Self Improvement Is "Weird"

[Plinco]

You seem to be more interested in an argument than critique...

What's the difference? An argument can most certainly be a critique.

You think that because you ignore advice and continue to do things your own way, you're somehow setting an example for "independent thinking".

I've gotten much better results after doing things my way. Do you think I or anyone else is obligated to follow advice?

 

[BillyPilgrim]

Yep, and as Revelation cautions us: Their hair will be as the hair of women, and their teeth as the teeth of lions. Strange, perilous world we all inhabit

Pilgrim 14:8 Their hair will be as the hair of Barons, and their teeth as the teeth as lambs.

 

[Plinco]

This is a matter of social grace. Not independent mindedness.

People who lack this grace and the interpersonal skills that come with them sometimes claim they’re a “lone wolf” who “people just don’t understand”. However, this is self-deceit, because the reality of such individuals is that they’re recluses who are poorly socialized.

Part of personal development is improving your ability with people. Humans are social beings, so socializing carries significance within human dynamics. A huge part of that is communication, which is NOT limited solely to the content of speech, but also the tonality of the person, their body language, and individual particularities (e.g. personality, character, mood, etc.)—all of which nuance the message being conveyed since they’re forms of self-expression. Women are especially sensitive to subcommunication, hence why 2 men can say and do the exact same things, yet one is deemed attractive while the other is not.

Ultimately, you don’t change people’s minds by reasoning with them using logical, factual rationale. You do so by social persuasion, eloquence, and beautifying the form of something to them rather than focusing on the substance. If you wish to improve yourself more, this will be something you need to work on.

This is a very common misunderstanding. People conflate isolation with independence, or rationality for a lack of emotion. Reason and emotion are not mutually exclusive but are companions. You'll feel much stronger emotions when you're clear headed and can integrate everything back to yourself, in other words, you can think with clarity how some thing or an idea affects you. Talk to any recovering drug addict and they'll tell you that clarity of mind affected their emotional state.

Socialization is pattern recognition. That's all. Nothing special about that in general. However one must consider that people don't always act rational. Non-forced obedience to "authority" figures is not rational, and yet people consider it to be a matter of 'social grace' to surrender themselves for the sake of someone else's interests. Part of developing yourself is breaking off habits that are for the sake of 'social grace' and not of reason.

Something I like to say is that some rules are meant to be followed and some rules are mean to be broken.

 

[BackInTheGame78]

This is a very common misunderstanding. People conflate isolation with independence, or rationality for a lack of emotion. Reason and emotion are not mutually exclusive but are companions. You'll feel much stronger emotions when you're clear headed and can integrate everything back to yourself, in other words, you can think with clarity how some thing or an idea affects you. Talk to any recovering drug addict and they'll tell you that clarity of mind affected their emotional state.

Socialization is pattern recognition. That's all. Nothing special about that in general. However one must consider that people don't always act rational. Non-forced obedience to "authority" figures is not rational, and yet people consider it to be a matter of 'social grace' to surrender themselves for the sake of someone else's interests. Part of developing yourself is breaking off habits that are for the sake of 'social grace' and not of reason.

Something I like to say is that some rules are meant to be followed and some rules are mean to be broken.

I think you've been breathing in too much grass pollen OP.

 

[Cheeky_James]

Here’s something to consider about self improvement .
this how I see it

you are not who you think you are.
You are who others think you are.

example
A guy could go hardcore self improvement - after some time he may think hes become an awesome alpha male , funny, cool sexy guy (or whatever the goal of his SI efforts was) his new self image.

but.. if they consensus opinion of everyone else around him is that he is a delusional loner weirdo…
Then that’s what he is.

Cos that’s how the world works, unfortunately.

 

[Plinco]

you are not who you think you are.
You are who others think you are.

For argument sake, if each person was incapable of self-evaluation, why would you trust any of them to define you?

So are you saying that people are inherently delusional, to the point that each person cannot trust themselves to evaluate their own results? If I can bench press 205lbs, but other people say that I'm too skinny to bench that much weight, do I still go with defining myself based on what others think and forget that I could bench 205?

 

[Cheeky_James]

For argument sake, if each person was incapable of self-evaluation, why would you trust any of them to define you?

So are you saying that people are inherently delusional, to the point that each person cannot trust themselves to evaluate their own results? If I can bench press 205lbs, but other people say that I'm too skinny to bench that much weight, do I still go with defining myself based on what others think and forget that I could bench 205?

self improvement is kinda a flawed notion.
Because of personal bias.
How can you evaluate yourself and your improvement objectively- when you have massive personal bias Inbuilt to your own psychology.
You can set goals and tick them off sure.
But you cannot measure how much improvement has occurred objectively.. results I suppose are a measure , but personal bias still stands as to what the results mean.