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Respect and fear go hand in hand

Who Dares Win

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Lets be honest, genuine earned respect accounts for no more than 10% of the cases wheter is from a woman or a man.

90% of the times respecting someone space, desiders and views only comes from the fear of the conseguences of not doing so.

A woman married to a violent criminal will hardly come up with fake accusation to win a divorce and custody of the kids, she knows he will go at her heavy for that therefore she respects his life, his freedom and rights and surely wont offend any of those with lies.
A woman married to a nice beta, helpless incapable of retaliations one as we know has no problem to fabricate lies to get more money in the court even at the cost of ruining his life or even have him arrested.

Those rich kids and spoiled girls going after people eating their meals on the streets now and demanding knees and fists do not respect their space, time and right to have a meal in peace yet somehow respect the territory of armed hillbillies that would welcome them with boiling lead.

When a woman say "you must respect others if you want to be respected" its simply cause she has nothing to earn respect wheter we talk about behaviour or pure value as a person...she is bullsh1tting you into thinking that if you are compliant to her demands she will be nice to you, trust me its not gonna happen.

Respect comes 10% of the times from your sheer value (lms, professional, accomplishments, whatever) and 90% of time from fear of your reaction also dont confuse respect with ammiration, those are two different things.
 

metalwater

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I guess your posting for some debate. I don't agree with this one. fear is just fear and can lead to compliance. compliance and respect are not the same. I can get compliance from many in all sorts of ways by using my power (physical strength, money, reputation, etc..). Respect is something that can only be given by choice. It is one of the pillars of what we talk about, can't negotiate desire or respect. Can get compliance by fear all day long. That will just make us cause more fear because the compliance does not feel as good as respect but we might keep trying.
 

AttackFormation

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I guess your posting for some debate. I don't agree with this one. fear is just fear and can lead to compliance. compliance and respect are not the same. I can get compliance from many in all sorts of ways by using my power (physical strength, money, reputation, etc..). Respect is something that can only be given by choice. It is one of the pillars of what we talk about, can't negotiate desire or respect. Can get compliance by fear all day long. That will just make us cause more fear because the compliance does not feel as good as respect but we might keep trying.
I agree with this, conflating compliant fear with respect is a character flaw, but I don't think that's what WDW truly intended. I think he simply means that fear is in practice a larger component of "good behavior" than respect is. If you reflect on how people behave in dating, I think there is a solid argument for that.
 

BeExcellent

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Not in a healthy relationship. But you’ll see that in toxic relationships all day long.

Respect is a requirement for real love.

Compliance arises out of fear and breeds hatred.

Abuse is born of control and the need to control, the need to have compliance.

But respect cannot arise from abuse, compliance or control.

Fear is a protective self preservation mechanism. Fear is not love and while someone may fear you and respect your ability to enforce consequences that is not the kind of respect you want as a man, for it has been coerced rather than freely given.
Real respect is not coerced by fear it is freely given to you because of love.

Very different things but people do confuse & conflate the two.
 

derby1

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Interesting story, stupidly i lived with a dealer in my younger years, he used to have a way of dealing with people with his left fist, who didnt pay up..

people "admired" him and used to buy him loads of drinks etc..

I used to help people out, sometimes we used to let people stop with us etc , I wouldnt even say what i did was weak, or blue pill, I wasnt a walk over.

HOWEVER, no one bought me a drink ever, if anything they would slag me off........never him

FEAR 100%
 

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Who Dares Win

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I guess your posting for some debate. I don't agree with this one. fear is just fear and can lead to compliance. compliance and respect are not the same. I can get compliance from many in all sorts of ways by using my power (physical strength, money, reputation, etc..). Respect is something that can only be given by choice. It is one of the pillars of what we talk about, can't negotiate desire or respect. Can get compliance by fear all day long. That will just make us cause more fear because the compliance does not feel as good as respect but we might keep trying.
We have to clarify what respect is, respect can be described as many things generally.

I believe many people give to the concept of respect many shades of what is actually admiration or esteem which can be, but not necessarily.

If I say that egyptians respect israelian territory does it mean that egyptians do not invade it cause they have high esteem of them as people or cause they fear a retaliation from their effective military forces?

If I say that a woman respect her husbands requests for her to stay in shape and not to flirt with other men cause she fears that he will leave her with no appeal otherwise, am I wrong?

Many women love their husband but they know he is into them so much that even if they get fat he will stick around, they love him and recognize his value as man but dont fear to be dumped nor his reactions for those misbehaviour.
Sure they dont flirt with other men not cheated on him cause of their attachment to him yet they know his lesser demands are not mandatory.

I hope I explained myself, I guess we should actually focus on what we consider when we talk about respect.
 

metalwater

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Interesting story, stupidly i lived with a dealer in my younger years, he used to have a way of dealing with people with his left fist, who didnt pay up..

people "admired" him and used to buy him loads of drinks etc..

I used to help people out, sometimes we used to let people stop with us etc , I wouldnt even say what i did was weak, or blue pill, I wasnt a walk over.

HOWEVER, no one bought me a drink ever, if anything they would slag me off........never him

FEAR 100%
with a boss type, that a dealer can be they can actually have both fear and respect. they can actually do business in an honorable way and treat ppl fair. and if that doesn't work, then fear does the job. these type of guys make excellent friends, as long as your honest. honest and legal have nothing to do with each other.
 

metalwater

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We have to clarify what respect is, respect can be described as many things generally.

I believe many people give to the concept of respect many shades of what is actually admiration or esteem which can be, but not necessarily.

If I say that egyptians respect israelian territory does it mean that egyptians do not invade it cause they have high esteem of them as people or cause they fear a retaliation from their effective military forces?

If I say that a woman respect her husbands requests for her to stay in shape and not to flirt with other men cause she fears that he will leave her with no appeal otherwise, am I wrong?

Many women love their husband but they know he is into them so much that even if they get fat he will stick around, they love him and recognize his value as man but dont fear to be dumped nor his reactions for those misbehaviour.
Sure they dont flirt with other men not cheated on him cause of their attachment to him yet they know his lesser demands are not mandatory.

I hope I explained myself, I guess we should actually focus on what we consider when we talk about respect.
I know what you mean, I think it might just be semantics. I know a few guys that keep the wife in line with fear, they are not bad guys but they don't hesitate to slap the girl if they think she needs it. most of those girls behave. It is fear.

If the girl respects or fears the husband they do the right stuff without any prompting. So some of the guys when they realize they have lost respect move to fear. Not because they are mean, they don't know what else to do. I certainly considered it at one point.
 

BeExcellent

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If a man resorts to physical means to incite fear in his woman he has lost her respect and is now seeking compliance through use of force. That is how abuse arises.

If a man keeps himself desirable to other women and isn’t afraid to walk away or choose another woman, he doesn’t need to get physical. He doesn’t need to be intimidating or exert control.

I am not talking about armies and respect amongst nations. That is different than a man and woman who are a couple.

Weakness comes in a number of forms. Blue pill supplication is one kind of weakness. Bullying by force is another.

Both types are weak, even though getting physical is using strength to intimidate & gain compliance. Neither type wants to lose the girl...therein lies the weakness.

You always must retain the ability to walk away from the relationship. She must know you have the ability to walk.

Some of y’all have never seen a truly healthy relationship and so you don’t understand that a woman can love you & be deeply devoted to you and such a woman reveres and respects her man...and while she may fear losing him it’s not because of anything he is doing...rather it’s because of who he is and his desirability to others.
 

metalwater

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If a man resorts to physical means to incite fear in his woman he has lost her respect and is now seeking compliance through use of force. That is how abuse arises.

If a man keeps himself desirable to other women and isn’t afraid to walk away or choose another woman, he doesn’t need to get physical. He doesn’t need to be intimidating or exert control.

I am not talking about armies and respect amongst nations. That is different than a man and woman who are a couple.

Weakness comes in a number of forms. Blue pill supplication is one kind of weakness. Bullying by force is another.

Both types are weak, even though getting physical is using strength to intimidate & gain compliance. Neither type wants to lose the girl...therein lies the weakness.

You always must retain the ability to walk away from the relationship. She must know you have the ability to walk.

Some of y’all have never seen a truly healthy relationship and so you don’t understand that a woman can love you & be deeply devoted to you and such a woman reveres and respects her man...and while she may fear losing him it’s not because of anything he is doing...rather it’s because of who he is and his desirability to others.
women use the terms "weakness", "insecurity" and a few other hot words to try to control men. shame is it usually works and other men will even get on the bandwagon. the winner is the strongest usually, law of the jungle. a couple of the guys I know, tell it differently. If she doesn't like it she can go or she can shape up.

I don't believe in being cruel to anyone(according to me..), not even dogs; unless they bite me.

I don't agree with you again. (haha). I have had women that treated me like a king, red pill lense tells me it is because at that time my SMV was so much higher. they looked ok, but I was on top and did not even know it; shame on me as I wanted Disney.

It has nothing to do with who he is and everything about the opinion of others in most cases.
 
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NSX-R

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I own one if not the best ****tail bar in my area. As soon as people find out that I’m the owner i earn almost immediately respect 99% of the time . But when some people get to know you more they tend to become more comfortable and sometimes they lower their respect towards you . My answer to that is , zero compromise. If someone goes out if the line even for the slightest bit , then he’s out .
Zero compromise is my 0.2 cents on this
 

mrgoodstuff

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I own one if not the best ****tail bar in my area. As soon as people find out that I’m the owner i earn almost immediately respect 99% of the time . But when some people get to know you more they tend to become more comfortable and sometimes they lower their respect towards you . My answer to that is , zero compromise. If someone goes out if the line even for the slightest bit , then he’s out .
Zero compromise is my 0.2 cents on this
Earlier before you were as experienced did you let some lower respect slide and watch it get out of hand?
 

TyTe`EyEz

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Lets be honest, genuine earned respect accounts for no more than 10% of the cases wheter is from a woman or a man.

90% of the times respecting someone space, desiders and views only comes from the fear of the conseguences of not doing so.

A woman married to a violent criminal will hardly come up with fake accusation to win a divorce and custody of the kids, she knows he will go at her heavy for that therefore she respects his life, his freedom and rights and surely wont offend any of those with lies.
A woman married to a nice beta, helpless incapable of retaliations one as we know has no problem to fabricate lies to get more money in the court even at the cost of ruining his life or even have him arrested.

Those rich kids and spoiled girls going after people eating their meals on the streets now and demanding knees and fists do not respect their space, time and right to have a meal in peace yet somehow respect the territory of armed hillbillies that would welcome them with boiling lead.

When a woman say "you must respect others if you want to be respected" its simply cause she has nothing to earn respect wheter we talk about behaviour or pure value as a person...she is bullsh1tting you into thinking that if you are compliant to her demands she will be nice to you, trust me its not gonna happen.

Respect comes 10% of the times from your sheer value (lms, professional, accomplishments, whatever) and 90% of time from fear of your reaction also dont confuse respect with ammiration, those are two different things.
I didn't read the thread, but I've seen enough murder-suicides in the news to know that women should be scared lol
 

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TyTe`EyEz

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I didn't read the thread, but I've seen enough murder-suicides in the news to know that women should be scared lol
I reckon they had him pegged as a beta b1tch, then he hit his breaking point. Sad on both accounts.
 

NSX-R

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Earlier before you were as experienced did you let some lower respect slide and watch it get out of hand?
Yes . Sometimes were so bad that people even were becoming abusive with almost nothing as an excuse .
I do strongly believe that depending on your habits ,your job and the way you represent yourself plays the biggest role getting respect from people . Keeping a cool composure and not letting them get too much into your personal life or keeping them secret is what makes them guessing all the time and thanks to that you can maintain or elevate their respect to you . But still i do believe it’s more complicated.
I’m gonna have to disagree with the op though. Many of the people i earn respect from is people who’ve never been in my place , or at least live in my area . Which means they have nothing to lose . Op examples is mistaking threats with respect. An abused woman won’t push charges on her man not because out of respect for him , but mostly because usually is threatened by that man or in some other cases they are afraid to be humiliated by the public opinion or because they want to protect their children. Believing that respect is earned only through violence is the weakest mindset that someone can have .
 

CAPSLOCK BANDIT

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This mind and this body, they allow us to experience things and our experiences form our individual context and eventually perspective.

Those who do not respect themselves, they do not have the ability to respect others... Respect is a concept of association and we are unwilling to treat any person we do not share an intimate connection with, better than we treat ourselves... If we treat ourselves like ****, we literally have to treat others the same way or worse, the ego wills it.

Fear is a response; one that can be conditioned. Respect cannot be conditioned, unless that conditioning
is done by the self.

Self Conditioned Fear is called Anxiety.

I would say Anxiety relates closer to Respect than Fear does, because both relate to the self, where as Fear, our response to it is to herd.... Ideology and Religion are a direct response to Fear in my opinion, more so ideology because it can be more readily adopted/dismissed without dire social repercussions.
 

RangerMIke

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Lets be honest, genuine earned respect accounts for no more than 10% of the cases wheter is from a woman or a man.

90% of the times respecting someone space, desiders and views only comes from the fear of the conseguences of not doing so.

A woman married to a violent criminal will hardly come up with fake accusation to win a divorce and custody of the kids, she knows he will go at her heavy for that therefore she respects his life, his freedom and rights and surely wont offend any of those with lies.
A woman married to a nice beta, helpless incapable of retaliations one as we know has no problem to fabricate lies to get more money in the court even at the cost of ruining his life or even have him arrested.

Those rich kids and spoiled girls going after people eating their meals on the streets now and demanding knees and fists do not respect their space, time and right to have a meal in peace yet somehow respect the territory of armed hillbillies that would welcome them with boiling lead.

When a woman say "you must respect others if you want to be respected" its simply cause she has nothing to earn respect wheter we talk about behaviour or pure value as a person...she is bullsh1tting you into thinking that if you are compliant to her demands she will be nice to you, trust me its not gonna happen.

Respect comes 10% of the times from your sheer value (lms, professional, accomplishments, whatever) and 90% of time from fear of your reaction also dont confuse respect with ammiration, those are two different things.
Respect is earned not gifted. You earn this through the use of power, there are three powers a person can use to earn respect and the smart man uses all three depending on the circumstances:

(1) Coercive Power: "Do what I want or there will be consequences or no reward." This is actually the WORST power you can use because it is only effective as long as others care and believe you can act on your threats. As soon as people believe you no longer have this ability, respect is gone. But it is useful in certain circumstances. For example: If a woman is doing something you do not like, you withdraw your attention and walk away. Now if the woman does not give a fvck about your attention... this will not work... if she believes at some point you will come crawling back, it will not work. The key to making coercive power work is to be painfully consistent, and you have to be prepared to follow through with your threats.

(2) Expert Power: "Do what I want because I know what I'm doing." This is a good one, but it does have it's pit-falls. First the other person has to value what you know.... second you really have to know what you are doing. As an example when it comes to women is she needs your help with something and she knows you can deliver. The thing you have to remember when you are exercising expert power is you MUST get something in return for what you do... always get reciprocity. Too many men just give this sh1t up for free, and no one respects or values anything just given to them. Leverage everything to an advantage... EVERYTHING.

(3) Charismatic Power: "Do what I want because I'm awesome and you like me." This is the best... but it is also the hardest to create and even harder to maintain. You have to be charming, a great communicator, and an attractive personality. When it comes to women, this is really just being the best version of yourself possible... and when it comes to communication with women, you have to learn to communicate emotionally. This takes A LOT of work and this should be your baseline goal in relationships. If you have charismatic power, people will do what you want even if you are not present or doing something they need.

You should be using all three, so to be successful with women at some time you will use all three. I do agree with the OP, that without some form of consequences, none of this works.
 

mrgoodstuff

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Respect is earned not gifted. You earn this through the use of power, there are three powers a person can use to earn respect and the smart man uses all three depending on the circumstances:

(1) Coercive Power: "Do what I want or there will be consequences or no reward." This is actually the WORST power you can use because it is only effective as long as others care and believe you can act on your threats. As soon as people believe you no longer have this ability, respect is gone. But it is useful in certain circumstances. For example: If a woman is doing something you do not like, you withdraw your attention and walk away. Now if the woman does not give a fvck about your attention... this will not work... if she believes at some point you will come crawling back, it will not work. The key to making coercive power work is to be painfully consistent, and you have to be prepared to follow through with your threats.

(2) Expert Power: "Do what I want because I know what I'm doing." This is a good one, but it does have it's pit-falls. First the other person has to value what you know.... second you really have to know what you are doing. As an example when it comes to women is she needs your help with something and she knows you can deliver. The thing you have to remember when you are exercising expert power is you MUST get something in return for what you do... always get reciprocity. Too many men just give this sh1t up for free, and no one respects or values anything just given to them. Leverage everything to an advantage... EVERYTHING.

(3) Charismatic Power: "Do what I want because I'm awesome and you like me." This is the best... but it is also the hardest to create and even harder to maintain. You have to be charming, a great communicator, and an attractive personality. When it comes to women, this is really just being the best version of yourself possible... and when it comes to communication with women, you have to learn to communicate emotionally. This takes A LOT of work and this should be your baseline goal in relationships. If you have charismatic power, people will do what you want even if you are not present or doing something they need.

You should be using all three, so to be successful with women at some time you will use all three. I do agree with the OP, that without some form of consequences, none of this works.
You can make all the right actions and a group or person can give low to zero respect due to their agenda, biases or ignorance.

This is a great list however to those willing to receive you.
 
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