Girl who is quite the conversationalist

[white cloud 8]

I just went out with a girl last night, and she is quite the conversationalist, strong in her beliefs, and, very enjoyable to talk to. I guess I held my own quite well because we did *NOT* have shallow conversation (we both thought it was boring) we had some pretty deep discussions. She taking psychology in university (I'm a fine arts student), so we talked about some interesting things . The evening started around 7:30pm and we kept on talking till almost 4:00am this morning. I'm just wondering which articles from the DJ Bible (and possibly other suggested readings I should do) to strengthen my conversational skills even further?

BTW: I really enjoyed my time with her, I actually had a *REAL* conversation with this girl .


-thanx

 

[Francisco d'Anconia]

Here's a hint, don't just talk with her, listen to her. Go beyond the topic but notice her voice inflections, her facial expressions, any kino which may happen. All of these things adds depth to a conversation about almost any topic. Watching conversationalist interact is like watching people who dance well together. There's synergy, passion, give and take, and congruence.

 

[white cloud 8]

Here's a hint, don't just talk with her, listen to her. Go beyond the topic but notice her voice inflections, her facial expressions, any kino which may happen. All of these things adds depth to a conversation about almost any topic. Watching conversationalist interact is like watching people who dance well together. There's synergy, passion, give and take, and congruence.

Believe me, I did my fair share of listening (and gave my thoughts on what she had to say). The conversation lasted for quite some time (5 1/2 hrs. :rockon: ) is that too long or there really is no bad length for a conversation (if it kept flowing, I guess I was doing my job ). So are there any suggested reading(s) I should do?

 

[Francisco d'Anconia]

Believe me, I did my fair share of listening (and gave my thoughts on what she had to say). The conversation lasted for quite some time (5 1/2 hrs. :rockon: ) is that too long or there really is no bad length for a conversation (if it kept flowing, I guess I was doing my job ). So are there any suggested reading(s) I should do?

Like I said, go beyond whatever you guys were talking about and notice her presentation. But if you must read something, look into the work of Leil Lowndes.

 

[white cloud 8]

also about what you were saying about observation and listening (the tone of her voice sounded sincere yet curious, and she was constantly smiling throughout the evening) i of course did the same with smiling and spoke with intent (reciprocated it back)

BTW: for the works of Leil Lowndes, which ones would be more recommended: http://www.amazon.com/gp/search/ref...d-keywords=Leil+Lowndes&Go.x=11&Go.y=11&Go=Go

Also, should I also look at the work(s) of Dale Carnegie? http://www.amazon.com/gp/search/ref...ve&keywords=Dale+Carnegie&Go.x=0&Go.y=0&Go=Go

 

[Serialized3]

That sounds like a lot of talk to me man, which is good if you're looking for a friend, but if you want anything more with this girl, I'd have to suggest that you do some kino or start making some emotional connections. I've blown some stuff by being too "deep" and talking all that philosophy and academic stuff, and we both ended up eventually boring each other, which killed the romance.

 

[white cloud 8]

That sounds like a lot of talk to me man, which is good if you're looking for a friend, but if you want anything more with this girl, I'd have to suggest that you do some kino or start making some emotional connections. I've blown some stuff by being too "deep" and talking all that philosophy and academic stuff, and we both ended up eventually boring each other, which killed the romance.

Hmmm...interesting observation, I didn't think of it that way. I think this first meeting was to test the waters (I can see she is interested, I have to maintain that) but also, the next time we do meet, I'll step it up on kino (I got the impression that this girl likes to take things slow, which can be nice).

BTW: she found what we were talking about (varying subjects, nothing shallow) more meaningful.

 

[Serialized3]

Well, I actually should have put more emphasis on moving the conversation from talking about "meaningful things" to talking about emotional connections and stuff like that (chick talk), because talk is cheap, and you'll probably end up not arousing her on an emotional/physical level unless you talk about stuff like connections, romance, sex, etc.

Kino is also important, just light stuff for now, but get closer physically when you get closer emotionally.

Sorry dude, I've just made this mistake too many times, having long, deep conversations with girls, especially in college, and then just ending up not arousing them. I'm just offering you my two cents.

 

[Francisco d'Anconia]

also about what you were saying about observation and listening (the tone of her voice sounded sincere yet curious, and she was constantly smiling throughout the evening) i of course did the same with smiling and spoke with intent (reciprocated it back)

BTW: for the works of Leil Lowndes, which ones would be more recommended: http://www.amazon.com/gp/search/ref...d-keywords=Leil+Lowndes&Go.x=11&Go.y=11&Go=Go

Also, should I also look at the work(s) of Dale Carnegie? http://www.amazon.com/gp/search/ref...ve&keywords=Dale+Carnegie&Go.x=0&Go.y=0&Go=Go

Take a look at "How to Talk to Anybody About Anything." It's not an introductory book so guys who still have problems initiating conversations, DON'T PICK UP THIS BOOK UNTIL YOU CAN INITIATE AND SUSTAIN A DECENT CONVERSATION!!!

 

[syed]

I agree with the other dude...if you are at all interested in this girl, ditch the long convos. Flirt like it's your job, and get the kiss on THIS NEXT date. I mean, you should have already gotten it by now, so youve got some catching up to do.

Use your time between now and your next date to plan ahead. Give her some options. And for each of those options, plan out possible scenarios as to how the night will go. Think of funny stories you can tell. Think of times when you'll be able to initiate some hand-holding, hugging, arm-in-arm walking, slapping...any touching = good. Look to find at least 2 or 3 places throughout the night where you can initiate a first kiss. Dont wait until the end unless you have to.

Dude, the long convos is a bad idea. And she's really got you wrapped...she has you going on the internet asking dudes you don't know for advice so that the next convo can be even longer. **** that, man. Quid pro quo. You've shown her the goods, now it's time for her to pony up.

You're thinking logically. You're thinking that she's gonna get turned on by long convos. You're thinking that she's gonna go out with the guy that has the most intellectually superior arguments. That's not how people find their lovers, dude.

That's just my take. If you really do enjoy the convos, then by all means do it. Just don't expect a physical relationship with this girl.

 

[syed]

oh, and p.s., long convos are fine...but save them until you are close to or have already gotten the lay.

oh and when I say "long" convo I mean the type of convo you are talking about. Not necessarily long...but the kind of convo that is really mindblowing, paradigm-shifting stuff.

 

[white cloud 8]

Thanks for the advice so far, you guys would probably smack the living hell out of me if I told you that we talked close to an hour in her car (total privacy) :trouble: :kick: . She is a Catholic (sticks to her beliefs, and I respect that) should this make me a little bit weary if I attempt to go in for a kiss the next time we meet? After this first meeting, she has told me some of what she is interested in, passionate about, what she dislikes, what she would like to do in the future. What to keep in mind for next time is keep the conversation light hearted, apply more kino, beforehand brush up on my conversational skills (do some suggested readings). She says that she likes to be in control of herself but not other people, she has never been drunk in her life (at most she will have one or two maybe three drinks). She told me that she is just beginning to learn to have fun (or she did not really have the opportunity to do very many fun things...so I guess I need to show this girl a good time) Another thing I am finding is that she wants to see if you really have an opinion (she ask Why? when I say certain things as a response to her deep questions). I like this girl, just want to be put on the right path so that I'm doing the right things.

BTW: She is older than me (possibly 3-4 years older, I'm currently 20) and she is majoring in psychology (no wonder...with the all deep conversation :crackup: ). Any other tips or advice I should be aware of with this type of girl?

 

[Francisco d'Anconia]

Sounds like you've met a woman who actually has something to say and has an opinion about things other than "American Idol." Take the advice of cutting back on the conversation in you want to but some women actually are attracted to men who aren't evasive when it comes to conversation.

 

[white cloud 8]

Sounds like you've met a woman who actually has something to say and has an opinion about things other than "American Idol." Take the advice of cutting back on the conversation in you want to but some women actually are attracted to men who aren't evasive when it comes to conversation.

I practically gave my opinion (when it was needed) other than that, I was listening. So that *may* be an attractive quality (should I move the topics of conversation more towards the direction on emotion and romance?) if so, should it just naturally progress to that point or do I have to sway it that way? I shouldn't solely rely on that alone though, the other important factor I need to do is kino, right? I should do it more subtle with a girl like this or should I just try to initiate if would hold my hand if I extend it or if I go in to hold her waist..or I can just fool around a little bit and see if she is ticklish. Should I hold off on trying to go in for a kiss or...no?

Other suggestions?

 

[Francisco d'Anconia]

YOu're not getting it.

[Zen=on]
Conversations should flow effortlessly. Like a stream it is guided by the banks which holds it but in time the stream flows with more intent and gradually expands its banks eventually growing into a powerful river. And so should a conversation.
[/zen]

It should not matter what you talk about, its how the words inspire you and your companion to continue and build upon the topic(s). Go into it with a plan (like opening lines) you will enhance your chances of stumbling over your words and looking like an AFC. Play it off the cuff with the skills described in the book I mentioned earlier and you'll understand how well being unscripted can work.

 

[white cloud 8]

Could people please give suggestions on some books about dating? Are there any books which actually *HELP?*

 

[white cloud 8]

Help, please

 

[syed]

wait...dude, why haven't you gone out with her again, yet?

Anyway, this is my advice. But again, I'm the guy who is saying to shy away from all these deep intimate convos. Girls say they like guys who listen. I don't buy that ****. They want a guy who talks. Who can tell stories, take them to another world. Make them feel like another, better version of themselves. You think Mystery, or Toecutter, or whoever just sits there and listens to the girl blab? No, man...they're storytellers.

Ok, so my advice is this. A chick is a chick is a chick. They might say they are really religious or whatnot, but when it gets to be the heat of the moment they sing a different song.

Personally, I don't ever talk ABOUT romance. Or try to steer the convo int hat direction. That's just me. I completely avoid sex in conversation. Other people embrace it. It depends on what you're comfortable with. If you are completely comfortable talking about sex & romance, then talk about it.

Ok, you need to escalate the touching. So, if you're ever walking anywhere, you can hold her hand. Should be no problem. Even friends hold hands. If you arent comfortable with that, you should at least put your arm around her.

If you tell a joke, or poke fun at her, you should sometimes lightly touch her on the arm. Like if she does something embarrassing, laugh with her, and as you are laughing brush her arm with your hand. She'll accept it because she is laughing and having a good time, and it's very good to do this because it creates sort of a subtext that you two are in your own little world.

If you want to get a kiss...hmmm...first of all, like I said, DO NOT wait until the last minute to get the kiss. Only do the whole, awkward, goodbye-kiss as a last resort. There should be times (that you have planned and are ready for) throughout the evening/day when you'll have opportunities to go in for a kiss. As far as how to get it...I mean, you could sit here all day and think of creative ways to get her to kiss you. But the bottom line is, whatever you say or do doesnt really matter that much. If she's gonna kiss you, she's gonna kiss you. You can ask her to kiss you. You can tell her to kiss you. You can just go in for it. You can tell her to close her eyes, and then go in for it. You can twirl her around and then go in for it. Bottom line...she's either kissing you or she isn't.

BOTTOM LINE: GET YOUR ASS OUT THERE AND TRY SOMETHING. HAVE A PLAN, AND STICK TO IT. YOU'RE NEVER GOING TO DO ANYTHING WITH HER IF YOU DONT CALL HER AND GO OUT AGAIN.

 

[white cloud 8]

wait...dude, why haven't you gone out with her again, yet?

Anyway, this is my advice. But again, I'm the guy who is saying to shy away from all these deep intimate convos. Girls say they like guys who listen. I don't buy that ****. They want a guy who talks. Who can tell stories, take them to another world. Make them feel like another, better version of themselves. You think Mystery, or Toecutter, or whoever just sits there and listens to the girl blab? No, man...they're storytellers.

Ok, so my advice is this. A chick is a chick is a chick. They might say they are really religious or whatnot, but when it gets to be the heat of the moment they sing a different song.

Personally, I don't ever talk ABOUT romance. Or try to steer the convo int hat direction. That's just me. I completely avoid sex in conversation. Other people embrace it. It depends on what you're comfortable with. If you are completely comfortable talking about sex & romance, then talk about it.

Ok, you need to escalate the touching. So, if you're ever walking anywhere, you can hold her hand. Should be no problem. Even friends hold hands. If you arent comfortable with that, you should at least put your arm around her.

If you tell a joke, or poke fun at her, you should sometimes lightly touch her on the arm. Like if she does something embarrassing, laugh with her, and as you are laughing brush her arm with your hand. She'll accept it because she is laughing and having a good time, and it's very good to do this because it creates sort of a subtext that you two are in your own little world.

If you want to get a kiss...hmmm...first of all, like I said, DO NOT wait until the last minute to get the kiss. Only do the whole, awkward, goodbye-kiss as a last resort. There should be times (that you have planned and are ready for) throughout the evening/day when you'll have opportunities to go in for a kiss. As far as how to get it...I mean, you could sit here all day and think of creative ways to get her to kiss you. But the bottom line is, whatever you say or do doesnt really matter that much. If she's gonna kiss you, she's gonna kiss you. You can ask her to kiss you. You can tell her to kiss you. You can just go in for it. You can tell her to close her eyes, and then go in for it. You can twirl her around and then go in for it. Bottom line...she's either kissing you or she isn't.

BOTTOM LINE: GET YOUR ASS OUT THERE AND TRY SOMETHING. HAVE A PLAN, AND STICK TO IT. YOU'RE NEVER GOING TO DO ANYTHING WITH HER IF YOU DONT CALL HER AND GO OUT AGAIN.

Hmmm...interesting, well since I haven't had much experience with sex or romance (I should steer away from these topics if I haven't had much experience with them, correct?) should I focus on my strengths moreso (listening, picking up on what she is actually saying, commenting, telling stories)? since it has been a natural progression with kino e.g. when I talked with her at first I would touch her on the forearm or on the small of the back; holding hands would be the next step. As far as going in for the kiss is concerned, if the moment is right (I passed up the opportunity I think the first time :crazy:, read my first post) GO FOR IT!

 

[white cloud 8]

Would anyone know any *EXCELLENT* books on dating?