"The Coffee Shop Girl You Never Spoke To"

You've replayed it a hundred times. She stood three feet away, scrolling her phone. You had an opening. You composed the perfect line — after she was gone.

For all you know, she's married now. To some guy who said something. Anything.

Openers are cheap. Almost any sentence works when it's delivered within three seconds. The expensive part is the standing there, drafting and deleting, while the window quietly closes.

The "22 Rules" stripped out my hesitation. What to open with, how to keep it alive, and the one habit that costs guys more women than anything else: waiting for perfect.

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How to react to failure?

Cyfer

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How do you guys react to failure?

I was in an environment where I was sitting next to a girl who had a boyfriend, no problem, because she was only 6-7/10. There were two girls behind me however, 8 and 9-9.5/10. Tried to get the number of the 9.5 only to find out both were going to meet their boyfriends right after the event.

I panicked and had no comeback, nothing suave, witty or even confident as usual. How do you usually react in these situations? Think I should have made a joke, like screw their boyfriends and come have a foursome with me.


Normally with approaches on the street I'm fine with failure since it is a 5 minute interaction. Here it was an event, where I had invested time talking to these girls. Perhaps the moral of the story is invest in yourself and not in others?
 

"She Liked You in March. It's October Now."

Attraction runs on a clock.

She flirted for weeks. Touched your arm. Found reasons to be alone with you. And you were careful. Respectful. Waiting for the right moment.

The moment had a shelf life. It expired around month two, and by the time you asked her out, she'd quietly filed you under "little brother."

One of the hardest lessons inside the 22 Rules: women rarely wait. Interest either grows or it decays, and nothing decays it faster than a man who never moves.

Make the move while she's still inventing reasons to be near you.

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nroug7

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Cyfer said:
How do you guys react to failure?

I was in an environment where I was sitting next to a girl who had a boyfriend, no problem, because she was only 6-7/10. There were two girls behind me however, 8 and 9-9.5/10. Tried to get the number of the 9.5 only to find out both were going to meet their boyfriends right after the event.

I panicked and had no comeback, nothing suave, witty or even confident as usual. How do you usually react in these situations? Think I should have made a joke, like screw their boyfriends and come have a foursome with me.


Normally with approaches on the street I'm fine with failure since it is a 5 minute interaction. Here it was an event, where I had invested time talking to these girls. Perhaps the moral of the story is invest in yourself and not in others?
You wouldn't have had much luck anyways, usually I can escalate with a girl using tons of innuendo and after a while she might mention she has a boyfriend. When they bring it up straight away it's a no go.
 

Cyfer

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nroug7 said:
You wouldn't have had much luck anyways, usually I can escalate with a girl using tons of innuendo and after a while she might mention she has a boyfriend. When they bring it up straight away it's a no go.
I didn't mean I was trying to still get her number, I'm cool with the fact that she has a boyfriend.

Generally though, I just want to get better at handling those kinds of situations.
 

Atom Smasher

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You're not "failing". You're simply in the learning process. Just keep talking to people. Lots of small talk makes on pretty adept at handling these kinds of situations.

As an aside, I think men sometimes put too much pressure on themselves to be "C&F" and to have witty comebacks. It's not always necessary.
 

VladPatton

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You react with a chuckle and wish them a good time. Nothing you can do. Once it affects you, you will obsess over it. Brush it off and that's that.

It's not like you're ever gonna see those biznitches again!
 

"I'm Not Looking for Anything Serious Right Now"

When a woman says it, guys hear a confession. A heads-up. A scheduling conflict.

Here's the translation: I don't feel anything. Right now. With you.

Watch what happens when a man triggers actual attraction. The busy career, the recent breakup, the "not in a place to date" — all of it evaporates instantly. The same woman who was guarding her freedom is suddenly free every night.

The "22 Rules" explain why. When the right switches flip, her timeline rearranges itself around you.

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betheman

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Atom Smasher said:
You're not "failing". You're simply in the learning process. Just keep talking to people. Lots of small talk makes on pretty adept at handling these kinds of situations.

As an aside, I think men sometimes put too much pressure on themselves to be "C&F" and to have witty comebacks. It's not always necessary.
Exactly!

you approached and tried, why do you view that as failure? they may have been lying, they may not.
When you put pressure on yourself to be c&f, you run the increased risk of being viewed as an absolute d!ck! if they were polite to you, a simple "hey thats cool ladies, enjoy your day" will reflect that you are a cool guy and not all butthurt over the setback, if ever you bump into them or their friends again, they are more likely to rengage with you and you get some social proff out of it.
 

MrNiceGuy23

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It depends how they tell you. If you're having good conversation with them and they seem to be flirty, they might be the type looking to be promiscuous, so going for the witty comment might improve your chances. If they sternly tell you "I have a boyfriend I'm meeting here soon" almost immediately after you try to game them, then they either find you completely unattractive or they aren't into flirting with other men while dating or they lied because they found you creepy.

Personally, I would return by saying something along the lines of "Oh my we better hurry up then we don't have much time!" If you're attractive and already built up some banter between you it should well received, and at the very least, the girls would admire your tenacity and humor.
 

Cyfer

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Thanks guys, your posts were really helpful.

What betheman said about being a **** resonates especially well, I think I've gone from one extreme (nerd) to being close to the other, where I can almost be ****ish because I've gained so much confidence/not giving a damn/saying whatever.

I definitely need to tone it down and be more suave.

It almost seems paradoxical though. The 'cool' guys don't have to exert any effort, yet how are they ever noticed if they don't exert effort?
As in, I'm fine with the idea of being laid back ONCE I gain social status, but until I gain this, with new people how do I establish myself as the leader with social status?
Generally, with new people now I'm seen as the instantaneous leader because I get to know everyone and introduce everyone to each other, but for example I got called by the girl that I sat next to there 'a bit of a ****' in a jokey way and 'not the kind of guy to be in a relationship'. To be a true leader I need to maintain the ability to prove myself... without proving myself.

I'm still trying to find out how to do this. Stuff like taking the lead when walking about and being assertive/cutting out on bull**** comes to mind but that is situation-specific. Any tips?
 

twentee

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as has been said here MANY times, are YOU a 9 or a 10? If not, why not? and if so, why are you not busy FIXING the deficit? If you are 5 ft noting, 100 lbs, can barely walk, wtf are you doing on the NFL field? Better find a way to beef up, or go where the competition looks like you, or where the women prefer your type of guy.
 

"Why Women Dump the Guys Who Try the Hardest"

You paid for dinner. You drove. You said "whatever you want is fine" every single time. All the effort, no expectations.

And she left anyway — probably for a guy who makes her pick up the pizza.

Painful. Also predictable. Her mind quietly concludes that anything requiring zero effort from her is worth exactly zero. You became a free sample, and free samples get taken for granted.

The 22 Rules flip the dynamic. Small shifts that get her investing effort, money, and time in you — until SHE'S the one afraid of losing YOU.

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Cyfer

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Deleted. No point to the comment. Please keep posting advice and tips, thank you!
 
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Atom Smasher

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A man has to strike a delicate balance with humor. Too much and you are seen as a clown and people lose respect. Not sure if this applies here but it's worth noting.
 

Cyfer

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Atom Smasher said:
A man has to strike a delicate balance with humor. Too much and you are seen as a clown and people lose respect. Not sure if this applies here but it's worth noting.
It does. Whilst people may not regard me as a clown, I don't think I generate calm respect. How would you suggest you achieve that balance?

I tend to have sprints of goofing around a lot, and really pushing it. And then I have moments where I am incredibly serious and philosophical. Do you think it is bad to be so extreme at both ends, and rarely in the middle?

Thank you.
 

MikeAndIke

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Atom Smasher,

That was deep. Im interested in your response to Cyfer's question as it will be useful to all.
 

Atom Smasher

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Cyfer said:
It does. Whilst people may not regard me as a clown, I don't think I generate calm respect. How would you suggest you achieve that balance?

I tend to have sprints of goofing around a lot, and really pushing it. And then I have moments where I am incredibly serious and philosophical. Do you think it is bad to be so extreme at both ends, and rarely in the middle?

Thank you.
The nature of these things is that it is impossible to formularize a workable paradigm for everybody. What I can get away with, you can not, and vice-versa. It all has to do with chemistry and personality.

I'm a pretty funny guy in real life, and in the past I found that if I joked around too much people would lose respect for me. I was able to tell because they became a little dismissive and would interrupt me or not give me their undivided attention. What happens is that you become a characature, a known quantity and they learn to look to you for laughs and not for serious opinions.

It also becomes uncomfortable for them because they feel pressured to have to laugh or respond to everything you say, even if they're not in the mood. It become work, and they slowly start tending to avoid you unless they're in the right mood.

So it boils down to experimentation and calibration. You need to cut back on your joking around if you suspect you are going overboard. People love a man who is funny and yet shifts into seriousness frequently.

Some tips that have worked for me:

Body language is important. Clowns are twitchy and move quickly. Slow yourself down and T A K E | U P | S P A C E.

Think in terms that you are in control of time and space itself. I can't emphasize this enough. Don't be wide-eyed and super-expressive with your face. When someone addresses you, look to them slowly as if you're judging if what they are saying has merit.

Think of your self as grounded. Literally be conscious of your contact with the earth.

I am currently experimenting with voice inflection and I find that I can set myself to a certain spot where I am most effective with my vocal tone and pacing. So far I'm finding it by the seat of my pants, so I can't articulate what I'm doing. Soon I will know and be able to access it more readily.


Do not feel you need to acknowledge and answer every question or comment that comes your way. Ignore some, be slow to answer others.

Once you have conveyed goundedness and mastery of time and space, you are now free to go into bursts of C & F. It's like you have "authorization" to clown it up a bit because you have already established your groundedness. Take a few flights up into fooling around, and then land and ground yourself again. Balance is the key, and is different for everybody.

You will sense when you are being too humorous and you will be able to reel yourself in if you practice enough.

How to ground yourself and acheive credibility verbally:

Make a positive observation about a person and verbalize it. For example, "That's because you have passion for what you do."

or,

"Yes, I can see that you value and respect [whatever it is they're talking about]"

Statements like this tend to offset the clowning around to yield a good balance of humor vs. seriousness. In the above example, they are delighted about what you said about them and they will internally assign the words "value" and "respect" to you.

These are just a few things that have helped me balance myself. YMMV, because everyone's different, but I think the body language stuff is pretty universal.

When in doubt, pull in the reins on C & F and deploy it only sporadically.

HTH
 

"She Wants a Man, Not a Boy"

You asked her if she wanted to grab coffee. Then you asked if the time worked. Then you asked if the place was okay. Then you asked if she'd prefer tea.

Four questions. Four chances for her to say no. Four signals that you're terrified of making a decision.

Plan it. Pick the place. Pick the time. Tell her where to meet you. She'll either show up or she won't.

Either way, you look like a man instead of a scared little boy.

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zinc4

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Cyfer said:
How do you guys react to failure?

I was in an environment where I was sitting next to a girl who had a boyfriend, no problem, because she was only 6-7/10. There were two girls behind me however, 8 and 9-9.5/10. Tried to get the number of the 9.5 only to find out both were going to meet their boyfriends right after the event.

I panicked and had no comeback, nothing suave, witty or even confident as usual. How do you usually react in these situations? Think I should have made a joke, like screw their boyfriends and come have a foursome with me.


Normally with approaches on the street I'm fine with failure since it is a 5 minute interaction. Here it was an event, where I had invested time talking to these girls. Perhaps the moral of the story is invest in yourself and not in others?

It is all BS and not important...seriously, it's all BS...EVERYTHING...nothing is important except for how you treat others if that makes any sense...your ego is your worst enemy. I fight it every day.
 

nroug7

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Atom Smasher said:
The nature of these things is that it is impossible to formularize a workable paradigm for everybody. What I can get away with, you can not, and vice-versa. It all has to do with chemistry and personality.

I'm a pretty funny guy in real life, and in the past I found that if I joked around too much people would lose respect for me. I was able to tell because they became a little dismissive and would interrupt me or not give me their undivided attention. What happens is that you become a characature, a known quantity and they learn to look to you for laughs and not for serious opinions.

It also becomes uncomfortable for them because they feel pressured to have to laugh or respond to everything you say, even if they're not in the mood. It become work, and they slowly start tending to avoid you unless they're in the right mood.

So it boils down to experimentation and calibration. You need to cut back on your joking around if you suspect you are going overboard. People love a man who is funny and yet shifts into seriousness frequently.

Some tips that have worked for me:

Body language is important. Clowns are twitchy and move quickly. Slow yourself down and T A K E | U P | S P A C E.

Think in terms that you are in control of time and space itself. I can't emphasize this enough. Don't be wide-eyed and super-expressive with your face. When someone addresses you, look to them slowly as if you're judging if what they are saying has merit.

Think of your self as grounded. Literally be conscious of your contact with the earth.

I am currently experimenting with voice inflection and I find that I can set myself to a certain spot where I am most effective with my vocal tone and pacing. So far I'm finding it by the seat of my pants, so I can't articulate what I'm doing. Soon I will know and be able to access it more readily.


Do not feel you need to acknowledge and answer every question or comment that comes your way. Ignore some, be slow to answer others.

Once you have conveyed goundedness and mastery of time and space, you are now free to go into bursts of C & F. It's like you have "authorization" to clown it up a bit because you have already established your groundedness. Take a few flights up into fooling around, and then land and ground yourself again. Balance is the key, and is different for everybody.

You will sense when you are being too humorous and you will be able to reel yourself in if you practice enough.

How to ground yourself and acheive credibility verbally:

Make a positive observation about a person and verbalize it. For example, "That's because you have passion for what you do."

or,

"Yes, I can see that you value and respect [whatever it is they're talking about]"

Statements like this tend to offset the clowning around to yield a good balance of humor vs. seriousness. In the above example, they are delighted about what you said about them and they will internally assign the words "value" and "respect" to you.

These are just a few things that have helped me balance myself. YMMV, because everyone's different, but I think the body language stuff is pretty universal.

When in doubt, pull in the reins on C & F and deploy it only sporadically.

HTH
I tend to use a lot of dark humor that is although very funny, heavily layered in serious undertones a lot. Even though many of my friends laugh at my jokes/etc they still are aware I can be serious.
The question is, wouldn't I have a bit more freedom with C&F due to my young age? (19)
 

RedZone

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Even the most successful people fail at some point in their life, but they don't let that deter them from their goal. So in short, don't let that rattle you and keep you from approaching girls because if that does than you truly fail.
 

"You Can't Argue a Woman Into Liking You"

You made your case like a lawyer. Stable job. Good guy. Ready for something real. All true. All irrelevant.

She weighed your points, nodded along, felt nothing — then fell hard for some tattooed bartender with a motorcycle and a gambling problem.

Logic is where attraction goes to die. The "22 Rules" work a level deeper, on the subconscious switches that decide within minutes whether you register as a MAN or as part of the furniture.

Stop presenting evidence. Start flipping switches.

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