Would you to take the Rona Vaccine?

[FairShake]

Personally, I don't really think the masks do much good unless you are engaging in up close conversation with a group of people indoors. I doubt they do much if you are just going out shopping and maintaining your social distancing. If you're the type who has to stop and chat with everybody you see, you might want to wear one.

If you don't already have COVID-19 just walking around the grocery store w/o a mask without extensive face to face contact is probably fine.

If you do already have COVID-19 just walking around the grocery store w/o a mask can infect and kill grocery store workers who do have extensive contact every day.

Masks work if you're sick. They have for years. They work in every other country that is killing the US in their coronavirus responses. If you protect somebody else's mother we can only hope they protect your father.

 

[Kotaix]

People are too docile, these days.

What really gets me is how much blind faith is demonstrated by people who'll allow anyone to inject any thing into their bodies, as long as the person holding the syringe is wearing a white lab coat. If you docile sheep only knew exactly how little the person pushing the plunger actually knows about what he's injecting into you....you probably still wouldn't care...baaaaah....baaaah....baaaah.

A healthcare worker's knowledge of what's in the vaccine they use is irrelevant, just like home cooks understanding of the exact component ratio of a purchased mix is irrelevant to them being able to use it to make a cake. They don't care, they just buy it because it works.

If I get bit by a rabid dog or a deadly snake, the doctor's knowledge about what's in the vial beyond what's on the label isn't going to matter to me or anyone else in that position. I just want him to use the right one, and as soon as possible so I don't die an agonizing horrible death.

If you want to entertain conspiracy theories then that's your prerogative.

 

[zekko]

If you do already have COVID-19 just walking around the grocery store w/o a mask can infect and kill grocery store workers who do have extensive contact every day.

Masks work if you're sick. They have for years. They work in every other country that is killing the US in their coronavirus responses. If you protect somebody else's mother we can only hope they protect your father.

If you have the virus, you shouldn't be walking around the grocery store at all, whether you have a mask or not.

I'm not really sold on the idea that other countries are killing the US with their coronavirus responses either. Yes, we lead the world in cases, but we also test far, far more than any other country. And there are so many variables among different countries as to climate, economy, population, infrastructure, etc., that it seems difficult to compare one country to the next.

So far I've been fortunate enough not to have caught it. There are several behaviors I've engaged in that have contributed to that, but I don't think wearing a mask was one of them. I agree masks help protect others if you're infectious.

 

[EyeBRollin]

The United States has 4% of the world's population but 30% of the COVID-19 cases.

European, Asian, and Oceania countries have largely beaten this virus already and we're still arguing over wearing a mask or even taking a vaccine once made available.

 

[DelayedGratification]

If you have the virus, you shouldn't be walking around the grocery store at all, whether you have a mask or not.

And given the prevalence of asymptomatic carriers, you know for a fact that you do or do not have the virus exactly... how?

 

[zekko]

And given the prevalence of asymptomatic carriers, you know for a fact that you do or do not have the virus exactly... how?

You're right, I don't know. But what are the odds of my being infected? What's an acceptable risk? If I maintain social distancing and practice good hand washing and sanitizing, what are the odds of me infecting people? And for the record, I don't refuse to wear a mask. If a store's policy is that they require a mask, I wear one. It's a matter of simple respect. If they don't require a mask, chances are I won't wear one. Because in those stores, the workers aren't usually wearing masks, nor are most of the customers. But they do have the plastic partitions up, and the six foot markers. As long as I'm not sneezing, coughing, or talking to people, I just don't think the masks make that much difference.

 

[DelayedGratification]

You're right, I don't know. But what are the odds of my being infected? What's an acceptable risk? If I maintain social distancing and practice good hand washing and sanitizing, what are the odds of me infecting people? And for the record, I don't refuse to wear a mask. If a store's policy is that they require a mask, I wear one. It's a matter of simple respect. If they don't require a mask, chances are I won't wear one. Because in those stores, the workers aren't usually wearing masks, nor are most of the customers. But they do have the plastic partitions up, and the six foot markers. As long as I'm not sneezing, coughing, or talking to people, I just don't think the masks make that much difference.

Kudos to you for recognizing that a mask just isn't a big deal. It's amazing to me that it's such a point of contention.

The flaw in your reasoning is that you're thinking at interpersonal scale rather than epidemiological scale. It's not about individual risk, it's about how the math works out across the larger population. Most people seem to accept the notion of herd immunity, which is a similar concept with equally counterintuitive math behind it, if one were to think merely at the individual scale rather than at public health scale.

But somehow the rather simple notion that people wearing face coverings reduces the average radius of droplet transmission is controversial.

Didn't think I'd live to see such strange days.

 

[FairShake]

If you have the virus, you shouldn't be walking around the grocery store at all, whether you have a mask or not.

I'm not really sold on the idea that other countries are killing the US with their coronavirus responses either. Yes, we lead the world in cases, but we also test far, far more than any other country. And there are so many variables among different countries as to climate, economy, population, infrastructure, etc., that it seems difficult to compare one country to the next.

Not everyone who has the virus knows they have the virus. Asymptomatic spread is the very reason this bug spreads so far and so fast.

In terms of testing we rank 34th per capita. We are 11th in cases per capita.

 

[FairShake]

If I maintain social distancing and practice good hand washing and sanitizing, what are the odds of me infecting people?

The virus spreads largely by airborne and droplet transmission routes. Hand washing is important but not the biggest factor at play.

And for the record, I don't refuse to wear a mask. If a store's policy is that they require a mask, I wear one. It's a matter of simple respect. If they don't require a mask, chances are I won't wear one. Because in those stores, the workers aren't usually wearing masks, nor are most of the customers.

Well I certainly hope those stores start requiring people to wear masks then.

 

[zekko]

The virus spreads largely by airborne and droplet transmission routes. Hand washing is important but not the biggest factor at play.

Most people wear cloth masks, bandanas, scarves, or the like, not professional level masks. Rick the Toad said even the N95s do not filter out the virus. As long as I'm not talking to, spitting on, sneezing on, or coughing on people, as well as following universal precautions, I doubt if I'm going to infect anyone not by not wearing a mask.

 

[DelayedGratification]

Most people wear cloth masks, bandanas, scarves, or the like, not professional level masks. Rick the Toad said even the N95s do not filter out the virus. As long as I'm not talking to, spitting on, sneezing on, or coughing on people, as well as following universal precautions, I doubt if I'm going to infect anyone not by not wearing a mask.

And as you've conceded in the past, masks are not about being a 100% barrier. And while I respect Rick, he's neither a virologist nor an epidemiologist (and, of course, neither am I). And he's probably not wrong: an N95 may not guard against infection if you were to step into a room swimming with aerosolized virus. But again, it's not the point.

For yet another flawed analogy: seat belts. You may be the safest driver in the world, and never get in an accident. You personally, anyway. That does not negate the fact that seat belt laws, from a public health perspective, have decreased road fatalities.

 

[FairShake]

Most people wear cloth masks, bandanas, scarves, or the like, not professional level masks. Rick the Toad said even the N95s do not filter out the virus. As long as I'm not talking to, spitting on, sneezing on, or coughing on people, as well as following universal precautions, I doubt if I'm going to infect anyone not by not wearing a mask.

The N95 exists to protect YOU while other masks exist to protect others. For example, when I worked at a hospital, the once-in-awhile Tuberculosis patient would wear a surgical mask when they were moved from room to room to prevent transmission to others. When we would enter the room we would wear N95 masks.

FWIW, and this is not scientific, I have care for almost 3 dozen COVID patients now and have worn one constantly sterilized N95 mask per week. I have been inches away from coughing patients regularly, a few with no masks. An N95 filters out 95% of all microbes 0.1 microns or more (COVID is slightly larger). I'm COVID-free per 3 tests. I firmly believe HOW you catch it is very important to it efficacy. 95% (or more) being filtered out means a lower viral load and a greater potential for lack of infection.

 

[zekko]

And while I respect Rick, he's neither a virologist nor an epidemiologist

He's said he has a degree in Infectious Disease Epidemiology, along with his experience working with infectious diseases, so he has some expertise to draw upon.

 

[zekko]

I wouldn't worry so much about the masks, since apparently people are wanting to destroy our cities now. And they're not social distancing either.

 

[DelayedGratification]

He's said he has a degree in Infectious Disease Epidemiology, along with his experience working with infectious diseases, so he has some expertise to draw upon.

Missed that, my bad. A bit odd then that he's so laissez-faire about face-coverings, taking a small-group-dynamics viewpoint rather than an epidemiological one. But then, his primary job is a PA, not Public Health, and the questions he's fielded are mostly from a personal perspective than policy.

 

[FairShake]

I wouldn't worry so much about the masks, since apparently people are wanting to destroy our cities now. And they're not social distancing either.

True...and the media won't call THEM out on it (too scared probably)

 

[EyeBRollin]

True...and the media won't call THEM out on it (too scared probably)

Correct. The media needs to highlight the outside agitators they keep arresting.

 

[glass half full]

Correct. The media needs to highlight the outside agitators they keep arresting.

Would be more interesting to see them asking on the street, who supplies the materials being used by the protesters.
Bricks, ready-made Molotov ****tails, etc.
Hordes of this stuff has been found. Who supplies this? By the reports (I only watch Fox, in case you're wondering)...there isn't a brick supply company anywhere near the protests (NYC). Who is buying them? Most of what you see on tv for protesters, appear to be bottom feeders.