"How I Made Sure No Woman Ever Friend-Zoned Me Again"
She calls you when her car breaks down. When she needs help moving. When some guy she's actually dating treats her badly.
You're the listener. The reliable one. The guy who would treat her so much better, if she'd just open her eyes.
She won't. You trained her to see you as the low-effort option — the friend who requires zero risk and zero investment. Every favor dug the hole deeper.
The "22 Rules" break the pattern. You'll stop auditioning for a role she already cast and become the man she chases instead. It starts with Rule 1.
So, what's going on in your game right now?
- Thread starter Warrior74
- Start date
"How I Made Sure No Woman Ever Friend-Zoned Me Again"
She calls you when her car breaks down. When she needs help moving. When some guy she's actually dating treats her badly.
You're the listener. The reliable one. The guy who would treat her so much better, if she'd just open her eyes.
She won't. You trained her to see you as the low-effort option — the friend who requires zero risk and zero investment. Every favor dug the hole deeper.
The "22 Rules" break the pattern. You'll stop auditioning for a role she already cast and become the man she chases instead. It starts with Rule 1.
Work: is low pay and the hours are all over the place, makes it hard to make plans and often hard to go out on weekends.
Home: just got a new place, its awesome, just starting to DJ it up now that I'm settled in. roommate is a bit of a perv, not sure if I want my girls to meet him, I think he'll scare alot of them off, I might have to move back out but hoping not to
Approaching: have been practicing approaching in my new city, to be honest, I've just been trying on girls who are working, so they kind of HAVE to talk to me. Been asking where the good clubs in my town are, when the girls go, and then their names. My new town is small enough that they are all naming the same club and so once I get out there and see them all, I will have a huge amount of pre-selection, once I go there and chat them up. Have had girls in stores asking MY name and what day I'll be at the club...so thats a good sign. I'll be clubbing it and re-connecting with them shortly I hope
Women: have been building a "social circle" of acquaintances with the store girls I'm chatting up, plus I now frequent two restaurants in town, and am getting familiar with the hot ladies on the staff, most of them are "taken" but I don't mind being "friends" with them because hot girls travel in packs and again it help because they all hang at the same club and like I said, when I walk in there for the first time, I'm gonna be like a celebrity in a sense (mere exposure effect)
-picked up a girl from my work, gave her an eskimo kiss, which led to a real kiss, which led to...well you know
-got blown out early on during a dinner with a woman, posted about it, now I know what to do next time. Was not sexual enough...
Look - have been working on standing taller, have gained 8lbs and still climbing, I'm skinny so I need some mass. Have a personal trainer that created a great 6 meal a day plan, and then I'll be working out one muscle per day once I have enough bulk to cut into something. Have been shopping for new clothes, avoiding labels like American Eagle in favour of cooler, more unique clothes that are a little more smooth and "adult" - have also been practicing stronger eye contact on women, never looking away first etc., "smiling" with my eyes, things like that.
And yeah thats all I can think of at the moment....PEACE!
Home: just got a new place, its awesome, just starting to DJ it up now that I'm settled in. roommate is a bit of a perv, not sure if I want my girls to meet him, I think he'll scare alot of them off, I might have to move back out but hoping not to
Approaching: have been practicing approaching in my new city, to be honest, I've just been trying on girls who are working, so they kind of HAVE to talk to me. Been asking where the good clubs in my town are, when the girls go, and then their names. My new town is small enough that they are all naming the same club and so once I get out there and see them all, I will have a huge amount of pre-selection, once I go there and chat them up. Have had girls in stores asking MY name and what day I'll be at the club...so thats a good sign. I'll be clubbing it and re-connecting with them shortly I hope
Women: have been building a "social circle" of acquaintances with the store girls I'm chatting up, plus I now frequent two restaurants in town, and am getting familiar with the hot ladies on the staff, most of them are "taken" but I don't mind being "friends" with them because hot girls travel in packs and again it help because they all hang at the same club and like I said, when I walk in there for the first time, I'm gonna be like a celebrity in a sense (mere exposure effect)
-picked up a girl from my work, gave her an eskimo kiss, which led to a real kiss, which led to...well you know
-got blown out early on during a dinner with a woman, posted about it, now I know what to do next time. Was not sexual enough...
Look - have been working on standing taller, have gained 8lbs and still climbing, I'm skinny so I need some mass. Have a personal trainer that created a great 6 meal a day plan, and then I'll be working out one muscle per day once I have enough bulk to cut into something. Have been shopping for new clothes, avoiding labels like American Eagle in favour of cooler, more unique clothes that are a little more smooth and "adult" - have also been practicing stronger eye contact on women, never looking away first etc., "smiling" with my eyes, things like that.
And yeah thats all I can think of at the moment....PEACE!
Last few months I've been working on a big promotion at work and lifting big weights at the gym. The promotion has just been secured (going to sign the paperwork next week) and my lifting as well as physique have progressed heaps.
I'm getting checked out more & more by women, due to my change in physique and improvement in style. I'm getting pickier as well and am now going through another transition into a higher caliber (read: hotter
) of women that I want to date. I've actually turned down more women in the last few months than I have in my whole life - even ones that I'd happily date earlier.
Last one I dated was a cute yoga instructor. Haven't been dating for a month to work on that promotion. Now that it's secured, I have a few lined up this weekend and next week.
Negative: the only thing I've perceived as a negative in my game right now is that I'm way less excited about meeting & dating women than I used to be (could be a positive, as my career & hobbies are way more exciting to me right now).I'm also getting pickier & seeing a lot of flags (yellow & red) too soon. I'm either reading too much into it or I'm just better at getting them to talk about those. Combination of both, I think.
Sounds cliche but atm I'd love to meet a woman that I'm excited to spend some time with (other than sexually).
I'm getting checked out more & more by women, due to my change in physique and improvement in style. I'm getting pickier as well and am now going through another transition into a higher caliber (read: hotter
) of women that I want to date. I've actually turned down more women in the last few months than I have in my whole life - even ones that I'd happily date earlier.Last one I dated was a cute yoga instructor. Haven't been dating for a month to work on that promotion. Now that it's secured, I have a few lined up this weekend and next week.
Negative: the only thing I've perceived as a negative in my game right now is that I'm way less excited about meeting & dating women than I used to be (could be a positive, as my career & hobbies are way more exciting to me right now).I'm also getting pickier & seeing a lot of flags (yellow & red) too soon. I'm either reading too much into it or I'm just better at getting them to talk about those. Combination of both, I think.
Sounds cliche but atm I'd love to meet a woman that I'm excited to spend some time with (other than sexually).
congrats on the promotion. Hopefully that means more pay days and more lay days!
Not been impressed with the selection where I am living. Went out with the crew and approached a ton and nothing. Some of the chicks weren't attractive, so it was more for practice and keeping up on things. These venues are just horrible - seems like its 70% dudes and a lot of girls with bfs in tow. Basically its your classic wolf in sheep's clothing here ; ugly girls acting like *****es.
At the end of the day, I can blame anything for my lack of success but it comes down to yours truly. got WORK to do!
Not been impressed with the selection where I am living. Went out with the crew and approached a ton and nothing. Some of the chicks weren't attractive, so it was more for practice and keeping up on things. These venues are just horrible - seems like its 70% dudes and a lot of girls with bfs in tow. Basically its your classic wolf in sheep's clothing here ; ugly girls acting like *****es.
At the end of the day, I can blame anything for my lack of success but it comes down to yours truly. got WORK to do!
Basically, I'm on the verge of doing good. At least I believe so.
I moved to another country and haven't approached yet. Actually I did but with no serious intention for hookup. She is like young HB8 but not really my type and several Red Flags(inconsistent testing and mentioning she attended swinger party - maybe lied but wtf?) kept me for trying to seduce her. She tried. But it would end up living with her / taking care of her and I don't find her that much attractive.
My work keeps me strangled...I'm very tired all week, doing 10things at once. Have to put that to end and work less at work and more for myself.
Approaching is not easy since I'm lousy eastern European in western country - not a real problem since I'm pretty charming but nothing serious can evolve I guess - they always marry up. And on top of that...girls here are not really pretty here although there are lots of foreign girls in here. Well, we will see. Of course I will give it a try nevertheless.
Attending other social circles like community work and such is not an option as I am a stranger and don't know the language.
I pretty much know what to do to improve but every time I start doing the right things...sleeping more, workout more, going out....some shyt storm comes and drains out my energy. I guess I let that happen...maybe I'm just lazy shyt.
I turned on sosuave to get some motivation and to improve my English which sucks.
I'm doing much more better financially compared to before but my job is shyty. I have to find some better job. I'd love to be on my own but I'm not a businessman in heart (my Jedi powers are used for nonprofit stuff) and I don't have any passion which could make me money too. Instead of being a cop or arms seller I don't have any other dream job. Thats the fvcking problem. I don't have any career goals. Maybe I go to Afghanistan building cell phone towers for good money....but no women there. And I would like to taste some after this celibacy.
Buy a car, solve out the papers and enjoying the freedom. Then I'm going to try horse riding. And I check some pubs and bars, maybe I'll be lucky and find some hot American girl, she marries me and I finally get to do what I think I love: Hot chics, kids, sea, horses, hunting and guns. And I'll be happy Texan redneck on ranch. Yeeehaw Actually I met one American chic last weekend in Irish pub...but she was not
pretty enough although I was drunk like monkey.
I moved to another country and haven't approached yet. Actually I did but with no serious intention for hookup. She is like young HB8 but not really my type and several Red Flags(inconsistent testing and mentioning she attended swinger party - maybe lied but wtf?) kept me for trying to seduce her. She tried. But it would end up living with her / taking care of her and I don't find her that much attractive.
My work keeps me strangled...I'm very tired all week, doing 10things at once. Have to put that to end and work less at work and more for myself.
Approaching is not easy since I'm lousy eastern European in western country - not a real problem since I'm pretty charming but nothing serious can evolve I guess - they always marry up. And on top of that...girls here are not really pretty here although there are lots of foreign girls in here. Well, we will see. Of course I will give it a try nevertheless.
Attending other social circles like community work and such is not an option as I am a stranger and don't know the language.
I pretty much know what to do to improve but every time I start doing the right things...sleeping more, workout more, going out....some shyt storm comes and drains out my energy. I guess I let that happen...maybe I'm just lazy shyt.
I turned on sosuave to get some motivation and to improve my English which sucks.
I'm doing much more better financially compared to before but my job is shyty. I have to find some better job. I'd love to be on my own but I'm not a businessman in heart (my Jedi powers are used for nonprofit stuff) and I don't have any passion which could make me money too. Instead of being a cop or arms seller I don't have any other dream job. Thats the fvcking problem. I don't have any career goals. Maybe I go to Afghanistan building cell phone towers for good money....but no women there. And I would like to taste some after this celibacy.
Buy a car, solve out the papers and enjoying the freedom. Then I'm going to try horse riding. And I check some pubs and bars, maybe I'll be lucky and find some hot American girl, she marries me and I finally get to do what I think I love: Hot chics, kids, sea, horses, hunting and guns. And I'll be happy Texan redneck on ranch. Yeeehaw Actually I met one American chic last weekend in Irish pub...but she was not
pretty enough although I was drunk like monkey.
"How I Made Sure No Woman Ever Friend-Zoned Me Again"
She calls you when her car breaks down. When she needs help moving. When some guy she's actually dating treats her badly.
You're the listener. The reliable one. The guy who would treat her so much better, if she'd just open her eyes.
She won't. You trained her to see you as the low-effort option — the friend who requires zero risk and zero investment. Every favor dug the hole deeper.
The "22 Rules" break the pattern. You'll stop auditioning for a role she already cast and become the man she chases instead. It starts with Rule 1.
bluenorther
Senior Don Juan
I had six-way heart bypass surgery last October, and the recovery has been more like PTSD, in addition to post-op depression. After what they put me through, dying suddenly became an attractive alternative.
Dating has been out of the question, so I'm focusing on getting my work back together.
An old exFWB is divorced now, but when I saw her the other day, had to Next her-- she's mentally ill and can't manage her weight.
I did meet a hot real estate babe on the job, but I don't see her often enough to talk much. That doesn't mean I can't make it work!
Ladies email me at POF to say they like my profile.
Dating has been out of the question, so I'm focusing on getting my work back together.
An old exFWB is divorced now, but when I saw her the other day, had to Next her-- she's mentally ill and can't manage her weight.
I did meet a hot real estate babe on the job, but I don't see her often enough to talk much. That doesn't mean I can't make it work!
Ladies email me at POF to say they like my profile.
Just wanted to bump this for anyone who missed it. I'm out of the game, working hard on my paying down my debts. No time for dating. A fire left me with no clothes and a new roommate to help cover bills, and I'm finally caught up on my child support, so I'm basically back at square one trying to get my life together...its tough at the bottom especially this late in the game.
SoldMySoul
Master Don Juan
Warrior74 said:
You hit something on the head, "It's tough at the bottom." Man that was music to my ears. Because brother that is where I am! Not to mention, but to add to your true statement, It is lonely at the bottom too.
My game is weak at this point! I have a lot of negs in my life that are beyond my control. When you are on top, everybody wants to be there with you.... at the bottom, not so much.
Yah. Once me and my ex split my money has been terrible ever since (4 years or so). We were doing okay as a couple...middle class, but solo with child support has me basically on the edge of poverty. The only way forward is to have my own business...I'm never going to get ahead waiting on someone else to pay me. In fact if it wasn't for having a hustler mentality I would have to move home with my folks. I'm going to make money by any means necessary.SoldMySoul said:
"Nervous Around Beautiful Women? There's a Rule for That"
I could talk to any woman I wasn't attracted to. Charming, funny, relaxed. Then a gorgeous woman looked my way and I'd become a sweating, babbling mess.
The fix took me years to find and ten minutes to learn. Nervousness and excitement are the same physical state — pounding heart, adrenaline, flushed face. Your brain just picks the label. And you can pick a better one.
Rule 16 shows you how. You feel the nerves, relabel them as excitement, and let that energy pour out as enthusiasm. Women notice the guy radiating it. They always do.
3countriesPlan
Master Don Juan
I have a gf who is allowing me to see other girls.
2 booty calls (one is about to be ejected, getting boring)
I'm dating 1 girl, going on dates with 2 others and going to the bars once a week to find new azz.
Weaknesses:
Not working efficiently enough at the bars
Meeting way too many girls that strike me as "odd" (not filtering too well )
I've been working out hardcore lately, my wing invited me to go to the bar but I went to the gym after a date instead.
Haven't been closing real well lately.. been nexting a lot of conservative time wasting girls.. note to self: go for more HK ones and less traditional ones.
2 booty calls (one is about to be ejected, getting boring)
I'm dating 1 girl, going on dates with 2 others and going to the bars once a week to find new azz.
Weaknesses:
Not working efficiently enough at the bars
Meeting way too many girls that strike me as "odd" (not filtering too well )
I've been working out hardcore lately, my wing invited me to go to the bar but I went to the gym after a date instead.
Haven't been closing real well lately.. been nexting a lot of conservative time wasting girls.. note to self: go for more HK ones and less traditional ones.
I had zero prospects before but am out of the game now. Trying to get life back on track via a real career , a place of my own and my hobbies. mentally I am not where I want to be right now. The upside is that financially and physically I am in better shape than last year...the head stuff will go away once the ball gets rolling.
SexyMofo
Banned
Sorry to hear that Bossman, fyi it's Boxer. I hope you rise up and become reborn like the phoenix.Warrior74 said:
Strengths:
1. Hunting skills. I've gone out with 101 women from May 2008 to present. I've f*cked a third of them, keep in mind I don't like to date so if I can't close the deal within 2-3 dates, she's done.
2. Business. Recession has hit me hard, but I'm still making enough income to pay my bills and have a little left over to invest.
3. Investments. I spend years studying investing ala Warren Buffet and it has paid off.
Weaknesses:
1. I'm an a**hole. I can't keep a woman after a couple of f*cks.
2. People skills. I know if I was more socially adept, I would be more successful in all areas of my life.
Sup Otto. See your still doing your thing. You got em riled up over in the discussion forum!SexyMofo said:
So update. I finally got all of my back debts sorted, a little cushion for emergencies and I have my side business picking up nicely. I renewed my gym membership and I'm taking my fat ass to the gym starting tomorrow. So now my life will consist of Dayjob +Gym + Side Biz. I have about 50lbs to lose to be at my healthiest but a quick 20 is what I'm shooting for in the next two months. I'm at 220lbs now. My game is still completely non existant. I only get attention from fatties and trashy hoes at the moment. Of course its mainly because I dress like an office drone all day every day (company polo and khakis and sensible shoes). I'm just biding my time as I build up my war chest and get all the pieces in place.
"You Can't Argue a Woman Into Liking You"
You made your case like a lawyer. Stable job. Good guy. Ready for something real. All true. All irrelevant.
She weighed your points, nodded along, felt nothing — then fell hard for some tattooed bartender with a motorcycle and a gambling problem.
Logic is where attraction goes to die. The "22 Rules" work a level deeper, on the subconscious switches that decide within minutes whether you register as a MAN or as part of the furniture.
Stop presenting evidence. Start flipping switches.
women haze
Senior Don Juan
- Joined
- Jun 20, 2009
- Messages
- 484
- Reaction score
- 23
Hmmm What's going on in my game? well
I went to Atlantic City for a bachelor party for a friend of mine past weekend, and met this woman HB7 28, beautiful, successful. She lives about an hour away from me, I surprised myself well i had a drink or two in me...
I sat down initiated conversation, looked in her eyes put her leg on my lap...walked the beach, danced. I got her phone number we split ways that night, because her friend wanted to leave. I don't know if this was a mistake...but I just called her afterwards to make sue she got in safe that night. She missed my call but sent me a text back.
Well anyways, fast forward to today Just gave her a ring an hour ago she didn't pick up, prolly wont call me... ah well I keeps it moving.
Other than that..I been going to Salsa class, and working out to pass my time lately....
That's all to report
I went to Atlantic City for a bachelor party for a friend of mine past weekend, and met this woman HB7 28, beautiful, successful. She lives about an hour away from me, I surprised myself well i had a drink or two in me...
I sat down initiated conversation, looked in her eyes put her leg on my lap...walked the beach, danced. I got her phone number we split ways that night, because her friend wanted to leave. I don't know if this was a mistake...but I just called her afterwards to make sue she got in safe that night. She missed my call but sent me a text back.
Well anyways, fast forward to today Just gave her a ring an hour ago she didn't pick up, prolly wont call me... ah well I keeps it moving.
Other than that..I been going to Salsa class, and working out to pass my time lately....
That's all to report
This thread has been an interesting dialogue as to where my (our) game and life has been going. I am glad to say that my confidence and overall push towards a new life seems to be going relatively well. - not perfect, but not horrible either. Tonight is a huge party at the house I used to live in before i moved , and there promises to be a lot of friends and hot smokeshows to get back into the game with. Suffice it to say I am excited not just about a sick get together, but to finally be moving on from everything.
As for my actual game, I don't have any women right now. The confidence I had a few years ago still isn't where i want it to be; the kind of confidence that makes one unstoppable in the field. Right now I am looking forward to life while looking back on the part of life that really worked well for me.
The short term goal with my game is to start chatting it up as effectively as i did a few years back. I can either be a great conversationalist or quiet/shy so tonight will be about being the former. Wish me luck!
As for my actual game, I don't have any women right now. The confidence I had a few years ago still isn't where i want it to be; the kind of confidence that makes one unstoppable in the field. Right now I am looking forward to life while looking back on the part of life that really worked well for me.
The short term goal with my game is to start chatting it up as effectively as i did a few years back. I can either be a great conversationalist or quiet/shy so tonight will be about being the former. Wish me luck!
Serg897
Master Don Juan
I like this thread, so I'll keep the ball rolling:
Right now Im only seeing one woman sporadically, she is about 29 or 30 - actually the one I talk about in this thread:
http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?t=176655
I happened to mend the damage somewhat from that incident, and its actually been pretty interesting - I had another date and we have been making out, etc - but no sex yet. Have another one tomorrow - she actually seems fairly interested at this point. Things have been moving pretty slow, and Im trying to keep myself from getting too invested since I only have her as my one plate at the moment - therefore I am concentrating on other areas of my life.
This semester is going to be one of the roughest I have had in my life, especially in a few months, so I plan to concentrate more on myself and my studies over women for the time being. Whenever I go out I pick up numbers from time to time, but Im not being as aggressive in chasing them as before.
Right now Im only seeing one woman sporadically, she is about 29 or 30 - actually the one I talk about in this thread:
http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?t=176655
I happened to mend the damage somewhat from that incident, and its actually been pretty interesting - I had another date and we have been making out, etc - but no sex yet. Have another one tomorrow - she actually seems fairly interested at this point. Things have been moving pretty slow, and Im trying to keep myself from getting too invested since I only have her as my one plate at the moment - therefore I am concentrating on other areas of my life.
This semester is going to be one of the roughest I have had in my life, especially in a few months, so I plan to concentrate more on myself and my studies over women for the time being. Whenever I go out I pick up numbers from time to time, but Im not being as aggressive in chasing them as before.
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More updates:
My old venture is on the way out as the other business partner ( the one who actually worked) is going to announce his departure. We had a good discussion about the good and bad parts of the entire experience and how we plan on running a business later on in our lives. I noticed the same down mood that I had about a month ago, the kind of mood that kills your game.
This weekend was a pretty good weekend for calibrating where my game is going - UP. Life has been more enjoyable lately and this was reflected in the results. Again, the goal was to work on small things like smiling, eye contact, conversation and getting interest from random girls. pretty simple stuff that some probably take for granted! Thursday night featured a pretty smoking cougar talking to us ( girls approached us all night), and another not-so-hot chick who was trying to get near my face. Its too bad because her friend was smoke but was too shy to chat it up. My buddy also accidentally threw a pretty hard neg towards the cougar and she left. honest mistake, that cougar was DTF. Next time.....
The next day was even better. After going to one place that was dead, a bunch of us piled into the car and headed into town to try our duals there. Pulled a jersey shore on a college senior and got her number. It was difficult sidestepping that I was living with my folk and unemployed, but us engineers are pretty arrogant folks when it comes down to it. She seemed alright so I might or might not give her a ring sometime. On the way out of the same venue, I managed to chat it up with yet another decent looking 29 year old who was also DTF.
So where is my game now? Its not perfect by any means, but its on the way back up. Now lets hope the same thing with the job situation happens!
My old venture is on the way out as the other business partner ( the one who actually worked) is going to announce his departure. We had a good discussion about the good and bad parts of the entire experience and how we plan on running a business later on in our lives. I noticed the same down mood that I had about a month ago, the kind of mood that kills your game.
This weekend was a pretty good weekend for calibrating where my game is going - UP. Life has been more enjoyable lately and this was reflected in the results. Again, the goal was to work on small things like smiling, eye contact, conversation and getting interest from random girls. pretty simple stuff that some probably take for granted! Thursday night featured a pretty smoking cougar talking to us ( girls approached us all night), and another not-so-hot chick who was trying to get near my face. Its too bad because her friend was smoke but was too shy to chat it up. My buddy also accidentally threw a pretty hard neg towards the cougar and she left. honest mistake, that cougar was DTF. Next time.....
The next day was even better. After going to one place that was dead, a bunch of us piled into the car and headed into town to try our duals there. Pulled a jersey shore on a college senior and got her number. It was difficult sidestepping that I was living with my folk and unemployed, but us engineers are pretty arrogant folks when it comes down to it. She seemed alright so I might or might not give her a ring sometime. On the way out of the same venue, I managed to chat it up with yet another decent looking 29 year old who was also DTF.
So where is my game now? Its not perfect by any means, but its on the way back up. Now lets hope the same thing with the job situation happens!
Solomon
Master Don Juan
Two years in!! (whoo-hoo) taking a break as of right now, my fiances are crap since I lost my job, and honestly I have lost passion for "the game" I got one plate and a couple solid prospects, but honestly right now I'm just trying to pick up the pieces and get my life on track again
"Why Women Dump the Guys Who Try the Hardest"
You paid for dinner. You drove. You said "whatever you want is fine" every single time. All the effort, no expectations.
And she left anyway — probably for a guy who makes her pick up the pizza.
Painful. Also predictable. Her mind quietly concludes that anything requiring zero effort from her is worth exactly zero. You became a free sample, and free samples get taken for granted.
The 22 Rules flip the dynamic. Small shifts that get her investing effort, money, and time in you — until SHE'S the one afraid of losing YOU.