The Art of War got me thinking…

[Noahwilson]

Recently, I picked up The Art of War, and honestly, I didn’t expect some of the ideas to stick with me as much as they did.

One line that caught my attention was: “All warfare is based on deception.” Another idea I liked was that a good fighter can make sure he isn’t easily defeated, but he can’t always guarantee that he’ll defeat the enemy.

It made me realize the book is really about strategy, planning ahead, and knowing when to make your move- not just about fighting.

Somewhere I also came across this line: “Nuestra alma está preparada tanto para la guerra como para la paz.” Basically, our soul is prepared for both war and peace.

Now I’m looking for something similar to read. Does anyone know a good book along these lines?

 

[BaronOfHair]

Strategy

By Lawernce Freedman

 

[Slowhandluke]

Recently, I picked up The Art of War, and honestly, I didn’t expect some of the ideas to stick with me as much as they did.

One line that caught my attention was: “All warfare is based on deception.” Another idea I liked was that a good fighter can make sure he isn’t easily defeated, but he can’t always guarantee that he’ll defeat the enemy.

It made me realize the book is really about strategy, planning ahead, and knowing when to make your move- not just about fighting.

Somewhere I also came across this line: “Nuestra alma está preparada tanto para la guerra como para la paz.” Basically, our soul is prepared for both war and peace.

Now I’m looking for something similar to read. Does anyone know a good book along these lines?

OODA loop by fighter pilot John Boyd. Its taught in the marine corp. Its basically one of the grand daddies of strategic thinking in the modern age. He tried to incorporate the art of war; Carl von Clausewitz, seminal military treatise On War, etc. (read his biography esp section on the OODA loop).


But at the end of the day, ALL the strategies depend on being smart and unbiased. Being able to see reality as it is, and being able to develop as many scenarios as possible (including limiting as many unknowns as possible); and knowing more about the battlefield then the other guy.. Simple, but hard to implement.

To a certain point, one either has the IQ for strategic thinking or one does not. Know thy self. If one is not gifted in strategic thinking, then align with someone who is... One can read a book by Michael Jordan on how to play basketball... but to play basketball just as good, to many people, that is just impossible....

 

[BackInTheGame78]

Recently, I picked up The Art of War, and honestly, I didn’t expect some of the ideas to stick with me as much as they did.

One line that caught my attention was: “All warfare is based on deception.” Another idea I liked was that a good fighter can make sure he isn’t easily defeated, but he can’t always guarantee that he’ll defeat the enemy.

It made me realize the book is really about strategy, planning ahead, and knowing when to make your move- not just about fighting.

Somewhere I also came across this line: “Nuestra alma está preparada tanto para la guerra como para la paz.” Basically, our soul is prepared for both war and peace.

Now I’m looking for something similar to read. Does anyone know a good book along these lines?

All you need to remember for that is the Battle of Troy and the Trojan Horse story.

Probably the ultimate story of deception in a war.

 

[Clockwerk50]

I haven't read it but:

 

[BeExcellent]

Advice from the old lady:

The Prince by Nicolo Machiaveli

Sits on my bedside table with Art of War.

The 48 Laws of Power by Robert Greene is also at my fingertips, and Greene's books are in chapters that are easy to read & reread in small bites, which I find helpful because they are meaty & well sourced.

 

[Slowhandluke]

Advice from the old lady:

The Prince by Nicolo Machiaveli

Sits on my bedside table with Art of War.

The 48 Laws of Power by Robert Greene is also at my fingertips, and Greene's books are in chapters that are easy to read & reread in small bites, which I find helpful because they are meaty & well sourced.

just my two cents. I think Nicolo Machiaveli died powerless and poor. Robert Greene (imho) is a grifter... sometimes he says one thing then the opposite. His "good" advice is so general as to be tripe.

He does regurgitate "good research".. but he does not add anything to it. I feel like he is popular because his book make people feel like they are learning a "secret" to whatever subject that is trending or popluar. For example, name a "secret" that he says in his books that is not generally know? Power is an aphrodisiac for women. Well, golly gee.. thats kinda well known. I've read some of his other books, but I already have forgotten most of it because the concepts were already well known. Perhaps, its just me? i do read a lot... but a lot of the studies and conclusions he make has been in the ether for decades...

whatever, ymmv...

 

[BeExcellent]

I also read Marcus Aurelius, Adam Smith, and Winston Churchill amongst others.

Care to denigrate those authors while you are at it? lol.

 

[Sega Genesis]

What sits on my bedside table is "The Seven Spiritual Laws of Success" by Deepak Chopra.

This little book is so powerful it changed my life!

The Seven Spiritual Laws of Success by Deepak Chopra is a short guide that teaches true success comes from living in harmony with natural universal laws rather than through hard work or ambition.

The irony is by following Universal law you will achieve success! Including wealth through "wealth consciousness." And inner peace and happiness as well.

Basically the opposite of War although I never read the Art of War so can't comment on it.

 

[Bokanovsky]

Recently, I picked up The Art of War, and honestly, I didn’t expect some of the ideas to stick with me as much as they did.

One line that caught my attention was: “All warfare is based on deception.” Another idea I liked was that a good fighter can make sure he isn’t easily defeated, but he can’t always guarantee that he’ll defeat the enemy.

It made me realize the book is really about strategy, planning ahead, and knowing when to make your move- not just about fighting.

Somewhere I also came across this line: “Nuestra alma está preparada tanto para la guerra como para la paz.” Basically, our soul is prepared for both war and peace.

Now I’m looking for something similar to read. Does anyone know a good book along these lines?

I know that the Art of War is a popular book. I think a big part of why it's popular is its reliance on contrarian logic. "The best victory is the one that makes the battle unnecessary." People read that and think wow that's brilliant, even though it's really just common sense.

One thing that you have to remember about Sun Tzu is that he was Chinese. And the Chinese have historically been on the losing end of most wars with foreign adversaries, despite being a technologically and culturally advanced society and having a massive population. For centuries, they've had their asses handed to them by the Mongols, the Manchus, the Europeans and the Japanese, among others. So there's that.

 

[Bokanovsky]

just my two cents. I think Nicolo Machiaveli died powerless and poor. Robert Greene (imho) is a grifter... sometimes he says one thing then the opposite. His "good" advice is so general as to be tripe.

The old adage, those who teach can't do, comes to mind. I think the reverse is also true. Think of the greatest generals like Alexander the Great, Hannibal, Subatai, Tamerlane and Napoleon. None of them wrote books on strategy/tactics. Just like men who are actually good with women don't write books on seduction.

 

[Slowhandluke]

I also read Marcus Aurelius, Adam Smith, and Winston Churchill amongst others.

Care to denigrate those authors while you are at it? lol.

I either read or listened to the following books/ audio book that are related in some way to strategies in life -- how to live; how to conduct oneself, how to compete, etc.. etc.:

Novum Organum by Francis Bacon;
Extraordinary Popular Delusions and the Madness of Crowds by Charles Mackay
The Gulag Archipelago Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn's (probably 60% completed because the book became just an "accounting" of the people who died; for example, X Y person died here.. 200 from Z village died there..I think those people were popular during their time)
Numerous book from Peter Drucker (60% coverage of his works? probably)
Numerous autobiographies (Shoe dog by phil knight,The Known and Unknown by Donald Rumsfeld, Am I being too Subtle by Sam Zell, Mien Kauf by Hitler, Zen by Allen Watts. etc)
Numerous Biographies -- e.g. Walter Isaacson's books on Elon, Steve jobs, etc.. 4 to 5 books from multiple authors regarding Ghenghis Khan.. etc.. etc..
Numerous popular business books (books by Clay Christensen, Geogrey Moore, Michael Porter, Eric Ries, etc.)

And many, many others... Don't forget I am very old I am also an INTJ so reading and learning comes 2nd nature to me... After a while.. I think my favorite book on strategy would be "Boyd: The Fighter Pilot who changed the art of war". It's not that his OODA loop was the best/"end all" of strategies.. It showed to me that strategies are really simple concepts. To win a basketball game, you have to put the basketball in the hoop more than the other player. To win in business, you have to have more customers that pay the business more money. To win a war, you have to break you enemy's resolve to fight. Simple things, but the execution is hard. One has to iterate as things change. This is a very simple concept.. iterate.. see what changed.. act according to the change.. etc.. It's a simple decision process (laughably so), but it take intelligent to do -- to parry an opponents thrust.. It's the book that got me thinking about "strategy" general. I'm sure other people will have other books that "touched" them; that caused them to think in other ways. But this book helped me form my version of how a strategy should be -- combining all the other books I've read from Art of War by Sun Tzu to Prince by Machiavelli (I think I only read 40% of that book because his book became to intwine with the politics of his time -- anecdotes of people I did not know).

John Boyd's book help me connect every other books on strategy together. Perhaps I was just at a tipping point.. Perhaps another book would have helped me create my "universal theory" on strategy but the case being what it is -- Boyd's book was the one and that is why it is my favorite. I smile every time I picture Boyd spending years and years going over every book on fightting wars he could possible get his hands on; spending nights at home going over ever great battle (and some not so great) since antiquity.. not caring about his cloths, his small apartment, etc.. He was driven -- and ultimately, he was given the name the "ghetto general" hahahahah

Oh, Extraordinary Popular Delusions and the Madness of Crowds by Charles Mackay is a fun book. It's cool to hear stories of "smart people" of that time believing in alchemy, tulips that cost more than a house, etc.. The concepts of mass delusion hasn't changed and being humans it's nice to see and hear these past delusions.. I'm sure there are mass delusions now -- I think I know what they are, but obviously, the masses wouldn't agree until most of them are dead.. like in the past hahahahaah..

 

[Slowhandluke]

I know that the Art of War is a popular book. I think a big part of why it's popular is its reliance on contrarian logic. "The best victory is the one that makes the battle unnecessary." People read that and think wow that's brilliant, even though it's really just common sense.

One thing that you have to remember about Sun Tzu is that he was Chinese. And the Chinese have historically been on the losing end of most wars with foreign adversaries, despite being a technologically and culturally advanced society and having a massive population. For centuries, they've had their asses handed to them by the Mongols, the Manchus, the Europeans and the Japanese, among others. So there's that.

Yes, everything is basically common sense looking back in hindsight. That's the trick. In the thick of war or a fight, people have biases and are very emotional.. Some people just "stand there" and are paralyzed. Some people worry to much.. or worry to little, etc.. etc..


Oh, China back in the past was made up of many empires.. During most of that continent's history, there wasnt a single "china" - usually multiple dynasties or empires. To say China always got defeated is like saying Europe always got defeated while discounting the multiple european countries that might have formed with the "invading" powers. In other words, the art of war by Sun tzu... Can we really say it is from "China"? The China that we know of today? no, not really. It was written by a man from a Chinese Empire from a period we there were several that were fighting each other.

 

[Noahwilson]

I either read or listened to the following books/ audio book that are related in some way to strategies in life -- how to live; how to conduct oneself, how to compete, etc.. etc.:

Novum Organum by Francis Bacon;
Extraordinary Popular Delusions and the Madness of Crowds by Charles Mackay
The Gulag Archipelago Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn's (probably 60% completed because the book became just an "accounting" of the people who died; for example, X Y person died here.. 200 from Z village died there..I think those people were popular during their time)
Numerous book from Peter Drucker (60% coverage of his works? probably)
Numerous autobiographies (Shoe dog by phil knight,The Known and Unknown by Donald Rumsfeld, Am I being too Subtle by Sam Zell, Mien Kauf by Hitler, Zen by Allen Watts. etc)
Numerous Biographies -- e.g. Walter Isaacson's books on Elon, Steve jobs, etc.. 4 to 5 books from multiple authors regarding Ghenghis Khan.. etc.. etc..
Numerous popular business books (books by Clay Christensen, Geogrey Moore, Michael Porter, Eric Ries, etc.)

And many, many others... Don't forget I am very old I am also an INTJ so reading and learning comes 2nd nature to me... After a while.. I think my favorite book on strategy would be "Boyd: The Fighter Pilot who changed the art of war". It's not that his OODA loop was the best/"end all" of strategies.. It showed to me that strategies are really simple concepts. To win a basketball game, you have to put the basketball in the hoop more than the other player. To win in business, you have to have more customers that pay the business more money. To win a war, you have to break you enemy's resolve to fight. Simple things, but the execution is hard. One has to iterate as things change. This is a very simple concept.. iterate.. see what changed.. act according to the change.. etc.. It's a simple decision process (laughably so), but it take intelligent to do -- to parry an opponents thrust.. It's the book that got me thinking about "strategy" general. I'm sure other people will have other books that "touched" them; that caused them to think in other ways. But this book helped me form my version of how a strategy should be -- combining all the other books I've read from Art of War by Sun Tzu to Prince by Machiavelli (I think I only read 40% of that book because his book became to intwine with the politics of his time -- anecdotes of people I did not know).

John Boyd's book help me connect every other books on strategy together. Perhaps I was just at a tipping point.. Perhaps another book would have helped me create my "universal theory" on strategy but the case being what it is -- Boyd's book was the one and that is why it is my favorite. I smile every time I picture Boyd spending years and years going over every book on fightting wars he could possible get his hands on; spending nights at home going over ever great battle (and some not so great) since antiquity.. not caring about his cloths, his small apartment, etc.. He was driven -- and ultimately, he was given the name the "ghetto general" hahahahah

Oh, Extraordinary Popular Delusions and the Madness of Crowds by Charles Mackay is a fun book. It's cool to hear stories of "smart people" of that time believing in alchemy, tulips that cost more than a house, etc.. The concepts of mass delusion hasn't changed and being humans it's nice to see and hear these past delusions.. I'm sure there are mass delusions now -- I think I know what they are, but obviously, the masses wouldn't agree until most of them are dead.. like in the past hahahahaah..

I’m definitely going to check out some of the books you mentioned. I really liked your point about strategy being simple in concept but tough to execute. The whole idea of adapting, seeing what changes, and adjusting your next move makes a lot of sense to me.

You’ve given me a pretty serious reading list. I’ll probably start with Boyd. Thanks for sharing all of this!

 

[Jor-El]

The book on my bedside table is rather on the thin side.... "My Plan To Find The Real Killers by O.J.Simpson

 

[zekko]

just my two cents. I think Nicolo Machiaveli died powerless and poor. Robert Greene (imho) is a grifter... sometimes he says one thing then the opposite. His "good" advice is so general as to be tripe

Advice is only as good as how you put it into action. A guy can have a good idea, or get good advice, but if he doesn't use it properly, it isn't going to do him any good.