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Should I bring this up or leave it alone?

jnMissouri

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We've all been there, the woman with male friends. It's a battle that I've never seen anyone win. Since my twenties with my 9 and 10 gf's they always had male orbiters, besties, etc. Trying to cut them out has never worked. Some became an issue, but largely in hindsight, because of the girl (IMO).

My new gf is Asian, for some reason I trust her in a way I've never trusted any woman. It took longer to bed her, she has a low body count despite her 10 looks, etc. I even told her my boundaries and that I have no problem if she goes out for drinks with the girls, etc. Which she did, and got hit on all night. I didn't think for a second that she did anything, and we talked about it more later when talking about boundaries, and she got really curious and interested to know what my boundaries are, which basically I told her, if you wouldn't do it in front of me, don't do it behind my back. She said she has the same boundary. I told her it wasn't even a question in my mind that she didn't give out her number, and she said I didn't, I said I know, hence why I never asked, I trust her until she gives me a reason not to trust her.

So we're laying in bed one Sunday and she always tries to ask me about my past relationships, and tells me about some of hers. She mentioned that her ex husband was controlling and jealous of her male friends to me a couple other times and rolled her eyes about it. But last Sunday she told me about a past relationship that made me wonder a littler later in the week. Her male best friend eventually pursued her romantically. Because they knew each other well already, after three months of dating, they got engaged when he proposed. She said yes. Then the dudes ex gf showed up to her house 3 months pregnant and told her she was in love with the guy and what is she going to do with this baby alone, etc. So she broke it off with the dude and told him to go marry her, which he did and they are still married she told me.

My thing is, the battle of male orbiters and getting rid of them can never be won. Even if you do win, unless she's locked in a room she will always get hit on. If she is happy and a good woman, she won't entertain anything WHILE she is with you.

The thing I wonder, is should I even bring this up with her and is there a way of doing it without sounding like her jealous or controlling ex husband? I was thinking of saying so your ex husband was jealous and controlling about your guy friends, but you DID date and almost marry your male best friend at one point before you had met him, so your male friends are technically an option for you....no?

I honestly DO NOT worry about her. I know she has lot's of guys constantly pursuing her. Even after our first date when she called me about dating exclusively (she's Asian, traditional) she mentioned to me on our second date that a guy with a private jet she had given her number out before meeting me was ready to fly to meet her and she told him she is seeing someone right now (me). When she comes over Friday night and spends the night, she texts me and invites me over a few hours after getting home Saturday (two weeks in a row now) and I leave Sunday. I see the same dudes show up on her phone calling her 50 times while she is showing me a video, etc. (almost as if she has a friend calling on purpose to see how I react lol) and she ignores them. To me, it's clearly a male friend (or a friend playing along to test how I react) and you know what? I didn't even sweat it, you know why? Because she drove out of her way to MY place to bang me, then invited me over to her place for dinner the next day and we banged again, and she even made me breakfast the next morning.

So SHOULD I even bring up the male friend situation of her past at all or maybe wait until there is a legitimate issue with a male friend and bring it up as, well you say that they are male friends, but you DID date a male friend in the past....
 

Willie Naylor

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This chick sounds mentally stable. Good job.

Get her out of your life.

Speaking generally, don't question a girl about her male friends.
 

joesbigship

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I honestly DO NOT worry about her. I know she has lot's of guys constantly pursuing her.
Wow bro that's an incredibly long post. I skimmed and the main point I get out of this is that you really dig her to the point that you could get really hurt if/when things go south.

These issues are impossible to assess accurately since one man's 9 or 10 can be another man's 7. Check out biggoal's posts where he labels girls who are borderline 5's and 6's as "very hot."

Also, it's pointless to ask about whether she would. I have had countless women who are married or in ltr's who hit on me, pursue me into the bathroom, dm me, slip me their number, sneak off into another room with me, etc.

There's a possibility since the repercussions for almost all women is basically zero. So are you going to make an issue of it and worry your ass off or just live with the risk just like you would with any other activity?
 

2Rocky

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Sounds like she has you on the wrong end of the Covert Dread equation. But Your mindset is the cause)

We as guys WANT to have the woman all the other guys want...It is just par for the course. Any woman worth having (and half of the ones NOT) is going to get hit on by other guys. We also should do our best to stay attractive to other women. When she sees another woman check you out when you are out together it will only make her want you more....

I had a woman who tried to make me jealous because a guy flat out asked her out at work "because she wasn't wearing a diamond" and I told ther "that's just part of dating an attractive woman. I'm used to it." and changed the topic.
 

Çharismo

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So we're laying in bed one Sunday and she always tries to ask me about my past relationships, and tells me about some of hers. She mentioned that her ex husband was controlling and jealous of her male friends to me a couple other times and rolled her eyes about it. But last Sunday she told me about a past relationship that made me wonder a littler later in the week. Her male best friend eventually pursued her romantically. Because they knew each other well already, after three months of dating, they got engaged when he proposed. She said yes. Then the dudes ex gf showed up to her house 3 months pregnant and told her she was in love with the guy and what is she going to do with this baby alone, etc. So she broke it off with the dude and told him to go marry her, which he did and they are still married she told me.
Huge red flag. Proceed with caution. You will never hear anything positive about an ex from a woman’s mouth.

Even after our first date when she called me about dating exclusively (she's Asian, traditional) she mentioned to me on our second date that a guy with a private jet she had given her number out before meeting me was ready to fly to meet her and she told him she is seeing someone right now.
Another red flag. Proceed with caution. It seems to me that instead of keeping things like that to herself you have to wonder why she feels the need to tell you about things like that. It also seems that she is giving out her number to anyone that she deems fancy or whoever seems to approach her.

I see the same dudes show up on her phone calling her 50 times while she is showing me a video, etc. (almost as if she has a friend calling on purpose to see how I react lol) and she ignores them.
Another red flag. Proceed with caution. She is being called 50 times (I know you are exaggerating) so she might have potential stalkers looming around as well. The point that I’m trying to make is that she is enabling this behavior rather than putting a stop to it. Look man your gut is telling you something and I highly suggest you proceed with caution with this woman. She likes the attention, she likes the orbiters, and she is most likely keeping her options open. I don’t think she is even taking you seriously.

The problem with this situation is that if you bring up all these “friends” of her she will say that you are “controlling” and “jealous” like her ex but if you don’t bring it up there is a highly possibility that you are also enabling her behavior. She knows what she is doing by keeping you on your toes and playing you for a fool. Don’t be naive. I wouldn’t even take this woman seriously and just have fun with her and see where it goes.
 
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Macadellic

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OP,
Become a man with options that has girl friends and girlfriends in your life.

You be the one that goes out with your boys and has girls calling you.

Have you ever heard or read the following?
“Dating an attractive, beautiful, hottie means she will have guy friends and constantly hit on… it just comes with dating such a woman… it’s part of the territory.”

Become the following.
Dating a man that has himself together, is socially competent, compelling, with self awareness and emotionally intelligent with a fit frame will have girl friends and constantly receive IOI’s… it just comes with dating such a man… it’s part of the territory.

If she brings up any of this to your attention then she is the one that is controlling, possessive, jealous and she needs to work on herself.

Add this girl to your list of girl friends.
 

jnMissouri

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Wow bro that's an incredibly long post. I skimmed and the main point I get out of this is that you really dig her to the point that you could get really hurt if/when things go south.

These issues are impossible to assess accurately since one man's 9 or 10 can be another man's 7. Check out biggoal's posts where he labels girls who are borderline 5's and 6's as "very hot."

Also, it's pointless to ask about whether she would. I have had countless women who are married or in ltr's who hit on me, pursue me into the bathroom, dm me, slip me their number, sneak off into another room with me, etc.

There's a possibility since the repercussions for almost all women is basically zero. So are you going to make an issue of it and worry your ass off or just live with the risk just like you would with any other activity?

My thoughts as I noted are that even with no male friends, attractive women will get hit on EVERYWHERE, there's always a risk. Yeah, one mans 10 is a 5, sure. But she didn't have guys with private jets chasing her when we were dating because she's a 5 in their eyes...

She went out with her girls which I encouraged and got hit on by guys all night. I wasn't even worried about it. She called me at like 9:30 when she got home an hour or so after meeting up with her friends, even called me AT the venue with her girls in the background, knowing her and how she is with me, I wasn't even worried about it when she told me guys hit on her all night. We talked about it more later another day and brought up my boundaries and she said of course she didn't give her number out, etc. I told her I wasn't even worried, and I truly wasn't, I just wanted to tell her that my boundary is that if she wouldn't do it in front of me then don't do it behind my back, and she said she has the same boundary.

I will avoid bringing it up with her unless it becomes an issue, though I will say I don't think she is aware of her own naiveness on the topic. Probably because 99% of the guys she has no interest in at all, and I've told her that before about all the guys who want her "I can have any man, but I chose you" type of things she says, I've mentioned yeah but 99% of those guys that want you, you have no interest in at all.

I've just evaluated my history with women who have male friends and trying to cut them out has never ended well. Yes, in one case he became a problem although she was not interested in him. I've also been on the opposite end of this, I was befriended by a married colleague who fell for me and we had an affair...and my girl knows I've dated colleagues before because I've mentioned it to her as something I try to avoid but they pursued a lot and I gave it a shot with each one. I suppose SHE could have the same concerns about ME.....and I'm far more likely to cheat than her...because I have many times...though I am trying to stop....
 

joesbigship

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Dude, just look at the amount of words you are posting. This just reinforces my suspicion of a big SMV gap as well as your susceptibility to taking a big emotional hit. You're already worrying your ass off, so it could only get uglier when there's the inevitable "problem."

Also, you are vastly underestimating how thirsty guys are. I've seen mediocre 7 caliber girls have guys fly them out or fly out to them. I've seen guys obsess over 5's and 6's, DMing and texting them endlessly or stalking them or visiting them endlessly at their place of work. I know quite a few very average looking bartenders who have "regular clients" who not only visit them weekly but even daily.

Guys fly into a jealous rage over 6's all day long. Forget about whatever rating you're trying to impress yourself or us with. The real problem is you. You are extremely jealous and this will undermine your relationship without any doubt unless you get a handle on this immediately.

And yes, she is manipulating you: a big red flag (about you) that you can't spot it considering how obvious, even blatant it is.
 

metalwater

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you know what you want and what makes you feel ok.

if you want to accept a woman that keeps contact with other suitors (orbiters) then that's your choice. if you're ok with it then you're ok with it.

if you are not ok with it, don't accept it. do not let the opinion of others or fitting in or fear of shame or fear of being labeled jealous or insecure stop you from what you want.

if a woman has high enough interest in you, she will focus on you and ignore the others. most of them will disappear when she does this. the persistent ones she will have to dismiss and MAY even need your help to do so.

one of the most difficult comments to swallow recently is when someone said that all of our women's troubles are due to our insisting on trying to work with medium or low-interest women. it's really true and usually because we have a high interest when she is hot.

the very high-interest women will not keep orbiters if only because you don't like it but more because she doesn't need it. If she is less than very high interest (90% of relationships she is less than that) then she will want backups and even side action if only emotional. when an obiter (another guy that wants sex) talks to her and she doesn't VIBE with him he will go away within a short time. the smart guys will check back later... everyone knows this also, so the very high-interest woman will cut ties with the orbitors. the ugly truth is that with such high dedication the man usually will be the one to cheat because his confidence becomes over the top.
 

LARaiders85

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She mentioned that her ex husband was controlling and jealous of her male friends to me a couple other times and rolled her eyes about it.
She is conditioning you with this technique so that she can maintain her harem in plain sight. Maybe the ex was jealous, but likely he wasn't since it bothers you too.
 

BeExcellent

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Advice from the old lady:

Leave it be. If she’s hot other men are going to notice her. That’s par for the course as you know. She’s been a hot woman for a long time & knows it’s her job to manage the undue attention. That’s her landscape and she knows how to navigate that. It’s second nature.

She is being open and transparent with you. That is an extension of trust. She is telling you and showing you who she is and she seems congruent.

You are dealing with your own insecurities here. Anything you say will make you appear insecure, flustered and worried (AKA weak). Don’t go there. Not good optics. Be accepting of her friends, get to know them & then see what happens. I do this. I am SUPER transparent. My BF is welcome around any friend of mine (we went to breakfast this am with a close male friend of mine this morning….HIS idea.)

But he also gets weird too and it makes him seem worried and insecure. This week is Thanksgiving in US. All my children (3) are here. My ex husband (their Dad) flies out tomorrow. We have done Thanksgiving together for years post divorce and always include significant others and friends of either gender. We have an amicable relationship and are never getting back together in any way shape or form. My BF is weirded out since he has no children, has never been married, and doesn’t understand an amicable post divorce landscape. That’s HIS problem and I have said very directly “There is no problem here. Do not create problems where none exist.”…

And I’d advise you the same….
 

StacksHitEmUp

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Advice from the old lady:

Leave it be. If she’s hot other men are going to notice her. That’s par for the course as you know. She’s been a hot woman for a long time & knows it’s her job to manage the undue attention. That’s her landscape and she knows how to navigate that. It’s second nature.

She is being open and transparent with you. That is an extension of trust. She is telling you and showing you who she is and she seems congruent.

You are dealing with your own insecurities here. Anything you say will make you appear insecure, flustered and worried (AKA weak). Don’t go there. Not good optics. Be accepting of her friends, get to know them & then see what happens. I do this. I am SUPER transparent. My BF is welcome around any friend of mine (we went to breakfast this am with a close male friend of mine this morning….HIS idea.)

But he also gets weird too and it makes him seem worried and insecure. This week is Thanksgiving in US. All my children (3) are here. My ex husband (their Dad) flies out tomorrow. We have done Thanksgiving together for years post divorce and always include significant others and friends of either gender. We have an amicable relationship and are never getting back together in any way shape or form. My BF is weirded out since he has no children, has never been married, and doesn’t understand an amicable post divorce landscape. That’s HIS problem and I have said very directly “There is no problem here. Do not create problems where none exist.”…

And I’d advise you the same….
That’s what many men don’t understand. Women that look good are going to have tons of dudes DM’ing her the weirdest ****. It’s how she handles them that matters. If you want a women without orbiters or desperate dudes trying to get at her you have to find you a real ugly one.

A question for the old lady: are you turned off by your boyfriend’s behaviour regarding the thanksgiving dinner? You’ve mentioned a few times your boyfriend gets insecure at times, what does that do to your attraction to him?
 

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BeExcellent

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That’s what many men don’t understand. Women that look good are going to have tons of dudes DM’ing her the weirdest ****. It’s how she handles them that matters. If you want a women without orbiters or desperate dudes trying to get at her you have to find you a real ugly one.

A question for the old lady: are you turned off by your boyfriend’s behaviour regarding the thanksgiving dinner? You’ve mentioned a few times your boyfriend gets insecure at times, what does that do to your attraction to him?
It annoys me honestly. It does not diminish my attraction toward him but it creates undue drama. We are still relatively new at 6 months but we are exclusive & have been since mid-summer (his request but I like it)…

But he has to fully trust me and I realize that my domestic situation is unusual (my kid’s father is coming in from out of state -we get on well-) and my playboy friend is coming over as well as a few other people (my BF’s ex from a few years ago too) who don’t have family in the area. I’ve made clear that he is joining the family + managerie for the holiday…and I have gotten to be good friends with his ex that he’s still friends with…I think it will be fun. His ex wants to meet my playboy friend…so should be interesting…

So no it doesn’t lessen attraction. My deal is unusual and he’s kinda the new person in the group. He will adjust. I’m not snubbing good friends who have been there through thick & thin because he’s insecure. It’s Thanksgiving and Friendsgiving at my house. That’s how I roll.
 

rjc149

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Two things are certain.

1. As an attractive Asian woman, she will have a ton of male interest, from friendzoned orbiters to wealthy fetishists and everyone in between. I’ve seen Asian women who aren’t a hair above 5 get drooled on by gaggles of horny white dudes. Of course she’s letting you know this in a seemingly innocent, innocuous way.

2. As long as she’s happy in the relationship and has high interest in you, she will be open, transparent, and loyal. As long as she’s happy in the relationship and has high interest in you.

She’s basically giving you a warning. If you start to slack off, become complacent, stop meeting her emotional needs, or become needy and jealous, she will stop being transparent about the suitors waiting in the woodwork.

You also need to be prepared for a woman’s inexplicable change and shift of emotions and attraction for you, that will have nothing to do with you. It may be blue skies right now but there’s always a storm right around the corner. You have to accept the possibility that an attractive women with multiple appealing prospects will simply move on, despite you behaving as attractively as possible.

Dating very attractive women requires a difficult balance of emotional availability and emotional detachment, that only true abundance can give you. There’s nothing that can be said to you here that will allay your concern, other than to always be prepared to walk away at a moment’s notice.
 
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Barrister

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Two things are certain.

1. As an attractive Asian woman, she will have a ton of male interest, from friendzoned orbiters to wealthy fetishists and everyone in between. I’ve seen Asian women who aren’t a hair above 5 get drooled on by gaggles of horny white dudes. Of course she’s letting you know this in a seemingly innocent, innocuous way.

2. As long as she’s happy in the relationship and has high interest in you, she will be open, transparent, and loyal. As long as she’s happy in the relationship and has high interest in you.

She’s basically giving you a warning. If you start to slack off, become complacent, stop meeting her emotional needs, or become needy and jealous, she will stop being transparent about the suitors waiting in the woodwork.

You also need to be prepared for a woman’s inexplicable change and shift of emotions and attraction for you, that will have nothing to do with you. It may be blue skies right now but there’s always a storm right around the corner. You have to accept the possibility that an attractive women with multiple appealing prospects will simply move on, despite you behaving as attractively as possible.

Dating very attractive women requires a difficult balance of emotional availability and emotional detachment, that only true abundance can give you. There’s nothing that can be said to you here that will allay your concern, other than to always be prepared to walk away at a moment’s notice.
Agree with everything you said. Just a point of clarification: it makes no difference whether she is Asian or not. If a woman is attractive, all of what you wrote is true for them in any sort of relationship. Race makes no difference.
 

rjc149

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Agree with everything you said. Just a point of clarification: it makes no difference whether she is Asian or not. If a woman is attractive, all of what you wrote is true for them in any sort of relationship. Race makes no difference.
I felt it was worth noting that Asian women are subjected to higher levels of objectification and fetishization in western society. Since they are often seen as more submissive, sexualized, and thus more "attainable" it's more common for them, at least anecdotally (especially on OLD), to experience more aggressive sexual pursuit.
 
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