Advice Needed

[lp12468]

Hi all. I am currently in a long term relationship with a single mom, and it has become toxic. She moved across the country to be with me, but has been showing fading interest the past few months especially. She has a number of red flags like daddy issues, being friends with sluts and even a stripper in the past, being abused as a kid, etc. which is out of her control to some extent. We were on again off again for around 2 years before she moved, with me ending it each time. It has gotten to the point where she logged into all of my devices and saw notes trying to decode some of her communication. While actions haven't lined up, she has recognized a soft spot of me thinking she's into poly relationships, group sexual encounters, cuckoldry, and she communicates very subtly these narratives to eat away at me and sow doubt. I have mostly stayed unaffected, but at times been reactive in terms of punishment and throwing indirects back at her. Other recent indirects have been on me being lazy, boring, etc. as I decided to pivot to medical school admissions full-time rather than my prior tech career. Her friend even was throwing negative indirects at me the one time we all met up. She has supported the move and talks about the future frequently together. However some of the notes she read involved me listing things such as 'build a social net before it's done' and 'this relationship is dragging you down' and some unrelated worries that I had that I wanted to discuss with my medical providers. Our most recent interaction ended with her saying, after she saw these devices and cried, if you don't want to be with me then don't be a coward and string me along. I'm a single mom, etc. I said we can talk about it another time, then she followed with we can talk about it later this week and then left. I don't plan to talk until she reaches out to me. I'm wondering if this is her testing me. She is on her period and lately I've been pulling back as I focus in on medical school and my goals. This doesn't suit her needs as well as she eventually wants me to step into that co-parenting dynamic. I've also been clear on not wanting to move fast and move in together, wanting a consistent dynamic of respect, etc. She even keeps on bringing up how she deserved a promise ring long ago. Let me know your thoughts and how the dynamic can be changed.

 

[Divorced w 3]

First of all, you're just as toxic, playing the same circular game she is. I get this impression though that you really love this woman. Why do you love her? Does she have any redeeming qualities? Why would you let this woman move her kid across the country for you? I'm guessing she can't be all that bad, since you're years into this?

You also seem to know a lot about this woman's past, and that you're throwing shade at her for it. She has a sexual side for sure. Why don't you meet her in the middle and have her arrange a threesome with a female friend? If the relationship is on the outs, at least get the story. Big question becomes why she's going through your phone and devices. That's a sign that she has a high anxiety about whatever you're doing and not telling her about. It's also a red line, but I don't think you're going to do anything to enforce that red line.

So ultimately - if you're not going to leave her, how are you going to let all these concerns of yours go?

 

[BackInTheGame78]

In the latest episode of D4T ("Desperate Dudes Do Desperate Things")...

 

[Divorced w 3]

In the latest episode of D4T ("Desperate Dudes Do Desperate Things")...

Stories this lopsided almost always have more than is originally disclosed.

 

[BackInTheGame78]

Stories this lopsided almost always have more than is originally disclosed.

They all start with a man that has no other options, which is the bigger problem.

Scarcity means you try to do anything to hold onto the one option you have instead of actively getting rid of ones that don't fit what you want because you have too many.

 

[lp12468]

I do have a lot of love for her. We originally met at work remotely and supported eachother on a project then built a bond from there. I love her because despite the red flags she is a giver, loving and kind. Generally she is also good with kids, ambitious but also feminine. She doesn't subscribe to feminism and wants traditional gender roles and a relationship/family long term. She is also very hard working and cares about her family as a first generation immigrant from Mexico.

I will bring that up and see how it goes. I have floated the poly thing and she said no I just want to be in a relationship with you. But in doing it it wasn't with that angle, more directed at her and her indirects about it.

Well she is paranoid about it because in the past she did see me on dating apps. She even created fake accounts to track me. Although I made it clear that I never physically cheated. Part of this was reactive as she kept on throwing me indirects on sexual fantasies involving her and other people. But it was probably all just a test.

 

[lp12468]

Final thing I would say is that she understands me having grown up with a mom and sister that have bipolar. She also supports me in my long term goals of medicine. She has been with me through some of my hardest times in terms of mental health, career, etc. and always supported me.

 

[Divorced w 3]

Final thing I would say is that she understands me having grown up with a mom and sister that have bipolar. She also supports me in my long term goals of medicine. She has been with me through some of my hardest times in terms of mental health, career, etc. and always supported me.

I have bipolar too. I think that answers a lot of your questions. We tend to get super anxious and worked up. Sit with that and do some real searching. Sounds like she's not all that bad. My girlfriend has a past - shocking, given I met her at 33 right? - but she is so above and beyond in love with me, she put up with a ton of my crap. I'm not saying she's right - but take a big step back and see how many fires you have set here yourself. Stay calm - always lean toward keeping cool.

 

[Doctor Europeo]

1.- single mom,
2.- has become toxic.
3.- has been showing fading interest the past few months especially.
4.-daddy issues,
5.-being friends with sluts and even a stripper in the past,
6.- being abused as a kid, etc.
7.- We were on again off again for around 2 years before she moved, with me ending it each time.
8.- It has gotten to the point where she logged into all of my devices.
9.- While actions haven't lined up
10.- she's into poly relationships, group sexual encounters, cuckoldry, and
11.- she communicates very subtly these narratives to eat away at me and sow doubt.
12.-recent indirects
13.- Her friend even was throwing negative indirects at me the one time we all met up.
14.- she eventually wants me to step into that co-parenting dynamic.
15.- She even keeps on bringing up how she deserved a promise ring long ago.

Look at all of these. This is a f0cking mess and you should have ended the relationship a long time ago, long before she moved across the country for you.

You should have never never gave her exclusivity in the 1st place. This woman was never LTR material, she was clearly just recreational use only at best, Smash & Dash, Pump & Ghost.

 

[Gamisch]

Leave. And yiu know that as well cmon bruh..

But okay..threads like these are always made by man who'll say " can you PLEASE give me ANY other option than to leave??".

There is no magic sentence or song that will reverse the situation. I've been there countless of times. Tried all the trick in the book. All those women disappeared forever. So I've learned to ALWAYS keep my suitcase packed when I deal with a woman. Some day will be the day we'll go our separate ways.

You oughtta disappear like batman, learn from the experience( study!!!) and come back better and date better women .

I know you won't leave so this post is pointless

 

[lp12468]

@Gamisch, reverse the situation in terms of my actions or the underlying, uncontrollable factors?

 

[Clockwerk50]

You need to take a step back and logically look at your situation. The more you rush and act in haste, the more mistakes you will make.

With that out of the way, you ****ed up. Not because of your promises, hesitation, or reluctance to move in together, but because of your incongruency. She went digging into your personal information because your actions are not identical to your words. Clearly, there is a reason why she moved in with you, and I am assuming this involves both of you and a future together, but obviously, you have one foot out the door, and this got her spider senses tingling.

You were caught once using dating apps, and now she has found notes about preparing for the relationship to end. She obviously has legitimate reasons to question your commitment. I have already said my piece about how "monkey branching" should be women's behaviour.

Now, what should you do? No one here can answer that, but you need to define your actual objective before choosing a course of action. All choices have pros and cons. As an example, if you decide to stay with her, you have to rebuild trust, which will most likely demand that you forgo your independence and commit to the relationship on her terms. There also seems to be an issue with boundaries, which I am assuming you have none.

Regardless, whether you decide to stay with her, end it, or renegotiate a new relationship, you will not get very far trying to regain control or steer the boat in the right direction through indirect punishment. In other words, you have to man up and take responsibility for your decisions, be honest with yourself about what you want, and commit to such choices.

PS: If you decide to end it and return to dating, read the article below. It discusses relegating a woman to a lower relationship rank following an offense and argues that she cannot regain her former rank. Given your history of breaking up and taking her back, this would have saved you time and issues that you are dealing with right now.

HumanSockPuppet’s Guide to Managing Your Bitches : TheRedPill

 

[Gamisch]

@Gamisch, reverse the situation in terms of my actions or the underlying, uncontrollable factors?

You CANT reverse the situation! Time moves forward, never backwards!!

SHE is the uncontrollable factor. But as DW3 said ,so are you as you can't control your ;self worth, ego ,lust, toxic attachment to her and your standards

You should've left dozens of moments. So no, you won't reverse the attraction. You can however get RENEWED respect from a NEW woman, but only after you drop your current skin like a snake and become a NEW YOU.

 

[Sega Genesis]

Hey OP....

Firstly, it takes two people to make a toxic relationship not just one. It's two people acting and "reacting to" each other. One person acts, the other reacts, their partner reacts to that, lather rinse repeat. It can become a vicious toxic cycle if not addressed early.

In many ways (not all) I agree with Divorced w 3 and Clockwerk50. @Divorced w 3 has experienced this first hand in his relationship yet apparently they are still together and hopefully in a mutally good place finally having introspected and learned from mistakes on both sides.

Look within and introspect as to how YOU contributed to the breakdown and toxicity. Own your shyt. Do better.

As for her, not suggesting she's behaving like a perfect angel, she's not, but it's possible her behavior on some level is in direct response to your own toxic actions as outlined here which is something you need to discuss with her without accusations and assumptions (calling or thinking of her as a hoe, a wh0re, daddy issues, etc.)

That is completely unfair imo.

As a man YOU lead. Often by example.

Something to consider anyway, good luck.

 

[BackInTheGame78]

I do have a lot of love for her. We originally met at work remotely and supported eachother on a project then built a bond from there. I love her because despite the red flags she is a giver, loving and kind. Generally she is also good with kids, ambitious but also feminine. She doesn't subscribe to feminism and wants traditional gender roles and a relationship/family long term. She is also very hard working and cares about her family as a first generation immigrant from Mexico.

I will bring that up and see how it goes. I have floated the poly thing and she said no I just want to be in a relationship with you. But in doing it it wasn't with that angle, more directed at her and her indirects about it.

Well she is paranoid about it because in the past she did see me on dating apps. She even created fake accounts to track me. Although I made it clear that I never physically cheated. Part of this was reactive as she kept on throwing me indirects on sexual fantasies involving her and other people. But it was probably all just a test.

Why are you wasting your time trying to prolong the inevitable?

This relationship has run it's course most likely. Accept it and move on with your life.

Poly is another excuse for "I need to cling to you like a little child clings to their Mommy when they are afraid".

 

[lp12468]

I do want to try and work this out, also because deep down I love her and she has invested a ton. She moved across the country for me, and the daughter is nice. I told her early on it was not a deal breaker. If I go that path, any other recommendations? Her lease ends mid-2027 assuming this holds which should be enough time for us both to determine if it works or not. If I sense she is checked out completely and it is not going to be fixed I will end it. But again I want to try and work it out. I have made a number of changes lately like doubling down on my purpose, focusing on health and wellness, and operating in my frame so it will be interesting how she continues to test and respond. Part of me thinks she always viewed me as beta, and doesn't like that. Like if I were to cede to that mentality, buy the promise ring, spend more money on trips and dates, etc. it may buy time but would she really love me?

 

[lp12468]

So I think that will be a good filter for how things go. In the end I don't want to be a beta cuck she just views for security and a paycheck.

 

[Sega Genesis]

So I think that will be a good filter for how things go. In the end I don't want to be a beta cuck she just views for security and a paycheck.

I'm not seeing entitlement here, I am seeing a woman who loves you and is seeking commitment with YOU which the promise ring will help demonstrate.

I am also seeing a woman who yes is seeking security which isn't a bad thing and also seeking a strong Leader who will provide accordingly.

It's not simply about her using you or having an entitlement mentality. Some women are but I don't see that in this situation.

In turn she will follow your Lead, be feminine and submissive naturally/organically which is what you guys say you want is it not?

I just created a thread in Anything Else about the pros and cons of men Leading, being strong providers including financially and paying.

Check it out, the video is only 7 minutes.

 

[BaronOfHair]

@lp12468 "I love her because despite the red flags she is a giver, loving and kind"

We all love watching re-runs of Married With Children, for entertainment value. That doesn't make associating RL equivalents to The Bundys an especially astute move. You say this gal was a stripper in the past... She's been a "giver" in some rather questionable ways

 

[Divorced w 3]

I do want to try and work this out, also because deep down I love her and she has invested a ton. She moved across the country for me, and the daughter is nice. I told her early on it was not a deal breaker. If I go that path, any other recommendations? Her lease ends mid-2027 assuming this holds which should be enough time for us both to determine if it works or not. If I sense she is checked out completely and it is not going to be fixed I will end it. But again I want to try and work it out. I have made a number of changes lately like doubling down on my purpose, focusing on health and wellness, and operating in my frame so it will be interesting how she continues to test and respond. Part of me thinks she always viewed me as beta, and doesn't like that. Like if I were to cede to that mentality, buy the promise ring, spend more money on trips and dates, etc. it may buy time but would she really love me?

I'll keep this really simple, because while your situation isn't my story exactly, it rhymes and so I'll take a stab at it.

You need to keep your side of the street absolutely spotless. You cannot be going on dating apps. You cannot call her names. Drop the need to be this dominant male through demanding submission. Her lease ends in 9 months. At this rate, I don't trust her to stay wherever you are. You don't need to lavish her with gifts, trips, or anything else out of excess. You simply need to be a good guy. Don't let your anxiety get the best of you. If you stay on the straight and narrow, you'll be able to be in a position to find out if this is a relationship you still want.