What would you call this?

RickTheToad

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@Robert28, you are way too available for this lady. Start adding some distance. Listen to the glass dude. The dude knows his sh!t. I would had dropped her after four with no sex. The excuses she's giving you are lame for a 33 year old. I initially thought she was in her late teens or early 20's. She's treating you like her gay boyfriend. NEXT the b!tch. I personally would be a bit more direct, but that's just me. I'd just say to her I do not think we're right for each other. You seem to be looking for a friend, I am looking for something more. Take care. Step back and see what she says. If there is a sexual interest on her end, she'll hit back and act. If there is, she'll just say ok like the glass dude said. I am more direct and like to get to the point. I do not have time to waste on some of these trivial games the ladies play.
 

Robert28

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I totally disagree. Terrible advice.

You are going to look like a try hard for a chick that has never fvcked you and has you confused, falling even more into her frame. You are telling her "let me TRY HARDER since I cant get what I want from you".

Its been 9 dates with no sex. Do whatever you want.

I told you what I would do and its really not that complex. Its she comes back with a sexual attitude at my place or I walk.

I get laid. I get chicks. I currently have a 3 girl rotation that has stood up for 3 months.

Go get all groomed up and take her out on a lavish date if you want, its terrible advice and you will just look like a beta cuck.

If she doesnt want to fvck you by now she either doesnt want to or you have to switch gears to an IDGAF mentality and move on.
Honestly the more I think about it the less I want to give her that ultimatum. If I have to give someone an ultimatum to sleep with me then that’ll just open a whole new bag of worms down the road and I’ll be right back to where I am now. I know I screwed up along the way somewhere I just can’t pinpoint it right now but I don’t really care to because I asked myself “is it worth even trying to save?”. Nope, not anymore anyways. I’ve given her plenty of chances but at this point I think I’m done. Even if she comes out tomorrow and says let’s screw. I’m just trying to figure out if I need to break it off in an email or in person, I don’t want to do the go silent game because I’m not trying to save anything at this point.
 

Robert28

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@Robert28, you are way too available for this lady. Start adding some distance. Listen to the glass dude. The dude knows his sh!t. I would had dropped her after four with no sex. The excuses she's giving you are lame for a 33 year old. I initially thought she was in her late teens or early 20's. She's treating you like her gay boyfriend. NEXT the b!tch. I personally would be a bit more direct, but that's just me. I'd just say to her I do not think we're right for each other. You seem to be looking for a friend, I am looking for something more. Take care. Step back and see what she says. If there is a sexual interest on her end, she'll hit back and act. If there is, she'll just say ok like the glass dude said. I am more direct and like to get to the point. I do not have time to waste on some of these trivial games the ladies play.
It just seems like I can get to a certain point with this girl and then she shuts it down. What I mean is she never pulls away when I try to touch her or anything, I can kiss her in public or private or in front of her friends. I think what’s kept me around is my thinking of “damn I’ve come this far, just gotta keep trying”.
 

RickTheToad

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It just seems like I can get to a certain point with this girl and then she shuts it down. What I mean is she never pulls away when I try to touch her or anything, I can kiss her in public or private or in front of her friends. I think what’s kept me around is my thinking of “damn I’ve come this far, just gotta keep trying”.
That's when you just walk away and see if she chases. If she comes back, she comes back on your terms. She comes over, she sucks d!ck and other things. If not, no problem, NEXT. She's on the fence with you. She may have other suitors (been there before) and she wants to juggle them all. You need to be the lessor one invested. The one in invests the least in the relationship has the power. Trust when I say she knows she has the control of the relationship with you. Men want sex from the lady. The lady wants attention. She's getting what she wants, but what about you? You're getting a kiss. Wow. NEXT. Dude, walk away, allow her to chase you. If she refuses to chase you, no problem. You have a gift for her. The gift of your silence and no contact.
 

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Robert28

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That's when you just walk away and see if she chases. If she comes back, she comes back on your terms. She comes over, she sucks d!ck and other things. If not, no problem, NEXT. She's on the fence with you. She may have other suitors (been there before) and she wants to juggle them all. You need to be the lessor one invested. The one in invests the least in the relationship has the power. Trust when I say she knows she has the control of the relationship with you. Men want sex from the lady. The lady wants attention. She's getting what she wants, but what about you? You're getting a kiss. Wow. NEXT. Dude, walk away, allow her to chase you. If she refuses to chase you, no problem. You have a gift for her. The gift of your silence and no contact.
Well I can already tell you with 1000% certainty that she will chase me. It’ll be within 2 days at the MOST. I know this because I pulled away for a couple days and here she came “did I do or say something wrong the other night?” and I think I lost the frame there because I was like “oh no not at all just been busy”. I don’t want to do that anymore, I’m too old to play the game and have to think on my feet with women all the time. I’ve got enough stuff to think about without adding a woman to it that I have to be constantly thinking of how to act around. The telling thing is I’ve actually enjoyed NOT hearing from her since last night.
The funny thing is I know she has no idea that I’m about to break it off. None whatsoever. I’ve hidden it well from her but I’ve been thinking about all this for awhile now and haven’t let her know I’m in the mindset I am.
 

RickTheToad

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Well I can already tell you with 1000% certainty that she will chase me. It’ll be within 2 days at the MOST. I know this because I pulled away for a couple days and here she came “did I do or say something wrong the other night?” and I think I lost the frame there because I was like “oh no not at all just been busy”. I don’t want to do that anymore, I’m too old to play the game and have to think on my feet with women all the time. I’ve got enough stuff to think about without adding a woman to it that I have to be constantly thinking of how to act around. The telling thing is I’ve actually enjoyed NOT hearing from her since last night.
If she's not chasing you under the sheets, it's a waste of your time. Myself, Glass dude and others have suggested what to do. You now should consider your options and proceed to get what you want. When she says that again after you pull away, you say what either I or glass dude posted. You will know one way or another whether her interest is sexual or non-sexual. It's seems, by what you're describing, she's more non-sexual and is just kissing you to keep your hopes up; but I could be wrong. The way I worded it is not an ultimatum. It's telling her what you are looking for and what she's seems to be acting towards you. If there is an interest on more than friends on her part, she'd then either sh!t or get off the pot.

It's never good to stay in neutral for this long. In addition, you are seeing her too much. 9 times in a month and you've not fvcked yet? Dude. Once a week until you smash. After you smash, you can then twice a week, once during the week day once on the weekend. If she asks you now what you are doing for Friday or Saturday, add some mystery. You're going out with friends to the city or something. Be vague it will make her mind wonder. She knows friends means other ladies. Now, it may or may not mean that, but that's for her hamster wheel to decipher. Be busy. Be unavailable.
 

Robert28

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If she's not chasing you under the sheets, it's a waste of your time. Myself, Glass dude and others have suggested what to do. You now should consider your options and proceed to get what you want. When she says that again after you pull away, you say what either I or glass dude posted. You will know one way or another whether her interest is sexual or non-sexual. It's seems, by what you're describing, she's more non-sexual and is just kissing you to keep your hopes up; but I could be wrong. The way I worded it is not an ultimatum. It's telling her what you are looking for and what she's seems to be acting towards you. If there is an interest on more than friends on her part, she'd then either sh!t or get off the pot.

It's never good to stay in neutral for this long. In addition, you are seeing her too much. 9 times in a month and you've not fvcked yet? Dude. Once a week until you smash. After you smash, you can then twice a week, once during the week day once on the weekend. If she asks you now what you are doing for Friday or Saturday, add some mystery. You're going out with friends to the city or something. Be vague it will make her mind wonder. She knows friends means other ladies. Now, it may or may not mean that, but that's for her hamster wheel to decipher. Be busy. Be unavailable.
No you’re right. In all honesty I thought I WAS being unavailable because she’s made the comment to me a few times “I like that you aren’t like most guys and give me my space and aren’t always blowing up my phone and acting all needy”. I say 9 times it might have been less, we’ve only hung out once a week that I can remember, a couple of times wasn’t really a hangout as you’d call it. whats so weird is when we are together she constantly opens up about **** she said she never tells anyone and we always have good conversation and seem to like a lot of the same stuff. The sticking point is that next level as you say, the sex. If we’d been having sex this whole time this would have been the almost perfect relationship.
 

Robert28

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She made some comments last night that have stuck with me and I can’t shake them. We were talking about hair and I have all my hair, which most women love about me, but she made the comment “I like bald guys”. What’s so significant about that you ask? Her ex is bald but he lives in Colorado and she moved out a few months ago and flew back here to South Carolina. I was thinking “yep, still hung up on her ex” and who knows if they still talk, I could care less at this point. She claims he was a narcissist and all but all women say that about their ex.
The other comment she made is her roommate has been dating this guy a couple months and told her “I don’t really like Darrel, I just keep him around to pay my rent and help me with bills”. Now, I got to thinking “holy fvck am I being groomed to be Darrel???”. But I’ve never gave her money, never paid for anything other than dinner and drinks when we went out but she’s treated me as well. It just stuck with me when she said that.
 

markfromeurope

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That's why I'd try to game her one more time but this time properly - considering you are rather deep in her frame zone already stance "Listen I like you but no sex means bye" might not necessarily work in your favour. Gaming her properly and then cutting contact might do the trick.

Sex might not be worthy of waiting tho'.
 

Robert28

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That's why I'd try to game her one more time but this time properly - considering you are rather deep in her frame zone already stance "Listen I like you but no sex means bye" might not necessarily work in your favour. Gaming her properly and then cutting contact might do the trick.

Sex might not be worthy of waiting tho'.
Well she’s a Scorpio and they’re supposedly the best when it comes to sex, at least in my experience.lol Yeah I gotta hit the reset button with her but I don’t know if I want to and start all over or if I just want to jump out the plane and say screw it.
 

RickTheToad

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She made some comments last night that have stuck with me and I can’t shake them. We were talking about hair and I have all my hair, which most women love about me, but she made the comment “I like bald guys”. What’s so significant about that you ask? Her ex is bald but he lives in Colorado and she moved out a few months ago and flew back here to South Carolina. I was thinking “yep, still hung up on her ex” and who knows if they still talk, I could care less at this point. She claims he was a narcissist and all but all women say that about their ex.
The other comment she made is her roommate has been dating this guy a couple months and told her “I don’t really like Darrel, I just keep him around to pay my rent and help me with bills”. Now, I got to thinking “holy fvck am I being groomed to be Darrel???”. But I’ve never gave her money, never paid for anything other than dinner and drinks when we went out but she’s treated me as well. It just stuck with me when she said that.
Dude, why are you talking to her about hair? It seems she's friendzoning you dude. Stop being so available. If you have to chat, 10 - 15 mins max. Hey, how are you? How's your day, Let's get together on Saturday Thursday. Cool? Great. Need to get back to work or heading out to get a drink with my friends. Speak in a bit. Simple and to the point. No sex = NEXT. 9 times with no sex. Dude...... Cut back contact immediately.

Actually, scratch that. No weekend plans with this one. She has to earn a Friday, Saturday or Sunday with you. You are busy with other things and hanging with other people. You need to look (and should be anyway) more busy with an active social lifestyle.
 

Robert28

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Dude, why are you talking to her about hair? It seems she's friendzoning you dude. Stop being so available. If you have to chat, 10 - 15 mins max. Hey, how are you? How's your day, Let's get together on Saturday Thursday. Cool? Great. Need to get back to work or heading out to get a drink with my friends. Speak in a bit. Simple and to the point. No sex = NEXT. 9 times with no sex. Dude...... Cut back contact immediately.

Actually, scratch that. No weekend plans with this one. She has to earn a Friday, Saturday or Sunday with you. You are busy with other things and hanging with other people. You need to look (and should be anyway) more busy with an active social lifestyle.
No no this was a subject we were talking about in person last night. We keep our texting short, we don’t have long ass deep discussions through text. I’ve purposely kept texting short. I think the hair thing came up because we were out last night and saw a guy with a killer mullet.lol

I just figured it up, it’s been 7 dates, not 9. Still though.
 

Glassguy

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What I mean is she never pulls away when I try to touch her or anything, I can kiss her in public or private or in front of her friends. I think what’s kept me around is my thinking of “damn I’ve come this far, just gotta keep trying”.
Duh! Thats her plan to get your free non sexual attention and validation. Seems she is good at it too.

Eject and move on.

When she blows you up asking where you went, simply tell her "This isnt working out. We are obviously interested in different things and you dont seem to be as sexual as me". End of story.

Next.
 

RickTheToad

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No no this was a subject we were talking about in person last night. We keep our texting short, we don’t have long ass deep discussions through text. I’ve purposely kept texting short. I think the hair thing came up because we were out last night and saw a guy with a killer mullet.lol
Why are you talking to her about ex-boyfriends? When a lady brings up her sexual past, boyfriends, etc. Say, let's not talk about that. I live in the here and now. Come join me and give a smirk or smile. Talk about positive things. Future things. Cool things happening now. It sounds more and more like a friendship then a fvckship dude. You need to slam on the breaks and get it in gear by NC, long pauses in responses, hours (your busy, again, you should already be busy in your life). Just say in your next text back, when are you free again? She'll say whenever, invite her over. If she says no, simple reply, okay, another time then. You then disappear. She'll get the message. I think you're spinning wheels at this point, but a direct blunt approach may change things around.
 
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RickTheToad

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Duh! Thats her plan to get your free non sexual attention and validation. Seems she is good at it too.

Eject and move on.

When she blows you up asking where you went, simply tell her "This isnt working out. We are obviously interested in different things and you dont seem to be as sexual as me". End of story.

Next.
NFN, I said that earlier. This dude and her are more "friends" then anything more at this point. It's going to be a hassle to turn this around.
 

markfromeurope

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The thing is you might be qualified as beta-provider already (she allows to be kissed but is not into you really).

Have you every tried spanking her when you're alone?

Something tells me you tripped somewhere on escalation path. It's not terribly bad but its bad so you need to do something to flip it towards straight sexual attraction.

Set the hot date. Escalate slowly. Spank her. Phuck her. If mission failed, disengage. You are already past 9 dates and somewhat physical with her so why not to try that instead of "Me discontent no sex bye" I mean come on, from what you have written I don't really see you trying for real to seal the deal. Do it and be direct about it with actions.
 

Robert28

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Why are you talking to her about ex-boyfriends? When a lady brings up her sexual past, boyfriends, etc. Say, let's not talk about that. I live in the here and now. Come join me and give a smirk or smile. Talk about positive things. Future things. Cool things happening now. It sounds more and more like a friendship then a fvckship dude. You need to slam on the breaks and get it in gear by NC, long pauses in responses, hours (your busy, again, you should already be busy in your life). Just say in your next text back, when are you free again? She'll say whenever, invite her over. If she says no, simple reply, okay, another time then. You then disappear. She'll get the message. I think you're spinning wheels at this point, but a direct blunt approach may change things around.
No we haven’t really talked about ex’s a lot. I think it came up once because she’s friends with two girls I dated in college and she just said why she moved back here from Colorado. All I can tell you about her ex is he’s bald, apparently a narcissist and they dated a year. I always moved the convo away from it quickly though but I hadn’t come up much. I would never make a rookie mistake like that, just like I’d never make a mistake of “you don’t like me as much as your ex boohoo hoo”. I think I tried to qualify myself in other ways though mistakingly, haven’t made a fool out of myself though. In all honesty I don’t think I want to go forward with this chick. I’m just trying to figure out a way to leave.
 

RickTheToad

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The thing is you might be qualified as beta-provider already (she allows to be kissed but is not into you really).

Have you every tried spanking her when you're alone?

Something tells me you tripped somewhere on escalation path. It's not terribly bad but its bad so you need to do something to flip it towards straight sexual attraction.

Set the hot date. Escalate slowly. Spank her. Phuck her. If mission failed, disengage. You are already past 9 dates and somewhat physical with her so why not to try that instead of "Me discontent no sex bye" I mean come on, from what you have written I don't really see you trying for real to seal the deal. Do it and be direct about it with actions.
He tripped up where a lot of men do. Giving her too much free non-sexual attention. I recall a few ladies texting me all the time every day. I would respond at my leisure. That's what this dude and every other guy should do. Always respond to her communications, just at your pace, not her's. Shows you are busy with life, which, again, you should be. Talking about old boyfriends, hair, etc., not the greatest sign from a lady.
 

Robert28

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Duh! Thats her plan to get your free non sexual attention and validation. Seems she is good at it too.

Eject and move on.

When she blows you up asking where you went, simply tell her "This isnt working out. We are obviously interested in different things and you dont seem to be as sexual as me". End of story.

Next.
Don’t worry I’m going to deploy those exact words, I just think it’ll be more effective springing them on her when she reaches out to me rather than me springing them out of the blue right now. I’ve copied and saved those words to use though.
 
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