Any night owls here?

DarwinTaurus

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I've suffered from insomnia for most of my adult life, which is more than likely self-inflicted, due to the life-choice of working shift-work.

I work 12 hour shifts (each shift is 7:30 to 7:30): 2 days, 2 nights, then for days off.

I've tried everything over the years: Restavit, Phenergan, Melatonin, Valerian Root, etc.

The big difference I've made to my lifestyle recently, is quitting caffeine. As of today, it has been 28 days. And I used to love it. Went through a vicious cycle of energy drinks, etc. No more coffee, coke, ice-coffee, etc. Sleep has gradually been getting better. Next step is to quit alcohol.
 

BillyPilgrim

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I've suffered from insomnia for most of my adult life, which is more than likely self-inflicted, due to the life-choice of working shift-work.

I work 12 hour shifts (each shift is 7:30 to 7:30): 2 days, 2 nights, then for days off.

I've tried everything over the years: Restavit, Phenergan, Melatonin, Valerian Root, etc.

The big difference I've made to my lifestyle recently, is quitting caffeine. As of today, it has been 28 days. And I used to love it. Went through a vicious cycle of energy drinks, etc. No more coffee, coke, ice-coffee, etc. Sleep has gradually been getting better. Next step is to quit alcohol.
That's nuts, they should segregate the day and night shifts. It's insane to make people shift back and forth. While you made the choice to take this job, you also have to look at the company offering it. People need to work so they know the job will be taken.

In the U.S. they commonly make nurses do this in hospital settings when they're making life-altering decisions, imo this should be outlawed.
 

DarwinTaurus

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That's nuts, they should segregate the day and night shifts. It's insane to make people shift back and forth. While you made the choice to take this job, you also have to look at the company offering it. People need to work so they know the job will be taken.

In the U.S. they commonly make nurses do this in hospital settings when they're making life-altering decisions, imo this should be outlawed.

The 4 on, 4 off roster is a lot better than the one I used to work... which was based on 28 days. I love getting 4 days off every 4 days. I take 4 shifts off, and I get 12 days off.

But the real reason, I put myself through it, it is damn good money.
 

FlexpertHamilton

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I've suffered from insomnia for most of my adult life, which is more than likely self-inflicted, due to the life-choice of working shift-work.

I work 12 hour shifts (each shift is 7:30 to 7:30): 2 days, 2 nights, then for days off.

I've tried everything over the years: Restavit, Phenergan, Melatonin, Valerian Root, etc.

The big difference I've made to my lifestyle recently, is quitting caffeine. As of today, it has been 28 days. And I used to love it. Went through a vicious cycle of energy drinks, etc. No more coffee, coke, ice-coffee, etc. Sleep has gradually been getting better. Next step is to quit alcohol.
The reason night shifts are so problematic is because they're usually in a rotation. If you're going to work a night shift, you better stick to that schedule 7 days a week, every week. A rotating day/night shift schedule is terrible for you.
 

Stoic

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I've been reading up on delayed sleep phase disorder and chronotypes and this is more prevelant than I realized. And from an evolutionary perspective, this makes perfect sense. Tribes that had variations in sleep-wake preferences had a huge advantage - having a rotation of people who were awake would make the tribe less vulnerable to predation and more productive (foraging, hunting, cleaning, maintaining shelters, etc).

I've been aware that I had this most of my life but people minimize it and say you're just "lazy", or simply assert that waking up early is superior: "waking up early is beneficial for me, therefore it must be beneficial for everyone". The claims around waking up early make no sense - #1 you still have the same number of hours in a day regardless of when you wake up or go to sleep and #2) in a modern day global economy, the "early bird gets the worm" notion is irrelevant in pretty much every industry.

I've always tried to get myself to comform to early wake times and it's a never ending struggle that my body never adapts to, or worse, maladapts. As of late I've let myself sleep on my own preferred schedule and my sleep has been fantastic. I consistently fall asleep quickly and wake up quickly at the same time every day (2am - 10:30am), don't feel groggy in the morning, more clarity, more energy. If anyone else resonates with this, it would be worth quitting your job and finding something that is more in line with your natural circadian rhythms. Don't listen to the morning larks who tell you otherwise, listen to your body and do what feels best.

Also, from what I know, men are much likely to be night owls than women, because men have considerably more variability than women in general, who are basically all NPCs. This has always made sleepovers hard, but I'm officially done with them now.
I wouldn’t overthink this. You very well could just be lazy. :)
 

BillyPilgrim

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I wouldn’t overthink this. You very well could just be lazy. :)
What an insightful answer. Thinking is a definite sign of laziness. :)

 
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BillyPilgrim

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You morning people keep things running for us thinkers and we appreciate it. Society can't advance without all the NPC's doing all of the rote work that enables others to do the heavy lifting. Don't sell yourselves short, you have vital roles.
 

zekko

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I've always tried to get myself to comform to early wake times and it's a never ending struggle that my body never adapts to, or worse, maladapts.
I've worked night or evening shifts basically my whole life, and even when I was a kid I tended to be a night owl. I've been retired going on eight years now and my sleep is still something I constantly struggle with. I sleep great, it's just that my body wants to sleep at the wrong times. I love getting up at dawn, and I try to keep this schedule, but my body has other ideas. I just keep struggling with it, but it hasn't stopped being a problem yet. I'm hoping if I keep at it, eventually my body will get the idea and reset. But so far, yeah it's never adapted. Or rather, it will adapt for a little while, then slide back.
 

Deranged

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You morning people keep things running for us thinkers and we appreciate it. Society can't advance without all the NPC's doing all of the rote work that enables others to do the heavy lifting. Don't sell yourselves short, you have vital roles.
Absolutely savage! There may be a kernel of truth here. I love it.
 

Fortune_favors_the_bold

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I've been reading up on delayed sleep phase disorder and chronotypes and this is more prevelant than I realized. And from an evolutionary perspective, this makes perfect sense. Tribes that had variations in sleep-wake preferences had a huge advantage - having a rotation of people who were awake would make the tribe less vulnerable to predation and more productive (foraging, hunting, cleaning, maintaining shelters, etc).

I've been aware that I had this most of my life but people minimize it and say you're just "lazy", or simply assert that waking up early is superior: "waking up early is beneficial for me, therefore it must be beneficial for everyone". The claims around waking up early make no sense - #1 you still have the same number of hours in a day regardless of when you wake up or go to sleep and #2) in a modern day global economy, the "early bird gets the worm" notion is irrelevant in pretty much every industry.

I've always tried to get myself to comform to early wake times and it's a never ending struggle that my body never adapts to, or worse, maladapts. As of late I've let myself sleep on my own preferred schedule and my sleep has been fantastic. I consistently fall asleep quickly and wake up quickly at the same time every day (2am - 10:30am), don't feel groggy in the morning, more clarity, more energy. If anyone else resonates with this, it would be worth quitting your job and finding something that is more in line with your natural circadian rhythms. Don't listen to the morning larks who tell you otherwise, listen to your body and do what feels best.

Also, from what I know, men are much likely to be night owls than women, because men have considerably more variability than women in general, who are basically all NPCs. This has always made sleepovers hard, but I'm officially done with them now.
Same here except that the best productivity and energy in my life came when my schedule was 3am-11am.

I struggled with mental clarity, energy and overall performance my entire school life then during university time when I had full control of my schedule my productivity sky rocketed, got bigger and stronger.

8 hours of sleep from 2 to 10 make me brand new while 8 hours from 11 to 7 leave me tired the whole day...it seems like the most restoring sleep comes in the morning where in fact is very unlikely that outside noise would disrupt my sleep.
 
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