Morals (attn: Maverick)

[MacAvoy]

Another word for morals is hypocrisy

You have no idea how funny this is. Its completely true in this case as well.

 

[Mavrick]

You have no idea how funny this is. Its completely true in this case as well.

Hahahah... [waits one second] ... No, it's not. To each his own, and I have learned my mother focking lesson.

 

[comic_relief]

Has anyone ever read Nietzsche's actual work like "the anti-chist" or "beyond good and evil" or "ecce homo"?

They are great philosophical reads but one of his main sticking point is the "reevaluation of values."

This means look at the values that you have to see if they are actually good because most of the values are really quite weak.

One value/time honored tradition is the idea of crying a persons funeral. Is it good to remember them? Yes, but you should do it in a way that the person would have liked. I have been kicked out of many different funerals because I tell funny stories of the deceased and had people rolling on the ground laughing. It's rude to cry at a persons funeral.

Another value that I absolutely hate is the notion of "Do not question the authority figures." It keeps the majority down and does not allow for growth. If you do not question, you will never grow. I once heard a quote, "A patriot is not one that will not question, but one that continually questions."

I could go on and on about morals, but the two things that morality comes from is the either religion or culture. Both are so incredibly mixed (Judeo-Christian beliefs) that it is almost one in the same. This is why we must question our own morals and reevaluate them.

In response to the question, I believe that no matter what we need morals and cannot live without them. But we must find out which ones we need and do away with the harmful ones that are holding us back. I am still in the process of doing so.

comic_relief

 

[Donsing]

To me, morals = good and bad; good = what I like, value, principles, and want to happen to me; bad = what I don't like, value, principles, and want to happen to me. That's it, but our habit is to enforce or try to press our guidelines (morals) upon other, therefore, conflict occurs between individuals. Have fun, guys.

 

[DoctorLW]

To each their own.

But having strong morals, and sticking by them, is the road less traveled for sure. I enjoy the challenge of doing the right thing... most of the time it's a lot easier to do the wrong thing.

In the short run, avoiding good moral decisions might lead you to better life positioning... but in the long run people remember those who gave their word and delivered on it and you will end up better off for it.

To clarify, since there are a lot of differences in actions someone considers moral or immoral, I would simplify it as: treat others with the respect that you expect them to show you (even if they don't).

 

[ChrizZ]

Morals are just society programming.

Morals ensure the survival of the human species and control the masses.

 

[Quiksilver]

Without morals, society could not function, even on the most basic and primitive level.

How can you trust somebody who has no morals? Someone who has no compunctions against doing anything, at any time. I could not live around someone who would stab me in the back in my sleep because I stole his ice cream from the freezer the night before.

I could not have a friend who would start hitting on my girlfriend in front of me, simply because he thinks she's hot.

If nobody had a moral code, who could you trust?

(spare me the 'trust yourself' argument)

Here is a simple example of why morality is good, from a google search:

The phenomenon of 'reciprocity' in nature is seen by evolutionary biologists as one way to begin to understand human morality. Its function is typically to ensure a reliable supply of essential resources, especially for animals living in a habitat where food quantity or quality fluctuates unpredictably. For example, on any given night for vampire bats, some individuals fail to feed on prey while others consume a surplus of blood. Bats that have successfully fed then regurgitate part of their blood meal to save a conspecific from starvation. Since these animals live in close-knit groups over many years, an individual can count on other group members to return the favor on nights when it goes hungry

 

[MacAvoy]

How can you trust somebody who has no morals? Someone who has no compunctions against doing anything, at any time. I could not live around someone who would stab me in the back in my sleep because I stole his ice cream from the freezer the night before.

My question to you is how can you trust people with morals? As brother DonGorgon said:

Another word for morals is hypocrisy

The very guy who I started this debate with PM'd me and told me he made a new identity because he has grown as a man and his original identity no longer applies. What is most interesting though is he goes on about how the husband might shoot you for banging his wife and that I need morals but only a couple of weeks ago he was getting BJ's from an attached women.

So tell me, how I can trust people that have morals? When the people that are going out preaching their morals are the ones most often breaking them when no one is looking. Its been seen so many times over and over again.

 

[Mavrick]

I can't get bjs from women who aren't married? She has made no vows to her bf. She chose to do that, and I didn't make her. As for married women, they are off limits for me. You do what you want.

I have not deceived you in any way.

 

[Purple-Haze]

I can't get bjs from women who aren't married? She has made no vows to her bf. She chose to do that, and I didn't make her. As for married women, they are off limits for me. You do what you want.

I have not deceived you in any way.

How is a married woman any different than a woman in an LTR as far as cheating goes? How do you reason that?

Both are lying to their partners by engaging in sexual relations with a 3rd party - and that party is a co-conspirator by virtue of doing the deed.

 

[sosilky]

$

no morals needed do whatever it takes break every law, break all ten comandments. we all should, i mean total global anarchy could be a good quality of life. the planet wouldn't blow up in less then a week or anything.

 

[Mavrick]

How is a married woman any different than a woman in an LTR as far as cheating goes? How do you reason that?

Both are lying to their partners by engaging in sexual relations with a 3rd party - and that party is a co-conspirator by virtue of doing the deed.

She's not married, and she's free to do as she pleases. If she deceives him, that's on her. If this is the way you look at, then I'm immoral.

 

[MacAvoy]

How is a married woman any different than a woman in an LTR as far as cheating goes? How do you reason that?

She's not married, and she's free to do as she pleases. If she deceives him, that's on her. If this is the way you look at, then I'm immoral.

Does anybody else besides me not find this totally hypocritical and hilarious?

IMO a man with such high morals wouldn't be doing either. Or does morals mean bending them when convenient? If so then I'm very moral.

 

[Purple-Haze]

She's not married, and she's free to do as she pleases. If she deceives him, that's on her. If this is the way you look at, then I'm immoral.

At the root of a marriage AND LTR is the notion of commitment - in both cases, the couples in question have taken an explicit vow (in one form or another) to be monogamous. By engaging in some kind of sexual exchange with an involved woman, you are helping her cheat (YOU are actively engaging in immoral behaviour - based on your definiton of immorality).

So what do you do if you meet a woman who is in a common law marriage? How do you deal with that?

I don't know about morality, but you are definitely a hypocrite.

 

[Mavrick]

Well, we're not doing anything now, and I'm not doing anything with anyone else although I could. The last to girls I've been out with I've told that I didn't want to even have sex yet. So, anyway, I'm saying don't mess with married women. That's my morals. I didn't say messing with single women is immoral, so that doesn't make me a hypocrite.

 

[Purple-Haze]

Well, we're not doing anything now, and I'm not doing anything with anyone else although I could. The last to girls I've been out with I've told that I didn't want to even have sex yet. So, anyway, I'm saying don't mess with married women. That's my morals. I didn't say messing with single women is immoral, so that doesn't make me a hypocrite.

I haven't read the entire thread, so I may be missing something. I am not concerned with the specifics of your story or issue. What I find laughable is that you consider yourself "moral" and yet use it to suit your convenience.

You "morals" are this: DON'T mess with married women, but single women in LTRs (or monogamous, committed relationships for that matter) are fair game if they want to cheat.

Jeez dude. Do you want an explicit definition of "hypocrite"?

It's fine if you want to do girls who have bfs. That's your choice. But don't go around touting yourself as being moral just b/c you wouldn't sleep with a married woman when you will sleep with a girl with a bf.

This isn't even about morality anymore. Your line of reasoning is ripe with hypocrisy.

 

[Mavrick]

I haven't read the entire thread, so I may be missing something. I am not concerned with the specifics of your story or issue. What I find laughable is that you consider yourself "moral" and yet use it to suit your convenience.

You "morals" are this: DON'T mess with married women, but single women in LTRs (or monogamous, committed relationships for that matter) are fair game if they want to cheat.

Jeez dude. Do you want an explicit definition of "hypocrite"?

It's fine if you want to do girls who have bfs. That's your choice. But don't go around touting yourself as being moral just b/c you wouldn't sleep with a married woman when you will sleep with a girl with a bf.

This isn't even about morality anymore. Your line of reasoning is ripe with hypocrisy.

Yes, a hypocrite is someone that does something they said themselves not to do. Did I mess with a married woman? No. Therefore, I'm not a hypocrite.

My morals are just different from yours. That does not make me a hypocrite. I believe that a woman in an LTR is fair game if she's willing to move forward with you (which I thought was going to happen). She deceived me into believing that she was dumping him for me (they were already on the break). When she did not make that break, I moved on.

 

[Purple-Haze]

Yes, a hypocrite is someone that does something they said themselves not to do. Did I mess with a married woman? No. Therefore, I'm not a hypocrite.

Let's take a look at the definition of hypocrisy, shall we? It is the "practice of professing beliefs, feelings, or virtues that one does not hold or possess; falseness". Now you hold that it is wrong to have an affair with a married woman - this is a belief of yours. But you see no problem with helping a woman with a bf cheat.

You practice what you preach in that you do not cheat with married women but do so with women with SOs. Fine.

So prima facie, you are not a not a hypocrite. But let's got a bit further. In order for me to fully respond, I need to hear why you differentiate b/w the two relationships. Why does one hold a certain value that the other doesn't?

If you answer this, I think you may have a chance of seeing how your stance on cheating reveals the hypocrisy in your stance on morality.

People do this all the time. They walk around spouting stuff like, "ohh, I ain't no hypocrite. I say what I mean and do what I say." I don't need to tell you that it's not as simple as that. You only delude yourself if you allow yourseld to apply a mere definition to your actions and excuse as that being "true" to your sense of morals.

 

[Purple-Haze]

Yes, a hypocrite is someone that does something they said themselves not to do. Did I mess with a married woman? No. Therefore, I'm not a hypocrite.

My morals are just different from yours. That does not make me a hypocrite. I believe that a woman in an LTR is fair game if she's willing to move forward with you (which I thought was going to happen). She deceived me into believing that she was dumping him for me (they were already on the break). When she did not make that break, I moved on.

You edited your post in the time I was writing mine up.

If you she told you she was leaving him for you, that may not constitute cheating in the strict sense. If there was any kind of overlap and he was not informed of it, then that IS cheating.

Are you telling me then that because she did not breakup with him (as promised), you were not willing to put up with that, hence you left her? In which case, why did you leave her?

 

[Mavrick]

Let's take a look at the definition of hypocrisy, shall we? It is the "practice of professing beliefs, feelings, or virtues that one does not hold or possess; falseness". Now you hold that it is wrong to have an affair with a married woman - this is a belief of yours. But you see no problem with helping a woman with a bf cheat.

This does NOT make me a hypocrite. I never said that it was wrong to help a woman cheat on her boyfriend. I didn't make any profession of a belief, feeling, or virtue that stated a woman in a LTR should be untouched.

Whew, so that clears me of hypocrisy. Thanks for helping clear that up.