Every man I know who's gotten married has a sh**ty life

[BaronOfHair]

Marriage is good for society. Not so sure it's good for individual men.

Whether or not it's universally beneficial to women is questionable as well. Chicks's fear that their husbands may grow dissatisfied with them, take up with same dame who's much younger, sexier, and more malleable than they are isn't entirely unfounded

Hell, the risk of such a thing grows exponentially stronger, when a fella is both physically attractive and has moved fairly far up the socioeconomic ladder

 

[remarkable]

You wouldnt believe how many "good women" i have seen dating "azzholes" longtime.

I should clarify that I mean genuinely, truly good women. And I agree, listen to their actions as opposed to their words. Truly good women will prove themselves eventually, and the women that larp as good women will expose themselves, as well.

 

[Widowed]

I was happily married for 26 years before my wife passed away. Was everything always perfect? No. We worked on things together and made sure we were a united front for our children to see. There’s a lot of compromise in a successful marriage but it has to work both ways.

 

[justaroundthecorner]

I was happily married for 26 years before my wife passed away. Was everything always perfect? No. We worked on things together and made sure we were a united front for our children to see. There’s a lot of compromise in a successful marriage but it has to work both ways.

Listen to this guy and stop beating off to Hamilton or Ducreux memes.

This 100000% .

Its a seduction site and ofcourse it branches out to other parts of ale female dynamics. But if you're married and you vow for marriage, go ahead and contribute to R/ relationships and join the circle jerk

If anything, Sosuave is the last and on top of that a small place where the truth is allowed to be told.

The reason why we are " busy" with talking men out of marriage is because the OGs know that often they type of men who are overly eager to get married are the biggest betas..not saying a married man is beta ( because it supposed to be the opposite, a married man should be a true alpha) but most member's personal experiences are seeing the biggest beta simps suddenly rush into marriage, oftentimes without even being in a long term relationship with said woman.

There is a difference between man that has ability to swoop average or above average women into marriage but decide not to waiting for the right woman and men that marry early because *****-whipped or dumb or marriage due to family pressure/gf getting pregnant etc. this sort of stuff.

I am here to feed my individualism (and my healthy level of egoism) vs influence of marriage on my mentality (to not forget that even if married, I still need to keep myself in check). That's one of the answers married guys can give you.

Another would be - if I am already here for the above purpose, I can give you highlights how it looks on the other side of the fence if properly managed, what is realistic and what is not - the issue is that nowadays its difficult to find the right woman for marriage - nevertheless you can search for such and you can use your player/intuition/gaming techniques also to screen candidates - that's what I did and it paid off, I got into relationship I am satisfied with, my wife is not feminist, she has conservative mentality (just like my mother or her mother) isn't fattie and I have already one cute child with her which welcomes me with big smile in the morning - but between 21-35 I dated several liberal (leftie/feminist) women, and when I was 35 I was already jaded against idea of marriage or LTR and almost decided that perhaps I should start seeing escorts because I so fckng hate dating in modern times. Thankfully, I met my wife few months later. Guess what - I was just dating wrong persons.

Life is about persistance, about sometimes brutal screening of other people, part of life is violence itself, we kill animals to gather food and resources from them, all of us control some form of territory, we gain social position, eventually we compete for women - nowadays, women worth dating are probably only a fraction of "decent women pool" available for our fathers, but it doesn't automatically mean that every married guy is screwed - sorry to say it but if you are ***** whipped its much easier to make stupid decision and tie the knot with psycho-feminist that will control you, try to beat the masculinity out of you or cheat on you when opportunity will arise.

All of you have a choice - raise your SMV so much that even some of the liberal woman will act submissive towards you in certain situations or raise SMV and compete for conservative women (if you know how to screen) or just do what your intuition tells you (raise SMV, pump&dump, eventually find a good woman). You have plenty of strategies how to not get fckd by women, system, in relstionship - yet instead we often read that this or that sosuave member got derailed by his woman and we read it again and again.

Most of the issues with woman can be fixed by keeping religiously to two ideas:
1. Keep your s.hite together.
2.Steer clear from problems and people with issues.

If you can't keep the steering wheel, someone else will take care of it. It doesn't mean that you are innocent of what happened next because you let the steering wheel go.

A lot of married guys I know are actually beta (but not in the sense of losers but in the sense of - "If no alpha on the board, I can convenietly take his place to some extent") - they can support their families, defend them, they can keep job, secure steady promotions, help raise children, hell some of them even can sustain their crazy feminist wives (yuck), they are not rich but they are at least average in term of average assets, most of them have no particularly visible deficiencies.

I am not saying that every each of them is incredibly happy person - actually I think that at least some of them are not (and I know that some of them cheat) but stable not particularly happy life is still better than unstable and sad life.

Therefore creating thread like this one i.e. "All married guys are screwed" reeks of wannabe PUA loser mentality - when I found about PUA being 20 year old blue pill I almost jumped on the ideas of PUAs and instantly thought that marriage is trap for men and idea of LTR with next door type of girl instantly launched Admiral Ackbar's "It's a trap!" moment in my head. Well, those days are behind me and I am thankful for that because being single 41 year old in western world is still socially awkward if you are not rich - that's the sad truth. It also affects how people perceive you and may affect your social or work position mostly in negative manner if people know about it. Your dating pool also changes from attractive 20-something women to 30+ women with baggage that you don't want to deal with (that was in my head when I dated 30 year old woman with PTSD from former relationship when I was 33 - "why do I need to deal with crap that was created by her and her former bf?").

Pick up should not be short-sighted, entering relationships should be well thought, staying single should have strategic purpose of eventually meeting the right person - getting married or not should not be viewed as "extreme/last resort action" - millions of men married before us and they lived happy lived, often longer than single guys (which statistics confirm) - it's just about using all your available means, skills and attributes to choose wisely - if you still choose long legged cheating bimbo over next door girl that holds your back when you are in a dumpster, its on you. Real man would probably screw the first (if single and opportunity would arise) and marry the second. That's my point of view.

 

[Slowhandluke]

Whether or not it's universally beneficial to women is questionable as well. Chicks's fear that their husbands may grow dissatisfied with them, take up with same dame who's much younger, sexier, and more malleable than they are isn't entirely unfounded

Hell, the risk of such a thing grows exponentially stronger, when a fella is both physically attractive and has moved fairly far up the socioeconomic ladder

Men have a tendency to "stick" with women they date/marry when they are younger. Men have loyalty... THIS does. not mean men dont want to spread his seeds and have sex with younger women as they get older. They do, but in a lot of case they still are "mentally" loyalty to their first woman.

Ghenis khan had many wives, but his main wife that he consulted with and held above all others was his first - the one he met when he was just a young poor tribesman. I think Napoleon was the same thing.. Look at most of the founding fathers - some had mistress, but they mostly stayed loyal. Even most European king acted the same way.

Women at their core understand this and in a lot of cases, excuse their "loyal" husband for fooling arround. Its only when their husbands get "mentally" involved with another woman... when he "mentally" cheats does she get upset (at least this was the behavior throughout history).

Mistress, multiple wives, concubines, etc were prevalent throughout history. The reverse is not. There is a reason.

 

[BaronOfHair]

@Slowhandluke "Ghenis khan had many wives, but his main wife that he consulted with and held above all others was his first - the one he met when he was just a young poor tribesman"

And would he/any of these high-flying fellas of yesteryear remained "loyal" to their alleged One, if they were compelled to operate under the highly impractical and romanticized view of marriage that remains pervasive here in The US? That is to say, they were expected to confine themselves to one vagina for several decades? Doubtful

Point is though: Even once we've achieved legal reform(I.E. Gotten the government out of marriage), this entire enterprise will remain a "risk" for everyone, men AND women alike. There are no guarantees that your spouse won't someday grow dissatisfied, then take up with someone else, and that you'll have to restart your existence. Quote Bukowski, albeit in a different context:

"Everything is ultimately just on replay"

 

[remarkable]

I was happily married for 26 years before my wife passed away. Was everything always perfect? No. We worked on things together and made sure we were a united front for our children to see. There’s a lot of compromise in a successful marriage but it has to work both ways.

So sorry for your loss, may I ask how you dealt with it all? Do you plan on getting back on the dating market or re-marrying?

 

[Slowhandluke]

@Slowhandluke "Ghenis khan had many wives, but his main wife that he consulted with and held above all others was his first - the one he met when he was just a young poor tribesman"

And would he/any of these high-flying fellas of yesteryear remained "loyal" to their alleged One, if they were compelled to operate under the highly impractical and romanticized view of marriage that remains pervasive here in The US? That is to say, they were expected to confine themselves to one vagina for several decades? Doubtful

Point is though: Even once we've achieved legal reform(I.E. Gotten the government out of marriage), this entire enterprise will remain a "risk" for everyone, men AND women alike. There are no guarantees that your spouse won't someday grow dissatisfied, then take up with someone else, and that you'll have to restart your existence. Quote Bukowski, albeit in a different context:

"Everything is ultimately just on replay"

women are in general not realistic. when society allowed the input of women (especially after feminist brain washing), relationships between women and men have gotten worse. Monogamy was the idea for most men, but back in the past, people understood everyone was fallible. People (both men and women) understood the young women would throw themselves after married, powerful, successful men. And people understood, some men would not be able to resist their biological imperative.

things will change. but yeah, women have made "marriage" a risk today. men, not marrying is a consequence. "Bad ideas" will disappear as these ideas die with people who are not reproducing.

 

[Gamisch]

Listen to this guy and stop beating off to Hamilton or Ducreux memes.



There is a difference between man that has ability to swoop average or above average women into marriage but decide not to waiting for the right woman and men that marry early because *****-whipped or dumb or marriage due to family pressure/gf getting pregnant etc. this sort of stuff.

I am here to feed my individualism (and my healthy level of egoism) vs influence of marriage on my mentality (to not forget that even if married, I still need to keep myself in check). That's one of the answers married guys can give you.

Another would be - if I am already here for the above purpose, I can give you highlights how it looks on the other side of the fence if properly managed, what is realistic and what is not - the issue is that nowadays its difficult to find the right woman for marriage - nevertheless you can search for such and you can use your player/intuition/gaming techniques also to screen candidates - that's what I did and it paid off, I got into relationship I am satisfied with, my wife is not feminist, she has conservative mentality (just like my mother or her mother) isn't fattie and I have already one cute child with her which welcomes me with big smile in the morning - but between 21-35 I dated several liberal (leftie/feminist) women, and when I was 35 I was already jaded against idea of marriage or LTR and almost decided that perhaps I should start seeing escorts because I so fckng hate dating in modern times. Thankfully, I met my wife few months later. Guess what - I was just dating wrong persons.

Life is about persistance, about sometimes brutal screening of other people, part of life is violence itself, we kill animals to gather food and resources from them, all of us control some form of territory, we gain social position, eventually we compete for women - nowadays, women worth dating are probably only a fraction of "decent women pool" available for our fathers, but it doesn't automatically mean that every married guy is screwed - sorry to say it but if you are ***** whipped its much easier to make stupid decision and tie the knot with psycho-feminist that will control you, try to beat the masculinity out of you or cheat on you when opportunity will arise.

All of you have a choice - raise your SMV so much that even some of the liberal woman will act submissive towards you in certain situations or raise SMV and compete for conservative women (if you know how to screen) or just do what your intuition tells you (raise SMV, pump&dump, eventually find a good woman). You have plenty of strategies how to not get fckd by women, system, in relstionship - yet instead we often read that this or that sosuave member got derailed by his woman and we read it again and again.

Most of the issues with woman can be fixed by keeping religiously to two ideas:
1. Keep your s.hite together.
2.Steer clear from problems and people with issues.

If you can't keep the steering wheel, someone else will take care of it. It doesn't mean that you are innocent of what happened next because you let the steering wheel go.

A lot of married guys I know are actually beta (but not in the sense of losers but in the sense of - "If no alpha on the board, I can convenietly take his place to some extent") - they can support their families, defend them, they can keep job, secure steady promotions, help raise children, hell some of them even can sustain their crazy feminist wives (yuck), they are not rich but they are at least average in term of average assets, most of them have no particularly visible deficiencies.

I am not saying that every each of them is incredibly happy person - actually I think that at least some of them are not (and I know that some of them cheat) but stable not particularly happy life is still better than unstable and sad life.

Therefore creating thread like this one i.e. "All married guys are screwed" reeks of wannabe PUA loser mentality - when I found about PUA being 20 year old blue pill I almost jumped on the ideas of PUAs and instantly thought that marriage is trap for men and idea of LTR with next door type of girl instantly launched Admiral Ackbar's "It's a trap!" moment in my head. Well, those days are behind me and I am thankful for that because being single 41 year old in western world is still socially awkward if you are not rich - that's the sad truth. It also affects how people perceive you and may affect your social or work position mostly in negative manner if people know about it. Your dating pool also changes from attractive 20-something women to 30+ women with baggage that you don't want to deal with (that was in my head when I dated 30 year old woman with PTSD from former relationship when I was 33 - "why do I need to deal with crap that was created by her and her former bf?").

Pick up should not be short-sighted, entering relationships should be well thought, staying single should have strategic purpose of eventually meeting the right person - getting married or not should not be viewed as "extreme/last resort action" - millions of men married before us and they lived happy lived, often longer than single guys (which statistics confirm) - it's just about using all your available means, skills and attributes to choose wisely - if you still choose long legged cheating bimbo over next door girl that holds your back when you are in a dumpster, its on you. Real man would probably screw the first (if single and opportunity would arise) and marry the second. That's my point of view.

I sense that ( surprisingly) this thread created two camps; those that are married and defend it religiously and those who don't. To be clear; OP never said that" married guys are screwed ". He actually kinda said what you say, that most of the people he knows who are married git a sh1tty life. Thats merely an observation rather than a conviction.

And I for one can confirm that. I like that you said that most men you know that are married are beta, because I can also confirm that. Again , it SHOULD be the opposite imo( a married man should be an absolute warrior alpha) but the reality I see is most men who severely struggle with women suddenly get married, skipping the entire " normal " route of bf/ gf, cohabitation ect ect. From start straight to finish like a warp trick.

Again ,it's surprised me to see how people are unable to look at this topic with an helicopter view, trying to see the complete picture. Everyone chimes in from an individual point of view, actually attacking OP saying he should " grow up" and that its " just a part of growing up". They completely missing the point, which is a dire warning. .

 

[Gamisch]

I sense that ( surprisingly) this thread created two camps; those that are married and defend it religiously and those who don't. To be clear; OP never said that" married guys are screwed ". He actually kinda said what you say, that most of the people he knows who are married git a sh1tty life. Thats merely an observation rather than a conviction.

And I for one can confirm that. I like that you said that most men you know that are married are beta, because I can also confirm that. Again , it SHOULD be the opposite imo( a married man should be an absolute warrior alpha) but the reality I see is most men who severely struggle with women suddenly get married, skipping the entire " normal " route of bf/ gf, cohabitation ect ect. From start straight to finish like a warp trick.

Again ,it's surprised me to see how people are unable to look at this topic with an helicopter view, trying to see the complete picture. Everyone chimes in from an individual point of view, actually attacking OP saying he should " grow up" and that its " just a part of growing up". They completely missing the point, which is a dire warning. .

Lost frame in a relationship. Not sure what to do

Yesterday I got in a fight with my fiancée. Previously, I had told her I was planning to come right home. My mom texted me and asked "can you drop by for a while on your way home?" I said yes. I texted my fiancée "I'm going to see Mom for just a little bit." She then said "ok I guess no sex...

www.sosuave.net

And THIS is exactly what I mean...

This OP is engaged, says he lost frame and now yous cant leave...now you gotta pray someone got the golden post that will make your woman submit again while "normally " a qoute on qoute "Don juan" would take his L and be on the hunt for the next woman ,taking the lessons from the previous one along with him( growth). And thats why I say be careful before making such rigorous moves, make sure that the woman you wanna marry is 10000% into you.

On this forum we endlessly discuss female nature and how one day she views you as a God and the next day BOOM she doesn't like you anymore. Despite this "knowledge " most men are inherently beta who apparently wanna be taken to the cleaners by a woman. And that correlates with this thread; if you cant pivot ( leave) you are fecked and a sh1tty life awaits you...

Im not against marriage, but I would urgently advise any man to treat it with EXTREME caution.

 

[justaroundthecorner]

I sense that ( surprisingly) this thread created two camps; those that are married and defend it religiously and those who don't. To be clear; OP never said that" married guys are screwed ". He actually kinda said what you say, that most of the people he knows who are married git a sh1tty life. Thats merely an observation rather than a conviction.

And I for one can confirm that. I like that you said that most men you know that are married are beta, because I can also confirm that. Again , it SHOULD be the opposite imo( a married man should be an absolute warrior alpha) but the reality I see is most men who severely struggle with women suddenly get married, skipping the entire " normal " route of bf/ gf, cohabitation ect ect. From start straight to finish like a warp trick.

Again ,it's surprised me to see how people are unable to look at this topic with an helicopter view, trying to see the complete picture. Everyone chimes in from an individual point of view, actually attacking OP saying he should " grow up" and that its " just a part of growing up". They completely missing the point, which is a dire warning. .

I do not agree - OP clearly meant that most of married guys he knows are screwed (title of this thread - "Every man I know who's gotten married has a sh**ty life" - is self-explanatory).

Helicopter view is reserved in this case only to married and divorced guys - guys that have never gʻgʻgʻ married have "never been married myself, but guy I know was and..." view. That's what one of other ss members wrote in this thread - single guys can't comprehend what it means to be married while married guys were at some point single...

 

[Gamisch]

I do not agree - OP clearly meant that most of married guys he knows are screwed (title of this thread - "Every man I know who's gotten married has a sh**ty life" - is self-explanatory).

Helicopter view is reserved in this case only to married and divorced guys - guys that have never gʻgʻgʻ married have "never been married myself, but guy I know was and..." view. That's what one of other ss members wrote in this thread - single guys can't comprehend what it means to be married while married guys were at some point single...

Why dont we simply go by the ACTUAL title instead of arguing back and forth what might be the hidden message beyond the title? The title says sh1tty life, not screwed. Screwed would literally give it a completely different meaning. Every word has its own meaning.

And no, you dont have to been married to understand the dynamics. Because if we go by that , you could say a man who been in a sh1tty marriage cant understand whats it like to be in a successful one.

Thats what I mean with helicopter view; the ability to look at things from different angles while separating your own bias for the time being.

Perhaps some single guys didn't get married because they've witnessed the sh1tty life in front of their eyes, which made them more cautious to rush into a marriage.

The topic is having good friends that got married and now they got a sh1tty life..and I can testify that I've seen this countless of times.

 

[remarkable]

If you're a man who is unable to find a good, loyal woman to build a life and have children with, then definitely do not get married. But the reason for not getting married is less about women, and more about the men who have a skill issue in attracting a quality woman.

If all the unmarried men want to cope by blaming everything else but themselves, by all means...

 

[Slowhandluke]

If you're a man who is unable to find a good, loyal woman to build a life and have children with, then definitely do not get married. But the reason for not getting married is less about women, and more about the men who have a skill issue in attracting a quality woman.

If all the unmarried men want to cope by blaming everything else but themselves, by all means...

No one is perfect. All humans have flaws. Society understands this and creates safe guards. For example, laws, safety equipment, standards, regulations, etc.. To prevent humans from being humans and doing stupid human things. Seat belts. Why would we have seat belts if everyone is a good driver? But we aren't and we actually have laws that MAKE us wear seat belts. People while driving get distracted by kids, by stress from jobs, by the scenery, etc..

Marriage doesn't have any safe guards for men. Marriage only has safe guards for women who get left behind by their husbands and cannot survive by themselves; but that world no longer exists. She can get a job. She has sanitary wipe to allow her to work, etc. This "safe guard" is can now be weaponized by women to hurt their ex-husbands. Women are only human. It's too tempting to divorce and wreck the husband for perceived wrongs; or just for money ..... or just because of "feelings".

Blaming men for marrying women and later getting divorces, is like blaming people 40 years ago getting into fatals accidents that could have been prevented by wearing seatbelts, and saying, "well, Ted needs to drive better or else he wouldn't have died" -- instead of looking at the car companies for not installing seatbelts in their cars. yes, 40 years ago, the majority of cars IIRC did not have seat belts and a lot of people died.

The marriage rate is mirroring this reality. Men are not marrying. Men are not getting into relationships with women. Things will need to change. Perhaps, the muslims will take over and we will start turning into Islamists (the muslim women seem to be happy being controlled by their husbands???)... or the Latin Americans will take over; these people obviously have no problem having a lot of kids.

 

[FlexpertHamilton]

If you're a man who is unable to find a good, loyal woman to build a life and have children with, then definitely do not get married. But the reason for not getting married is less about women, and more about the men who have a skill issue in attracting a quality woman.

If all the unmarried men want to cope by blaming everything else but themselves, by all means...

I would wager that for most men in the US, maybe 1-5% of the women in their dating pool at best are both a) attractive and b) good woman

You have to be top 20% men at minimum if you want to attract a good wife in the first place. Then you also need to have the skills to understand women's nature to be able to stay happy and sane with her long term. Most of the men I see getting married are NOT top 20% and are very inexperienced or naive around women, and this is the fundamental problem. Men first need to become womanizers and have abundance, and only then should they consider marriage. Getting married from a place of scarcity and inexperience is a horrendous idea.

There's no cope here btw, you're projecting by assuming all these unmarried saps are secretly wishing we were married. I've met high quality women and never once did I even entertain the idea of marriage with them. I'm just not interested. Bro I don't even like sleeping over with a women i'm dating.

 

[The Duke]

If you're a man who is unable to find a good, loyal woman to build a life and have children with, then definitely do not get married. But the reason for not getting married is less about women, and more about the men who have a skill issue in attracting a quality woman.

If all the unmarried men want to cope by blaming everything else but themselves, by all means...

That simple huh? Please tell us what skills a man must posess?

 

[BaronOfHair]

If all the unmarried men want to cope by blaming everything else but themselves, by all means...

Having never had the desire to walk down the aisle, I blame my bachelorhood on nothing but my fondness for liberty

 

[remarkable]

I would wager that for most men in the US, maybe 1-5% of the women in their dating pool at best are both a) attractive and b) good woman

You have to be top 20% men at minimum if you want to attract a good wife in the first place. Then you also need to have the skills to understand women's nature to be able to stay happy and sane with her long term. Most of the men I see getting married are NOT top 20% and are very inexperienced or naive around women, and this is the fundamental problem. Men first need to become womanizers and have abundance, and only then should they consider marriage. Getting married from a place of scarcity and inexperience is a horrendous idea.

I wasn't claiming that all men should get married, and I even advised in my post that you quoted that some men shouldn't get married. I never claimed unmarried saps are secretly wishing to be married, but I was merely addressing the general point of how marriage for a man is bad. My response to that is marrying a good, loyal quality woman will mitigate all the risk.

There's no cope here btw, you're projecting by assuming all these unmarried saps are secretly wishing we were married. I've met high quality women and never once did I even entertain the idea of marriage with them. I'm just not interested. Bro I don't even like sleeping over with a women i'm dating.

Couldn't one argue that you just haven't met that one woman that made you want to sleep over? Imagine an absolute 10 in appearance, personality, everything you wanted in a woman with the upmost loyalty to you, and you still wouldn't commit to her? If you're claiming you'd still walk away from that, then I'm concerned for this generation of men.

 

[remarkable]

That simple huh? Please tell us what skills a man must posess?

The concept is simple, yes, but I can acknowledge it takes work and growth to be a good man. If you have a daughter, sister or any woman in your life that you care about, think of the man you would want them to end up with.

 

[remarkable]

Blaming men for marrying women and later getting divorces, is like blaming people 40 years ago getting into fatals accidents that could have been prevented by wearing seatbelts, and saying, "well, Ted needs to drive better or else he wouldn't have died" -- instead of looking at the car companies for not installing seatbelts in their cars. yes, 40 years ago, the majority of cars IIRC did not have seat belts and a lot of people died.

The marriage rate is mirroring this reality. Men are not marrying. Men are not getting into relationships with women. Things will need to change. Perhaps, the muslims will take over and we will start turning into Islamists (the muslim women seem to be happy being controlled by their husbands???)... or the Latin Americans will take over; these people obviously have no problem having a lot of kids.

I understand that good women are more and more rare these days, but I do believe its up to men to be better men and to not tolerate women being degenerate. A major reason for OF and the toxicity of women is that beta simps enable this type of behavior, which just empowers more and more women to act that way. For many generations, men have built, led and managed societies and this modern shift towards enabling women to be the way they are is, in my opinion, men's fault.

Men need to be better fathers, teaching their daughters to act respectable, and showing them what a good man is. And concurrently, teaching their sons to be leaders with integrity so that women can allow them to lead like how our ancestors lived.