Married. How many guys have a side dish ?

[DumbSS]

Not reading everything so if something says she’s hostile/hates you ignore this but Talk to your wife about having an open relationship. Or a hall pass. Be real with her about how you’re feeling & say you respect her too much to go behind her back but you have some **** you need to get out of your system. She might offer to have a 3some to help you thru it & rekindle the spark between you. Or she might be stoked to get back out there herself (If you don’t like the sound of that really fkn evaluate yourself bud). This sounds like it has the potential to be messy, but not as messy as sneaking around & getting caught & having everything taken from you in the divorce, and having your kids resent you.

 

[GT40]

Most wives aren’t going for an open relationship. Not a threesome either. One never knows I suppose but highly unlikely.

 

[DumbSS]

Most wives aren’t going for an open relationship. Not a threesome either. One never knows I suppose but highly unlikely.

I mean sure, but how many guys have the guts to ask these questions instead of going behind her back like a coward? ‘I respect you too much’ alone could solve all your problems, removing the need for extracurriculars altogether. In a perfect world hey? Captain hindsight here to say ‘if you don’t mean ‘till death do us part’ don’t agree to it’ lol

 

[mrgoodstuff]

I mean sure, but how many guys have the guts to ask these questions instead of going behind her back like a coward? ‘I respect you too much’ alone could solve all your problems, removing the need for extracurriculars altogether. In a perfect world hey? Captain hindsight here to say ‘if you don’t mean ‘till death do us part’ don’t agree to it’ lol

How do you feel if a woman has a man shut down multiple months or years? I feel it means she doesn't care. I agree its better to say something vs sneaking around.

 

[DEEZEDBRAH]

Just like the title says. Any married guys here have sex outside the marriage ? Something. Extra?

Your avi is the subtle art of not giving a ****kkk.

Not doing it right.

Day 1, I am getting mine. Your not in the mood means next. Act accordingly.

 

[GT40]

So when you say next ... you mean you’re getting some Trim on the side. ?

 

[highSpeed]

I mean sure, but how many guys have the guts to ask these questions instead of going behind her back like a coward? ‘I respect you too much’ alone could solve all your problems, removing the need for extracurriculars altogether. In a perfect world hey? Captain hindsight here to say ‘if you don’t mean ‘till death do us part’ don’t agree to it’ lol

Again, not that simple when finances and kids are involved. Easy to suggest that a married guy say to his wife, who I might add does not care about the physical nature of the relationship, that he should tell her he has too much respect for her to go behind her back. Look, if she's at the point where she literally never puts out, she's not interested in the relationship, so doing that probably prompts an argument that doesn't need to happen.

At that point, I think for most guys, it's about trying to hang on to your family and your finances. Prompting an argument that can damage your abilities on both fronts, that seems as though it's a bad idea. I'm sure she knows that leaving him high and dry long enough, he's going to go out and get some, she doesn't need to have it thrown in her face.

In a perfect world, they sit down, they talk about it, she starts to put out more and is into it. I swear, women wait for the marriage and the kids and then the inner f you type of attitude comes out and that's it for most marriages. Some stay together for kids and finances but women get more and more entitled as we get pulled deeper and deeper into the throws of feminism, so the divorce rates will get higher.

I've heard it on here before, maybe you went too far with this or the man did that. Look, unless he's beating the sh*t out of her, cheating or has literally abandoned the marriage, she has no right to neuter her husband like that. Again, the sick, twisted f*cks that I think most women are, they get off on neutering their mate. It's like they want to take them back to being a kid where they are the parent, it's a sick mindset that most women have. Taking their mate back to a child, it gives them the real thing they desire, power, not sex or a great marriage.

 

[Calihopeful]

When a man is married he should not be having any side dish at all.

If there's a problem within the marriage - work it out like a man.

If the marriage is ending - work it out until it ends. Fight for it.

If the wife cheated on you - end the marriage and fvck around like a champion!

Agreed. Playing devils advocate, I think it is possible for a guy to have a loving marriage, plenty of sex, and still want to have sex with a new woman. It's the novelty of the situation. Doesn't necessarily mean there is a problem with the marriage. I could have a one night stand with a woman and still come home and love my wife. But lying and sneaking around is weak. You are not a slave to your biological impulses.

 

[Calihopeful]

If you crave other women surely p0rn be the answer?

I can’t logically make an argument as to why you’d go out of your way to have an affair on a happy marriage for novelty.

Perhaps if you were drunk or otherwise impaired.

There is a difference between watching people fvck and actually fvcking.

I can't make that argument either, but I can understand why someone would do it (not the same as saying it's OK to do it). If you're in a happy marriage, do you never look at other women sexually? Of course you do. Logically, you can make the argument that it's not worth the risk of losing a happy marriage, and I would agree. But you don't even have to "go out of your way to have an affair." You could be in a situation where the opportunity presents itself, one time thing, spouse likely won't find out, etc.... Hypothetically, if the guy DGAF (no guilt), wife never found out, his relationship never changed, his affair would be akin to masturbation. Where is the harm in that scenario?

 

[GT40]

Agreed. Porn doesn’t do it for me. It’s ok once in a while. The real thing is always way better.

When kids are involved it’s financial suicide when caught. You can bet on being money raped by her in court.

I’d agree too that most men would rail another woman if no chance of being caught. I’ve thought about it not gonna lie

 

[Calihopeful]

Because you would know as an individual that you were a liar, a cheat and a breaker of promises. How would you view your wife in that scenario?

If someone doesn’t care about that, and won’t self judge their own hypocrisy and feel a lesser man because of it, that’s on them.

It’s less likely a wife would care a jot if you watched p0rn. Some consider it “virtual cheating” but most don’t care.

I could never be so arrogant as to assume in the scenario you paint I would behave in a moral way - perhaps I would falter.

However, I get a sense of self esteem from leading a good life and having a clear conscience, and I have little respect for men who cheat on their women. They’ll cheat with your woman if YOU don’t know and are therefore not worthy of friendship as they have poor moral fibre.

Personally, I'm on the same page with everything bold. In the scenario I painted, if the guy doesn't care, and his conscience isn't affected, I have a hard time seeing the harm in it. Just saying "That's wrong!" or "That's gross", doesn't really solve the problem, if there is one. There is another philosophical argument that follows the same train of thought here.

Suppose a brother and sister head up to a cabin for vacation. They are always really close. They end up having sex, they use protection, no one is pregnant. Afterwords, they are fine, and actually feel closer to one another because of the incident. They aren't in a relationship with each other, never intend to be, and no one else finds out. Is there any harm done?

What if it was your buddy’s woman and he wouldn’t find out? Is that different?

I really like this way of thinking about it. It gives a knee jerk reaction that it is different. But it is not. If there is no harm done, i.e. he would not find out, it doesn't affect your conscience, then it's no different.

 

[AttackFormation]

What I’m saying is most here recognise how low and dirty cheating on your buddy’s girl is. Even if he doesn’t know, you are a morally bankrupt idiot and cannot be trusted. There is no glory in that, and if people think that’s OK is no one knows, you’re probably cluster B yourself. You can’t put yourselves in another mans shoes and judge your actions by how that would feel if it was done to you.

Same for cheating on your girl if no one knows. It’s this attitude which is the cause of all the worlds problems - I’ll have mine and yours too.

This is a PUA forum, although at times it’s a great source of wisdom, it does attract the type of man who views his success in the world as the amount of women he screws, and often delights in the harm he causes them and others, so I’m not banking on broad support.

I’m thankful for the decent guidance I have and the good bits.

This is why people who ask things like "what's the problem if no one knows?" can't be given a good answer, because you either have a conscience or you don't. And if they had one, they wouldn't ask that question in the first place. The feelings of guilt and remorse would in of themselves be the problem letting them know it's wrong. But their brains don't work like that. If you don't feel that betraying people behind their backs is wrong, then there's nothing anyone can say to "logically" convince you otherwise.

However I do make a distinction between you breaking your vows, and someone you sleep with breaking their vows. It's the responsibility of the committed person to not cheat, not the random single person.

 

[GT40]

What if it was your buddy’s woman and he wouldn’t find out? Is that different?

Not a chance. I’d never betray a friend like that. Not worth it

 

[Calihopeful]

This is why people who ask things like "what's the problem if no one knows?" can't be given a good answer, because you either have a conscience or you don't. And if they had one, they wouldn't ask that question in the first place. The feelings of guilt and remorse would in of themselves be the problem letting them know it's wrong. But their brains don't work like that. If you don't feel that betraying people behind their backs is wrong, then there's nothing anyone can say to "logically" convince you otherwise.

However I do make a distinction between you breaking your vows, and someone you sleep with breaking their vows. It's the responsibility of the committed person to not cheat, not the random single person.

Very excellent point. If someone does not have a conscience, how can you convince them much of anything is wrong? Perhaps it's a useless scenario then. Just as you cannot logically reason with someone who does not value reason, arguing with them would be a waste of time. That said, I think Sam Harris did a really good job at the end of his short book "Lying." (emphasis mine)

"Lying is, almost by definition, a refusal to cooperate with others. It condenses a lack of trust and trustworthiness into a single act. It is both a failure of understanding and an unwillingness to be understood. To lie is to recoil from relationship.

By lying, we deny others a view of the world as it is. Our dishonesty not only influences the choices they make, it often determines the choices they can make—and in ways we cannot always predict. Every lie is a direct assault upon the autonomy of those we lie to.

And by lying to one person, we potentially spread falsehoods to many others—even to whole societies. We also force upon ourselves subsequent choices—to maintain the deception or not—that can complicate our lives. In this way, every lie haunts our future. There is no telling when or how it might collide with reality, requiring further maintenance. The truth never needs to be tended in this way. It can simply be reiterated."