"Why Women Dump the Guys Who Try the Hardest"

You paid for dinner. You drove. You said "whatever you want is fine" every single time. All the effort, no expectations.

And she left anyway — probably for a guy who makes her pick up the pizza.

Painful. Also predictable. Her mind quietly concludes that anything requiring zero effort from her is worth exactly zero. You became a free sample, and free samples get taken for granted.

The 22 Rules flip the dynamic. Small shifts that get her investing effort, money, and time in you — until SHE'S the one afraid of losing YOU.

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Friend Zone? Or something else?

Oni

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There's this hb8 whom I've known for a couple years. When we first met, I was just an afc who lacks confidence and style, I was afraid of girls. A few years later, that changed. But during the time that I was changing, i may have fallen into the friend zone. She use to be oneitis, but that's no longer it. What I don't truly understand is that am i actually in friend zone. We never call each other on the phone. She never complains to me about stuff thats happening to her in life and expect me to comfort and listen to her. There really isn't a typical friend zone relationship in between us.

She is however, very kind and nice to me (that's the first thing about her that caught my attention). We departed after high school graduation and met up again this summer. I thought about maybe giving her a shot and see how thing goes. The first day i asked her out, we ate lunch, watched movie and then went on a stroll at the park; we ended up playing around with a lot of light kino at the slides and she was giving me a light massage; thus i thought to myself hey things are looking pretty good so far. The next time we went out together, i decided to give a little test by attempting to lead her somewhere by grabbing her hand. She quickly responded by pulling her hand away so i tried to play it off like nothing happened. But in my mind i was a little confuse. We hung out a couple more times during the summer but i alreadyy know its a loss cause so i didnt really try anything.

What I don't understand is what kinda relationship is that between us? We don't do the typical friend zone stuff, she gives me some indicator of interest and we have a lot of kino (hugs, massage, playing with hair, if i say i have calluses on my arm she would grab it and loves peeling off the skin, pulling on my leg hair, etc), she told me she likes me (i ono in what way) the most out of all the guys she know, one time she was changing in my room and i accidently walked in when she had her bra on and i said sorry but she didnt act surprise or anything--she just calmly said its okay as if it's normal, BUT she just doens't seem to want to progress into something more..something as simple as holding hand and she backs off.

Well, summer end for me and i probably won't see her for a while again. I just want some reflection on what I have done this summer and learn from it. what do you guys think?:box:
 

"Why Women Dump the Guys Who Try the Hardest"

You paid for dinner. You drove. You said "whatever you want is fine" every single time. All the effort, no expectations.

And she left anyway — probably for a guy who makes her pick up the pizza.

Painful. Also predictable. Her mind quietly concludes that anything requiring zero effort from her is worth exactly zero. You became a free sample, and free samples get taken for granted.

The 22 Rules flip the dynamic. Small shifts that get her investing effort, money, and time in you — until SHE'S the one afraid of losing YOU.

Read more...

speakeasy

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See the thread below about the harmless zone, could you possibly be in there? If she isn't romantic with you, yet doesn't care if you see her in her bra, that makes me think you're in the harmless zone, which is one step below the friend zone.
 

Oni

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thanks for the heads up. i ran a search on harmless zone and read up about it. the thing is i'm not exactly fat or nerdy. im tall and built and i always neg her when i have a chance. i am not shy and am socially outgoing as well. i remember last summer i wasnt seeing her a lot because i was seeing another girl and at one time we were eating at dennys with some other friends and she threw a potato at me saying how i never hang out with her anymore (she was on opposite side of table).

but let's say i'm in the harmless zone anyway. is there a long gaming that i can do on her so that the next time i see her (probably in a year) i can be out of this harmless zone?
 

JJMcLure

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Sounds like she thinks of you like a brother. Getting out of this would be extremely difficult if not impossible (and even if it was, certainly would not be worth the time and effort which could be spent on other chicks). Use her as social proof and work other chicks.
 

Oni

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JJMcLure said:
Sounds like she thinks of you like a brother. Getting out of this would be extremely difficult if not impossible (and even if it was, certainly would not be worth the time and effort which could be spent on other chicks). Use her as social proof and work other chicks.
i see. is there really no other way to do this? i thik i saw an article on getting out of it once.
 

"You Can't Argue a Woman Into Liking You"

You made your case like a lawyer. Stable job. Good guy. Ready for something real. All true. All irrelevant.

She weighed your points, nodded along, felt nothing — then fell hard for some tattooed bartender with a motorcycle and a gambling problem.

Logic is where attraction goes to die. The "22 Rules" work a level deeper, on the subconscious switches that decide within minutes whether you register as a MAN or as part of the furniture.

Stop presenting evidence. Start flipping switches.

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DJVladdy

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Heres the thing:
If you are tall AND built, you are NOT in a harmless zone, period.
 

Oni

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DJVladdy said:
Heres the thing:
If you are tall AND built, you are NOT in a harmless zone, period.
well thats relief :cool: but that brings me back to the question, what was i into?
 

TheHumanist

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I have suspicion that you just didn't push it enough. It could be possible you set up a little confortable zone. Harmless zone is a state that present an image that the guy is not "threatening" in anyway (not just because a person is fat or or look nerdy, but does open the possibility to be seen as one if allowed). Friendzone is something you dig oneself into.

It could possible that you dig yourself into a little that make her a little unconfortable to easily allow you to just hold hands like that.

Then again, what do I know...
 
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