military press question

[shock]

Do you guys recommend standing or seated? Also, my gym just has a Smith, is that acceptable? Or would I be better of just using DBs??

 

[I-tallionStallion]

Don't they have a bench rack there? You can military press off that if need be.

 

[MrS]

Standing BB
Sitting BB
Standing DB
Sitting DB
Smith standing
Smith sitting

 

[speed dawg]

I do them standing because it helps strengthen the lower back stabilizing muscles. Anything to knock out two birds with one stone and shorten my workout!

 

[Lifeforce]

Technically military presses can only be performed by standing up. If you press while sitting down it's seated shoulder press. I prefer standing because it gives training to the core as well.

 

[MrS]

I do them standing because it helps strengthen the lower back stabilizing muscles. Anything to knock out two birds with one stone and shorten my workout!

Just to clear that one up.

First, there is no such thing as stabilizing muscles.

Second, it shouldn't be all lower back, it should be CORE. That's front, sides, back. Keeping the core tight is essential.

So in short, it's not your lower back stabilizing muscles, it's your core that gets some stability work.

 

[speed dawg]

Just to clear that one up.

First, there is no such thing as stabilizing muscles.

Second, it shouldn't be all lower back, it should be CORE. That's front, sides, back. Keeping the core tight is essential.

So in short, it's not your lower back stabilizing muscles, it's your core that gets some stability work.

No, it's my lower back. Yes, it works the entire core. But I like it and do it (stand up) because it strengthens my lower back when I do overhead moves.

 

[mrRuckus]

First, there is no such thing as stabilizing muscles.

Don't be assinine, little punk.

 

[MrS]

Don't be assinine, little punk.

Slightly violent reply, there, mrRuckus. You took it the wrong way.

I feel my reply was completely wasted.

 

[Caferacer]

Just to clear that one up.

First, there is no such thing as stabilizing muscles.

Second, it shouldn't be all lower back, it should be CORE. That's front, sides, back. Keeping the core tight is essential.

So in short, it's not your lower back stabilizing muscles, it's your core that gets some stability work.

And what is your core composed of?

Lower back.

Doing standing presses (push presses as I have known them) will involve some lower back because you have to lean backwards at the beginning of the movement. Saying core is just as vague as saying stabilizer muscles. There are muscles that take the majority of the load depending on the movement. You have to agree that the lower back will be supporting more load in a rep with good form than your obliques.

Muscle can be stabilizers. They can also be the ones actively moving (triceps in bench press) or be stretching and helping to protect muscles from tearing in a movement (biceps in a bench press). It just depends on the role the muscle takes on as a movement. I forget the exact names for the roles and don't feel like digging up my PT book.

Just wanted to clear that up. No offense is meant in any way.

 

[MrS]

None taken, better your reply than the esteemed mrRuckus.

All I meant was there are no magical "stabiliser" muscles. Some muscles can be involved and stabilise a movement, yes, but they are no hidden muscles that suddenly appear when you do certain movements. You'd be suprised how many times that is mentioned!

Standing presses don't have to be push presses, they can be strict presses, jerks, whatver. Strictly? You SHOULDN'T lean back, that isn't the strictest of form. You are technically supposed to move yourself under the bar as you press it, sitting under it in some circumstances. Like on the military press, you don't lean back so when you press and move your head forward you are under it. You start under it and end up with your head in front of it.
Check any Olympic lifting side views to know exactly what I mean.

And core, for me, is not lower back.
Core, is your abs, your obliques, your lower back.
So, for me, I wouldn't say a heavy, good form military press would stress my lower back more than my obliques.

 

[mrRuckus]

Rippetoe has a slight lean back in the form he teaches. It's not planned on being there but a slight one he says is just fine. There are even videos on youtube of him teaching with a little hip thrust (not quads like a push press).

Typically i stand there with my legs completely stiff and contracted as well as my glutes and it's really hard to lean back to much like that. The glutes thing is the same thing you are supposed to do on the deadlift which helps prevent you from extending too far backwards when you reach the top.

 

[Kerpal]

How do you avoid hitting yourself in the face with the bar if you don't lean back?

 

[Junkyard]

tilt your head back

 

[Metaphysical]

when you sit down and do military press people arch their lower backs and put too much pressure on it. you can break a disk like that and once you do, you are paralyzed for the rest of your damn life.

do it when you're standing. sitting millitary press was one of the stupidest bodybuilding inventions

 

[Caferacer]

Rippetoe has a slight lean back in the form he teaches. It's not planned on being there but a slight one he says is just fine. There are even videos on youtube of him teaching with a little hip thrust (not quads like a push press).

Typically i stand there with my legs completely stiff and contracted as well as my glutes and it's really hard to lean back to much like that. The glutes thing is the same thing you are supposed to do on the deadlift which helps prevent you from extending too far backwards when you reach the top.

The hip/leg push serves a purpose though. If you start on your clavicle, then you are in a position of very little leverage to use just your shoulders to press the weight up.

I typically lean back simply because it is too awkward to hold a large amount of weight any place but right over your feet. This is also why I have a 'pop' off the bottom of the rep, so let me have the chance to get the weight up past my clavicle.

 

[mrRuckus]

The hip/leg push serves a purpose though. If you start on your clavicle, then you are in a position of very little leverage to use just your shoulders to press the weight up.

I typically lean back simply because it is too awkward to hold a large amount of weight any place but right over your feet. This is also why I have a 'pop' off the bottom of the rep, so let me have the chance to get the weight up past my clavicle.

I just haven't bothered to learn the lift with any sort of hip thrust yet. It's really not natural to do it like a push press would be. Even in the videos the one guy had trouble doing it with Rippetoe standing right there.

The bar should be moving in a straight line over your feet. When ISN'T it right over your feet? My clavicle is over my feet... It's your upper back and head that move to get out of the way of the bar. I don't move my lower back to do that. This is really simple to demonstrate if you just use the bar. The only reason people lean back is because it shifts more of the lift to their pecs, which makes the lift easier.

What i always see guys in the gym doing is holding the bar out in front of their face. As soon as it's clear of my head i'm moving my head forward under the bar.

 

[kickureface]

i don't know how you hold it but it's very possible to hold the bar over the feet without lean

ruckus is right here for strict pressing. other leg movement is push pressing

 

[Caferacer]

I just haven't bothered to learn the lift with any sort of hip thrust yet. It's really not natural to do it like a push press would be. Even in the videos the one guy had trouble doing it with Rippetoe standing right there.

The bar should be moving in a straight line over your feet. When ISN'T it right over your feet? My clavicle is over my feet... It's your upper back and head that move to get out of the way of the bar. I don't move my lower back to do that. This is really simple to demonstrate if you just use the bar. The only reason people lean back is because it shifts more of the lift to their pecs, which makes the lift easier.

What i always see guys in the gym doing is holding the bar out in front of their face. As soon as it's clear of my head i'm moving my head forward under the bar.

Put that way, I think we are both walking about the same thing. There is a lean in the beginning, but to get up under the weight there is a straightening of the back like you said. For some reason I thought you were talking about holding the bar with the weight over your toes trying to avoid any lean. I think Kickureface is speaking of it this way. There is a difference between over your toes and your whole foot, I just didn't write clearly enough. I guess because I always set up for push presses like I am doing front squats.

Plus, the way I visualize the lift I don't think about lower or upper back, and yet I wrote lower back. I'm just being weird right now I guess.