“I Love you” and the razor’s edge

Ranger

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#1
There will be more parts to this but I don’t want to do it poorly or make a book out of it.


Just to talk about a woman saying “I love you” to you and what to do/say next isn’t just another PUA technique if you are seeing value in her being connected to you, even as a plate. Its more about where you are coming from with your mind set. I’m not a fan of PUA techniques as a method for getting women. It all bypasses the most important parts and if you fall into her frame or “Fall in love” you have a world of hurt coming. Real love is a slow process.

I’ve been told that I don’t have enough experience with women because I was married for 20+ years. Yet I have not seen one thing on these forums that I have not experienced with that one single woman or any of the other women I have been with before or after. So no, I don’t believe in some things that are talked about. Like how diabolical women are. That’s garbage. However, the “I love you”, is a very interesting experience.

I will say first off. If you say “I love you” first, that was exactly what she was looking for. This is validation from you that she is good enough to breed and produce offspring. But she really doesn’t want to hear that until she says it. Sober and with her full faculties. If you say it, it’s a coffin nail. She will start dancing on the hypergamy string. Just like a marionet (puppet on a string). I use that very precisely when I say “Marionet”. She has no control over it. Socially you can restrict it, but those days are gone, and the cat is out of the bag. Ever try to stick a cat back into a bag? It’s going to leave lots of marks.

I should talk about the word “needy” as it applies to women. Its not neediness as we think neediness is. It’s not only different but it is very dangerous to think women are “needy” with our definition. Their needs are very different than ours. Women ration sex to obtain power. This is not a conscious action. She does not “feel” desire for you until she detects a possible catastrophic event from you about to happen. (competition anxiety or detects you are considering other women)

If she doesn’t feel desire, you aren’t getting any. Zero interest in sex with you. I got this straight from two different married women I was seeing. I lured them covertly into revealing this. Until she is ready to jump, she has to hold you in place. This is so deep inside her genetics that it turns off and on her sexual propensities without any knowledge of what’s going on. If you think this is evil, you might as well stop right here. There is NOTHING she can do to control this.

So what do you think happens if you say “I love you” first?

It’s important to understand what an intimate connection is up front. I will figure out how to communicate it in the best way I can. I’m not the wizard I should be with words sometimes. I don’t think many will have heard something like this yet.
 

lamath

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#2
Good topic

I have a limited experience on this, but i never said it 1st.

It always the women who brings it up, I never told her right away me too.


Not sure best way to handle it.

Would be great to get some women perspective on this
 
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Alvafe

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#3
don't even need to be I love you, just the I like you is enough to get a lot of sh!t, what I would say is hold you damn tongue, let the woman talk, silence is gold
 

Spaz

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#4
Interesting topic Ranger.

It's normally the person that fears the most who says it 1st.

Fear in losing someone.

Women don't love men in the same breath as men do with women. I would argue that men's love is more enduring and more deeper then a woman can possibly imagine.

I'd be interested to know each and everyone's thoughts or perception on what a woman's love is. I bet most can't even spell it out here.
 

Ranger

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#5
Interesting topic Ranger.

It's normally the person that fears the most who says it 1st.

Fear in losing someone.

Women don't love men in the same breath as men do with women. I would argue that men's love is more enduring and more deeper then a woman can possibly imagine.

I'd be interested to know each and everyone's thoughts or perception on what a woman's love is. I bet most can't even spell it out here.
My thoughts on that are coming up as well. It’s my own take of course but based on all that I’ve learned and unfortunately, experienced. It is going to be interesting.
 
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Ranger

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#6
TWO

Feel free to disagree with me at any time. My ego is set well aside. I’m not here to stick myself to my only viewpoint.

I think its important to understand “Love” as we know it and how women know it. Here is a story that many of you will recognize and identify with. It was very enlightening even though the truth of it didn’t come until much later.

I was working in Bellingham, Washington designing some upgrades for the Cherry Point refinery. I was in a Starbucks coffee shop and met this young woman. She was a graduate student in Biology Engineering. Obviously, she was much younger than me.

After the first time I hammered her down, we were having a conversation that led to some interesting things. She was telling me how her ex was decrying and screaming how she had devastated him and trashed him. That she was a heartless bytch. She was laughing and making fun of it with me. Truly. So, when you do this…women will be laughing at you at some point and sharing it with her new lover. Think about that.

She said she wanted to experience me because of she was curious and because of her mother. Her mother was supporting her son (her brother) in HIS new girlfriend. About 12 years older than him. Mom was all for it. But when this young woman I was seeing mentioned to her mother that she would like to experience an older man, mom hit the roof. Do you recognize anything in that? LOL The Feminine Imperative and older women glaring right at you. Think about that. Her daughter taking older professional men that are supposed to be reserved for the older women. Massive falling out.

I had a lot of fun with that woman. Scary fun. Relationships and love are so different for women that we shouldn’t even be listed as the same species.

The point was the boyfriend. He had developed feelings much deeper for her than she for him. This is such a common theme that it can never be ignored. I agree with @Spaz. Our love is much deeper and sustaining than a woman’s.
 

Howiestern

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#7
@Ranger - Well stated. Very correct.

Here are a few thoughts-

-A man's definition and a woman's are often two different things. Women seem to have multiple meanings of the word at different stages which may change over time. I don't think there is so much variation with men. A man's love is far deeper and committed than a woman's. I see and hear the pain in my buddies that go thru divorce. Women don't struggle with the loss of someone they loved like a man does. Man give so much to be in a committed relationship. Women don't give up anything.

-I've had several girls tell me after they initiated a break up that they would always love me. It totally baffles me why they would say this. I'm usually so disgusted when I hear this that i don't care what they mean by it. It means nothing to me at this point other than they are more full of schitt than I originally thought. Perhaps its their way of saying they will always remember the connection we had.

-I dated a girl for 1.5yrs. She told me all the time that she loved me. I never once told her. She has since told several of my friends that it bothered her a lot that I would never reciprocate "I love you". But it never bothered her enough to dump me! Never ever tell them first, for the exact reasons Ranger stated above. Delay reciprocating the term in order to keep the carrot dangling out in front of them. Doing so helps create that desire that is so important.

-The term "LOVE" is printed all over women's clothing. Victoria's Secret is probably the biggest violator of over using the word. Things that are in abundance have less value and less meaning.

-Men tend to lie about accomplishments(height, salary, # of women they've fuhked, etc)......women lie about feelings. Love is a feeling. Don't let those sweet little actors derail you.
 

Ranger

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#8
@Ranger - Well stated. Very correct.

Here are a few thoughts-

-A man's definition and a woman's are often two different things. Women seem to have multiple meanings of the word at different stages which may change over time. I don't think there is so much variation with men. A man's love is far deeper and committed than a woman's.

-I've had several girls tell me after they initiated a break up that they would always love me. It totally baffles me why they would say this. I'm usually so disgusted when I hear this that i don't care what they mean by it. It means nothing to me at this point other than they are more full of schitt than I originally thought. Perhaps its their way of saying they will always remember the connection we had.

-I dated a girl for 1.5yrs. She told me all the time that she loved me. I never once told her. She has since told several of my friends that it bothered her a lot that I would never reciprocate "I love you". But it never bothered her enough to dump me! Never ever tell them first, for the exact reasons Ranger stated above. Delay reciprocating the term in order to keep the carrot dangling out in front of them. Doing so helps create that desire that is so important.

-The term "LOVE" is printed all over women's clothing. Victoria's Secret is probably the biggest violator of over using the word. Things that are in abundance have less value and less meaning.

-Men tend to lie about accomplishments(height, salary, # of women they've fuhked, etc)......women lie about feelings. Love is a feeling. Don't let those sweet little actors derail you.
Good post. You are spot on about the “I will always love you”. It’s about the initial connection and is utterly worthless. So worthless that I would find it a deliberate insult. It’s passive aggressive. And it is deliberate in a way. You made the feelings go away. From her viewpoint of course. Lol
 

Ranger

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#10
Women sell's love.

It's a commodity.

And the only women who truly loves you is your mother until up to the point you become useless.
Lol that’s an inconvenient truth that is hard for some to face.
 
Read the 22 Rules for Massive Success with Women. Everything you need to know to become a huge success with women. And it's free!

samspade

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#14
For all the stupid things I've said and done, I've never said "I love you" first. When I was young I didn't know what it should feel like. As I grew older I learned not to go there, and/or I had good enough frame that she always said it first.

I've said it back to my LTRs, but even then, I'm still not totally sure what I mean by it. I don't think I was as in love as they were. I didn't feel it the way I feel love for family. My last ex used to say to me "It's okay with me if you don't love me as much as I love you." She was pretty sprung for me, and I guess she was willing to accept that. I guess the word makes me uncomfortable, to the extent that I would express it to a woman, because they throw it around like confetti. I would like to feel it on a deep level and to have that reciprocated. So, honestly, to me it doesn't matter much what or how a woman feels when she says it, because I barely understand what I feel when I say it, or I feel like I'm just saying it without anything to back it emotionally. (Outside of the familial sense.)
 

Ranger

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#15
Still no anwser on how to handle the i love you **** test.

Good stuff id really like some women perspective on this
It’s best if you do what’s right for you. Now that I understand things, I can pretty much say most anything. Either way.
 
Read the 22 Rules for Massive Success with Women. Everything you need to know to become a huge success with women. And it's free!

LARaiders85

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#17
@Ranger - Well stated. Very correct.

Here are a few thoughts-

-A man's definition and a woman's are often two different things. Women seem to have multiple meanings of the word at different stages which may change over time. I don't think there is so much variation with men. A man's love is far deeper and committed than a woman's. I see and hear the pain in my buddies that go thru divorce. Women don't struggle with the loss of someone they loved like a man does. Man give so much to be in a committed relationship. Women don't give up anything.

/Men have a protective instinct to literally sacrifice their life for the woman they love. That instinct is not reciprocated. What can be reciprocated is the top women who do paid bond and also have a strong sense of duty and morals tied into their self image. A friend of mine went blind and his girlfriend (early 20s) not only married him but Became an eye doctor to try to cure him./

-I've had several girls tell me after they initiated a break up that they would always love me. It totally baffles me why they would say this. I'm usually so disgusted when I hear this that i don't care what they mean by it. It means nothing to me at this point other than they are more full of schitt than I originally thought. Perhaps its their way of saying they will always remember the connection we had.

/It's shallow but also more of an agape type love for a friend. I have that with one of my 5 exes because she treated me well and I treat her well in return/

-I dated a girl for 1.5yrs. She told me all the time that she loved me. I never once told her. She has since told several of my friends that it bothered her a lot that I would never reciprocate "I love you". But it never bothered her enough to dump me! Never ever tell them first, for the exact reasons Ranger stated above. Delay reciprocating the term in order to keep the carrot dangling out in front of them. Doing so helps create that desire that is so important.

-The term "LOVE" is printed all over women's clothing. Victoria's Secret is probably the biggest violator of over using the word. Things that are in abundance have less value and less meaning.

-Men tend to lie about accomplishments(height, salary, # of women they've fuhked, etc)......women lie about feelings. Love is a feeling. Don't let those sweet little actors derail you.

/Emotional apex predators. They say it both when they feel it and when they don't feel it anymore, for different reasons./
 

lamath

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#18
Interesting topic Ranger.

It's normally the person that fears the most who says it 1st.

Fear in losing someone.

Women don't love men in the same breath as men do with women. I would argue that men's love is more enduring and more deeper then a woman can possibly imagine.

I'd be interested to know each and everyone's thoughts or perception on what a woman's love is. I bet most can't even spell it out here.

i too would be interested on this, i read Rollos and i get it, but still id like to understand it more. If there is a way to understand it.


I know there is different book on this my give a chance to the Female Brain by Louann Brizendine MD
 

Spaz

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#19
i too would be interested on this, i read Rollos and i get it, but still id like to understand it more. If there is a way to understand it.


I know there is different book on this my give a chance to the Female Brain by Louann Brizendine MD
Women's "love" = survival

That's why it's fleeting.

Which is why a man have to teach her love according to him and it can only be done when she greatly admires/respect you as her leader.
 

BeExcellent

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#20
I would like to feel it on a deep level and to have that reciprocated.
I will take a stab at this, although I cannot speak for all women, only for myself.

Love is an action verb transitive. That means it is something rooted in action. When you love someone you give of yourself to that person. You do loving things for that person. You place that person's well being ahead of your own. There is a sacrificial nature to love because it is sacrificing of the self for the other. Obviously this creates a vulnerability that is inherent in love. When two partners place the well being of the other ahead of their own welfare, it is a beautiful thing to see. It is born of trust, commitment and courage. To love is to risk loss. That is the way of things.

Women don't have a different definition of love necessarily. Many do not know what it is or how to manifest it. But there are men who are similarly clueless as well. To say all women trade sex or use sex as a tool is to me an offensive stance, for I do not do this, nor have I ever done it, in fact I think women who do that (and there are many) rob themselves of the beauty and intimacy and the bond that the shared sexual experience can create.

There are a number of things I take issue with which are presented in this thread as though they are fact. Women using sex as a tool is but one of these things.

I've no issue with an older guy dating a much younger woman. Recently I ran into a delightful Italian man and his buddy while out to dinner with my guy. We struck up a conversation, the four of us, and the man seated next to me was 84 years old. Still attractive, even at that advanced age, and still spry. Still had most all his hair (although it was white) and still plays tennis several times a week. His second wife is in her early 50's, a 30 year age difference. They have been married 25 or so years. He is retired and has been for decades. He spoke of his wife with adoration.

I have a cousin in her late 20's who is dating a man in his late 50's or early 60's, not sure which. Big deal. They are happy and that is all that matters, although it does raise eyebrows in their social circles (both ways I might add - both peer groups *she is very smart and very beautiful* have a tough time digesting the pairing.) The young men in her peer group seem just as flumoxed about them dating as the older women in his peer group. So what?

As to the saying of "I love you", I think it is said most appropriately in the moment and should be sincerely expressed, who ever says it first notwithstanding and it doesn't really matter. I've said it first at times, the man has said it first at times. In my current relationship he said it first, and he continues to say it. Obviously I say it too...and what it means has evolved and deepened as the relationship has evolved and deepened.
 
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