My modus operandi since my early 20s (I'm mid 30s now) has been to be flirty, physically escalate fast and get girls into bed as soon as possible.
But when I reflect back on the women I've dated and gone out for the most part they've been desperate/easy/needy/nymphos and generally low quality.
I have been trying to date higher quality women as I want a relationship and on quite a few occasions I've had girls go cold on me after kissing/public make outs.
Generally how it goes on the first or second date we've had some drinks, conversation, I've moved from some light incidental touches to a bit of handholding and then my hand would be resting on their thighs or around their waist and we are on a nice sofa or something and I lean in and kiss them and we start making out. But then after ten minutes or so they suddenly go cold and say it is getting late and then become more distant by text and it goes south.
One possibility I considered is they didn't enjoy kissing me. I wouldn't say I am the world's greatest kisser and people have different preferences when it comes to kissing so there is a compatibility issue but plenty of girls in the past haven't been able to get enough of kissing me and have complimented me on my kissing. But it seems the most logical explanation.
Another is that they feel uncomfortable and self conscious kissing in a public place because they are good girls and associate those negative feelings with me.
Another is that by moving too fast I am showing too much interest and ruining the sexual tension and challenge and putting myself in the same bracket of guys they've come across who just want sex.
You answered the dilemma yourself ... you can't use the same MO you used on low quality girls on higher quality girls and expect good results.
How about waiting for her to touch first, slowly reciprocate, give her one kiss at the end of 2nd date and slowly escalate touching and kissing on 3rd date, provided you have some privacy. Where's the rush? You said you're looking for a relationship, that means you'll have all the time in the world for make out sessions and more.
My modus operandi since my early 20s (I'm mid 30s now) has been to be flirty, physically escalate fast and get girls into bed as soon as possible. But when I reflect back on the women I've dated and gone out for the most part they've been desperate/easy/needy/nymphos and generally low quality.
Generally how it goes on the first or second date we've had some drinks, conversation, I've moved from some light incidental touches to a bit of handholding and then my hand would be resting on their thighs or around their waist and we are on a nice sofa or something and I lean in and kiss them and we start making out. But then after ten minutes or so they suddenly go cold and say it is getting late and then become more distant by text and it goes south.
One possibility I considered is they didn't enjoy kissing me. I wouldn't say I am the world's greatest kisser and people have different preferences when it comes to kissing so there is a compatibility issue but plenty of girls in the past haven't been able to get enough of kissing me and have complimented me on my kissing. But it seems the most logical explanation.
Another is that they feel uncomfortable and self conscious kissing in a public place because they are good girls and associate those negative feelings with me.
This can happen, but happens if you're not a top tier man. You have to ask yourself how you can be "Chad-like". Women make rules for betas and break them for alphas. If true, this is a sign women are not getting alpha vibes from you.
You are moving too fast and they are not comfortable, they regret what they did with you cos u r moving too fast and ofcourse this is why it only works with low quality women.
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Whether it’s in the club or on a date, the general rule is to keep makeouts short/brief until you are finally alone with her somewhere you could actually have sex.
On the couch at her place or yours, you can tongue her until your face falls off. But in public, you keep it short so as not to make her self-conscious and to leave her wanting more.
Okay, 2 things I can recommend to you that would fix your game better.
1) When you are on the couch, be less sexual and give more comfort.
When you are sitting next to her, lightly kiss her neck and then tell her she smells amazing.
Ask her some personal questions after that. Maybe even ask a few naughty questions.
2) Quit the hand holding
I never hold hands with a woman unless I'm in a serious relationship with them.
Holding hands gives off boyfriend vibes.
You can't go for this gesture during the early stages of dating because you have no clue how loyal she is to you.
Generally how it goes on the first or second date we've had some drinks, conversation, I've moved from some light incidental touches to a bit of handholding and then my hand would be resting on their thighs or around their waist and we are on a nice sofa or something and I lean in and kiss them and we start making out.
This seems like PUA type of step by step escalation. The thing is that type of thing is not gonna work as much wih higher quality women cos they can sort of sense the 'mechanical' and quick nature of it. If they initially let you kiss them its just cos you moved fast but they will slow things down and when looking back on it feel like it was kinda weird and that is why you are losing them.
You cant play this mechanical type of game with higher quality women. Its kinda obvious when I read it again what your doing, your starting with light touch, handholding, thighs/waiste etc.
I dunno man its 2023 does anyone even use these escalation tactics anymore? Like others have said if u wanna to quality girls and ltrs with better women you gotta use push-pull and tbh this PUA kino escalation Game I dunno if it still has much value. If u wanna touch like holding hands etc keep the touches minimal just to break the touch barrier but dont go for that obvious escalation from light touch to more touch with increasing sexualisation. I dont know if those escalation tactics are relevant today, I think today guys can get laid with not much kino type stuff at all just breaking the touch barrier maybe all thats needed.
@viking22 your self awareness isn't where it needs to be. If it was you would be able to pinpoint the problem. Salesmanship is important. They have to buy in to what you are selling. Foreplay comes in many different forms and has many different levels. Use appropriately.
You answered the dilemma yourself ... you can't use the same MO you used on low quality girls on higher quality girls and expect good results.
How about waiting for her to touch first, slowly reciprocate, give her one kiss at the end of 2nd date and slowly escalate touching and kissing on 3rd date, provided you have some privacy. Where's the rush? You said you're looking for a relationship, that means you'll have all the time in the world for make out sessions and more.
Disagree with most of the replies here
For her favourite singer would a make out turn her off?
It comes down to her interest level, clearly u aren’t reading their body language well enough to guage interest level. Or ur smv not high enough and girls just using you for free drinks
Your problems can by fixed by only asking out women who are giving you high interest from the get go - sending you choosing signals or being extremely receptive.
If the favorite singer acts too heavy too fast and she's not an airhead bimbo, then she realizes he only sees her as a piece of meat, a conquest, and it would turn her off.
Imagine this scenario: you're a high quality guy and you meet your favorite model/actress whatever. And instead of her wanting to get to know you, she presses you on spending lots of money on her for gifts, trips, whatever. Wouldn't you be turned off that she sees you as an ATM instead of a human being?
If the favorite singer acts too heavy too fast and she's not an airhead bimbo, then she realizes he only sees her as a piece of meat, a conquest, and it would turn her off.
Imagine this scenario: you're a high quality guy and you meet your favorite model/actress whatever. And instead of her wanting to get to know you, she presses you on spending lots of money on her for gifts, trips, whatever. Wouldn't you be turned off that she sees you as an ATM instead of a human being?
Lol i don’t think you understand that women look at men like pieces of meat too…
If she isn’t open to you making out with her, it’s because she doesn’t see you as the meat and was just enjoying your attention and admiration. She ‘feels’ higher smv than you.
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Lol i don’t think you understand that women look at men like pieces of meat too…
If she isn’t open to you making out with her, it’s because she doesn’t see you as the meat and was just enjoying your attention and admiration. She ‘feels’ higher smv than you.
It can be that there is no attraction.
Or it could be that she's a higher quality woman who takes her time to assess the guy before getting physical with him. She might be attracted to him but because he's acting too fast or she realizes that for whatever reason he's not good for her, she won't be making out with him.
It can be that there is no attraction.
Or it could be that she's a higher quality woman who takes her time to assess the guy before getting physical with him. She might be attracted to him but because he's acting too fast or she realizes that for whatever reason he's not good for her, she won't be making out with him.
No. A make out means very little to most girls.They’ll kiss an attractive guy on a date without thinking twice. OP is either kissing at awkward times, or simply dating girls that don’t find him attractive. btw girls don’t take time to assess men - unless than man isn’t her best option and is simply a backup plan. Women act on instinct
have you ever read a romance novel filled with passion? Women don’t take time to assess the men they desire.
It can be that there is no attraction.
Or it could be that she's a higher quality woman who takes her time to assess the guy before getting physical with him. She might be attracted to him but because he's acting too fast or she realizes that for whatever reason he's not good for her, she won't be making out with him.
I've only had 3 girls make me wait for sex. I've had many "quality" girls drop their panties earlier than they felt they should have, usually first or second date. They let me know weeks down the road and felt like they shouldn't have moved so quickly with me.
You say and do the right things, create a good vibe, take them to the right venues conducive to intimacy and you can make even girls like @BeExcellent do things she wasn't planning on. Hahaha I've done it many times. They all have these silly rules, but they'll break them every time for the right guy. The next day they are telling their girlfriends...."I can't believe I did that".
Whats with all these answers “you are moving too fast, you have to give more comfort, push pull, slowly escalate”. They don’t seem like answers strong, independent, sexy alpha men would give.
OP is in his mid 30s so he is dating a non-virgin woman. For a NON-VIRGIN woman, she has 15 seconds to take off her clothes and have sex, or get the f out of the guys face.
