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Most guys accidentally kill attraction before they even speak. They assume they need a bigger bank account, a better physique, or smoother lines. They miss the point.

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I learned this the hard way. Years of freezing up. Getting friend-zoned. Watching other guys walk away with the girl I wanted. Then I discovered a set of 22 simple rules that rewired my entire approach.

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Why Men Benefit from Marriage More Than Women

BaronOfHair

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Most people weren't allowed to read or write until very recently either...
A large percentage of people are lousy readers/classified as functional illiterate today. We're already in Dark Ages again

@BeExcellent "You see, a successful marriage requires solid character"

That excludes at least over 70% of the human race, right out of the gate

@Sega Genesis "That said I do contend that with such a high rate of divorce (here in SoCal it's the highest in the U.S."

Rates are destined to drop precipitously, the more populated the locale, and the hotter the people in it generally are. Therein lies yet another elephant in the room... Marriage arose at a time in human history during which communities were generally far more provincial, and temptations far fewer


@Slowhandluke "if marriages are only helpful for men, why is it that ever since people are getting married less; more women then ever are on medications? but men arent?"

We men have never found it as necessary to f-ck around with shrinks as the ladies have... When there's booze in the nearest convenience store's fridge, and dope being slung on every street corner across the nation, why wait for a scrip?
 
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Just because a woman listens to you and acts interested in what you say doesn't mean she really is. She might just be acting polite, while silently wishing that the date would hurry up and end, or that you would go away... and never come back.

Quote taken from The SoSuave Guide to Women and Dating, which you can read for FREE.

Slowhandluke

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@Slowhandluke I don't disagree but I wasn't referring to arranged marriages. Where I'm from (currently SoCal) I don't see many arranged marriages although I'm sure they exist.



I think love begins with lust (true for me and those I associate with) but then evolves into something deeper, more meaningful and longer lasting. Ideally.

That said I do contend that with such a high rate of divorce (here in SoCal it's the highest in the U.S.) the institution itself is collapsing due to a combination of factors... too many to get into now.
I guess you are talking about the modern southern California marriage where it is based on "love". I'm talking about marriage that is common throughout history and throughout the lands where it is not primarily about "love", but more of a union of 2 people who ultimately grow to "love" each other.

Throughout history marriage was not about "love" or what I like to refer to as lust, but the sharing of goals, experiences, and cooperation of two people with their knowledge that each person brings different things to the relationship. For example, the man is usually more rational while the woman is more emotional.

Attraction while helpful, was not a requirement. Probably because people throughout history knew that attraction (lust) was not as enduring as shared experiences, having the same circle of friends, or being reputable in the same village/city, etc.

tbh, Lust is probably too dangerous of a thing. It can blind people. In the past, that is why the father, the mother, the elders; helped (or made the actually) decision of who married who.
 

BackInTheGame78

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A large percentage of people are lousy readers/classified as functional illiterate today. We're already in Dark Ages again

@BeExcellent "You see, a successful marriage requires solid character"

That excludes at least over 70% of the human race, right out of the gate

@Sega Genesis "That said I do contend that with such a high rate of divorce (here in SoCal it's the highest in the U.S."

Rates are destined to drop precipitously, the more populated the locale, and the hotter the people in it generally are. Therein lies yet another elephant in the room... Marriage arose at a time in human history during which communities were generally far more provincial, and temptations far fewer


@Slowhandluke "if marriages are only helpful for men, why is it that ever since people are getting married less; more women then ever are on medications? but men arent?"

We men have never found it as necessary to f-ck around with shrinks as the ladies have... When there's booze in the nearest convenience store's fridge, and dope being slung on every street corner across the nation, why wait for a scrip?
Nice try but not even close to the same thing.
 

BaronOfHair

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Nice try but not even close to the same thing.
Bottom line is, as @Bokanovsky ( https://www.sosuave.net/forum/threa...marriage-more-than-women.285910/#post-3187876 )and others have pointed out:

One can find research which APPEARS to support just about anything, be it "Marriage is good for men" , "More people voting, in and of itself, would strengthen democracy", or "The sky is green, not blue". Reading the fine print, digging into the methodologies* used, and recognizing alternate interpretations of the data almost always reveals that things aren't quite as cut and dry as we'd prefer ...

-Marriage CAN benefit SOME men more than women

-More people voting WEAKENS democracy when the general public become fond of a a highly interventionist state, as has been the case here in The US, from The 1970s-forward

-Many neurological disorders can seriously taint those afflicted's perception of the external world, the color of the sky included... The respondents in that research who reported that the sky is green are all severely schizophrenic


*We haven't even discussed how the hell all these different researchers define "benefit"... It's entirely possible that each study had a different conceptualization of "benefit", and the conclusions they ultimately reached are therefore wildly inconsistent with one another
 

Slowhandluke

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@Slowhandluke "if marriages are only helpful for men, why is it that ever since people are getting married less; more women then ever are on medications? but men arent?"

We men have never found it as necessary to f-ck around with shrinks as the ladies have... When there's booze in the nearest convenience store's fridge, and dope being slung on every street corner across the nation, why wait for a scrip?
from what i understand rates of alcoholism is down... less and less people are drinking which includes men.


if I'm not mistaken, drug use in general is down including dope...
 

“The 22 Rules That Turned Me From Invisible to Irresistible With Women… Starting Tonight”

You can skip the expensive cars, the fancy clothes, and the endless gym selfies. Completely unnecessary.

I used to freeze the second a beautiful woman looked my way. Frustrated. Awkward. Watching other guys walk away with the girl while I stood there tongue-tied.

Then I discovered 22 simple rules that rewired my entire dating life. The anxiety vanished. Conversations flowed effortlessly. Women started chasing me for a change.

These rules trigger a woman's subconscious attraction switches. And you can start using them tonight.

Read more...

Prepostereax

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This pretty much nails it:
The problem with this argument is that you can find "research" to support just about anything. I'm sure sure there is research out there that "proves" that men who suck d!ck are happier than those who don't.
With marriage, you can't take broad stats and assume it applies to your situation

Marriage is a highly individual experience

For example, marrying the wrong person will set you back years at the very least, regardless of sex

There's some luck involved, but also judgement calls

So in some ways it can be like anything else you invest in, whether it's business or recreational - you get back proportional to what you put in
Why are you giving airtime to random feminists?

(And, I hope clicking on that doesn't affect my feed)
 

BadBoy89

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Why are you giving airtime to random feminists?

(And, I hope clicking on that doesn't affect my feed)
Author is a feminist? I didn’t know that.
 
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RoadKing_Rabbit

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Author is a feminist? I didn’t know that. ]
It tracks. It also reeks of red herrings, cherry picking and a few projections. But the end line was "Thoughts?" Those are mine.
 

jhonny9546

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I agree that marriage is a business contract. And I agree that its origins arose from families essentially arranging these partnerships. And I further agree that marriage as an institution does not line up well with the idea of romantic love. However I have seen many MANY successful and loving marriages between man and woman that adroitly combine the two concepts.



You see, a successful marriage requires solid character. There will always be temptation around, both for the man and the woman. People with character choose to honor the marriage. And look, there is an appeal to "strange", and there is an appeal to someone new who is mysterious and unknown. My sister used to always say "I'm married, not blind....." meaning she still could observe the attractiveness of others, but her commitment to her marriage meant that she would never act on those fleeting observations.



It's kind of like having a car you enjoy. There are other cars out there that catch your eye. You don't go trade your car every time you see something else interesting. A very simplified metaphor, obviously, but it makes a sufficient illustration.



My father (a most esteemed attorney who practiced family law for 20+ years along the way) used to always say: "Marriage is a partnership in a literal sense. And like a partnership, an agreement needs to be reached in the beginning, when everyone is getting along, about how to unwind and dissolve the partnership, it should come to that at some point."
I can't agree more with @BeExcellent you explained it really well..
This is why nowadays it is simply our choice as men whether to accept or not, whether to tolerate and tolerate all the lack of respect from women.

If you're doing well as a man, and you're controlling yourself, you're paving your own way, and you're giving it your all, then if you're not leaving any weaknesses that would make your woman look elsewhere because of some shortcoming of yours, then it's truly 100% your decision whether to continue or not, whether to take a step forward or not: I believe marriage today is more of a decision for men than for women.

As you said, women look around, but "contain themselves" because they must remain "faithful" to the commitment of their marriage.
For us men, it's different... and those like me will understand: for them, it's a task; for us, it's about love.

Woman loves a man if they feel obligated to perform a task for him or for the istitution (marriage) (social image).
Man loves a woman.


Of course, men look around too, but it's a huge difference. You know..


That said, it would be very interesting to understand what a man should do when his woman has decided to behave a certain way, to stir things up, because she has seen "the grass is greener on the other side."

However I have seen many MANY successful and loving marriages between man and woman that adroitly combine the two concepts.
And this is precisely where the man has made the difference: by enduring and overcoming difficult moments.
I have many examples of man being disrespected (not cheating), and LTR continuing because of the will of the man who "waited," created a "buffer" by being a bit absent/angry, hoping the waters would calm down. And so it was, but as the forum teaches us, this teaches the woman that the man in question wasn't strong for staying and now committing even more, but simply weak for staying and not walking away.

There is someone here, who has a special intuition for this type of thing, and I'm glad to hear more from @Desdinova What are your thoughts about this?


ps: @BeExcellent I've saved your quote!
 
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Hal9000

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I would agree that a "good" marriage is beneficial to both men and women with men receiving more benefit than women. When I think about the lifestyles of most single men I've known compared to the lifestyles of most married men, theres no comparison between the two as married men tend to live much, lets just say, tamer lives. I don't think this is typically the case with women as they tend to live their lives much more similarly regardless of marital status. This obviously results in the men living longer, being healthier, probably wealthier and being more satisfied as a result.

Having said that, theres probably not a single more destructive event in a man's life than dealing with a bad marriage and the inevitable divorce for reasons that have been well documented on here.
 

BaronOfHair

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@Hal9000 "When I think about the lifestyles of most single men I've known compared to the lifestyles of most married men, theres no comparison between the two as married men tend to live much, lets just say, tamer lives"

And once they're "domesticated", wives begin finding these same men less appealing than sleeping face first in a Porta Potty in a Coachella
 

Slowhandluke

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I would agree that a "good" marriage is beneficial to both men and women with men receiving more benefit than women. When I think about the lifestyles of most single men I've known compared to the lifestyles of most married men, theres no comparison between the two as married men tend to live much, lets just say, tamer lives. I don't think this is typically the case with women as they tend to live their lives much more similarly regardless of marital status. This obviously results in the men living longer, being healthier, probably wealthier and being more satisfied as a result.

Having said that, theres probably not a single more destructive event in a man's life than dealing with a bad marriage and the inevitable divorce for reasons that have been well documented on here.

"theres probably not a single more destructive event in a man's life than dealing with a bad marriage and the inevitable divorce" BUT most marriages end in divorce; so the act of getting married a good thing for men?

Its like saying going to war is a good thing for men because those that survive war gets veterans benefits, appreciation from the public, good retirement benefits, etc.. BUT totally ignoring the fact that most men will be killed by bullets, bombs, IEDs, etc.. etc..

TBH, I feel marriage is better for women.. Most women marry up and most men marry down. Women get an upgrade in lifestyle... and if she wants out, there's a good chance she can take a lot of his stuff... not to mention if they have kids, she can emotionally wreck him because "believe all women"... the court system is stacked against men.

what do men get? Sex? But then, that can be withdrawn at any time...
 

Manure Spherian

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what do men get? Sex? But then, that can be withdrawn at any time...
You don’t need marriage for sex. Marriage as it stands today is a fraudulent contract. What AUTHENTIC marriage does is establish fatherhood, first and foremost, although there are other benefits to individual families (eg, inheritance, assets, adequate child raising) and society at large.

And yes, authentic marriage—NOT romantic clown marriage—collectively benefits men more than women. Women do not need marriage to establish motherhood and without marriage as an institution they have an ENORMOUS upper hand in the sexual market.
 

Slowhandluke

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You don’t need marriage for sex. Marriage as it stands today is a fraudulent contract. What AUTHENTIC marriage does is establish fatherhood, first and foremost, although there are other benefits to individual families (eg, inheritance, assets, adequate child raising) and society at large.

And yes, authentic marriage—NOT romantic clown marriage—collectively benefits men more than women. Women do not need marriage to establish motherhood and without marriage as an institution they have an ENORMOUS upper hand in the sexual market.
if you are saying "authentic" marriage as those from a few generations ago, ("obey", "love through sickness and death", etc..) I agree... But marriage as it is now, no...

women do not have an upper hand in the sexual marketplace. Its called escorts, passport bros, pornography, etc...

If sex was such a big deal, we would have more men simping... but the number of men simping is getting lower and lower, year after year...

Women do not need marriage to be mothers, but they dont... why? I assume its because being married before kids is more important to them I guess.. i guess this is the same reason why most men dont hire women to serve as an artificial womb and just buy/get an egg from, I assume an egg bank?
 

Manure Spherian

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if you are saying "authentic" marriage as those from a few generations ago, ("obey", "love through sickness and death", etc..) I agree... But marriage as it is now, no...

women do not have an upper hand in the sexual marketplace. Its called escorts, passport bros, pornography, etc...

If sex was such a big deal, we would have more men simping... but the number of men simping is getting lower and lower, year after year...

Women do not need marriage to be mothers, but they dont... why? I assume its because being married before kids is more important to them I guess.. i guess this is the same reason why most men dont hire women to serve as an artificial womb and just buy/get an egg from, I assume an egg bank?
Female strength in the market is demonstrated by this board.

Sex isn’t a big deal?
 
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Slowhandluke

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Female strength in the market is demonstrated by this board.

Sex isn’t a big deal?
Show me a man who puts sex on a pedestal, and I will show you a simp... to some men, sex is a big deal... to most, they just shrug their shoulders... I dont think this board is about simping or sleeping with as many women as possible like a drug addict on the streets of Seattle looking for their next high.
 

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The worst thing to happen to the family is corporations seducing women into being career bots instead of being devoted wives & mothers.
I remember some long study on this, and found deep down the companies making fat losing medicines also had hands in pizza, and burgers. Similarly, the funders of traveling websites funded the propaganda of child-less men and women, and how enjoyable their lives really was. Interestingly enough the more corporate slaves, and hedonistic a certain population becomes the less they save, build and ultimately own, because the concept of future and building for it dies.
Now you get a whole population who owns nothing, lives for nothing, and it's still happy in ignorance.




I think love begins with lust (true for me and those I associate with) but then evolves into something deeper, more meaningful and longer lasting. Ideally.
I agree.
Many women and men tell me about that true love in which they didn't care for flesh. True love starts from lust which is the innate animalistic nature, and later it enters your soul where it becomes love.
Lust -> Flesh
Love -> Soul.
Lust and love both towards one person is what makes it whole.
 

BaronOfHair

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@Slowhandluke "if you are saying "authentic" marriage as those from a few generations ago, ("obey", "love through sickness and death", etc..) I agree... But marriage as it is now, no..."

Even back in the day, all that sh-t people said at the altar was, in the words of Ash Williams: "Just pillow talk, baby". Infidelity wouldn't be the subject of centuries worth of art otherwise
 

Manure Spherian

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@Slowhandluke "if you are saying "authentic" marriage as those from a few generations ago, ("obey", "love through sickness and death", etc..) I agree... But marriage as it is now, no..."

Even back in the day, all that sh-t people said at the altar was, in the words of Ash Williams: "Just pillow talk, baby". Infidelity wouldn't be the subject of centuries worth of art otherwise
It wasn’t about what someone said at an altar. It was a hard nosed negotiation between two FAMILIES, not two individuals.
 

BaronOfHair

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It wasn’t about what someone said at an altar. It was a hard nosed negotiation between two FAMILIES, not two individuals.
And since those days aren't even in the rear view mirror anymore, it's now wise to start adapting to the world we have. That might look something like encouraging one another to start thinking of marriage as exactly what it is:

An investment
 

Just because a woman listens to you and acts interested in what you say doesn't mean she really is. She might just be acting polite, while silently wishing that the date would hurry up and end, or that you would go away... and never come back.

Quote taken from The SoSuave Guide to Women and Dating, which you can read for FREE.

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