Value in Intending to Approach, but Not Actually Approaching?

[zekko]

But "eye contact experiments" (in old school DJ stuff) are puzzling to me. They included things like making eye contact with men in a city while walking and holding the eye contact until HE looks away. Umm not recommended lol.

That's a way to exert dominance, to be the alpha. I'm surprised that there weren't a whole lot of wanna be PUAs back then who were getting their @sses beat regularly, or worse.

 

[momentomori]

Instead of looking at it as an approach, look at it as starting a conversation. Have some actual purpose to your action. If there is no purpose then you will give off a distorted expression. Having a transparent vibe is more attractive.

Now what should the conversation be about? It should be personal. Women have short attention spans and get bored quickly when you talk about things. Make it personal as quickly and possible. Ask personal questions and relate with your own stories.

Talk from the “I” perspective. Ask big questions. Weak guys ask small questions that require a yes or no answer. Make her contribute to the conversation. Otherwise you do not connect. This shows that you value yourself.

And once she starts making worthy efforts of contribution, you can escalate the vibe from personal to sexual/romantic. So basically you go from stranger vibe to personal vibe quickly, and only escalate to a sexual/romantic vibe when she shows that she wants to have an interaction with you.

The entire process is on purpose. You are not wasting your time or hers. Usually I just do something simple like “not just are you sexy, but you’re pretty fun to talk to. Let’s hang out sometime.” And then pull out my phone. I simply do not remember the last time this escalation didn’t work because I only use it whenever the woman is making an effort to flirt with me. It’s rejection proof because I’m putting the onus on her to prove that she likes me. And in a sense, I’m giving her what she want. It’s almost impossible to get rejected when you u frame an escalation as a reward rather than trying to get something from her.

You can never get anything from women. You can only attract them and give yourself to them. That’s how I frame the game. I’m giving value to women, I’m not trying to seek value. Value seeking behavior is repulsive.

And of course, you cannot reward somebody for not doing anything. She has to make a worthy effort to flirt with you, give you windows to jump through, etc. Don’t look at it as you are trying to seduce her. Rather, look at it from the frame of she’s the one who should be seducing you. Women seduce guys they like all the damn time. But this forum makes it seem like the guy has to do all the work else women can’t be bothered. This is called desperation and having low standards, which is not sexy. It’s coming from the frame of low value.

Interesting, I like it! That definitely takes a lot of the pressure out of the interaction. I realize now that in my head I wanted to start off the conversation with a sexual tone, but that probably would overwhelm the girl and completely hit her out of left field. She probably wouldn't really know how to react. At least in a daytime non-nightgame type environment. Starting off with a normal conversation and then getting personal, and then after that sexualizing if she proves that she shows investment in the conversation is a very sensible progression and reduces the chances of something socially catastrophic/awkward from occurring.

 

[jimwho]

If you want to take pressure off, remember woman like compliments. I'm saying asking them out is a compliment.
Worst possible scenario is you flattered her. Don't be surprised when she accepts.

 

[momentomori]

Yeah the goal isn’t to create attraction. I don’t believe there is such a thing. You shouldn’t put any pressure on yourself to be anything but your natural personality and finding out if there is mutual interest.

The times when Ived tried to create attraction, there always comes to a point where the front I’m trying to put up (whether it’s being c0cky and funny or whatever) would crack and the woman would notice my incongruency.

So nowadays I believe in expression over impression. Don’t try to make an impression on people. Trying to do so would achieve its opposite intended effect. You would come across as validation seeking instead of impressive.

Instead, you should just express your genuine authentic self. And accept that not everyone will like you. This is a stronger way to move through the world.

Only freedom of self expression can bring anything real and lasting. You will naturally find people on your wavelength. By putting up a front and playing games, you’ll just end up attracting the wrong people and by the time you’re exhausted and finally decide to be the real you, people will think you’ve changed.

This is the problem with most romance and just about every bad relationship. Two people putting up a front to impress the other, and by The time each person “relaxes” and decide its time to be themselves, each party will feel like the other has changed. But ironically, it’s the first time each person has been real towards one another. And incidentally, each person realizes there is absolutely no chemistry in the romance. It was all built on quicksand.

So don’t do that. Whatever “attraction” you’re able to achieve in the short term with your fancy “game” isn’t worth it. You’ll burn yourself out tying to act like a performance monkey for women all the time.

Just have a normal personal interaction. Relate, be yourself. And if she makes an effort to flirt back, then you escalate. But the onus is on her to give you windows where you can escalate. It’s not on you to pull windows out of your a$$. That’s exhausting and ultimately a fruitless endeavor.

As Jimwho mentioned above, would you recommend opening with a compliment? For example saying "Hi, I think you're attractive" is definitely expressive, but I feel awkward being that forward and honest. I know London Daygame Model recommends this type of opener, but I find it a bit overwhelming to open that direct. Do you have any thoughts on openers that are situationally appropriate in daygame situations?

 

[jimwho]

As Jimwho mentioned above, would you recommend opening with a compliment?

Jimwho does not recommend opening with a compliment. Asking her out is flattering , that's the compliment .

 

[darksprezzatura]

Welcome to the Sprezzatura Method.

Hi!

Like many of you I've been a "student" of cold approaches, and in my early years I read a lot of stuff.

I'm not saying it's a load of BS, there were lots of useful nuggets.

Yet it didn't work that well for me because I kept thinking of it as a linear path.

If you're still reading this, awesome, let me introduce you to a method that worked for me.

BEGINNER: if you have panic attacks at the thought of talking to any girl, that anxiety won't simply die down by reading books.

Your aim would be to desensitize yourself to social interaction.

Talk to EVERYONE, ask a question, make a funny remark about your environment.

Make small talk, girls, guys EVERYONE. Learn to hold eye contact. Smile.

Place yourself amongst people and learn to understand social momentum you gain as you work a room


INTERMEDIATE: you can go upto a random girl and strike a conversation. More often than not you get rejected due to being overeager, not passing sh!t test. Maybe get a number here and there.

Your aim should be to understand the frame that the woman is the one who's supposed to impress you.

Why should she, you ask.

Because she has been dying to meet a man who believes this frame. Most guys don't internalize this.

You take care of yourself, you have a fit body, you got a myriad of skills, you got hobbies, a great job and a world to show her.

Practice flipping this frame, learn to qualify her.

EXPERT: You know how to get a new woman every month. You are humble enough to know you can't lay every woman you want. You have atleast a rotation of 4 at the moment.

Sow SEEDS everywhere. That means all women are practice. Talk to women everywhere, no need for approaching a woman to just sleep with her. Become the guy who can throw a big party and invite a tonne of women.

Your aim shoud be preselection. Women see you around women and the cycle keeps your rotation full. Soon enough you'll be smashing two or three women in 24 hours. I am no expert but I've done that just with preselection.

 

[jimwho]

Good stuff darks.. Sow seeds everywhere, that's close to my planting seeds style. Say hello and walk away. Next time, it's hay I remember you "hope you're well" If you ever see her again she knows you're normal, then its burger/or/****tails.

Edit=drinks

 

[DEEZEDBRAH]

Agreed. Yes I do most of the auxiliary things to make myself more attractive. Lift, eat healthy, skincare, etc. Working on some certifications to enhance my professional life, although I do get a little lazy from time to time, hah.

However, I still feel a step-by-step approach is the move here. I have already looked into Mystery Method and some of the other classic PUA stuff, but it just hasn't provided results. A bootcamp could help, but its a lot of money, and I could very easily revert back to my old ways once I'm finish it. I've also wasted money with online courses that did **** all for me, although have improved my online dating results. I think this is a long but gradual process to create change. I'm undoing decades of conditioning.



Just took a look at the site. I like it. Most of what he is saying is in line with what I've been saying here. He proposes a step-by-step approach to getting results. Basically he is using a cognitive behavior therapy methodology, which is scientifically proven to help overcome anxieties. I probably will be reading his book soon.

The problem is not pickup. Your title says it all. You half step. Its like shaking a man's hand (pre chyna vurus) with a limp wrist. How wet are women going from a non approach?

In the modern era, you have many Internet tough guys, dudes beating their chest about RP, AND GAME. Doesn't approach or is married.

Yes. A boot camp is expensive but, even more expensive is being low T, not approaching and pissing away years half stepping. If you look at the modern man, he is cowardly swiping on apps and making excuses for not getting girls.


A simple metric to take is 3 approaches a day. You can do that on a 30min lunch break. A night out, you can do a lot. Seek competence. Not mpua stats. Acquire competence. You can stack from then on. Sure, use apps. But know that they are tailored to girl power and the algorithms are aimed at such things. Looks max, continue to be lifting, and on the grind.

Read Deida way of the superior man. The book is fire. Get on your purpose. Get money right. Boot Camp is whatever. Learn to code. Chem engineering. Go trades or star a business. Game and women are sport. Secondary importance.

 

[darksprezzatura]

The problem is not pickup. Your title says it all. You half step. Its like shaking a man's hand (pre chyna vurus) with a limp wrist. How wet are women going from a non approach?

In the modern era, you have many Internet tough guys, dudes beating their chest about RP, AND GAME. Doesn't approach or is married.

Yes. A boot camp is expensive but, even more expensive is being low T, not approaching and pissing away years half stepping. If you look at the modern man, he is cowardly swiping on apps and making excuses for not getting girls.


A simple metric to take is 3 approaches a day. You can do that on a 30min lunch break. A night out, you can do a lot. Seek competence. Not mpua stats. Acquire competence. You can stack from then on. Sure, use apps. But know that they are tailored to girl power and the algorithms are aimed at such things. Looks max, continue to be lifting, and on the grind.

Read Deida way of the superior man. The book is fire. Get on your purpose. Get money right. Boot Camp is whatever. Learn to code. Chem engineering. Go trades or star a business. Game and women are sport. Secondary importance.

Bump

 

[bat soup]

For most of my life when I would see a hottie I would simply ignore her, and act as if I had no desire to interact with her. I would repress any notion of approaching and would actively avoid coming into close contact with her. Lately I've simply been entertaining the notion of approaching, and feeling the feelings of AA mixed with powerful feelings of sexual desire when coming into close proximity of a hottie. I feel that these intense feelings could be used to my advantage if I were to approach, but I simply feel overwhelmed by them and I feel cement blocks in my shoes.

In the initial stages of approach, do you guys think there's value to feeling the feelings of AA, while intending to approach a target, but not actually acting on that intention? While doing some of the preliminary actions of approaching, such as making eye contact, intending to approach, etc.? When dealing with decades of an ingrained behavior surely it takes a step-by-step process to overcome it, am I correct? Of course I could dive in headfirst and just take action, but I feel that the experience would be somewhat overwhelming and traumatizing, but with persistence I could simply power through it.

I feel that by doing this I'm actually making progress by acknowledging the feelings and desires that I've repressed for so long, but obviously at some point I want to follow-through and actually make an approach. Do you guys have thoughts on this?

I think you are making progress, because you're actually getting closer to taking action even if you haven't done so yet.

Try this: next time you see a girl you'd like to approch, think to yourself "if I were to approach her, what would I say". Then do it.

 

[DEEZEDBRAH]

Bump

Dark mate, wuddup?

@ Op, the one benefit from the modern era is the abundance of infield, analytics, and data from men exchanging notes. The SMP is a **** hole. The black pill and mgtow fellas see just how rotten and decaying the pool of women are. While the lack of solution is not useful for us. RP points out the problem but still lack any solution. Rollos lack of prescription is a classic example of taking zero ownership yet calling out the following or rsd. The SMP Ais garbage. The Game by Neil Strauss mentions misogyny in the pickup culture but it is a by product of abundance of women, a series of experiences, and the lasting impression that women only change when they cannot compete anymore. They change their tune when the milks gone bad. Karen is a classic example of the post wall CC girl who cannot compete anymore and is pissed off about it.

Tyler once went out on a rant about endless bs in the game. He recommended meditation. I cannot stress enough about the importance of the use of meditation. I trip too. I enjoy meditation. I have been in meditation groups too which btw are FULL of women.

As Jimwho mentioned above, would you recommend opening with a compliment? For example saying "Hi, I think you're attractive" is definitely expressive, but I feel awkward being that forward and honest. I know London Daygame Model recommends this type of opener, but I find it a bit overwhelming to open that direct. Do you have any thoughts on openers that are situationally appropriate in daygame situations?

I never use openers or any recycled pickup routines. I do have canned material from years of pickup. You develop the following from a series of pickup. The first thing you can internalise is that,

Spoiler

EVERY SET IS PRACTICE!

Act accordingly.

Chalk up the approach to a W. Stack. After you get part AA, acquire digits, IG, AND SNL. you can do advanced approach at church like in another thread, gym, coffee shops, grocery stores, and anywhere. Advanced or complicated pickup like a chick with her mom and dad. Hard stop.

Here's perspective. Model pua argued a 10% success rate. Wtf that means. 10% get digits, ig? Or pull? SNL? D IN v? Combine the complexity of a global pandemic and travel bans as well as quarantine following. The masks are annoying. The rate of success is far less likely or so you would imagine. Cut the ****. Approach. Google 30 day challenge. Its basic bit but a gradual framework is probably useful for you.

Exercise common sense. Check out a variety of different sources. Field test. Proceed. Find your flow. Personally, enthusiasm is key. Be unapologetic. Some are kittens and some are ****s. Pickup is sales. Volume is money. Get a life. Have something better than chasing women. Yet, still approach. Wtf is the alternative?

My D won't suck it self. Hotter girls are turning 18 19 20 21 every day.

 

[BackInTheGame78]

The problem is not pickup. Your title says it all. You half step. Its like shaking a man's hand (pre chyna vurus) with a limp wrist. How wet are women going from a non approach?

In the modern era, you have many Internet tough guys, dudes beating their chest about RP, AND GAME. Doesn't approach or is married.

Yes. A boot camp is expensive but, even more expensive is being low T, not approaching and pissing away years half stepping. If you look at the modern man, he is cowardly swiping on apps and making excuses for not getting girls.


A simple metric to take is 3 approaches a day. You can do that on a 30min lunch break. A night out, you can do a lot. Seek competence. Not mpua stats. Acquire competence. You can stack from then on. Sure, use apps. But know that they are tailored to girl power and the algorithms are aimed at such things. Looks max, continue to be lifting, and on the grind.

Read Deida way of the superior man. The book is fire. Get on your purpose. Get money right. Boot Camp is whatever. Learn to code. Chem engineering. Go trades or star a business. Game and women are sport. Secondary importance.

Lmao...please no more "I write some code in my sparetime, I can be a software engineer" people needed...I deal with them enough. They are the equivalent to dudes playing pickup basketball thinking they can be in the NBA.

 

[DEEZEDBRAH]

Lmao...please no more "I write some code in my sparetime, I can be a software engineer" people needed...I deal with them enough. They are the equivalent to dudes playing pickup basketball thinking they can be in the NBA.

Whats your point?

 

[BackInTheGame78]

Whats your point?

That it's comical people who decide they want to learn to code suddenly think they are professionals at it in ways that no other profession has people doing.

 

[SW15]

I don't really see any value in this unless you learn to identify approach scenarios where the deck is stacked against you and odds of success are very low. An example of this would be electing not to approach a group of 4 18 year olds in a mall food court.

 

[nismo-4]

In the "he came on a little strong" world

Something they tell you, but if you were Lebron James or Dwayne Johnson or Jason Momoa, they never hear they came on a little strong.

Women make excuses for betas to keep them orbiting, alpha lands on the planet.

This stuff about ignoring and let a woman come to you has gone too far. I understand guys don't want to look needy. Look at it like this, if a Sports illustrated model is around, think she'll approach us if we just stand there? Fat chance. Let's all go to a club and play Candy Crush on our phones while ignoring all the women and the Dallas Cowboys Cheerleaders will suck all our dix a month or 2 later before our Madden tournament.

Say to yourself you're an alpha and not approach. Yeah she doesn't get your validation (or care about it) but she still has the power because sex hasn't happened. Let us know how your double date with your Xbox and right hand went.

You don't win on defense alone. You need to actually approach. Make a move even if it means taking a hit. You might get pegged as beta, you might get pegged as useless because you won't be a beta. But the one who makes a move has a better chance of winning than the one sitting on the sidelines.

Case closed.

 

[DEEZEDBRAH]

That it's comical people who decide they want to learn to code suddenly think they are professionals at it in ways that no other profession has people doing.

Wtf are you talking about?

The points of the thread is pickup and approaching. I told Op to approach but more importantly, get a life, and skill set to bring to the market. Obv approach and pull.

What part of this do you dispute or were you just projecting?

 

[DEEZEDBRAH]

Something they tell you, but if you were Lebron James or Dwayne Johnson or Jason Momoa, they never hear they came on a little strong.

Women make excuses for betas to keep them orbiting, alpha lands on the planet.

This stuff about ignoring and let a woman come to you has gone too far. I understand guys don't want to look needy. Look at it like this, if a Sports illustrated model is around, think she'll approach us if we just stand there? Fat chance. Let's all go to a club and play Candy Crush on our phones while ignoring all the women and the Dallas Cowboys Cheerleaders will suck all our dix a month or 2 later before our Madden tournament.

Say to yourself you're an alpha and not approach. Yeah she doesn't get your validation (or care about it) but she still has the power because sex hasn't happened. Let us know how your double date with your Xbox and right hand went.

You don't win on defense alone. You need to actually approach. Make a move even if it means taking a hit. You might get pegged as beta, you might get pegged as useless because you won't be a beta. But the one who makes a move has a better chance of winning than the one sitting on the sidelines.

Case closed.

100%. The pursuit of course is more about cultivation of the skill set. Its phaggotry t9 think dudes need a BC and yet, here we are. 60 years of feminism. Majority of men raised on single mom house holds. Over a decade of feminism by government education. Most of the early life of a boy is a lot of times absent from strong male role models. Combine the following with Disney, girl power, feminism, affirmative action etc it does not end well. Rsd tyler quote something about the 2 things guys are delusional about. 1. Fight 2. Pickup girls. Most cannot do either at gunpoint. Nevermind actually be good or dare I say competent.

I think that you hit it nail on with respect to VALIDATION. A dude should approach from Go but I also believe ARC cemented the monumental standard of NO FREE ATTENTION. There's a fine line between approaching and chasing/simping. I suppose calibration is key.

I like the tyler 6 step.. Approach ALL, MINIMIZING TIME BETWEEN SETS....! I approach. I lead. She follows or #nextSet! Even if she follows, I am approaching more Just Cause.

I have pulled home SNL. beat it rotten and left. From the lift to my car, I've opened more sets. The reference experience abd cultivation of BEING THAT GUY is what fellas should pursue.

Nicely said man. You cannot win if you don't play the game.

 

[DEEZEDBRAH]

I don't really see any value in this unless you learn to identify approach scenarios where the deck is stacked against you and odds of success are very low. An example of this would be electing not to approach a group of 4 18 year olds in a mall food court.

In terms of ROI, Its got **** yet, there's something to be had in a life experience especially for a noob. Tons of fellas who have never taken a man's blow out. Most guys are reliant on tinder and soft rejections. Anything to mitigate taking a L. Granted, there's far better things to do than a series of these style approaches. Better ROI from individual approaches as the group dispersed. **** it was a food court. Even if only for the experience, the conversion rate is piss poor. Direct too. Poorly calibrated.

At least buddy has a story to tell. Beats AA. Hopefully thr lad stacks fron hereon.

 

[BackInTheGame78]

Wtf are you talking about?

The points of the thread is pickup and approaching. I told Op to approach but more importantly, get a life, and skill set to bring to the market. Obv approach and pull.

What part of this do you dispute or were you just projecting?

No...no...I work im the industry as a software engineer and everytime I talk to someone they tell me about how they are a coder and this that and the other...it is kind of an inside joke.