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Just saw "Joker"

MatureDJ

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Wow, what a movie! However, I didn't really feel much of the Incel vibe going on there, although obviously The Joker in an incel that the chick down the hall ultimately considered creepy.
 

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corrector

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I watched the movie three times already at home. I'll post a link to a watch-along party:

. Grace Randolf from Beyond the Trailer can comment on the movie while you put it in synch and watch it and give you a virtual sense of company while you are watching this movie. She pointed me to some insights within the movie that turned me on to watch this again on a larger screen in another part of the home.

I plan to re-watch this in about a month. I just loved the 70s/early 80s retro vibe and the imagery of the city just brought me into the movie. Again, I like the atmosphere of this movie and feel, as another movie reviewer commented (Jeremy Jahns), that the subway scene and class conflict portrayed in the movie seems to make the movie "too real" to feel comfortable and portrays withdrawal symptoms from medication due to city budget cuts as being effectively responsible for the Joker behaviour.

Also those who are upper status who get the girls also harass and mess with other women for fun. Most of the bad behaviour from other guys against women are usually guys who are up there in status and can get any woman they want and get away with raping/hurting women without LA going after them (i.e. we see this with Brock Turner), while the Joker-incel is more withdrawn and just minding his own business most of the time until things hit a breaking point.
 

Georgepithyou

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I didn't enjoy it, i was hoping it was about a normal guy who was rejected by society and this was how he breaks down.

Instead we got the story if a guy who was already mentally ill and autistic who didn't take his meds.
 

corrector

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I didn't enjoy it, i was hoping it was about a normal guy who was rejected by society and this was how he breaks down.

Instead we got the story if a guy who was already mentally ill and autistic who didn't take his meds.
He was not genetically mentally ill as it appears you are portraying. He was abused as a child and chained to a radiator. His realization that his mother was complicit in having an abusive boyfriend was what lead him to say his life is a comedy rather than a tragedy and kill his mother. Also his true father "could" have been Thomas Wayne because he found a picture of in the place of his mother with T.W. initial on the back of it and the claim that he was adopted could have been an elaborate cover-up. If that is true then he was rejected by his true father, and in a sense, rejected by his mother as well and consigned to a woeful inferior life because of the abuse and neglect, and ultimately rejected by everyone via neglect.

So, the idea here is does someone really have to be rejected by society to be rejected, or just neglected and invisible? The incel resonance is the feeling of being invisible, neglected or that you really don't register in anyone's radar and feeling alone, not necessary because some girl you are obsessed with/or have oneitis with "rejected" you. . The decision for the city to cut funding to for his continued therapy sessions and meds is an example of this type of neglect/rejection. They don't care if he experiences withdrawal symptoms from the meds.
 
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Poonani Maker

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I didn't enjoy it, i was hoping it was about a normal guy who was rejected by society and this was how he breaks down.

Instead we got the story if a guy who was already mentally ill and autistic who didn't take his meds.
I haven't watched and will Not ever watch another Hollywood movie. Hate Joaquin Phoenix and his stupid furry burry politics.
 

zekko

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Hate Joaquin Phoenix and his stupid furry burry politics.
I have nothing against Joaquin Phoenix but I can't stand the way actors use the Oscars as platforms for their political beliefs.
They say they feel obligated to use that stage to say something important and raise awareness of whatever it is they're into.
But there's a time and a place, people.
 

samspade

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I still think of Joaquin as the whiny kid from "Parenthood." Or as the whiny dude from "Gladiator."
 

zekko

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I still think of Joaquin as the whiny kid from "Parenthood." Or as the whiny dude from "Gladiator."
I associate him with "Signs". Swing away, Merrill.
Actually, now I associate him with The Joker. And bad award speeches. And his weird David Letterman appearance.
 

stormrider

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I didn't enjoy it, i was hoping it was about a normal guy who was rejected by society and this was how he breaks down.

Instead we got the story if a guy who was already mentally ill and autistic who didn't take his meds.
That was the vibe I got too. I was expecting social outcast vibe and got autistic durrr durrr vibe.

How can an autistic durrr durrr guy with no philosophies besides “im a victim/unique snowflake” be the ultimate mastermind to rival Batman.
 
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Who Dares Win

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I couldnt see myself in him plus I was expecting something like "falling down" (1993).

That pissed off blue collar who got bullied from his wife and people around him really is one of my favourite characters.
 

zekko

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How can an autistic durrr durrr guy with no philosophies besides “im a victim/unique snowflake” be the ultimate mastermind to rival Batman.
I thought Joaquin's character and the movie was really interesting. But I've never once felt like this was THE Joker, Batman villain. It's more like Taxi Driver, the story of one man's breakdown and turn to darkness.

I've never liked the "multiple Joker characters" theory, that this is one guy in a series of different clown criminals who were forerunners for, or the inspiration to, the eventual real Joker. I think the TV show Gotham used that premise? But I'm not sure, I don't watch it.

The other idea here is that this is just one of another false origin story that the Joker is telling, like Heath Ledger had several different versions he told. Some people seem very attached to this idea that the Joker should not have an actual backstory, and he should remain a mystery. Personally, I don't care one way or the other.
 

stormrider

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I thought Joaquin's character and the movie was really interesting. But I've never once felt like this was THE Joker, Batman villain. It's more like Taxi Driver, the story of one man's breakdown and turn to darkness.

I've never liked the "multiple Joker characters" theory, that this is one guy in a series of different clown criminals who were forerunners for, or the inspiration to, the eventual real Joker. I think the TV show Gotham used that premise? But I'm not sure, I don't watch it.

The other idea here is that this is just one of another false origin story that the Joker is telling, like Heath Ledger had several different versions he told. Some people seem very attached to this idea that the Joker should not have an actual backstory, and he should remain a mystery. Personally, I don't care one way or the other.
Joker is supposed to be an irresistible force. And Batman the immovable object. Without that dynamic, the plot doesn't work. So his origin story has to give him equal, if not greater emotional leverage than Bruce Wayne. But to me, he just seemed to be a nutcase who missed his meds. There was no tragedy that took away his humanity.

It is only from the depths of hell can you come back with extreme internal dominance like the Joker/Batman has. They are in a sense, mirror images of each other.
 

eli77

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He was not genetically mentally ill as it appears you are portraying. He was abused as a child and chained to a radiator. His realization that his mother was complicit in having an abusive boyfriend was what lead him to say his life is a comedy rather than a tragedy and kill his mother. Also his true father "could" have been Thomas Wayne because he found a picture of in the place of his mother with T.W. initial on the back of it and the claim that he was adopted could have been an elaborate cover-up. If that is true then he was rejected by his true father, and in a sense, rejected by his mother as well and consigned to a woeful inferior life because of the abuse and neglect, and ultimately rejected by everyone via neglect.

So, the idea here is does someone really have to be rejected by society to be rejected, or just neglected and invisible? The incel resonance is the feeling of being invisible, neglected or that you really don't register in anyone's radar and feeling alone, not necessary because some girl you are obsessed with/or have oneitis with "rejected" you. . The decision for the city to cut funding to for his continued therapy sessions and meds is an example of this type of neglect/rejection. They don't care if he experiences withdrawal symptoms from the meds.
interesting theory
 

MatureDJ

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I couldnt see myself in him plus I was expecting something like "falling down" (1993).

That pissed off blue collar who got bullied from his wife and people around him really is one of my favourite characters.
I was an aerospace engineer during that rough patch of time. He was our hero - and everywhere I've worked there was always some older generation guy that fit that character. o_O
 
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mrgoodstuff

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I was an aerospace engineer during that rough patch of time. He was our hero - and everywhere I've worked there was always some older generation guy that fit that character. o_O
Engineer mindset is bad for socialization because it's too honest and needs accuracy and truth. A language 96% of people do not speak.
 
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