"The Coffee Shop Girl You Never Spoke To"
You've replayed it a hundred times. She stood three feet away, scrolling her phone. You had an opening. You composed the perfect line — after she was gone.
For all you know, she's married now. To some guy who said something. Anything.
Openers are cheap. Almost any sentence works when it's delivered within three seconds. The expensive part is the standing there, drafting and deleting, while the window quietly closes.
The "22 Rules" stripped out my hesitation. What to open with, how to keep it alive, and the one habit that costs guys more women than anything else: waiting for perfect.
Need some quick advice
- Thread starter backbreaker
- Start date
"She Wants a Man, Not a Boy"
You asked her if she wanted to grab coffee. Then you asked if the time worked. Then you asked if the place was okay. Then you asked if she'd prefer tea.
Four questions. Four chances for her to say no. Four signals that you're terrified of making a decision.
Plan it. Pick the place. Pick the time. Tell her where to meet you. She'll either show up or she won't.
Either way, you look like a man instead of a scared little boy.
backbreaker
Master Don Juan
Also, don't "what the hell" me, I know how to handle this situtation without any generic advice that has nothing to do with a particular situtation, however I just like to hear some different pov's because I might have missed something.
FYI, if I wanted her to "be with me now" I would say that, but I don't... I am in no rush whatsoever.
Deprogram
Reprogram
First I have to get her to be comfortable around me that she WANTS nothing more than to spend time with me, as a friend, because then If I do what I am supposed to do, I can reprogram her to see me in a different light.
When you have a distinct gameplan, all of that is easy... the HARD part is the first step, which is to get her to corolate me with having fun.
backbreaker
Master Don Juan
This is too generic to work with anyone. Different people have different situtations.
When you teach a child to swim you don't throw him in and say "alright damnit, if you can't get this now you are never going to swim becuase you don't want to". He is scared of the new surroundings. He has never seen a swimming pool before. Same here. She has been with the guy for 2 damn years, even if she really doesn't care for him that much, seeing anyone outside the relationship is a big step. You just don't lay down an altomatium and say "here you go, take or leave it" because you haven't given her anything to be interested IN, how can she have a high intrest level?
The answer to your question, if you got the courage to go on. Its pretty scary, because its you realize just how deep the rabbit hole goes.......
Matrix like green and blue pill...........
Its .......... The 85 / 15 rule with women. Shes with a guy, who is lets say giving her 85% of what she needs. But women are greedy and want to be happy they want that 100% emotional feel. So she searches for the 15% she is missing. And that is usually a guy friend, someone she can hang out around make her feel good and feel that 15% void that her bf isnt feeling. the problem with it is. the guy in the 15% will start to feel like hes the 85% guy and try to take her from the bf. She plays it for awhile. and what usally happens is she dumps both ( rarely ). usually finds another 15% guy. Or the guy that is giving her the 85% Starts seeing all the extra attention shes getting from the 15% guy and starts shaping up ( if only for temporary purposes ) she that 85 starts to go up and is now 95% and the other guy becomes 5%. then soon 0%. because now she is 100% happy by the 85% guy.
It is Really really hard to get some control in that if you are looking for a gf from it. if you play it right you can maybe get her to validate herself with you with some sexual counter and what not. But that depends on her bf, and the comments c/f neg hits you do etc. But in all its a touchy situation. because almost always they will defend that 85% guy to hell and back. until she takes her heard out of her ass. Which is another rariety in this world. She just be careful, the few times ive seen this happen, is when a girl is with a guy / bf / husband.. usually protective type, and she searches for old relationships / friendships. Because she cant go out to find a 15% guy because of her 85% guy. So she goes thru old phone numbers trying to find someone who was Comfortable, had the 15% she needs, so she calls him. So BE CAREFUL. Realize what you are, and use it to your advantage. alot of it if you are interested is, c/f with AMOG and no im not going to give tips on that. I personally hate when a guy tries to take a girl im with. so i dont teach it. But i will point out what she is doing.
Matrix like green and blue pill...........
Its .......... The 85 / 15 rule with women. Shes with a guy, who is lets say giving her 85% of what she needs. But women are greedy and want to be happy they want that 100% emotional feel. So she searches for the 15% she is missing. And that is usually a guy friend, someone she can hang out around make her feel good and feel that 15% void that her bf isnt feeling. the problem with it is. the guy in the 15% will start to feel like hes the 85% guy and try to take her from the bf. She plays it for awhile. and what usally happens is she dumps both ( rarely ). usually finds another 15% guy. Or the guy that is giving her the 85% Starts seeing all the extra attention shes getting from the 15% guy and starts shaping up ( if only for temporary purposes ) she that 85 starts to go up and is now 95% and the other guy becomes 5%. then soon 0%. because now she is 100% happy by the 85% guy.
It is Really really hard to get some control in that if you are looking for a gf from it. if you play it right you can maybe get her to validate herself with you with some sexual counter and what not. But that depends on her bf, and the comments c/f neg hits you do etc. But in all its a touchy situation. because almost always they will defend that 85% guy to hell and back. until she takes her heard out of her ass. Which is another rariety in this world. She just be careful, the few times ive seen this happen, is when a girl is with a guy / bf / husband.. usually protective type, and she searches for old relationships / friendships. Because she cant go out to find a 15% guy because of her 85% guy. So she goes thru old phone numbers trying to find someone who was Comfortable, had the 15% she needs, so she calls him. So BE CAREFUL. Realize what you are, and use it to your advantage. alot of it if you are interested is, c/f with AMOG and no im not going to give tips on that. I personally hate when a guy tries to take a girl im with. so i dont teach it. But i will point out what she is doing.
It's possible you can raise her interest in you--by all means, it's worth a try. But do it while keeping in mind that it could be that she's just temporarily looking for some extra attention that maybe her bf isn't giving her now. I'm just saying keep your other options open.
"I'm Not Looking for Anything Serious Right Now"
When a woman says it, guys hear a confession. A heads-up. A scheduling conflict.
Here's the translation: I don't feel anything. Right now. With you.
Watch what happens when a man triggers actual attraction. The busy career, the recent breakup, the "not in a place to date" — all of it evaporates instantly. The same woman who was guarding her freedom is suddenly free every night.
The "22 Rules" explain why. When the right switches flip, her timeline rearranges itself around you.
backbreaker
Master Don Juan
Guys keep in mind, I know this girl pretty well. I didn't just met her last week, I have known her for 5 years, I know how she thinks.
Also, I don't really mind If we never more than friends... we are good friends and that is perfectly fine with me. Basically I am just doing it because she looks good, gave me an open ended inventation and to be frank, I want to see if I am as good as I think I am.
If I AM, this will be the toughest I have ever had to pull, but it's definatly not impossible.
Also, I don't really mind If we never more than friends... we are good friends and that is perfectly fine with me. Basically I am just doing it because she looks good, gave me an open ended inventation and to be frank, I want to see if I am as good as I think I am.
If I AM, this will be the toughest I have ever had to pull, but it's definatly not impossible.
backbreaker
Master Don Juan
Here is an update for anyone who is interested.
Because she goes to school and works for her mom during the week, and I just plain work during the week, I knew and see for the future it is going to be hard to keep base with her during the week, which is fine for me. I think I spoke with her on Wednesay for around 10 mintues but that was it for the week. She sent me at an email every day however, telling me what's going on with her. We tried to met up sometime during the week for a quick lunch but I had to pretty much babysit my business partner who had sugery on Friday so that was out of the question.
She called me on Friday while I was cutting my hair I told her I would call her back. When I did call her back ,she told me that she had to babysit Friday and saturday and sunday morning (her way of saying she is not free for the weekend, and she wasn't lying I knew she had to babysit, she just had thought it would be for 2 days instead of 3).
After around 2 and a half hours, she called me back and asked was I doing anything later that night (friday) and I wasn't doing anything besides catching up on some sleep, so I told her no. She said to expect a phone call because she wanted to finally sit down and talk to me.
Of course she didn't call, and honeslty I didn't expect her to for 2 reasons... 1 she was babysitting a 6 year old... when a 6 year old goes to sleep, you sleep, otherwise you would be a reck ,and 2nd she has a bad habit of making false promises.
Anyway, as I said I didn't loose any sleep over the ordeal and went to bed very early and because I was tired. Sure enough she called me first thing Saturday morning around 8am, telling me she was babysitting and Jared (the kid) wore her out.
I calmly explanded to her that this was the reason I got mad at her and stopped talking to her 2 years ago, because she makes promises and doesn't keep them, which is very selfish and inconsidarate. Although I believed her story without a dobut, because I have a 4 and a 7 year old as sisters and know how it can be, plus I know the kid, I had to lay the groundwork that " I am not your punk *** BF that you can walk over without any type of regards for what I am going though or what I have to do". I told her it wasn't about her not calling me, honeslty I could care less, I dont' date her and it wouldn't make me a difference if you didn't call for a week, I don't have a right to get mad, but I am "irrated" that you would call me to make sure I am not doing anything and let me know that you want to talk to me, then not call, and then not pick up the phone and say something like "hey I am tired I will just talk to you tomorrow, sorry". I told her that I am not mad at her, but that was unaccecptable. She apologized and we changed the subject. (The sad thing is, I don't think she knew she did anything wrong... she is pretty hot, hot enough so that most men, espically her BF would not call her on any crap like that... I know I didn't 2 years ago).
Anyway, to make a long story short, we talked for around 2 hours yestrday off an on, still really catching up on each other.
I can tell a couple of things about her that are different from 2 years ago:
1) The more I talk to her, the more I realize she isn't anywhere near satisfied with her current relationship. It went from "I am with him and I am content" to "I hate it when he does this and this" to " I am mad at him, don't bring up his name" to " He is too immature for me".
I am really starting to think that is why she contacted me...
It turns out she had more feelings for me back then than I thought (I was a total AFC). Her and her BF got into a really bad arguement, actually over me, around a month ago, when he found a letter I wrote to her 2 years ago (even though it was not very serious). She said she was looking at the letter for 2 weeks or so, and then got up the nerve to write me. I actually remember when she first contacted me, I could tell she was actually nervous.
What I think is happening is that she is really unsatisfied with her relaitonship and probably contacted me because I was the last person she thought about being with before her current BF. I dont' think she knew, because I didn't know, how much in common we are, and all of the things that she didn't like about me, like how I wrote her everyday and always wanted to be around her, and always told her how much I like her, are no longer apart of me.
usually she calls me, and when she does she always sounds enthusitic, and I called her wednesday night and Saturday night. On Wednesday she sounded as well as you can expect after being in school all day and being at work, and yesterday when I called her (actually I thought she called me and I returned the call, only way I would have called) and she had this "thank god It's you" tone to her voice.
A couple of notes, she didn't call me to gripe about her BF or to let off some steem about him... I even tried to see what was going on with them because she was mad at him and told me "I don't want to talk to you about him, I have other friends for that".
I also get the sense that she really is not dying, but itching to see me. As I stated, it's going to be virtually impossible to see each other during the week unless I pick her up from school on mondays. her BF lives 200 miles away and comes in every weekend to see her (and when they get together he takes her over friends house to play video games, which is part of the reason she is pissed) so it's going to be hard to see her on weekends... This weekend would have been perfect because her BF was not in town but she had to babysit. However when I bring up the subject she sounds sincere and she says things like "that's why I contacted you in the first place, because I wanted to talk to you and spend so me time with you and see you again". and things like that, although I don't try to dwell on serious stuff and keep the convo as fun as possible.
Yesterday she contacted me with a legit computer problem (I do run a computer company and she knows I am a computer tech by trade) and she is probably the most computer illerate person I know. She was having a hard time describing what the problem was over her babysitters house (which is approx 2 mintues away from my apartment) and when I in all seriousness asked her did she want me to come over right quick and fix the problem, she said she wished but her mom was coming over to spend the night (long story, but her mom and the woman she was babysitting for are best friends, and her mom is actually afraid of the dark and will not sleep by herself... complicated).. she then asked would it be okay if she made me breakfast and I came over in the morning.
I do know the first time we get together again, I will take her to do something fun and that I know she likes, to reforce the idea that I am a fun person and that she wants to be around me because I am fun and do fun things. She likes to dance but hates the club (like me), and I know she likes to bowl but her BF will not take her, so I might take her bowling one day soon..
Other than the fact that I have not seen her yet, things seem to be going great... We don't spend to much time on the phone, when we do talk it's fun, the only things she every says about her BF when she does bring him up are "I don't want to talk about him" or "I can't stand him for whatever reason".
There are two main things to note that i think are key. I never told you how we met. I used to date her friend, a girl who used to be her best friend. I called used to call her over her house from time to time, and one day she called me looking for my GF at the time and we just clicked. When we broke up, for some reason I called her (also because I thought she was hot) and again we clicked. Anyway, one of the major things she used to tell me is that "it would feel funny dating my friend's ex. Now, her tone has changed so much that I even caught her taking shots at her yesterday, saying "you and her just wern't ment for each other " (and she is right) and " if you see her, you would want to let her see you first so that she would not run to all of her friends telling them that I was stocking her".
Another thing is that I used to be so infactuated with her, if she called me at 5 in the morning and asked me to get her some ice cream, i would ask what flavor. Once I drove all the way across town without my contacts in the pouring rain to pick her up and take her home from her babysitters house. Needless to say I put up with any crap she dished out because I was scared to "loose her". Now I can safely say that I have established myself as "wearing the pants". I never call her unless I am returning a call, I call her on her crap, although there has really only been 2 inncodents, and I let her know what's on my mind. The funny thing is She is alot more rececptive to me know in 5 days then she was for 1 year 2 years ago! It's like she doesn't want to disopoint me. She wrote me a letter that quoted the following (wasn't lying about the email once every business day)
Because she goes to school and works for her mom during the week, and I just plain work during the week, I knew and see for the future it is going to be hard to keep base with her during the week, which is fine for me. I think I spoke with her on Wednesay for around 10 mintues but that was it for the week. She sent me at an email every day however, telling me what's going on with her. We tried to met up sometime during the week for a quick lunch but I had to pretty much babysit my business partner who had sugery on Friday so that was out of the question.
She called me on Friday while I was cutting my hair I told her I would call her back. When I did call her back ,she told me that she had to babysit Friday and saturday and sunday morning (her way of saying she is not free for the weekend, and she wasn't lying I knew she had to babysit, she just had thought it would be for 2 days instead of 3).
After around 2 and a half hours, she called me back and asked was I doing anything later that night (friday) and I wasn't doing anything besides catching up on some sleep, so I told her no. She said to expect a phone call because she wanted to finally sit down and talk to me.
Of course she didn't call, and honeslty I didn't expect her to for 2 reasons... 1 she was babysitting a 6 year old... when a 6 year old goes to sleep, you sleep, otherwise you would be a reck ,and 2nd she has a bad habit of making false promises.
Anyway, as I said I didn't loose any sleep over the ordeal and went to bed very early and because I was tired. Sure enough she called me first thing Saturday morning around 8am, telling me she was babysitting and Jared (the kid) wore her out.
I calmly explanded to her that this was the reason I got mad at her and stopped talking to her 2 years ago, because she makes promises and doesn't keep them, which is very selfish and inconsidarate. Although I believed her story without a dobut, because I have a 4 and a 7 year old as sisters and know how it can be, plus I know the kid, I had to lay the groundwork that " I am not your punk *** BF that you can walk over without any type of regards for what I am going though or what I have to do". I told her it wasn't about her not calling me, honeslty I could care less, I dont' date her and it wouldn't make me a difference if you didn't call for a week, I don't have a right to get mad, but I am "irrated" that you would call me to make sure I am not doing anything and let me know that you want to talk to me, then not call, and then not pick up the phone and say something like "hey I am tired I will just talk to you tomorrow, sorry". I told her that I am not mad at her, but that was unaccecptable. She apologized and we changed the subject. (The sad thing is, I don't think she knew she did anything wrong... she is pretty hot, hot enough so that most men, espically her BF would not call her on any crap like that... I know I didn't 2 years ago).
Anyway, to make a long story short, we talked for around 2 hours yestrday off an on, still really catching up on each other.
I can tell a couple of things about her that are different from 2 years ago:
1) The more I talk to her, the more I realize she isn't anywhere near satisfied with her current relationship. It went from "I am with him and I am content" to "I hate it when he does this and this" to " I am mad at him, don't bring up his name" to " He is too immature for me".
I am really starting to think that is why she contacted me...
It turns out she had more feelings for me back then than I thought (I was a total AFC). Her and her BF got into a really bad arguement, actually over me, around a month ago, when he found a letter I wrote to her 2 years ago (even though it was not very serious). She said she was looking at the letter for 2 weeks or so, and then got up the nerve to write me. I actually remember when she first contacted me, I could tell she was actually nervous.
What I think is happening is that she is really unsatisfied with her relaitonship and probably contacted me because I was the last person she thought about being with before her current BF. I dont' think she knew, because I didn't know, how much in common we are, and all of the things that she didn't like about me, like how I wrote her everyday and always wanted to be around her, and always told her how much I like her, are no longer apart of me.
usually she calls me, and when she does she always sounds enthusitic, and I called her wednesday night and Saturday night. On Wednesday she sounded as well as you can expect after being in school all day and being at work, and yesterday when I called her (actually I thought she called me and I returned the call, only way I would have called) and she had this "thank god It's you" tone to her voice.
A couple of notes, she didn't call me to gripe about her BF or to let off some steem about him... I even tried to see what was going on with them because she was mad at him and told me "I don't want to talk to you about him, I have other friends for that".
I also get the sense that she really is not dying, but itching to see me. As I stated, it's going to be virtually impossible to see each other during the week unless I pick her up from school on mondays. her BF lives 200 miles away and comes in every weekend to see her (and when they get together he takes her over friends house to play video games, which is part of the reason she is pissed) so it's going to be hard to see her on weekends... This weekend would have been perfect because her BF was not in town but she had to babysit. However when I bring up the subject she sounds sincere and she says things like "that's why I contacted you in the first place, because I wanted to talk to you and spend so me time with you and see you again". and things like that, although I don't try to dwell on serious stuff and keep the convo as fun as possible.
Yesterday she contacted me with a legit computer problem (I do run a computer company and she knows I am a computer tech by trade) and she is probably the most computer illerate person I know. She was having a hard time describing what the problem was over her babysitters house (which is approx 2 mintues away from my apartment) and when I in all seriousness asked her did she want me to come over right quick and fix the problem, she said she wished but her mom was coming over to spend the night (long story, but her mom and the woman she was babysitting for are best friends, and her mom is actually afraid of the dark and will not sleep by herself... complicated).. she then asked would it be okay if she made me breakfast and I came over in the morning.
I do know the first time we get together again, I will take her to do something fun and that I know she likes, to reforce the idea that I am a fun person and that she wants to be around me because I am fun and do fun things. She likes to dance but hates the club (like me), and I know she likes to bowl but her BF will not take her, so I might take her bowling one day soon..
Other than the fact that I have not seen her yet, things seem to be going great... We don't spend to much time on the phone, when we do talk it's fun, the only things she every says about her BF when she does bring him up are "I don't want to talk about him" or "I can't stand him for whatever reason".
There are two main things to note that i think are key. I never told you how we met. I used to date her friend, a girl who used to be her best friend. I called used to call her over her house from time to time, and one day she called me looking for my GF at the time and we just clicked. When we broke up, for some reason I called her (also because I thought she was hot) and again we clicked. Anyway, one of the major things she used to tell me is that "it would feel funny dating my friend's ex. Now, her tone has changed so much that I even caught her taking shots at her yesterday, saying "you and her just wern't ment for each other " (and she is right) and " if you see her, you would want to let her see you first so that she would not run to all of her friends telling them that I was stocking her".
Another thing is that I used to be so infactuated with her, if she called me at 5 in the morning and asked me to get her some ice cream, i would ask what flavor. Once I drove all the way across town without my contacts in the pouring rain to pick her up and take her home from her babysitters house. Needless to say I put up with any crap she dished out because I was scared to "loose her". Now I can safely say that I have established myself as "wearing the pants". I never call her unless I am returning a call, I call her on her crap, although there has really only been 2 inncodents, and I let her know what's on my mind. The funny thing is She is alot more rececptive to me know in 5 days then she was for 1 year 2 years ago! It's like she doesn't want to disopoint me. She wrote me a letter that quoted the following (wasn't lying about the email once every business day)
Now actually say what was just written out loud, with the correct connation and everything... This woman writes an article every week in a statewide paper and goes to school for journalism, I know she knows how to use punctuation correctly. This sounds like someone who is nevous." Sorry to make you feel like you are 2nd but my BF "might" not be able to come home this weekend. If you don't have any plans and I don't have any plans... We should do something. Ok? You understand right? I mean the whole relationship thing comes first when you only see each other on weekends...right?
I don't mind if you don't agree with me about the above
(yes she did leave the smily face)
Talk to you soon !"
backbreaker
Master Don Juan
Anyway, we have not talked today, which is fine with me because frankly we don't have anything to talk about until we see each other.
I will give you another update next week, and feel free to leave me any advice you think I will need.
I will give you another update next week, and feel free to leave me any advice you think I will need.
backbreaker
Master Don Juan
I will admit, you are absoultely right... Women are stupid enough to think "Hey I can stay with my BF and just have fun with him, so I can have the best of both worlds". Although I don't mind that situtation honestly, If we did go down that route, I would have to take any emotions I have out of the relationship we had, meaning no "favors" or anything like that, no calling me at 1am just to "talk" because that's what your BF is for.
Mr.Fortesque
Don Juan
so thx for update and good luck.
"She Made Her Decision Before You Finished Your Sentence"
Three seconds. That's how long it took. Your shoes. Your posture. The way you held your drink. Whether you looked at the floor or looked at her.
She already filed you away. Interesting. Boring. Safe. Bold. Before you even opened your mouth.
Everything you say after that is just her confirming what she already decided.
So stop rehearsing lines. Fix the first three seconds. Stand tall. Look up. Smile like you mean it. Walk like you belong wherever you're standing.
The words come later. The impression comes first.
backbreaker
Master Don Juan
okay, for thoose of you interested here is an update on what's going on, and espically with the guy arguring with me that I need to next her because she has no interest in me...
First, she called me and we got together 2 weeks ago for the first time in 2 years. It was fun. We stayed up the whole night and talked at both of our places, I really didn't want to make a move for a copule of reasons, but I got the jist that she had a good time.
Okay let me fast forward to these last couple of weeks.
First of all, her BF got kicked out of school and came home the wednesday before last, and me and her had a long, long converstion on thursday about if and how things were going to change. She assured me that she still would "make time" for me because I told her that I had no problem being her friend, but I would not be put on hold because her BF is back. I then told her that it would be best if we just weren't friends, simply because for a second I didn't believe what she was saying.
The next day when I woke up, I thought about the decision, and the fact that I really would miss talking to her, combined with the fact that she did do something that was pretty gutsy on her part, contacting me after 2 years trying to rekindle a friendship and not knowing how I felt about her, that I could be her friend as long as we had a mutal understanding about certain things. I told her this on Friday afternoon, the convo was short because we were both extremely busy.
I went out with some friends on Friday night, and while I was out I get a call from this girl. She was calling me on her way home, and becasuse I know she doesn't like talking in the car, something was wrong, majorly wrong. I then made my exit and when home and when I got home and called to see what was up, she was sobbing. It turns out she was really scared because her BF was back in town and he has developed some type of mental disorder, she thinks, and it sounds like schitszophrenica and I am not bullshi**ing. Even though I don't know the guy, I feel bad for him and I tell her I wish him the best, and give her the name of a couple of good doctors to take him to.
This is where it gets pretty intersting.
I was pretty busy that weekend, as was she.
She calls me on Sunday afternoon and she tells me that she wants to talk to me later that night. I say that's fine, just call.
She didn't call me that night, which is fine by me, I didn't loose any sleep. The next day she tells me that she is very sorry for not calling me like she said she was, and that her BF wanted to see her the night before. I tell her that honeslty, I don't care, and I really don't. She doesnt' have to explain every detail of her life to me, I dont date her, and honeslty there are some things I dont' care about, that being one of them.
We don't talk until Thursday and when I call her she was hurring to get off of the phone. I was pretty peaved becasue that's disrespectful. She calls me 20 or so mintues later, and it turns out she was in a heated arguement with her BF's dad. See, her BF's best friend, who ironically used to date this girl 6 years ago I found out eariler todaay, has been telling her BF that she has been cheating on him, which she hasn't, one because I just know she hasn't and secondly I know she hasn't because the guy not only said it was with me, that we had a child. And the sad thing is that her BF belived him (I joked around wiht her eariler today asking how the baby was doing). It seems for some reason over the last 2 years her BF is facinated with me. He thinks every black guy walking down the street talking to her is me, he thinks every phone call is me (90% of the time she calls me) and so on.
She goes on to tell me how she is depressed and how she doesn't think she can take it anymore. I will not tell you exactly what I told her, but I told her what she is doing is pretty silly and pointless. I also found out that she is trying her best to stay away from him, I don't think they have seen each other for almost a week now.
Anyway, I get a call eariler today and she asks me if I want to meet her at Starbucks. I say why not. When I get there she we have a pretty nice converstaion. Something I did today that I really didn't make an effort to do last time is to really pay attention to her body language. I noticed she had her legs crossed pointing towards me (a good sign), and although she was leaning back in her chair her pupils dilated a couple of times, we held eye contact for a copule of times, always ending with her smiling. Her feet were dangling towards me the entire time, and something I didn't pick up on at all before is that she was actually a nervous! I could tell because she keep moving positions and she kept figiting with her hands and playing with her neck. Although I didn't mention this I took note.
As soon as I noticed this, after 5 or 10 mintues, I started to give her some kinko, and to be honest I didnt' do it in a friendly, suttle way. I just slowly placed my hand on her knee and thigh and keep it there, then both. She didn't seem uncofortable in the least bit.
Also 5 mintues after I left she called me on the way home to talk to me or to finish our conversation.
To make a long story short, I have no doubt in my mind that she wants to jump my bones. I think if I really, REALLY wanted a quick fix I could have sex with her now if I forced the issue a tad bit but that wouldn't be too smart. I also realize that her BF must be fanicated with me for a reason, people I don't even know are saying that me and her are sleeping together. Also however, I do respect the relationship she is in and I don't want to rush anything.
First, she called me and we got together 2 weeks ago for the first time in 2 years. It was fun. We stayed up the whole night and talked at both of our places, I really didn't want to make a move for a copule of reasons, but I got the jist that she had a good time.
Okay let me fast forward to these last couple of weeks.
First of all, her BF got kicked out of school and came home the wednesday before last, and me and her had a long, long converstion on thursday about if and how things were going to change. She assured me that she still would "make time" for me because I told her that I had no problem being her friend, but I would not be put on hold because her BF is back. I then told her that it would be best if we just weren't friends, simply because for a second I didn't believe what she was saying.
The next day when I woke up, I thought about the decision, and the fact that I really would miss talking to her, combined with the fact that she did do something that was pretty gutsy on her part, contacting me after 2 years trying to rekindle a friendship and not knowing how I felt about her, that I could be her friend as long as we had a mutal understanding about certain things. I told her this on Friday afternoon, the convo was short because we were both extremely busy.
I went out with some friends on Friday night, and while I was out I get a call from this girl. She was calling me on her way home, and becasuse I know she doesn't like talking in the car, something was wrong, majorly wrong. I then made my exit and when home and when I got home and called to see what was up, she was sobbing. It turns out she was really scared because her BF was back in town and he has developed some type of mental disorder, she thinks, and it sounds like schitszophrenica and I am not bullshi**ing. Even though I don't know the guy, I feel bad for him and I tell her I wish him the best, and give her the name of a couple of good doctors to take him to.
This is where it gets pretty intersting.
I was pretty busy that weekend, as was she.
She calls me on Sunday afternoon and she tells me that she wants to talk to me later that night. I say that's fine, just call.
She didn't call me that night, which is fine by me, I didn't loose any sleep. The next day she tells me that she is very sorry for not calling me like she said she was, and that her BF wanted to see her the night before. I tell her that honeslty, I don't care, and I really don't. She doesnt' have to explain every detail of her life to me, I dont date her, and honeslty there are some things I dont' care about, that being one of them.
We don't talk until Thursday and when I call her she was hurring to get off of the phone. I was pretty peaved becasue that's disrespectful. She calls me 20 or so mintues later, and it turns out she was in a heated arguement with her BF's dad. See, her BF's best friend, who ironically used to date this girl 6 years ago I found out eariler todaay, has been telling her BF that she has been cheating on him, which she hasn't, one because I just know she hasn't and secondly I know she hasn't because the guy not only said it was with me, that we had a child. And the sad thing is that her BF belived him (I joked around wiht her eariler today asking how the baby was doing). It seems for some reason over the last 2 years her BF is facinated with me. He thinks every black guy walking down the street talking to her is me, he thinks every phone call is me (90% of the time she calls me) and so on.
She goes on to tell me how she is depressed and how she doesn't think she can take it anymore. I will not tell you exactly what I told her, but I told her what she is doing is pretty silly and pointless. I also found out that she is trying her best to stay away from him, I don't think they have seen each other for almost a week now.
Anyway, I get a call eariler today and she asks me if I want to meet her at Starbucks. I say why not. When I get there she we have a pretty nice converstaion. Something I did today that I really didn't make an effort to do last time is to really pay attention to her body language. I noticed she had her legs crossed pointing towards me (a good sign), and although she was leaning back in her chair her pupils dilated a couple of times, we held eye contact for a copule of times, always ending with her smiling. Her feet were dangling towards me the entire time, and something I didn't pick up on at all before is that she was actually a nervous! I could tell because she keep moving positions and she kept figiting with her hands and playing with her neck. Although I didn't mention this I took note.
As soon as I noticed this, after 5 or 10 mintues, I started to give her some kinko, and to be honest I didnt' do it in a friendly, suttle way. I just slowly placed my hand on her knee and thigh and keep it there, then both. She didn't seem uncofortable in the least bit.
Also 5 mintues after I left she called me on the way home to talk to me or to finish our conversation.
To make a long story short, I have no doubt in my mind that she wants to jump my bones. I think if I really, REALLY wanted a quick fix I could have sex with her now if I forced the issue a tad bit but that wouldn't be too smart. I also realize that her BF must be fanicated with me for a reason, people I don't even know are saying that me and her are sleeping together. Also however, I do respect the relationship she is in and I don't want to rush anything.
PuertoRican_Lover
Banned
She is obviously looking to replace her b/f this is why she called you, girls shop for a man before they leave their old one. You could have had sex with this girl already but you chose not to, but you she is willing
Quit being her emotional tampon and tell her to handle her private affairs and that you don't want to get in between her and her b/f - especially with rumors in the air.
Quit talking on the phone so much and playing phone tag unless it is only 'friends' that you want out of this. She wants you more than a friend - so keep your distance until she is over her b/f and you can move forward with a clean slate.
And yes, she is cheating on her b/f by calling and seeing you in private - you are not fooling me.
Quit being her emotional tampon and tell her to handle her private affairs and that you don't want to get in between her and her b/f - especially with rumors in the air.
Quit talking on the phone so much and playing phone tag unless it is only 'friends' that you want out of this. She wants you more than a friend - so keep your distance until she is over her b/f and you can move forward with a clean slate.
And yes, she is cheating on her b/f by calling and seeing you in private - you are not fooling me.
backbreaker
Master Don Juan
thanks for the advice, but we only really talk 1 or 2 times a week, i wouldn't consider that being phone tag.
As far as her emotional tampon, a BF with a serious mental illness is not something you take lightly, regardless if I am trying to Fvck her or not. Also, we just trust each other more than we trust other people.
However, I feel what you are saying and thanks for the advice, any more is greatly appricated.
As far as her emotional tampon, a BF with a serious mental illness is not something you take lightly, regardless if I am trying to Fvck her or not. Also, we just trust each other more than we trust other people.
However, I feel what you are saying and thanks for the advice, any more is greatly appricated.
Jay Fiedler
Don Juan
BB,
First, i sense that she is using you to replace the lack of affection and romanticism she isnt getting from her current bf.
I hesitate to say she is 100% romanticly interested in you, but ya never know. Girls have a tendancy to look for guy "friends" that treat them really well when they feel they are lacking that from their boyfriends...but it doesnt mean they are looking to totally replace their bf's.
If I were you I would talk to her occasionaly, but make it clear that until things are over with the bf, nothing can happen. I mean think about it, in all reality she is cheating on her bf to be with you. Is that really someone you want to have a ltr with? Because it sounds like even though you downplay how much you care for her or how her sometimes not calling doesnt bother you, I think most of us here can tell that deep down you are crazy for this girl. You will only hurt yourself if you get involved in this triangle while things are not clear as far as her personal life.
Just out of curiousity, you metnioned you were black. Is she white? And if so did that play any role in her not dating you 2 years ago?
First, i sense that she is using you to replace the lack of affection and romanticism she isnt getting from her current bf.
I hesitate to say she is 100% romanticly interested in you, but ya never know. Girls have a tendancy to look for guy "friends" that treat them really well when they feel they are lacking that from their boyfriends...but it doesnt mean they are looking to totally replace their bf's.
If I were you I would talk to her occasionaly, but make it clear that until things are over with the bf, nothing can happen. I mean think about it, in all reality she is cheating on her bf to be with you. Is that really someone you want to have a ltr with? Because it sounds like even though you downplay how much you care for her or how her sometimes not calling doesnt bother you, I think most of us here can tell that deep down you are crazy for this girl. You will only hurt yourself if you get involved in this triangle while things are not clear as far as her personal life.
Just out of curiousity, you metnioned you were black. Is she white? And if so did that play any role in her not dating you 2 years ago?
Alen-Delon
Senior Don Juan
Keep playing your game... you know you got her in your claws.... all you need to do is flow with situation like you ve been doing, i bet she ll be the first to make the major move....
Cheers and good luck....
Cheers and good luck....
"Why Women Dump the Guys Who Try the Hardest"
You paid for dinner. You drove. You said "whatever you want is fine" every single time. All the effort, no expectations.
And she left anyway — probably for a guy who makes her pick up the pizza.
Painful. Also predictable. Her mind quietly concludes that anything requiring zero effort from her is worth exactly zero. You became a free sample, and free samples get taken for granted.
The 22 Rules flip the dynamic. Small shifts that get her investing effort, money, and time in you — until SHE'S the one afraid of losing YOU.
backbreaker
Master Don Juan
I will try to answer your questions.
Honestly It really doesn't bother me that she doesnt' call me from time to time. Seriously. First, half of the time I am busy when she does call. Second, I understand that she is in college, has a job, a strict mom and a boyfriend. I have other things to do than wait by the phone for someone to call me so we can talk about nothing. Perfect example, she told me she wanted me to call her last night. I did on my way home. When she answered the phone she said she was busy, which I am sure she was because she has an exam today. She said she would call me back later. Although I figuured it was a 50-50% chance of that happening, I just went home and went straight to sleep.
i perfer to have converstions every other day or every 3 days or so that are very interesting rather than sit on the phone every day, talking about nothing.
Is she 100% romantically interested in me? I don't know, but she is romantically interested in to some extent, and I am good looking enough, and have enough going for myself that that's all I need. I can bring the rest home in due time. LIke I said, even if she was interested in me, as much as I do like her, I would be a fool to rush into a relationship right now with her. First and foremost, my company is growing and needs alot of my attention right now. Secondly, she has just gotten out of a 2 year relationshp (or is soon to be out of one)
however, I do feel your point and you are right on the money. I do a good job of distancing myself from that. I wouldn't say I am an emotional tampon... I don't let her get on the phone and talk about what her and her BF are going though on a daily basis. The only reason we talked about it yesterday was because it has to do with me. Last week she found out her BF more than likely has a serious mental condition. That's some pretty heavy stuff. But I tell her that "hey, what you do with him is between you to, and what me and you do is betweeen us" and she does a good job of not telling me what's going on with that situtation.
". I mean think about it, in all reality she is cheating on her bf to be with you"
Damn, I honestly never thought about it like that, I guess you make a good point.
Am I crazy for this girl. No, I am not "crazy" for anyone, but I can honesty say, and this is coming from a guy who has had his fare share of GF's in the past, that I feel a different way about her than I have felt about any other girl or woman in or that was in my life, including my mother. She knows I have certain feelings for her, but she doesn't know I feel like that. However, with that said I base that opinion off of the way we get along, and the way we communicate, in other words, if her attitude towards me were to change, such as her treating me like **** or misusing our friendship, I would not feel that way any longer.
I am Black (well, not black black, people say I am black with Asian features). Anyway, she is mixed; half white, and half Columbian. Did it play a role? Honestly, no. She has dated black guys before, besides the fact her mom didn't approve of the guys she dated, it really isn't a big deal to her. My race has only come up once in the last month and that was because her BF's best Friend said "she is cheating on you with some Black guy". Other than that, it never comes up and I would hate to think that is the reason. If I found out this was the case she would be kicked to the curve.
backbreaker
Master Don Juan
Okay here is another update on what is going on.
I decided that I needed to space myself out from her a bit, because it was getting to a point where I was expecting her to call me, which in my eyes is not good at all. I hadn't talked to her for a full week until around an hour an a half ago, and I was tempted not to pick up the phone, but I hadn't spoken or tried to call her (and she has not tried to call me either) in a week so I picked up the phone to say hi. The converstition was light and I just asked how she did on her exams, and that's pretty much it. I told her that I was busy, and i am, and to call me back later when I have some free time.
Actually the timing was perfect for me not talking to her beause I am a big horse racing fan, make a nice side income from it season after season, and for the last 2 years I take December to April off because I dont like any of the tracks that are running. I perfer Churchill, Pimplico and Del Mar and Santa Anitia (at times) and they run in the spring-fall and so last week I have been pretty busy with that, as I am now. I really haven't had time to sit around and think about her, well at times she would cross my mind but around 80-90% less than she used to, and I also noticed that I wasn't as attracted to her as I thought I was. She is very good looking, and I don't mean I thiink she is ugly, but although we get along, she is not what you would call a "deep" person, and that is unactractive to me. That was reconfirmed when we talked today. I asked her how her week went, and she said, "oh, nothing" and there was silence... okay. I actually found myself wanting to get off of the phone.
Anyway, I told her I am on my way to StarBucks, which I am, and asked did she want to stop and meet for a couple of mintues. She said that her mom was expecting her at 8pm and it was 7:45...
Now I do believe her, one I know how strict her mom is, and second she always has to call her mom and tell her where she, but what gets me is that there was no counter offer (I am learning). But even with that said, that could very well be because she doesn't know when she well get a chance to get out. However, My thinking is that you find a way to do what you want, and if she wanted to see me bad enough she would figure something out, so I will ask her a couple of more times, maybe 2, and if she doesn't get the point that either she is going to start seeing me in person or not talk to me at all, then I will probably just have to stop talking to her, because this is getting old.
I do still like her, because we do get along so well, but I don't "have to have her" and would loose no sleep at all if she showed no interest, but if she did I would have alot of work to do with her if she wanted a LTR. She is stubborn, lazy at times and has a little self esteem problem. That's unaccectable to me, but with that said, I dont' even know if it's worth it anymore.
I decided that I needed to space myself out from her a bit, because it was getting to a point where I was expecting her to call me, which in my eyes is not good at all. I hadn't talked to her for a full week until around an hour an a half ago, and I was tempted not to pick up the phone, but I hadn't spoken or tried to call her (and she has not tried to call me either) in a week so I picked up the phone to say hi. The converstition was light and I just asked how she did on her exams, and that's pretty much it. I told her that I was busy, and i am, and to call me back later when I have some free time.
Actually the timing was perfect for me not talking to her beause I am a big horse racing fan, make a nice side income from it season after season, and for the last 2 years I take December to April off because I dont like any of the tracks that are running. I perfer Churchill, Pimplico and Del Mar and Santa Anitia (at times) and they run in the spring-fall and so last week I have been pretty busy with that, as I am now. I really haven't had time to sit around and think about her, well at times she would cross my mind but around 80-90% less than she used to, and I also noticed that I wasn't as attracted to her as I thought I was. She is very good looking, and I don't mean I thiink she is ugly, but although we get along, she is not what you would call a "deep" person, and that is unactractive to me. That was reconfirmed when we talked today. I asked her how her week went, and she said, "oh, nothing" and there was silence... okay. I actually found myself wanting to get off of the phone.
Anyway, I told her I am on my way to StarBucks, which I am, and asked did she want to stop and meet for a couple of mintues. She said that her mom was expecting her at 8pm and it was 7:45...
Now I do believe her, one I know how strict her mom is, and second she always has to call her mom and tell her where she, but what gets me is that there was no counter offer (I am learning). But even with that said, that could very well be because she doesn't know when she well get a chance to get out. However, My thinking is that you find a way to do what you want, and if she wanted to see me bad enough she would figure something out, so I will ask her a couple of more times, maybe 2, and if she doesn't get the point that either she is going to start seeing me in person or not talk to me at all, then I will probably just have to stop talking to her, because this is getting old.
I do still like her, because we do get along so well, but I don't "have to have her" and would loose no sleep at all if she showed no interest, but if she did I would have alot of work to do with her if she wanted a LTR. She is stubborn, lazy at times and has a little self esteem problem. That's unaccectable to me, but with that said, I dont' even know if it's worth it anymore.