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OLD feels like a waste

BeExcellent

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Thats where you give her a chance to talk herself into sleeping with you on the first date. She doesnt feel like shes sleeping with a stranger as she knows some stuff about you and has glimpsed your personality albeit thru text or phone conversation.
Least thats how i approach it.
That’s what I watch my friend do. Currently he’s actively chatting with probably 10 different girls at various stages of interaction. Some are already multi year plates, some he’s recently bedded and they think they are going to rope him into an exclusive relationship (they are categorically wrong)...some he hasn’t yet met in person. I get amused because I have an unusual vantage point with him that he allows me. The women all think they are special, they all think sex is going to yoke him. They do not realize sex is a commodity he can get easily and anywhere.

Women want to feel special. The level of interaction and banter my friend creates in being conversational causes investment by these women (because engaging male conversationalists are unusual) and they do in fact talk themselves into having sex with him before they meet him.

That investment helps women feel comfortable enough to send him nudes or revealing pics etc., so before he meets them in many cases they are already comfortable with physical intimacy. I thought my ex BF was talented at this...but not even my ex had the skillset my friend has. It’s pretty dam impressive, lol.
 

Scaramouche

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Dear Flexpert,
Don't lose heart,the light is in the upland soon the vaccine will bring some relief......On line Dating in terms of results is a depressing business,but consider,perhaps its real value is in helping your verbal skills and developing and refining techniques to play even manipulate a Woman....Some might call that Charm....understanding what your dating strengths are,is a wonderful attribute!
 

Bigpapa

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I'm fairly good looking guy and have a nice apt in a popular part of the city. But I don't have much luck with OLD, they mostly ghost or flake on me before I can even meet them. Others won't even agree to meet because of the "pandemic".

Granted, I probably only spend an hour or two on it per week, but it's not nearly as efficient as it was even 2-3 years ago.

For reference I am using Hinge which I have used very successfully in the past.

I would like to meet women at places like sports clubs, improv, spin classes, any kind of groups like that, but pretty much everything in my city is closed down.

I'm getting a bit jaded from it all now. It's hard to have any sense of abundance when you literally cannot even get a girl to commit to showing up for a first date.
you should see old only as entertainment and have no expectation from it :)

the quality of girls there is way lower than what you can get in real life , so always have this in your mind

in terms of abundance , it is very unlikely to get that from old . Abundance comes from having a cool lifestyle , and people navigating unconscious towards you, because you are a cool person
 

SW15

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Try staying in contact with a text her and there between the time you set the date and the actual date. Almost all the flaking issues were solved by me doing that.
With app swiping for dates, the texting in between feels like babysitting to prevent the flakes. I've never liked it.

A flake occurs when not enough value has been demonstrated. Men need to demonstrate more value now with swipe apps because women have so many more choices as compared to an absence of swipe apps. Before swipe apps, the women who were on OkCupid, Plenty of Fish, and Match were getting their inboxes filled up quite dramatically as well. Swipe apps seems to have taken that behavior from ~2010 to a new level.

My flaking issues have been reduced by demonstrating value with in-person approaching at non-bar venues. Few men have the boldness to approach at a grocery store or outdoors on a walking/hiking path or college campus. I wish I did non-bar approaching more in college when I had access to the college campus instead of focus on night game during that time. With that said, any relationship I would have formed from non-bar approaching on a college campus during those years would have ended by now.

you should see old only as entertainment and have no expectation from it :)

the quality of girls there is way lower than what you can get in real life , so always have this in your mind

in terms of abundance , it is very unlikely to get that from old . Abundance comes from having a cool lifestyle , and people navigating unconscious towards you, because you are a cool person
On swipe apps, a female 5 has so many options that she becomes conditioned to expect the best. Since she draws a lot of attention, she'll only select men 7.5+ and higher and have sex with them. She'll then realize that while she can get sex from a top tier, she's less likely to get commitment from one. She might get commitment from a male 5-6, but she'll be utterly bored when she compares them to the 8-9s who she had sex with prior.

Abundance does not come from scavenging on swipe apps.
 

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BackInTheGame78

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With app swiping for dates, the texting in between feels like babysitting to prevent the flakes. I've never liked it.

A flake occurs when not enough value has been demonstrated. Men need to demonstrate more value now with swipe apps because women have so many more choices as compared to an absence of swipe apps. Before swipe apps, the women who were on OkCupid, Plenty of Fish, and Match were getting their inboxes filled up quite dramatically as well. Swipe apps seems to have taken that behavior from ~2010 to a new level.

My flaking issues have been reduced by demonstrating value with in-person approaching at non-bar venues. Few men have the boldness to approach at a grocery store or outdoors on a walking/hiking path or college campus. I wish I did non-bar approaching more in college when I had access to the college campus instead of focus on night game during that time. With that said, any relationship I would have formed from non-bar approaching on a college campus during those years would have ended by now.



On swipe apps, a female 5 has so many options that she becomes conditioned to expect the best. Since she draws a lot of attention, she'll only select men 7.5+ and higher and have sex with them. She'll then realize that while she can get sex from a top tier, she's less likely to get commitment from one. She might get commitment from a male 5-6, but she'll be utterly bored when she compares them to the 8-9s who she had sex with prior.

Abundance does not come from scavenging on swipe apps.
Nah, not to me. I ask them interesting questions and we have fun exchanges.
 

americandude

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OLD has worked for me. I met my ex-wife when she was 19 and I was 28 on AOL instant messenger. I had already dated women through AOL for two years prior to meeting my ex. We were together 17 years and have a son together. I've been divorced for three years and have had good experiences using OLD. I am an American in France, so it's been pretty interesting. I am currently dating A Polish woman that I met on Meetic and she is amazing. I have dated French, Ukrainian, Russian, Romanian, Brazilian, American, Estonian, etc..women, but this Polish woman has been pretty damn amazing....and I met her on OLD, so don't get discouraged.

I'll just add that this woman doesn't speak very good English, so I had the added difficulty of seducing her in French,lol..... I always feel that I can't express myself as well in French, although I've lived here several years.
 
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Bigpapa

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OLD has worked for me. I met my ex-wife when she was 19 and I was 28 on AOL instant messenger. I had already dated women through AOL for two years prior to meeting my ex. We were together 17 years and have a son together. I've been divorced for three years and have had good experiences using OLD. I am an American in France, so it's been pretty interesting. I am currently dating A Polish woman that I met on Meetic and she is amazing. I have dated French, Ukrainian, Russian, Romanian, Brazilian, American, Estonian, etc..women, but this Polish woman has been pretty damn amazing....and I met her on OLD, so don't get discouraged.

I'll just add that this woman doesn't speak very good English, so I had the added difficulty of seducing her in French,lol..... I always feel that I can't express myself as well in French, although I've lived here several years.
I am not saying that is not possible to find interesting women on old , but for sure it takes less time doing this in the real life :)

in addition to this , you are quite exotic for being an American in France , so this definitely helps you
 

americandude

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I am not saying that is not possible to find interesting women on old , but for sure it takes less time doing this in the real life :)

in addition to this , you are quite exotic for being an American in France , so this definitely helps you
I'm learning Polish too. We were in bed last Sunday and I would tell her the parts of her body in English and she would tell me the Polish equivalent..she has an an incredible body...she does yoga and is mostly vegetarian...no red meat, so she tastes amazing.
 

Aeterna

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OLD has worked for me. I met my ex-wife when she was 19 and I was 28 on AOL instant messenger. I had already dated women through AOL for two years prior to meeting my ex. We were together 17 years and have a son together. I've been divorced for three years and have had good experiences using OLD. I am an American in France, so it's been pretty interesting. I am currently dating A Polish woman that I met on Meetic and she is amazing. I have dated French, Ukrainian, Russian, Romanian, Brazilian, American, Estonian, etc..women, but this Polish woman has been pretty damn amazing....and I met her on OLD, so don't get discouraged.

I'll just add that this woman doesn't speak very good English, so I had the added difficulty of seducing her in French,lol..... I always feel that I can't express myself as well in French, although I've lived here several years.
You met your ex-wife 21 years ago during a time where social media and OLD were not prevalent.

You then started using them again when you were 46. Correct me if I'm wrong but the age range of women that you would typically match with would be mid to late 30s or early 40s.

I don't speak for the majority of men, but for me personally I would rather deal with women 18-22.

You are also using the apps overseas and in my experience I received far more matches since you automatically have an increased status of being an American.

The reason why a majority of guys are discouraged from the swipe app era is because you are essentially giving the average woman the dating life of a celebrity without the work to become one. The only difference is instead of rich simps messaging her, it is the vast majority of men.
 

americandude

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You met your ex-wife 21 years ago during a time where social media and OLD were not prevalent.

You then started using them again when you were 46. Correct me if I'm wrong but the age range of women that you would typically match with would be mid to late 30s or early 40s.

I don't speak for the majority of men, but for me personally I would rather deal with women 18-22.

You are also using the apps overseas and in my experience I received far more matches since you automatically have an increased status of being an American.

The reason why a majority of guys are discouraged from the swipe app era is because you are essentially giving the average woman the dating life of a celebrity without the work to become one. The only difference is instead of rich simps messaging her, it is the vast majority of men.
You are correct, but it in March it will be 4 years since my divorce, so I was 45. I don't lie about my age and the youngest woman I met on OLD that I dated was 12 years younger, but interestingly enough, the women that I had relationships with that I met in person were much younger.... in their twenties or early thirties. I look about ten years younger, so I get lots of attention from younger women.
The woman I am with now has never been married and doesn't have any children.
 
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B80

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Photos make a massive difference ime. Year ago was putting up half arsed pics that didn't shine me in best light.
, mainly getting 4/5's in late 30's or into 40's.

Recently changed to a cringy car selfie (but look good) and 1 topless photo. Over 200 matches I've kept, and they're just the women I'm half interested in. I live in a UK town conurbation of around 300k.

Ages range from 19 to late 40's. I swipe left on anyone that mentions Instagram in their bio.

Shows just how important pics are with OLD.

Bio just says 6"2. Athletic.

I'm 41.
 
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Lookatu

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she does yoga and is mostly vegetarian...no red meat, so she tastes amazing.
Is there really a correlation between being vegetarian and having a really clean, nice smelling/tasting pvssy? This is a serious question because one of my plates that's a vegetarian has one of the most cleanest pvssies I've ever had in my entire life. LOL
 

Bigpapa

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Is there really a correlation between being vegetarian and having a really clean, nice smelling/tasting pvssy? This is a serious question because one of my plates that's a vegetarian has one of the most cleanest pvssies I've ever had in my entire life. LOL
I think that this has to do more with the hygiene than anything else

what is true is that the smell and taste is way better
 

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LiveYourDream

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Is there really a correlation between being vegetarian and having a really clean, nice smelling/tasting pvssy? This is a serious question because one of my plates that's a vegetarian has one of the most cleanest pvssies I've ever had in my entire life. LOL
A high plant based (vs processed foods) vegetarian diet tends to be much more alkaline than the Standard American Diet. Her fluids excreted will likely lean toward being much more alkaline and less acidic. Thus the differences you notice.

I notice the changes in myself when I switch my own diet.

Worst for me is if I eat lots of processed foods or high levels of meat/keto-ish. Neither is pleasant at all. Quite the opposite and strongly so.

Most pleasant by far is when my diet is whole foods based, mostly veggies, with a bit of fruit and a bit of seeds/nuts. Next is with a little animal protein added. I personally feel best eating these ways as they fuel my body the best, as to where I feel the most clear and energetic. Win-Win. Good for me and good for my partner. Prefer to always be sweet for him.
 
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BadBoy89

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I have friends who slay on OLD. They say these 3 things:

1. Top notch photos
2. An interesting profile
3. Solid text game

My friend who routinely slays on OLD checks his swipe apps several times a day, is a handsome, well dressed guy who is also witty and engaging. He strikes up conversations constantly (never with ‘Hi’ or ‘How are you’) with starters like “So how’s your Wednesday evening treating you? Up to anything scandalous?” and women gobble up his text game. He’s very chatty via text and writes long thoughtful responses. This hooks women emotionally such that they get curious enough to meet him out...or come straight to his. If a woman expects him to pedestalize her or gush about her he throws out an IDGAF compliance test...and the chicks almost always comply. It’s interesting to observe.
Just wondering, how come all your friends are top notch rich alpha males who can sleep with any women anytime, but you are not hooked up with any of them? Maybe if you had ONE friend like that I could understand, but it seems like all your male friends are God‘s gift to women.

What rich handsome alpha male would tell a woman friend what he does and writes to girls online? Maybe if I was in my 20s I would admit going online to find a girl to my best friend, but in my 30s and 40s telling a woman I’m going online to find girl, AND telling her what I’m writing to these girls? It doesn’t right.

If your friend is handsome, witty, and engaging, why is he going online to find girls?

James Bond [8:43 pm]: “So Pu$$y, did you do anything Scandalous with Goldfinger today?”
Pu$$y Galore: [10:15 pm]: “Not really, we just drive around Fort Knox.”

Rock on!
 

BeExcellent

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Just wondering, how come all your friends are top notch rich alpha males who can sleep with any women anytime, but you are not hooked up with any of them? Maybe if you had ONE friend like that I could understand, but it seems like all your male friends are God‘s gift to women.

What rich handsome alpha male would tell a woman friend what he does and writes to girls online? Maybe if I was in my 20s I would admit going online to find a girl to my best friend, but in my 30s and 40s telling a woman I’m going online to find girl, AND telling her what I’m writing to these girls? It doesn’t right.

If your friend is handsome, witty, and engaging, why is he going online to find girls?

James Bond [8:43 pm]: “So Pu$$y, did you do anything Scandalous with Goldfinger today?”
Pu$$y Galore: [10:15 pm]: “Not really, we just drive around Fort Knox.”

Rock on!
A great quote. One that I actually relate to, lol.

The swipe apps are easy for him. Efficient. He can use the swipe apps to meet women (many of whom do not go out a lot) with minimum time investment. His online close rate is about 90% for those who either approach him or are receptive to him.

His first meet flake rate is low because he builds rapport well and is erudite in his banter. So when he goes out he’s already got a date set so therefore a woman is in his sights (preselected) as it were. But he’s a master at cold approach on the fly too. Anywhere. It’s impressive. Truly, lol.

He is who he is & zero fvcks given.

I dunno. I’ve always been around these sorts of men (my father was one, as were my grandfather and my uncles) so consequently these are the type of men who make up my friend circle and those who I select to get involved with. The archetype is familiar and these men are a blast to be around.

I am also a blast to be around.

I was married to the owner of the hottest nightclub in an internationally well known nightlife city. I love to dance, love men, and gravitate to men who know the game and how to play it. My story is various places on the forum. I’m still surrounded by sought after men wherever I go, which is nice, but everyone has tons of options (I do; the guys do; my girlfriends do), and nobody is thirsty. So we all enjoy each other’s time and company.

I enjoy people and I adore my friends, men and women both. I also love me. People feel all that and it is attractive. Then you add the looks and the sexual edgy vibe I’ve always had...and a caring demeanor? I am magnetic. I am grateful for that and I am effusive to those close to me. So people enjoy me and I enjoy me. Life is too short to be stuffy and stodgy.

Last night I was out with my playboy best bud, his date (a new first date who he subsequently banged)...another playboy who I dated briefly about 14 or 15 months ago (until I abruptly dropped him for BS behavior after a handful of dates)...his best mate, another player friend who randomly showed up (I had dropped him from my close circle before Christmas for being an ass hat & trying to tell me how to run my life (he wants very badly to ingratiate himself back in my good graces and my guy’s good graces as well)...my best girlfriend, her man, the man I’m seeing, and another couple who are super hip where the man is a known playboy but who honestly wants to settle down and his girlfriend who is a very attractive super sexy brunette. We knew all the staff at the venue, had a blast and I introduced everyone around.

The rest of my regular running buddies were out in another part of town
but I expect my guy and I might see them tonight after we grab dinner.

Why is that so hard to digest? Later this month I’m going to dinner with a fellow member of SS and my player friend. We’ve all met before & my buddy is going to offer some advice to our fellow member...technical advise if you will. I am as advertised. So is my friend. So is the other member of SS.

I share as I do here because there are people enjoying life and interaction with fellow human beings. My life isn’t perfect but it’s pretty cool. I’m happy. My friends are not perfect; their lives are not perfect either...but there is a great synergy and joy in associating with other people who you enjoy. We only have now. Be cool, be kind & have fun & appreciate those close to you. I cannot complain. Life is sweet.
 

BackInTheGame78

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That’s what I watch my friend do. Currently he’s actively chatting with probably 10 different girls at various stages of interaction. Some are already multi year plates, some he’s recently bedded and they think they are going to rope him into an exclusive relationship (they are categorically wrong)...some he hasn’t yet met in person. I get amused because I have an unusual vantage point with him that he allows me. The women all think they are special, they all think sex is going to yoke him. They do not realize sex is a commodity he can get easily and anywhere.

Women want to feel special. The level of interaction and banter my friend creates in being conversational causes investment by these women (because engaging male conversationalists are unusual) and they do in fact talk themselves into having sex with him before they meet him.

That investment helps women feel comfortable enough to send him nudes or revealing pics etc., so before he meets them in many cases they are already comfortable with physical intimacy. I thought my ex BF was talented at this...but not even my ex had the skillset my friend has. It’s pretty dam impressive, lol.
This is exactly what I do and what works for me regarding texting and having fun, interesting convos.

Most women I date long term we have some form of communication every day from the first day I text them until I stop seeing them. Goes both ways, and I never double text, whoever sends the last message the night before waits for the other person to respond the next day.

I ask random questions, we have fun convos and more than one woman has told me how it has made them feel a connection with me even when I am not with them and how they felt close to me and like they have known me for a lot longer than they have. People are DYING to feel connected with someone these days in this digital, non-social and now scary COVID world. If you know how to provide that they will be like putty in your hands.

Most people on the forum will advise not to do this because they are scared they will say something wrong and the girl will lose interest. I think this makes no sense. Clearly texting is a tool that can be used to great advantage if you know how.

If a person's goal is self-improvement in all areas of their life like so many say then why would you choose to not improve in something that can make a huge difference in positively effecting your flake rate(mine is close to 0 since I have been doing this)? Anyone who believes they shouldn't text because it can cause a woman to lose interest clearly doesn't know how to text properly. I have found it can greatly increase a woman's interest especially initially within the first month or two.

To be clear, I am not advocating texting all day long but sending 2-4 messages back and forth throughout the day is pretty normal for me.

So many people want to follow these rigid "rules" that don't allow them to be fluid and adapt to changing times and then wonder why they lack success. Others think a 50% flake rate is normal. In reality, they are causing the flakes by their pre-date behavior many times and then try to say the women "wasn't interested" when in reality their behavior is telling the woman THEY aren't interested.
 
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