Over 30 DJ's

SW15

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I think even their expectations that they project are really just excuses to push men away the way they have pushed men away their entire lives bc no one was ever good enough supposedly, out of literally 100+ guys. High standards can be a way to facilitate Avoidant attachment.

what I experience is that the wall is not so much in their looks but in their mental health. It's impossible to tolerate a neurotic mental patient in my free time. to the extent they can keep it together long enough to sit down and talk then the dates are boring job interviews and they seem hyper aware of power dynamics even within a single conversation. There is almost no sign of flirting or femininity at all.
The wall isn't always a wall with a woman in her 30s. Most women in their 30s post 2010 seem to be experiencing a padded cushion instead of a brick wall. They are still hotly pursued if they are using swipe apps.

There is a lot of weirdness in this cohort. I've mainly interacted with a 30 something women who have never been married and have no kids. I think the worst ones are the big career ones. The women with the demanding white collar careers are the least feminine ones. I once had a date with a 35 year old woman who spent weekends traveling to EDM festivals in other cities. Although she didn't have an overwhelmingly demanding career, she was a bit unstable. No second date there.

A lot of the 30 something women I've interacted with don't make relational development a priority. Relational development falls beneath her job, her friends, Fluffy the Cat/Fido the Dog's needs, etc. Although childless women in their 30s face some degree of social exclusion, they typically have more friends than childless men in their 30s.

I try really hard avoid boring job interview topics of conversation on first dates. Sometimes it works, but there are times where some of the 30 something women won't lighten up.

There's also a contingent of 30 something women who are looking to have babies fast, and that's a non-starter with me. I don't think that's been the majority of my interactions, but it is out there. If there is a contingent that feel that way, they generally hide it well.
 

SW15

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I think at the whole idea of women suddenly losing their looks and suddenly everything changes at the wall is sort of a revenge fantasy for Mgtow/incel types. It's not that it doesn't happen but it is seriously sedated in today's market which has plentiful options for even women with no looks at all.
Yes. It doesn't change that much. At best, there's a decline after menopause. Within the last 7 years or so, I've heard a few stories from acquaintances of women between 45-60 getting hotly pursued on Match, OurTime, and the more website/non-swipe type like online services. An in shape 50 year old woman will have no problems finding options.

The wall as a concept was probably more realistic in the era before dating websites and later dating apps. Most people have more dates as a result of apps than they would have if they were just dependent upon real life sourcing of dates. It must be said that a lot of these website/app sourced dates are complete garbage. One of the best attributes of cold approach is that in 5 minutes you can figure out if something will work in-person more easily. While this facet reduces the number of total dates, it also does reduce the amount of money wasted on failed dates. Apps are great at producing wasteful spend for men. The 30-39 year old childless women isn't asked out in person as much as she is asked out on apps. However, she still fields a decent amount of cold approaches if she lives in a singles dense neighborhood of a major metropolitan area. Most 30-39 year old single women live in such areas.

One of the most difficult things about dealing with 30-39 year old childless women is their bio clock. They have the massive demands that have been talked about on this thread, and they wish to rush into family formation. Whereas when this woman was 25, she didn't demand a shorter time frame to get to a major life milestone. Rushing into that life milestone is such a bad idea. There can be an advantage to going on a date with a 40 year old woman who has given up on having kids. You'd be much harder pressed to find a 35 year old woman who has given up on the idea of kids. An interaction with a 40 year old woman resigned to no kids has the potential have an more positive vibe because it's not a husband hunting job interview type expedition that you might get with a 32-36 year old. The difficult part there is finding said 40 year old being in good shape.
 

Spaz

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This is my experience. I am 35.
You're back again, Mark, women are not men, they are not supposed to be like men, so with that in mind, they of course act crazy to many men.

For me, all those craziness, if you're able to predict beforehand and use it to ur advantage, it will be a source of unending amusement.

You're a smart man....think, turn the situation around instead of complaining.
 

Spaz

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Yeah, had to do some break from this place.

@Post above - no worries, I am just stating facts and will still try to play against the odds or try to increase the odds in the worsening market available. That's how it works for me - I will never settle. That's not who I am.
Good.
 

VictorSleazy

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31 here. Made a commitment to myself only date under 25’s as long as i can. I think it all comes down to how good you take care of yourself. Girls i date say stuff like ”i wish i lookd like that when im 30+”

i hate the stress girls in their 27-30 age bring, you can feel their need to lock you down asap. Much more chill with younger ones
 

CAPSLOCK BANDIT

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As a man, when you are 20 and a woman is 20, your social value is inherently different, because we live in a gynocentric society. As a man, once you get into your 30's the ball falls into our court.

There is a growing trend of there being an outcry of older women who are trying to demonize the idea of older men dating younger women, because obviously the men their age want nothing to do with them.

In general, I find women my own age to be incredibly unappealing, basically 21-29, I only search past 29 based on income alone.
 

ThisIsSparta

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I made the experience that it is not uncommon to meet girls in the range between 22 and 27ish with the "45-year-old-boyfriend-experience".
And rarely do they mention the age as being the problem that led to go seperate ways.

That being said, a lot of todays "kids" can have way more baggage then a 35 year old comming out of a 10 year marriage.
We are talking about generations and that todays 20year old were brought up totaly different from todays 40year olds.
 

daproest1

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It’s pretty bad. And I live in miami Florida. I’m 32 but was with a girl from when I was 25 until I was 31. She was perfect. Just a little too argumentative at times. She was 4 years younger. Before her and after her, I don’t do relationships. She was... different. A... blank canvas if u will. I Had no redpill awareness or relationship game. Needless to say, she left. Those were some developmental years for me. And for her. Quit tending bar. Started and grew a business. She finished school, became a nurse, Etc. It’s weird now. I can’t really get close to anyone Emotionally. Don’t feel much. I have a 9 that lives in my Building Thats my age. She’s the first one I banged when I became single. Added another 2 plates After that. Then added a 3rd. I cut off the rest and kept the third. Why?
-32 year old in my building, high notch count. And emotional baggage. I could tell. It’s a vibe.

-plate 1: older than me by a few years, a Solid 10, but had a 20 year old son. I cant take Single moms seriously.

-plate 2: Also a 9, but moody and wishY washy. I have zero patience


-plate 3: a 6. Definitely the least attractive woman I’ve ever had. Well her body’s awesome. Remove her face and her body is like a 9. The sex is good. She was single, and sexless, for 2 years before she met me. Was with her ex for 4 and a half before that. She’s 27. She’s super sweet, nurturing, thoughtful, cooks, cleans, Cares about my cat. It goes to show. Women need to take BREAKS. Continuous d!ck fvcks up their head. BUT.... I feel nothing (she’s not the most intelligent, or funny, or pretty), so I’m thinking about cutting it off. It’s a shame. Even her dad is cool. I wish I wasn’t so superficial. Or spoiled? Idk.

I think any girl a few years younger than u, WITH A LOW NOTCH COUNT, that u get in your mid to late 20s, just marry her if u love her. Don’t be like me. I just didn’t wanna get married. Lost 6 years of my life. Now she hates me. Won’t talk to me. Treats me like I banged her grandmother even though I never cheated or anything, Etc.
 

daproest1

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I'm 23 and have not yet had any success with women. So you're saying that it's only going to get harder as I get older? That's not very encouraging.
No. Not for u. 23 is good. Work on yourself now. Money. Muscles. Knowledge. Game. Aim high. You WILL pull a 10. Make sure she’s younger. Make sure she has a low notch count (aim for below 4), and then GET HER TF AWAY FROM THE CITY AND MARRY HER when you’re 29. She’ll be 24-25.
 

daproest1

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Im 25 now, and it's interesting to see what I should expect when I eventually hit 30.

Some of the guys advise guys my age to start looking to lock someone down right now. But what if I still feel I have more dating/exploring to do? I get that women develop more baggage the older they get, but I won't have to date women the same age as me so what's the rush?

I personally feel like I haven't yet peaked in terms of my career, physique, or my communication skills. I might have aged a bit in the face but I'm still told I look younger than I am. I predict I'll peak around 27-28, which is when I'll start thinking of settling down.
Bro settle down. If u find your dream girl, just settle down. Trust me. You’ll regret not doing it at 32.
 

BMX

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Yeah...single, childless women between the ages of 27-35 are in the "danger zone" and I'm only getting warmed up.
 

daproest1

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I've been dealing with this type for a while. Not fun.
They’re horrible. And if they have children, that’s a problem. And if they’re not single, that’s obviously still a problem.
 

BMX

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They are extremely aggressive with their baby rabies agendas. Their watches are defective as they tick a little too loudly (smart watches included)* One non-PC joke via text and your @ss is ghosted. LMAO. They are in hardcore delusional states now: "OMG, if he doesn't drink 60 glasses of wine a month during lockdown like I do and enjoy cats..NEXT...If he doesn't watch Hallmark bullsh!tt during the holidays...well he ought to because that's the road my life is headed down as we speak!" Okay Emily, take your pills and apply fake-up liberally. Time to start telling them I'm 22 so they GO AWAY. And yes, I still look 22.

Just like CGA said on YT, they think that just because I am in the same age bracket or even the same exact age as they are that we have a lot in common and are a perfect match by default. No. At 32, I finally admitted that my full-time military grind and boxing days inside the ring have finally run their course, just like a lot of infantry dudes and professional fighters describe over and over and over. It's a job that changes in your 30's practically overnight. You go to sleep one night and wake up aching head to toe and in pain saying WTF happened to me? I'm just not reacting as quick as I used to and most of all I can't recover as quickly as I did at 28. But we are still young in the grand scheme of things and just getting started. I just do not feel the need to rush anything serious like they do. It's unattractive on many levels. Where is that same pride and optimism they had in themselves at 24 "getting their backs blown out by Chad/Tyrone and being run through more times than the Holland tunnel"?! You all had your chance(s) and they were blown all over your face for 20 years. Now you are well on your way to becoming a modern-day spinster with no real hobbies or passions. Or legitimate goals. Boring. Pass. Hard AF. Time to turn my back on you and find exciting prospects once again.
 

SW15

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Any observations on how the game changes? I read the posts and it seems that many of the DJ's benefit from being an undergrad at a college with many HB's, Where most of the people don't work 45 hours a week in an office populated by over 50 married co-workers who haven't partied since Grand Funk Railroad split up.

As it has been said on this site, "Finding a good woman in her 30's is like finding a parking space... All the good ones are taken and the remaining ones are handicapped."
My past responses haven't hit the original post as directly I would want. So, at 37, I'm going to take this opportunity to breeze through my mating history since age 18, and illustrate some changes that have occurred over the years. This comes from the perspective of a 5'10", 165 lb man. My weight has been in a constant range of near 160-165 since age 25. I'm reasonably athletic and I watch what I eat. About 4-5 years ago, I cut out soy/soy derivative ingredients and most processed ingredients from my diet. It's been good. I also eliminated porn and mbate around the same time.

I've never married and I've had no children. I've been exceptional at using condoms. The majority of the women I've had sex with were using birth control. I've not had any significant pregnancy scares. I had a couple of STD scares. Npne of my relationships have surpassed 3 years.

The most important thing to be an over 30 DJ is to be secure is one's self. That's also applicable in one's 20s as well, but it becomes more essential in one's 30s in my experience. Also, know what you want and how to pursue it.

There are 3 distinct eras I've noticed based on my life experiences.

Ages 18-22 (This phase would look different for men who don't pursue a BA/BS degree. It would exist, but be more similar to the 23-29 year old phase I experienced.)
Ages 23-29
Ages 30-present

Ages 18-22 mostly comprised of my undergrad degree (I later received a master's degree). My undergrad degree is from a large public university with a solid reputation for partying and milder winter weather. The undergrad era has a lot of value. It can be played a number of different ways. I probably didn't play it the best way. The way I played it and the way I think a lot of men play it (beta, alpha or in between) is that they focus upon night pickup. From ages 18-20, this is mostly done at parties at private residence off campus apartments if you are not a member of a fraternity. If you are a member of a fraternity, you have parties at your own fraternity house. I was not a member of a fraternity. If you do day game, it is mostly done in your classes, though some will do it in extracirricular activity clubs.

I was too focused on meeting women at night and not focused enough on meeting women during the day. That's a valuable lesson for all of the life stages. If you meet women during the day in any of the life stages, you'll reap better rewards. You'll deal with less drama, less bad behavior, and have higher quality relationships of longer durations. Relationship duration is a good indicator of quality of relationship during the first 5 years of a relationships. For relationships that last longer than 5 years, the length of the relationship becomes less of an indicator of its quality.

The women you would meet during the day on a university campus are ones that would give you the best opportunity for building a strong, longer term relationship. However, realize that even if you do this, by your 35th birthday, you're likely with a different woman. That day might even come by 30. I've observed many of my undergrad classmates of both sexes from my era via their social media pages. Now, they are now mostly between 35-39, and most of their college relationships didn't stick. The ones that do stick even for 3-5 years are worthwhile because you're getting a woman with no kids and in her physical peak. If you start an LTR in college, don't expect it to surpass 5 years. If it does, it's much better than starting a LTR with a woman at later phases in life. Two 18-22 year olds starting around the same time and growing together is way better than 2 post 25 year olds meeting, and having years of baggage, some of it potentially substantial.

If you're an undergrad, you're not missing much if you're not involved in meeting women at night. At most schools, including the one I attended, you can meet enough women from some combination of your classes, your extracirriculars, the on campus gym, and cold approaches on campus, including at the gym.

Ages 23-29: This is an interesting era. It is a shock to the system at 22/23 upon graduation when you get your first post college job and you go from everything who you spend your daytime hours looking similar to you in age and lifestyle to fewer people resembling you. In college, you can meet women in your classes at semester. Next semester, the classes change and the classmates change. At work, especially in white collar, office environments, that's not going to happen. It's the same people for a much longer than a semester. Also, interviewing for new jobs is a royal pain. I did ages 23-29 before #MeToo got big, but even dating within one's workplace was not advisable in the 2000s/early 2010s when I was in this phase. Romantic relationships forming at work has been on the decline since the early to mid 1990s.

In this era, with less free time, you'll need to put together a robust outside of work life. Most guys in this age bracket do it with going to bars to try to meet women, using swipe apps (or in the 2000s/early 2010s it was websites), and joining co-ed sports leagues. Of those 3 things, the most valuable one is the co-ed sports leagues. It's most advisable to avoid random nights out in bars, which are actually worse than the private residence parties in college I described. The best way to meet women for any sort of relationship is in person through your interests. Sure, you'll meet fewer women by doing as compared to swiping, but you'll have less bad experiences. I'd recommend playing in co-ed sports leagues, doing cold approaches at the grocery store or other retail outlets in singles dense areas of your home city, doing approaches in the gym or fitness classes, and getting involved in activities you like and meeting people through those activities. In much of this age group, fewer people are in 3+ year or 5+ year relationships, so you'll be able to meet people outside of work who resemble you, which becomes more difficult in the 30+ era.

Two special notes about this era.

Weddings: Around ages 26-30, you will start to see a flurry of weddings in your social circle, if your friends are about the same age as you are. At the latest, this ends by 32-33. If you find yourself single during this flurry of weddings, you may begin to doubt yourself and your lifestyle. Don't do that. If you find yourself in some LTR during this flurry, don't let others' timelines dictate the pace at which you propose marriage or even if you want to have a marriage. You have to be secure in yourself for this.

There used to be a notion that weddings were a good place to meet single people. The movie "Wedding Crashers", which came out in 2005, played on this. That might have been true when the Boomers and Gen X were getting married for the first time, but it wasn't true for the Millennials and it won't be true for Gen Z. If you've watched "Wedding Crashers" in the last 7 years, you'll realize how outdated it is. Vince Vaughn and Owen Wilson's characters are Gen X aged. I could even argue that "Wedding Crashers" was becoming outdated on the day it was released. At weddings, if the couple are two people ages 26+, most of their social circle will be established couples of the same age and few singles will attend. Almost no single women will be there. The best example from my social circle was a wedding of a 28m and 29f that occurred. There were over 100 attendees and no single women. There were maybe 2-3 incel/socially inept men that attended. I didn't attend. That's a wedding that is a waste of time for a player/Don Juan. You don't generally meet women at weddings. If you're friends with the couple and they happen to know single people, you'll meet the singles long before a wedding. You have a better chance of meeting women at wedding if the marrying couple has two members younger than 26.

Graduate school: I attended graduate school during this range (I have an MBA). Graduate school, in all programs, is a way different experience than undergrad. Generally speaking, in graduate school, you shouldn't date anyone else in grad school. Women in grad programs tend to be more feminist and more of a pain to deal with than women who do not pursue graduate degrees. The worst example of this are JD pursuing women, but the MBA pursuing women aren't great either. With that said, meeting a female grad student is better than meeting a woman with a completed graduate degree in the real world. If you're a male graduate student, look to date the undergrads at your school, though you'll typically have less contact with the undergrads than other undergrads.
 
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SW15

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Continued from above.....

Age 30+: Around age 30 is when I fully made the transition from being a primarily meeting women at night guy to a meeting women in the day guy. One of the things I learned in the 23-29 era is that weeknights are better at bars than Fri/Sat night. However, it is difficult for most white collar working guys to be out at the bar until midnight-2 am on Tuesday night/early Wednesday morning and be functional at work the next days. While there may be fewer women out on Tuesday/Wednesday nights, the ones who are out are more motivated than the Fri/Sat crowd, which is more interested posturing for attention and taking good Instagram pictures than finding some sort of relationship (short or long term). My jobs have required attentiveness starting at 8 or 8:30 am, so the weeknights at the bars have never been ideal for me.

Starting around age 30, if you find yourself single, you're going to be more of a lone wolf type. Your friends are mostly in multi-year relationships. A large % of them are married, and depending on where you are in your 30s, some are having babies. A lot of guys respond to this by immersing themselves in swipe apps because they don't have the social network to accomplish anything. That's the wrong move. Cold approaching is the way better option when compared to swipe apps. On swipe apps, you won't get as large of an age gap as you'll age if you do real world approaching. Swipe apps also happen to be a haven for carousel riders, careerist/feminist 30 somethings, etc. It's a much better choice to cold approach and cold approach at non-bar venues. If you are able to make something happen through a social circle, that's the best choice but not entirely realistic.

Physical fitness becomes more essential at this point in life, though relevant in all the phases I highlighted.

You're still going to not be able to meet people through work like 23-29 so all the things I highlighted in that era are relevant here.

The more difficult thing in this era is avoiding single moms. There are more single moms here than in past phases of life. Childless women 30+ are no picnic, as they too often have baggage, but it has the potential to be more workable baggage than a mom with 1+ kids.
 
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