What Women Really Want

[SW15]

Most women don't even know what women want.

Correct.

They will tell what they want which usually is pure nonsense ("I want someone who treats me the right way"). In reality, they just want a high-value man that is desired by many other women as others have said.

This is why Rollo talks about "money, muscles, and game".

 

[BaronOfHair]

And yet, women will take a lazy little biatch who happens to be physically attractive and superficially "fun" over an unattractive and/or boring REAL man any day of the week.

Marvin Milquetoasts aren't generally what folks imagine upon hearing the term "real man", anymore than Melissa McCarthy springs to mind, when the term "real woman" crops up

 

[BeExcellent]

To "drop" someone you first have to date him. You dated that guy even though, by your own admission, most male model are "neurotic", whatever that means. So you started dating a guy who you knew was not relationship material. You really should watch the video posted by The Duke. You are like Exhibit "A" to that video.

As to you "dropping" the male model, we haven't heard his side of the story. I'm not entirely prepared to accept your version of events at face value.

When I met the model guy he came off very confident and suave. Obviously he was extremely attractive. Like I said, looks get you in the door.

He also was very intelligent, another thing I look for. But as I got to know him over a roughly 2 month period I learned he was deeply insecure about his appearance, and he worked crazy hours (6am to midnight many times)....and I knew he was working because I was there with him (he was a used car broker hustling between dealer trade-ins and sales to used car dealers.) So I felt he was a work-a-holic who really didn't have time for a relationship.

Modeling work is often sporadic. So he did the car thing as a steady income. He also, I discovered as I got to know him, used drugs at times. This I did not like at all, and did not want to deal with.

So for those reasons (which I explained to him) were reasons I dropped him.

He liked me A LOT and knew I actually enjoyed his intelligence and personality as well as his looks, and he felt valued beyond just his looks by me....but I have standards and after getting to know him I felt he did not meet my standards (the drug use was a hard no.)

Later I was told by a mutual friend a.) how much he really liked me, and b.) that he was working those insane hours to get his house out of foreclosure, something he did not disclose to me because he was embarrassed about it (he saw me as very 'act together' and didn't think I would understand).

But by then I was already married to my first husband. We'd see him out & about once in a while, he was always warm & pleased to see us. I ran into him once at the airport with my mom & my kids. He was alone and made a point to tell me he had just dumped a gold digger girl (he had become very successful in the car business after staving off foreclosure) and that he wished he had what I had...

That was the last time I saw him. Years later I found out that he had died from a drug overdose.

So I made the correct decision to dump him when I did.

 

[Slowhandluke]

Women at the end of the day want a REAL man.

average women want REAL men... but what they deserve are average men. Now look at the status of an average man. It's not 6-6-6.

Average men want supermodels. But most men know this is not reasonable and they accept this fact.

 

[BeExcellent]

average women want REAL men... but what they deserve are average men. Now look at the status of an average man. It's not 6-6-6.

Average men want supermodels. But most men know this is not reasonable and they accept this fact.

Well if you are an above average woman like me, then yes it is 6-6-6. But I have attributes that allow me to reasonably expect that. That's not my point at all anyway.

Water seeks its own level. Always has, always will. I agree that an average woman should be pleased with an average man. But an average man can be a REAL man in the masculinity department and how he carries himself.

I personally know many....MANY couples where the man and wife are both average looking, but the husband is The. Man.

And the wives appreciate and respect that.

 

[BaronOfHair]

Well if you are an above average woman like me....

Several pics are worth more than a trillion boasts, BE

 

[SW15]

Well if you are an above average woman like me, then yes it is 6-6-6.

Average to below average women demand that now.

I agree that an average woman should be pleased with an average man.

That isn't happening as commonly with average tier women in the Millennial and Gen Z generations.

But an average man can be a REAL man in the masculinity department and how he carries himself.

Having more masculine traits and an overall persona would help a more average tier looks man.

I believe attraction, seduction, and retention are some combination of looks, money, status, and personality. That helps on the personality side of things.

 

[Slowhandluke]

Having more masculine traits and an overall persona would help a more average tier looks man.

I believe attraction, seduction, and retention are some combination of looks, money, status, and personality. That helps on the personality side of things.

The average man today is stronger, taller, and generally healthy. The last part maybe arguable. But if you compare the average man to the average woman, the average woman is a lot more unhealthy. Also, the average man today has more resources then men in the past.

If You Were the Average G.I. in World War II | The Saturday Evening Post

What was the average G.I. like in World War II? Some of these facts may surprise you.

www.saturdayeveningpost.com

With respect to physically attraction, both the average man and average woman have room for improvement. The average woman more than the average man. At the end of the day though, women are failing men... not the other way around. Women need to change. Average women are no longer the prize. If they want to be the prize, they have to be valuable. One way to do this is not be a man hater.. or demean men like if she is better than the average man. She is not. Women need to do better. Just because a woman can serial date chads, does not mean she's chad tier. Women in the past understood this.

 

[zekko]

The guy that provides the most fun emotional excitement to a woman will always win. Next, I will say it is status/money. Women like bad boys because they aren't boring and will always have them go through a tingle roller coaster ride. Rich & High-Status guys can artificially provide fun & excitement, but they cannot organically produce then they will lose to men who can provide that organic fun & excitement.

Meh, I've always thought the Bad Boy was overvalued by the community. They have their appeal, I'm not denying that, but they're not the only ones who can provide fun and excitement. Being in a constant state of instability is not the hallmark of a good relationship. But it's a fine persona to have if you're looking to pump and dump, which I guess is the main objective of most guys here.

 

[BeExcellent]

Several pics are worth more than a trillion boasts, BE

See avatar FFS. That's me. In my 50s. I used an unretouched "proof" that is not filtered or altered in any way because I am well aware that guys here do NOT believe I am as I say. That photo is only here because it is a real photo....PROOF if you will.

I'm sure you'll appreciate that as you enjoy irony.

So yeah. Been objectively "hot" all my life, which means mad options. The avatar before this one (maybe 2 ago - my avatar has always been a real photo of me) was put on Photofeeler by BigNeil & over a hundred dudes ranked the pic. The aggregate score was 9+ on a 10 point scale.

Not bad for the old lady I'd say.

That is my real hair (no extensions) and my real figure (I never needed surgical enhancesments)...and that's after 3 kids. I did have 3 C sections so everything is nice & tight down there, and I had an ob/gyn who was also an excellent surgeon so I did not end up with a weird abdominal outcome after surgical births like so many less fortunate women. I'd like to say I planned it that way but I didn't I got very lucky, and I do heal & recover well.

My son had the cord around his neck several times, so my first C section was an emergency to save his life. A vaginal birth would have strangled him.

But ya. That's me.

 

[CornbreadFed]

Meh, I've always thought the Bad Boy was overvalued by the community. They have their appeal, I'm not denying that, but they're not the only ones who can provide fun and excitement. Being in a constant state of instability is not the hallmark of a good relationship. But it's a fine persona to have if you're looking to pump and dump, which I guess is the main objective of most guys here.

Of course, bad boys are just the introductory 101 fun guys for women at earlier ages. At some point, they grow out of it and expand their palate to golden retrievers, Tupacs with a degree, weekend warriors, anomaly men, bros, man bun hip city bros, and etc.

 

[SW15]

Well if you are an above average woman like me, then yes it is 6-6-6. But I have attributes that allow me to reasonably expect that. That's not my point at all anyway.

That would mean above average, young, and childless.

Been objectively "hot" all my life, which means mad options. The avatar before this one (maybe 2 ago - my avatar has always been a real photo of me) was put on Photofeeler by BigNeil & over a hundred dudes ranked the pic. The aggregate score was 9+ on a 10 point scale.

In the picture that got posted on Photofeeler, how old were you in that picture?

An above average looking woman born in 1969 would have had her peak physical years in the era before home internet access / slow dial up internet.

It was possible for a woman whose peak ranged from 1987-1997 to have a lot of options by the standards of that day. In 1987-1997, a woman's options would have been more dependent upon her day-to-day living routine. Her college campus (if attending college), the frequency of her bar attendance (after age 21), the size of the city where she lived, and her real life social network would have been meaningful factors. Even with enhanced real life factors, the number of options would be less than many internet era females. It still would have been a good number of options.

In the last 15-20 years, women have been able to put up far more options due to swipe apps and social media.

The guy that provides the most fun emotional excitement to a woman will always win. Next, I will say it is status/money. Women like bad boys because they aren't boring and will always have them go through a tingle roller coaster ride. Rich & High-Status guys can artificially provide fun & excitement, but they cannot organically produce then they will lose to men who can provide that organic fun & excitement.

This is why women want men who are like Travis Kelce, Travis Barker, or a Weekend Warrior Tupac with a degree hybrid because they are a combination of fun, safety, and economic stability.

I've always thought the Bad Boy was overvalued by the community. They have their appeal, I'm not denying that, but they're not the only ones who can provide fun and excitement.

bad boys are just the introductory 101 fun guys for women at earlier ages. At some point, they grow out of it and expand their palate to golden retrievers, Tupacs with a degree, weekend warriors, anomaly men, bros, man bun hip city bros, and etc.

When I was younger, I used to hear more chatter about "bad boys". I don't seem to hear about it as much anymore, though I think they are still appealing and relevant.

Travis Barker likely would have been considered a bad boy when he was younger. He has a 1975 birthdate, so he'll be turning 50 soon. In the late 1990s-2000s, he was having sex with models, Playmates (when that carried status), and Paris Hilton near her physical peak.

I think the hybrid type that @CornbreadFed mentioned is appealing. The Tupac with a degree type can do well.

I have a triple digit notch friend that did well in part due to Golden Retriever Energy but he had a specific type of woman he did well with and he marketed well. This is a man who is 6'4", White, and a former NCAA athlete in a country club type sport. He used his college scholarship to get a degree (zero chance of pro athlete $$) and has had a solid white collar job in a good industry. Between his degree, white collar job, collegiate athlete past, height, and good physique/facial aesthetics, he was very appealing to bougie White women. Before his current LTR/marriage, he spent a lot of time in bars where bougie White women tended to congregate. He was able to get more same night sex than extended relationships with this type of effort.

This triple digit notch count friend wasn't a bad boy musician type or bad boy with tattoos and a motorcycle. I think he was more of an expanded palate type notch for a certain subset of women.

 

[Bokanovsky]

See avatar FFS. That's me. In my 50s. I used an unretouched "proof" that is not filtered or altered in any way because I am well aware that guys here do NOT believe I am as I say. That photo is only here because it is a real photo....PROOF if you will.

I'm sure you'll appreciate that as you enjoy irony.

So yeah. Been objectively "hot" all my life, which means mad options. The avatar before this one (maybe 2 ago - my avatar has always been a real photo of me) was put on Photofeeler by BigNeil & over a hundred dudes ranked the pic. The aggregate score was 9+ on a 10 point scale.

Not bad for the old lady I'd say.

That is my real hair (no extensions) and my real figure (I never needed surgical enhancesments)...and that's after 3 kids. I did have 3 C sections so everything is nice & tight down there, and I had an ob/gyn who was also an excellent surgeon so I did not end up with a weird abdominal outcome after surgical births like so many less fortunate women. I'd like to say I planned it that way but I didn't I got very lucky, and I do heal & recover well.

My son had the cord around his neck several times, so my first C section was an emergency to save his life. A vaginal birth would have strangled him.

But ya. That's me.

BE, I say this in the most respectful way possible: please seek professional help.

 

[zekko]

Of course, bad boys are just the introductory 101 fun guys for women at earlier ages. At some point, they grow out of it and expand their palate to golden retrievers, Tupacs with a degree, weekend warriors, anomaly men, bros, man bun hip city bros, and etc.

Golden retrievers lol. There's just something about me that finds it absolutely repulsive to put myself under a label. I always resist and refuse them.

 

[SW15]

Golden retrievers

Golden Retriever energy is a thing with Millennial and Gen Z women. They seem to respond to it.

I've never been known for Golden Retriever energy. Look at my avatar. It's not the Golden Retriever type. I'm likely too introverted for that. I can be energetic but that's not a default state.

 

[BeExcellent]

@Bokanovsky honestly I really don't understand the preoccupation with me here. I have always had a real pic as my avatar. People here assume I must be an overweight arthritic cat lady or something. I'm not.

THAT is the point of the photo. I'm trim & I'm not ugly, lol. Its not an attention thing, its an accuracy thing. BIG difference. I've never said I am the most beautiful girl around. Please. How idiotic.

Obviously I am off the market, have a desirable man, and was never trying to appeal personally to the teens. 20s or 30s here at any point in my tenure on SS. Rather I offer a perspective guys don't have.....

Which is how men are perceived by desirable women, and I offer that perspective as a woman who has always been desirable for LTRs/marriage.

That's not so weird is it?

There are some very successful, very handsome men who contribute here, but nobody is calling them out. I simply am as transparent as I can be within reason on a forum.

All I said in my first post in this thread is that women want REAL men. Manly men.

And then the personal crap about me starts. Again.

I'm a woman. I know what I want and I also know lots of women who want something similar.

Most women, the vast majority I'd say, really want a marriage/family and with a man they love, respect and enjoy. This is why plates break (most women are not happy being a plate indefinitely), this is why women have these lists of criteria. This why men are the brokers of relationships.

Men want sex; women want relationships (generally as highest priority). The challenge for both genders is bridging this difference in priorities.

These are complimentary goals really. Much as men and women are naturally complimentary.

The trouble for women is that many women are unrealistic in their expectations and this is because they don't digest that men have criteria too.

And the best women get locked down in marriage early in life never to be on the market again. Men do end up with the leftovers if you will, although you'll see quality women post death or divorce at times. Those women get locked down quickly too because they are refreshing compared to the market at large

If women do not truly understand their market value in SMV, then they set themselves up for hurt, disappointment and then disillusionment and bitterness. Same as men who become bitter & disillusioned about women.

Women may not look in the mirror and adjust their attitudes and behaviors any more than men do.

So you get this group of so called blackpill men, and you get this group of bitter women.

@SW15 I don't recall which photo BigNeil put up. I think it was the second one from roughly age 48 but I'm not sure. The first one was a black & white pic from my mid 20s. When I was at my 35 year HS reunion people were stunned because they told me I look the same as I did in HS. (I don't because I have 50+ year old skin now, lol but photos are very, very similar in appearance from then & now). I use a photo from my 50s now as an avatar because its current & accurate.

I have always been prettier in person than in photos for whatever reason. <Shrugs>

But you gotta also understand I choose photos that preserve some privacy for obvious reasons. Its a fine line between transparency & remaining anonymous.

 

[Sega Genesis]

I really don't understand the preoccupation with me here.

^^Be, this is not a criticism I promise you.

IMO you are one of the most insightful intelligent posters I've ever known on any forum!

However when you discuss your life and yourself to the extent you do, it's to be expected that some people are not gonna take well to it.

You've said before it's not bragging if it's true. I don't agree with that and it's not how braggadocio is defined.

However, it doesn't matter to me as you have so many other valuable attributes and are a great contributor, I've actually learned a lot from you!

Try to ignore if you can. That's what I've learned to do. Truly secure and confident people have no need to boast or convince others of anything.

Being solid with who you are (within yourself) is all that matters at the end of the day.

JMO

 

[BaronOfHair]

Meh, I've always thought the Bad Boy was overvalued by the community. They have their appeal, I'm not denying that, but they're not the only ones who can provide fun and excitement

We get into questions as to how we even define "bad boys"... Are we talking about street corner urchins rocking gold chains and wife beaters, or modern day equivalents to pre-accident Teddy Pendergrass? The former is repulsive, the latter is worthy of emulation

 

[Slowhandluke]

.

@Bokanovsky honestly I really don't understand the preoccupation with me here. I have always had a real pic as my avatar. People here assume I must be an overweight arthritic cat lady or something. I'm not.

THAT is the point of the photo. I'm trim & I'm not ugly, lol. Its not an attention thing, its an accuracy thing. BIG difference. I've never said I am the most beautiful girl around. Please. How idiotic.

Obviously I am off the market, have a desirable man, and was never trying to appeal personally to the teens. 20s or 30s here at any point in my tenure on SS. Rather I offer a perspective guys don't have.....

Which is how men are perceived by desirable women, and I offer that perspective as a woman who has always been desirable for LTRs/marriage.

That's not so weird is it?

There are some very successful, very handsome men who contribute here, but nobody is calling them out. I simply am as transparent as I can be within reason on a forum.

All I said in my first post in this thread is that women want REAL men. Manly men.

And then the personal crap about me starts. Again.

I'm a woman. I know what I want and I also know lots of women who want something similar.

Most women, the vast majority I'd say, really want a marriage/family and with a man they love, respect and enjoy. This is why plates break (most women are not happy being a plate indefinitely), this is why women have these lists of criteria. This why men are the brokers of relationships.

Men want sex; women want relationships (generally as highest priority). The challenge for both genders is bridging this difference in priorities.

These are complimentary goals really. Much as men and women are naturally complimentary.

The trouble for women is that many women are unrealistic in their expectations and this is because they don't digest that men have criteria too.

And the best women get locked down in marriage early in life never to be on the market again. Men do end up with the leftovers if you will, although you'll see quality women post death or divorce at times. Those women get locked down quickly too because they are refreshing compared to the market at large

If women do not truly understand their market value in SMV, then they set themselves up for hurt, disappointment and then disillusionment and bitterness. Same as men who become bitter & disillusioned about women.

Women may not look in the mirror and adjust their attitudes and behaviors any more than men do.

So you get this group of so called blackpill men, and you get this group of bitter women.

@SW15 I don't recall which photo BigNeil put up. I think it was the second one from roughly age 48 but I'm not sure. The first one was a black & white pic from my mid 20s. When I was at my 35 year HS reunion people were stunned because they told me I look the same as I did in HS. (I don't because I have 50+ year old skin now, lol but photos are very, very similar in appearance from then & now). I use a photo from my 50s now as an avatar because its current & accurate.

I have always been prettier in person than in photos for whatever reason. <Shrugs>

But you gotta also understand I choose photos that preserve some privacy for obvious reasons. Its a fine line between transparency & remaining anonymous.

you focus way too much on looks, at our age we are playing different roles now. you can no longer be playing the hot young girl role. As I can no longer be playing the young, brash full of potential young man. Things have pass.

your role is now probably of a materiarchy (lucky for you, a lot of women now are only given the role of the "cool aunt", or the cat woman, etc.)

different stages of our lives will afford us different roles. These roles will obviously be dictated by our circumstances. But the roles involving beauty and the roles of brashness is no longer in our domain. To dwell on them is to waste our times.

I'm happy you were hot when you were younger... but time has pass. As I can now longer move as fast or react as fast as compared to when I was younger, I don't dwell on those aspects of my life. I still play sports alot, but I don't reminisce about how much more athletic I was.

my role has evolved into more of a senior advisor and mastermind. Almost a patriarch it is what it is.. Life is about change and moving forward.

 

[zekko]

We get into questions as to how we even define "bad boys"... Are we talking about street corner urchins rocking gold chains and wife beaters, or modern day equivalents to pre-accident Teddy Pendergrass? The former is repulsive, the latter is worthy of emulation

Good point. Generally they're cads though. I tend to define them more harshly than most, I suppose, because I don't like labels. And I just despise the term. "Bad" is a negative term. And why "Boy" instead of "Man"? Sounds like a juvenile piece of garbage with no maturity.