Your Interpretation of my AFC moves

[Mind_Body_Soul]

OK, so here's my current situation and a bit of background. Been studying the community for a few years and have a pretty c&f personality, very focused on myself and making ME happy, great job, keep myself healthy, etc.
I've banged my share of women and would definitely not be classified as an AFC, but I think I may have f.ucked up my current situation. I want to get your opinions about what I did right/wrong.

So I got a wink on Match for this girl we'll call her R. According to her profile, R was VERY similar to me. I sent her a message, short & sweet, fast forward, talk to her on AIM, then phone, set up a date to go to a concert (high energy). First date, I build up the sexual tension, grab her hair around the back of the neck a little bit rough, tease her by blowing on her neck, etc. make her basically beg to get kissed. All the time she's saying "This isn't fair, I'm used to being in control etc." (This becomes a recurring pattern for her - always challenging my power) Finally I start making out with her. Great sexual chemistry etc.

Anyways... I'm driving home get a text message saying "You don't have to drive all the way home you can spend the night at my house." (She lived closer to the venue than I did). I was already closer to home so said no thanks.

Fast forward a bit, we go on another high energy date (concert actually) already planned that I would spend the night, that night I bang her, sex is great blah blah blah.

A week or so goes by, the girl and I have a lot in common, actually she's pretty much identical to me. We're hanging out or something and she starts expressing that she doesn't like how I have MySpace profiles, Match.com profiles, etc. all for dating purposes. She's starting to pull out the exclusivity card - which was actually fine with me because she's a really cool girl.

Here's where the AFC sh1t starts

So I change my profiles and make them unavailable. She does the same. We keep dating actually things go really well. Always high energy dates, surprise drives into the city in the middle of the night to go see some weird movie, sh.t like that.

The sex is always great.

This girl is definitely used to being in control though and tells me about how her ex b/f is so different from me. That she was in charge of the relationship etc. At one point she basically freaks out on me and is all upset saying "I don't know where I lost control etc..." So she obviously is power hungry.

A little bit more background on this girl, before she met me, there was this AMOG that she dated once or twice. He disappeared and only came back when I showed up (e.g. her value went up when she was dating me and he got jealous). So he is constantly messaging her asking her to hang out. She tells me all this. I just laugh and don't pay much attention to it. Afterall, I'm the one f.cking her. He even drunk dialed her the other night and told her he was in love with her, etc. LMAO

Anyways - she starts taking attitudes with me. Overall b1tchiness. Turns out she has anxiety/depression/self-esteem issues. She was prescribed meds, she doesn't really take them because of the side effects. The first time she gets b1tchy, I let her know that I don't accept disrespect in a relationship and to stop it.

It continues.

Last weekend we went to a concert and she pulled the b1tch card again on the way home. It doesn't even matter what it was about - something regarding me driving home after having a drink. (She had been drinking too and she had just gotten in an accident so yea --- I was gonna drive)

We get back to my place and she goes up and lies in bed. I get up there and turn the light out, I'm fuming. She says - is something wrong? I say - yeah, you're being a complete b1tch and I told you I wouldn't accept that. You've gotta go until you can respect me. She says something about "I think we got into this too quickly." (which is probably true - she had gotten out of a LTR about 6 months ago).

I say - listen, there is a lot I like about you (she's intelligent, funny, quick, loves all the same music as I do, etc.) but I refuse to put up with bullsh1t. You need to leave, figure out why you're being such a b.tch and then if you can act like a civilized human being, call me.

She spends the night at my place.

The next morning in bed she's crying and saying how she feels completely different this morning (e.g. doesn't want to stop seeing me). This is why I think she must be bi-polar or something. I bang her again and then tell her it's time to leave. We're out by her car, I'm hugging her goodbye and she says "I'll text you later." I say "no, don't text me. don't contact me until you figure out your problems." She's like "OK, I'll get in touch with you later this week." I say, "You get in touch with me when you're better - a week, a month, whatever"

So, the next day (Monday) I put back all my profiles and whatnot. Basically, I'm moving on with my life and not going to wait around for her. I think about her, I'm not gonna lie - it makes me sad that the relationship had to end like this.

I get a message from her yesterday, which I'll copy and paste into here.

hmmm. is this your way of telling me (along with the world) that i'm not what you're "looking" for? high maintenance and dramatic....very interesting. need i mention that you have wasted no time....? i'm not trying to be mean but...it is what it is i guess!

I got that in the morning, I waited until after work and then I replied with

R,

You are free to interpret this as you will.

You know where I stand. I refuse to date someone that will not treat me with respect.

You may realize that you want to date me you may realize that you don't, but I won't sit around and wait - life is too short.

Patrick.

And that's where it's been left. I'm just curious what everyone on here thinks about how I've handled this situation and possibly how I should handle it from here on out. I still want to date this person, but won't put up with bullsh1t. I'm hoping this was just a bit.ch test and that this could set the stage for the remainder of the relationship with me in power.

 

[kyphan]

You should have put your foot down HARD the first time. You've let her slide to this point, creating a situation where she expects to be able to do these things and have you accept them, even if the words coming out of your mouth are "stop it or we're through." It's all about our ACTIONS. What have your actions told her?

- That she can get away with her attitude around you
- That what you say and what you do in those situations will not always be the same thing
- That you will not stand up for yourself when she starts acting up
- That when she suggested exclusivity TOO EARLY ON you're willing to accept it, when you should have made her work for it

She's hid these problems to get you into her life, you've failed to stamp them out or leave, and now you're left with a big mess. It's not worth staying with her, so I suggest moving on completely and not giving her another chance.

 

[G-Theory]

I agree. And believe me, when a woman has deep seeded issues, no ultimatum you give her will fix her problems. It sounds like she needs help and there isn't anything you can do except maybe recommend a good therapist.

 

[Mind_Body_Soul]

She's hid these problems to get you into her life, you've failed to stamp them out or leave, and now you're left with a big mess. It's not worth staying with her, so I suggest moving on completely and not giving her another chance.

You guys are right. It's horrible how I can rationally agree with you yet I feel attraction for this person. I've met a lot of girls and I have yet to meet one like her which gives her value. This is the AFC part coming out, because rationally I can say, yeah I'll meet someone better that has all her positive qualities without the negative ones, yet internally I doubt myself.

This gives me something to work on.


Kyphan - can you give me an idea of what you mean by my ACTIONS? Or maybe a few examples of how I should have made it clear through them that I would not accept bull****.

 

[Mind_Body_Soul]

Oh and to explain more about my "actions". The first time she pulled the bull**** was right after we got done f*cking and I walked out the door and drove home. Maybe not the right move? But she immediately text'd me and said "If you don't come back right now, don't ever come back." to which I replied, "If that's what you want OK, cya" and then she went into sorry mode and was all "I didn't mean that" and I said "Threats don't work on me. Grow up."

 

[Vulpine]

I'm with kyphan, here.

You mentioned that it went on a little bit before it escalated to a point where you were fed up. I've been like this myself, so I can't rip on you too hard.

From where I sit, I don't really see things as "AFC" moves. I think, however, you missed the chance to work the DJ magic on her. See, when she started with the b!tching, THEN you set up the punishment/reward, push/pull on a smaller scale, and increase punishment gradually (never really increasing the reward, perhaps making the reward LESS).

It looks like your push/pull in this case is an ultimatum. Push = get out until you learn to knock off the b!tching. Pull = do this, and you can be with me.

It's too big a step, too late. Your punishment is "get out", the reward is "you". Wouldn't you agree that this is a bit counterproductive? A simpler punishment/reward scenario (and more productive given the circumstances) would have been to speak your mind: "You were a b!tch all night, and I'm fed up with that sort of treatment." Then, not fux her that night and avoid her for a short time (few days or whatever compared to normal visitation frequency) When you hang out with her again, and she's a princess, fack her again and see her shortly afterwards. When she starts with the b!tching again, same deal, just longer "time out".

But, you have to tell her what/why when you are upset, otherwise chicks will not come to the conclusions on their own: they'll ask their friends, run a google search, watch some Oprah, pour over a few back issues of Cosmo, and they'll come up with something like "he's seeing other people" and it won't work as you hoped.

I need to take my own advice here, I've been struggling to nip sh!t in the bud before it gets out of control.

From here? Well, since you "overcorrected" I think you need a little damage control in order to keep her around.

You'll probably need to call her up, explain something simple like "I think you misunderstood what I was getting at." Then, not dwell on it, move right to: "What are you doing XXX, let's go blahblahblah" and set up a date. If she insists on dwelling on the punishment, offer her something like: "Hey, I usually have a great time with you, until... *long pause prompt*" At this point she may get the hint, apologize, and drop the subject, or you may have to continue: "It's frustrating to be enjoying myself, then have it get all 'negative', like that." Leave it vague, downplay the issue (since you really overreacted) and move on to making plans.

You should still win out on this, your calling her back will be a little "sweet with the sour". IF you keep the control on the phone call, you can still scavenge her. If she wants to turn the phone call into a b!tch fest, she didn't get the point, and you should tell her so. Done. Oops.

Overall, don't use ultimatums or threats of leaving to handle issues. Come up with other punishments, start small, then escalate the punishment. Don't just walk out the door without explaining why, don't kick her out the next day after facking her, don't use the expression "or else".

 

[Mind_Body_Soul]

Vulpine,

Thank you very much for the advice. I'm gonna put it to the test and see how it works. I'll give her a call, do some damage control, and set up a date. If she wants to b1tch then NEXT.

Also - I love this push-pull stuff. I think it's gonna work wonders.

 

[Vulpine]

This is CRUCIAL:

Don't apologize.

In fact, don't bring up the issue at all. Just set up plans like nothing happened. Then, if she brings up the drama, blow it off.

 

[Mind_Body_Soul]

I have a problem apologizing anyways - I always think I'm right.

But going down the road the BS has to be treated in the push-pull fashion that you outlined. Punishment and reward - it's great.

 

[cordoncordon]

Wow, are we dating the same girl? I mean what you just described is the exact same thing as me. From meeting and falling for each other quickly, great chemistry, starts showing signs of *****iness, the very sudden turn of moods, and turns out she suffers from depression.

I've dealt once before with a woman who suffered from depression, and it was a mess trying to make things work. See, they don't think like you and I. When they get into one of their depressive spells, their whole world is upside down, they can't think straight. Just this past weekend we were driving and trying to figure out what bar to go to for a drink and she would say one place, i would say ok, then she would switch to another, i would say ok (not wanting to fight), then shed get "pissed" because I didnt want to go to the first bar lol. She said this weekend she hates her life, just wants to lay in bed, and pretty much hates everything. This coming from a girl that last week was the happiest woman you would ever meet. She showed signs of it before, but never to this extreme. Now she says last night she wants a break because she hates everything so much in her life that she doesn't want to ruin us. Just last week we were looking at engagement rings and she couldn't have been more excited.

But like i said, ive dealt with this before, and there really isnt much you can do. They have to be willing to get help and make changes themselves. We don't deserve to be put through the uncessasary BS that this kind of illness can cause. Life is too short and hard enough without that.

Anyway, I told my girl to get whatever help you need, and let me know if things get better in her own personal life, to let me know if/when they do, and we can go from there.

I think you should probably do the same as you initially suggested.

 

[Mind_Body_Soul]

cordoncordon - You are right, I probably should do as I initially suggested, but I'm gonna give Vulpine's advice a whirl and make it a learning experience. I have nothing to lose at this point and since I seem to find these depressed girls, I might as well learn how to handle them.

I too have dated a girl prior to this with depression issues and she actually improved (with my help) and that relationship turned into one of the most amazing experiences of my life. We are still great friends to this day.

 

[G-Theory]

On a side note:

It's natural to begin to feel attached to a woman. This is the nature of the primal reproductive cycle. In the past a man had to get attached to want to stick around to take care of the woman and the baby for survival sake.

The trick today is recognizing this for what it is and then moving past it.

 

[Mind_Body_Soul]

So I just called up R. Tried to set up a date, she went into "Why are you asking me on a date?".

I told her I wasn't sure what she was talking about even though I obviously know she's pissed off about the events of this week.

She said that she's really hurt I would put my profiles back up so quickly and that she wasn't sure if she wanted to go out on a date.

She asks if it's OK if she can think about it?

I sit there for about 10 seconds and say yeah, think about it. I feel I have the power in this situation because if she says no, I move on and if she says yes, we'll see.

EDIT: Now that I think about it - the reason she asked if she could "think about it" was in an attempt to regain control. From the tone of the conversation, she wants to go so my guess is that if she said YES too quickly, it would basically say I can get away with doing what I did. So she has to make me "sweat it out". Ahhh how clever pu$$y cat. She's playing push pull.

 

[Mind_Body_Soul]

It's natural to begin to feel attached to a woman. This is the nature of the primal reproductive cycle. In the past a man had to get attached to want to stick around to take care of the woman and the baby for survival sake.

The trick today is recognizing this for what it is and then moving past it.

Very hard to move past at times. I guess it's a mind over body type thing.

 

[Vulpine]

She said that she's really hurt I would put my profiles back up so quickly and that she wasn't sure if she wanted to go out on a date.

She asks if it's OK if she can think about it? I sit there for about 10 seconds and say yeah, think about it.

Oops. That was the power struggle and you missed it. "She wasn't sure if..." is the lead up, "can I think about it?" is the attempted frame steal. "yeah, think about it" is you handing her control.

The proper response would have been: "Think about what? You want to or don't. It's not an essay question, which is it? *irritated tone*" or just "Boo-hoo. You want to or not? *in a 'I'm not gonna fuxing beg' tone*"

I guess you know for next time.

Psssssheew... you're digging deep, dawg. If it's worth it, when she calls back with a yes answer, say "I made other plans because I wasn't sure when you were getting back to me. How about XXX instead."

Oh, and do, actually, make other plans. Play it however you want though;
her IL is low and it's probably a blown deal. Don't overplay it though, you were right to not take her crap in the first place, and she's turning around and giving you more? Maybe fishing for an apology so you can be a slave to the puzzy?

 

[Mind_Body_Soul]

Vulpine - you're right. This ship is sinking and I'm abandoning ship. Thanks to everyone for the advice.

 

[Vulpine]

EDIT: Now that I think about it - the reason she asked if she could "think about it" was in an attempt to regain control. From the tone of the conversation, she wants to go so my guess is that if she said YES too quickly, it would basically say I can get away with doing what I did. So she has to make me "sweat it out". Ahhh how clever pu$$y cat. She's playing push pull.

Haha, good edit - just before I got my post up. You're getting it.:rockon:

 

[Vulpine]

Hey, hey, don't be so hasty! You just called her, she's thinking about it, wait for her yes answer, and this might, might just scavenge. Cool out, playboy. Relax. It's a learning experience, right? You are demonstrating that you're catching on - so go with it.

EDIT: and your "sweat it out" may just be as you called it, and her IL might not be as low as it could be. What I mean is, her IL very well could be through the roof (for your bone-crusher push/pull that you just worked). Since you are jacking with her emotion major, I'm thinking you're in like Flynn and she's as good as scavenged.



Chill - you are in control. :cheer:

 

[Mind_Body_Soul]

I will see what she comes back with and keep you guys updated.

 

[azanon]

Don't take too long; i'm kicked back with some warm popcorn and a coke!