 

Glassguy

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Building comfort- let her talk. Keep her talking. If you didnt realize this, women love to talk. They also love to talk about themselves. They will even trip up and tell you things that they shouldnt be telling you if you only listen.

Remain a mystery- You just talk enough to keep the conversation going.
Her: Yeah I really like to travel blah blah
You: Oh yeah? Where do you like traveling to?
Her: blah blah

By the end of the date she has told you more than enough for you to know if there needs to be a date #2. Ex BFs, social presence, etc etc. She will also feel as if the date went well because all she did was talk. Not realizing that you just kept the convo going.

She will also think "Man I really dont know much about him (mystery) so I think I need to find out more...."

Then comes date #2 and you do the same thing except you also take advantage of times in the convo to drop in sexual inuendos when needed and ramp up the sexual presence.

If you are good at this, you dont have to say much at all. Your body position, eyes, witty comments and sly smile will do it all without anything really coming out of your mouth.
 

nicksaiz65

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Just show her appreciation. It will make any woman feel like you are coming from a validator frame and you will make her comfortable at the same time.

Drop all your game.

It’s all about presence. Show up with your dominant presence. And then Appreciation. Appreciate her feminine essence. You will create a space for her to flirt with you. And if she tries to play games, call her out on it. This is your leadership.

Presence, appreciation, and leadership.

I once showed a woman nothing but appreciation and she came over the next night. She actually called me too at close to midnight. She was looking for an excuse (plausible deniability) to come over.

Don’t mistaken appreciation for supplication. Guys supplicate and get rejected and vow never to show appreciation again. Because these two are so damn similar to each other. But one is an act of giving value and the other is an act of taking value.

Understand the difference and you will create a space for women to come into your sphere to try and have sex with you because they know you will ravish them in bed (your appreciation is a precursor to ravishing).
I definitely agree with you on the Dominance thing. I don't know how you deal with women without a Game strategy lol. Every time I tried to just be me and not be using a Game strategy constantly, it would blow up in my face haha.
 
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Alvafe

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Interested as well. Also curious about the difference of in-person mystery vs non-in person. Meaning, creating/maintaining mystery in person during conversation, and also maintaining mystery after the date as well.


Reason being, I actually had an hb8 recently tell me they weren’t interested in continuing to go out because I “didn’t reach out to her enough after dates” - basically that I wasn’t like the other losers who text a girl night of or day after a date telling them “how great of a time I had”...this girl was 23, I’m 28. Goes to show you what some women expect. Basically I ****ed her good (better than her last boyfriend, she said) but turned her off by not texting her for like 3 days after a date...I know I dodged a bullet there, but good lord can a girl go from high interest and wanting to **** your brains out to “not wanting to continue things” because you don’t validate them via text after a date...F that. Sounds like an insecure woman to me, if I’ve ever seen one. I’m onto the next already, but sweet Jesus it’s kind of annoying that some women literally expect you to text them that you “had a good time” and if you don’t, they can write you off and self-deselect from the process and move onto whatever other loser beta who will text them all day and night and validate their feelings without them having any anxiety over a guy they’re dating
problems, you belive that a woman tells you, chances are she lied to not confront you, she compared you with her ex, and you lost a nice way to neg her
 

nicksaiz65

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Building comfort- let her talk. Keep her talking. If you didnt realize this, women love to talk. They also love to talk about themselves. They will even trip up and tell you things that they shouldnt be telling you if you only listen.

Remain a mystery- You just talk enough to keep the conversation going.
Her: Yeah I really like to travel blah blah
You: Oh yeah? Where do you like traveling to?
Her: blah blah

By the end of the date she has told you more than enough for you to know if there needs to be a date #2. Ex BFs, social presence, etc etc. She will also feel as if the date went well because all she did was talk. Not realizing that you just kept the convo going.

She will also think "Man I really dont know much about him (mystery) so I think I need to find out more...."

Then comes date #2 and you do the same thing except you also take advantage of times in the convo to drop in sexual inuendos when needed and ramp up the sexual presence.

If you are good at this, you dont have to say much at all. Your body position, eyes, witty comments and sly smile will do it all without anything really coming out of your mouth.
That makes great sense. So for comfort, she does most of the talking: she just needs to keep talking to you. Or you just don't talk about yourself.

Now how would you handle it if you have lots of commonalities? To get specific, there was this one girl who I had a ton in common with. We liked all the same kind of music and video games. The first mistake I made was texting her for more than just logistics. The second mistake is I talked about all of that kind of stuff with her and I think I showed my hand too much. If you have shared interests like that, is it considered killing the mystery to talk about things like that?
 

nicksaiz65

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problems, you belive that a woman tells you, chances are she lied to not confront you, she compared you with her ex, and you lost a nice way to neg her
I love negging lol. I'm adding that to my arsenal
 

stormrider

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I definitely agree with you on the Dominance thing. I don't know how you deal with women without a Game strategy lol. Every time I tried to just be me and not be using a Game strategy constantly, it would blow up in my face haha.
That's a good question. I will expand on it. It's called the attraction holarchy. A holarchy is like a circle where the more you reach the center, the more you get to the core.

On the outside circle is the presence. This is what women notice first. But the outside circle is a byproduct of the totality of you that is inside the circle. Not only do women see your presence first, they also feel your presence. Every man gives off a presence/vibe based on what is inside of him.

Within the circle of presence is appreciation. A sense of appreciation is a sign of abundance and value. A great man who is about his business will walk around with a sense of appreciation. In a sense, him going to the bars/clubs is more of a celebration of his life than just merely seeking female validation. He carries a different vibe than the supplicating value seeker. So don't supplicate, appreciate.

Within appreciation is integrity. The reason why he was able to reach a state of appreciation in the first place is because he has the Integrity to be a masculine man who strives towards greatness and leads others towards empowerment and greatness. It is from integrity that a state of appreciation is born.

Within integrity is wholeness. A man who's self esteem is in tact will have the integrity to do what it takes to become successful in life. It is from this inner core that spurns all of his actions.

But not everyone is whole. Some people are broken.

But imagine you had all of these qualities of a man and were able to pull women within with your presence. What would happen? She would experience your state of abundance and appreciation. She would discover your integrity and wholeness. And it would cause her to want you. Why would you need game on top of already being a great guy? If you were her type, her seducing you would be automatic.
 

AJ84

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problems, you belive that a woman tells you, chances are she lied to not confront you, she compared you with her ex, and you lost a nice way to neg her
No. Think about it. If you went on a date with a girl and she didn’t text or reach out for 3 days, what would you think? High interest?

I would take her at her word. Especially if she slept with him and he went no contact for three days. In the female world that is a red flag sign she was just being used for sex and feeling like you are being used typically decreases interest for most girls.

I get not blowing up a girls phone but really for f**ks sake some balance of contact to keep the rapport and her interest going esp after crossing the sex line lol. Her reaction was a no brainer.
 
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guru1000

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No. Think about it. If you went on a date with a girl and she didn’t text or reach out for 3 days, what would you think? High interest?

I would take her at her word. Especially if she slept with him and he went no contact for three days. In the female world that is a red flag sign she was just being used for sex and feeling like you are being used typically decreases interest for most girls.
And men don't get used for sex too? You speak as if women are being used when they often implicitly push for sex more than men, hence their need for augmentation (heels, makeup, etc.) for seduction to begin with.

I respond to your post as it strips men of agency not to call. She is free to reach out after sex just as the man is.
 

AJ84

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And men don't get used for sex too? You speak as if women are being used when they often implicitly push for sex more than men, hence their need for augmentation (heels, makeup, etc.) for seduction to begin with.

I respond to your post as it strips men of agency not to call. She is free to reach out after sex just as the man is.
Yes she is free to do that, but a lot of girls will wait to see if they hear back from them after sex, it’s the first sh*t test actually. Not saying it’s right but depending on the context of the hook up, esp if it happened fast she may wait to see if he texts or calls. It’s a dumb passive aggressive move even I admit, but it’s very common.


And yes using him for sex happens but a guy is much are more likely to get used for resources.

If a girl is using a guy for sex and she’s hot and the sex is good, is that an issue for guys? I’m genuinely asking.

If a girl gets a free dinner date from a guy, doesn’t contact him for three days then texts to ask when he’s taking her out again, or drops hints about some purse she likes or some such crap, how does that feel in comparison to be used by a hot girl for sex?

Yes a guy should always have free agency not to text or call, and the girl has free agency to decide if she wants to continue dating a guy who doesn’t text or call her.
 

lamath

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And men don't get used for sex too? You speak as if women are being used when they often implicitly push for sex more than men, hence their need for augmentation (heels, makeup, etc.) for seduction to begin with.

I respond to your post as it strips men of agency not to call. She is free to reach out after sex just as the man is.
This believe that every men only want sex is why so many men approach women in an indirect way thinking that it makes then different than other men.

Its a powerful tool to brainwash most men.

I had that way of thinking for a long time.
 

guru1000

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Yes she is free to do that, but a lot of girls will wait to see if they hear back from them after sex, it’s the first sh*t test actually. Not saying it’s right but depending on the context of the hook up, esp if it happened fast she may wait to see if he texts or calls. It’s a dumb passive aggressive move even I admit, but it’s very common.


And yes using him for sex happens but a guy is much are more likely to get used for resources.

If a girl is using a guy for sex and she’s hot and the sex is good, is that an issue for guys? I’m genuinely asking.

If a girl gets a free dinner date from a guy, doesn’t contact him for three days then texts to ask when he’s taking her out again, or drops hints about some purse she likes or some such crap, how does that feel in comparison to be used by a hot girl for sex?

Yes a guy should always have free agency not to text or call, and the girl has free agency to decide if she wants to continue dating a guy who doesn’t text or call her.
Neither party is being used for sex. And that was the implicity buried in my rhetoric. The "free dinner date" is not a comparable item as "sex" as the free dinner date is at the expense of one, whereas with sex, it's at the expense of each other. Hence, why a man is under no social obligation to initiate, and neither is she. However, to shame a man into calling for "her to save her face" is a social construct which empowers her.

This does not mean a man should or should not initiate. Just pointing out the buried nuance there.
 

AJ84

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Neither party is being used for sex. And that was the implicity buried in my rhetoric. The "free dinner date" is not a comparable item as "sex" as the free dinner date is at the expense of one, whereas with sex, it's at the expense of each other. Hence, why a man is under no social obligation to initiate, and neither is she. However, to shame a man into calling for "her to save her face" is a social construct which empowers her.

This does not mean a man should or should not initiate. Just pointing out the buried nuance there.
My intention wasn’t to shame him, and no where in my post did I suggest he call her so she can save face. She’s accountable to her own actions.

I stated why she likely dumped him, which is likely the reason she directly gave him and that reason makes sense to most women based on the risk of getting used for sex which is something a lot of women actually try to screen for. Again, this girl is accountable to her own actions, not him. He has no obligation to her what soever but that doesn’t change the fact that him not calling her was interpreted in a negative way by her and she dumped him as a result and that reaction is a based on something that many women do respond negatively too which is the guy not taking the initiative to reach out after dates and most definitely after sex. Right or wrong, it is what it is.

In an ideal world women would just take more initiative around these things and not be so passive, hopefully women do make some changes around that but we are not there yet.
 
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guru1000

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My intention wasn’t to shame him, and no where in my post did I suggest he call her so she can save face. She’s accountable to her own actions.

I stated why she likely dumped him, which is likely the reason she directly gave him and that reason makes sense to most women based on the risk of getting used for sex which is something a lot of women actually try to screen for. Again, this girl is accountable to her own actions, not him. He has no obligation to her what soever but that doesn’t change the fact that him not calling her was interpreted in a negative way by her and she dumped him as a result and that reaction is a based on something that many women do respond negatively too which is the guy not taking the initiative to reach out after dates and most definitely after sex. Right or wrong, it is what it is.

In an ideal world women would just take more initiative around these things and not be so passive, hopefully women do make some changes around that but we are not there yet.
I will correct you and state that it’s not idealized that most women should initiate after sex. They actually do. Even a simple “thank you” after the date. I also find that women who purposefully withhold communication post-date under the guise of “being used” have much greater red flags than others due to their increased insecurities. So in this case, she rejects herself and does the man a great service.

Remember AJ, you speak for a few dozen women whom you know. I speak for many more.
 

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Make her guess things about you and give witty and ambiguous answers that keep her guessing. Women's biggest erogenous zone lies between their ears.
 

nicksaiz65

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Make her guess things about you and give witty and ambiguous answers that keep her guessing. Women's biggest erogenous zone lies between their ears.
Yeah not giving her straight honest answers is a pretty good technique from what I can tell.
 

AJ84

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I will correct you and state that it’s not idealized that most women should initiate after sex. They actually do. Even a simple “thank you” after the date. I also find that women who purposefully withhold communication post-date under the guise of “being used” have much greater red flags than others due to their increased insecurities. So in this case, she rejects herself and does the man a great service.

Remember AJ, you speak for a few dozen women whom you know. I speak for many more.
I speak as someone who actually is a woman. While there may be some women who withhold communication post date under the guise of being used for sex as a reason to dump a guy, which is horrible, there are lots of women who actually dump a guy because it was in fact just about sex and for those women they didn’t want to be used for just that which for them is also horrible.

Some women are fine with just sex. But a lot of women really are trying to prevent getting used and are not making up excuses when dumping a guy who appears to be using them for sex. And just like some girls use men for resources, some guys use women for sex. I mean, a significant portion of what’s posted right here illustrates how some women and men use each other in that way.

I think a simple thank you to a guy after a date is perfect, initiate a connection. I like that a lot. But what happens if he says you’re welcome and doesn’t text anything else for the next three days lol? Joking but if that did happen you can bet many women would hamster that to death lol.
 

devilkingx2

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Interested as well. Also curious about the difference of in-person mystery vs non-in person. Meaning, creating/maintaining mystery in person during conversation, and also maintaining mystery after the date as well.


Reason being, I actually had an hb8 recently tell me they weren’t interested in continuing to go out because I “didn’t reach out to her enough after dates” - basically that I wasn’t like the other losers who text a girl night of or day after a date telling them “how great of a time I had”...this girl was 23, I’m 28. Goes to show you what some women expect. Basically I ****ed her good (better than her last boyfriend, she said) but turned her off by not texting her for like 3 days after a date...I know I dodged a bullet there, but good lord can a girl go from high interest and wanting to **** your brains out to “not wanting to continue things” because you don’t validate them via text after a date...F that. Sounds like an insecure woman to me, if I’ve ever seen one. I’m onto the next already, but sweet Jesus it’s kind of annoying that some women literally expect you to text them that you “had a good time” and if you don’t, they can write you off and self-deselect from the process and move onto whatever other loser beta who will text them all day and night and validate their feelings without them having any anxiety over a guy they’re dating
To be fair, I can understand her complaint if it came off like you were using her for sex and otherwise didn't care about her, which is how it would come off if you only had time for her when you could smash.

Of course, for me the turn off would be the implied disinterest in sex, who would want a girl that feels like sex is a favor she's doing you and that you aren't returning the favor just by making her ***?

Personally I'll text a girl all day if she wants because I can text while I watch T.V. and play video games.
 
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