"The Kiss of Death Mistake"
You replay the conversation at 2 a.m. She texted back fast yesterday. Today, nothing. Was that smile friendly or flirty? What did the shoulder touch mean?
Every hour you spend decoding her signals drains your confidence and hands her the controls. Women can sense that insecurity from across the room — and it repels them.
One of the "22 Rules" kills the obsession on the spot: assume she likes you, and act accordingly. Sounds too simple. Works anyway.
Her interest tends to rise to meet your expectations. Psychologists call it a self-fulfilling prophecy.
Does having kids make your sex life Deteriorate?
- Thread starter Climax
- Start date
"She Laughed All Night. Then She Ghosted You. Here's Why."
Dinner ran three hours. She laughed at everything. You walked her to her car thinking this one's locked in.
Then: nothing. Two texts. No reply. What happened?
You did what most men do on a great date. You filled every silence, answered every question, and left her with nothing to wonder about. No mystery. Nothing to sit with when she got home.
Rule 3 of the "22 Rules" changes the ending: tell her a little, hold back the rest, and let her imagination do the chasing. The ghosting stops too.
Rollo Tomassi
Master Don Juan
Yes.
It's the best excuse woman has ever invented in the history of the world to forestall sex after marriage. The only cure is alcohol and even this is no guarantee.
Sex deteriorates after marriage regardless of children since there's no necessitiy for a woman to feel the need to compete with other women to gain a man's security. This is when she dictates her intimacy in order to change his behavior. When women say they're "working on their guy" or "fixing him" this is the method that they use for contigency to get him to comply. A child only gives her another tool as an excuse to dictate her terms for intimacy.
The most frequent points of divorce in a (western) marriage is after 7 years and after 20 years. 7 years is the average time it takes a couple to have 2 children - at which time if the relationship isn't founded well the couple split, usually because of sexual issues. 20 years is the point at which most marriages have raised their children to college age and realize they've only stayed together in a loveless marriage in an effort support their children through rearing.
It's the best excuse woman has ever invented in the history of the world to forestall sex after marriage. The only cure is alcohol and even this is no guarantee.
Sex deteriorates after marriage regardless of children since there's no necessitiy for a woman to feel the need to compete with other women to gain a man's security. This is when she dictates her intimacy in order to change his behavior. When women say they're "working on their guy" or "fixing him" this is the method that they use for contigency to get him to comply. A child only gives her another tool as an excuse to dictate her terms for intimacy.
The most frequent points of divorce in a (western) marriage is after 7 years and after 20 years. 7 years is the average time it takes a couple to have 2 children - at which time if the relationship isn't founded well the couple split, usually because of sexual issues. 20 years is the point at which most marriages have raised their children to college age and realize they've only stayed together in a loveless marriage in an effort support their children through rearing.
Sexy_Malibu
Master Don Juan
In my experience... having kids & sex worked this way for me...
Before kids: Lots of sex. Lots and lots and lots of sex. (This led to pregnancy, lol).
Being pregnant: morning sickness & fatness & crankiness (therefore not a lot of sex) ... there were points during the pregnancy where all I wanted was sex, that was hormonal I think, but overall pregnancy = not a lot of sex.
After childbirth: tired, sore, (in addition to being forbidden from having sex for a certain period of time), have a new baby to deal with, not getting any sleep... DO NOT FEEL LIKE HAVING SEX, EVER
Later: Eventually that feeling passes, but it's difficult to find time for sex because you're tired, you have a child to take care of constantly (in addition to work, housework, etc)... the baby doesn't sleep through the night so even when you try to have sex it is interrupted every single time. Quickies becomes your friend, but even they are far and few between.
Even later: Eventually your sex life picks up again, but it's never quite as frequent as it was pre-baby. And don't even think about having sex for hours in every room of the house like you used to. Out of the question. Once the kid is old enough if you have people who are willing to do you huge favors you can schedule babysitting sessions for you to have uninterrupted sex.
and then in my own personal experience...: I split with my ex, I have my kid's grandparents take her overnight (we have a 2-family house so it's easy for them to take her anytime without it being a big imposition or me worrying if something went wrong) so I can have privacy... I date various people on and off for a few years... which brings us back to... = lots and lots of sex.
[these results are not typical
]
Before kids: Lots of sex. Lots and lots and lots of sex. (This led to pregnancy, lol).
Being pregnant: morning sickness & fatness & crankiness (therefore not a lot of sex) ... there were points during the pregnancy where all I wanted was sex, that was hormonal I think, but overall pregnancy = not a lot of sex.
After childbirth: tired, sore, (in addition to being forbidden from having sex for a certain period of time), have a new baby to deal with, not getting any sleep... DO NOT FEEL LIKE HAVING SEX, EVER
Later: Eventually that feeling passes, but it's difficult to find time for sex because you're tired, you have a child to take care of constantly (in addition to work, housework, etc)... the baby doesn't sleep through the night so even when you try to have sex it is interrupted every single time. Quickies becomes your friend, but even they are far and few between.
Even later: Eventually your sex life picks up again, but it's never quite as frequent as it was pre-baby. And don't even think about having sex for hours in every room of the house like you used to. Out of the question. Once the kid is old enough if you have people who are willing to do you huge favors you can schedule babysitting sessions for you to have uninterrupted sex.
and then in my own personal experience...: I split with my ex, I have my kid's grandparents take her overnight (we have a 2-family house so it's easy for them to take her anytime without it being a big imposition or me worrying if something went wrong) so I can have privacy... I date various people on and off for a few years... which brings us back to... = lots and lots of sex.
[these results are not typical
]Francisco d'Anconia
Master Don Juan
It has nothing to do with the kids, the parents have the power to set the limits of their sex life. The biggest problem is when women feel that their primary purpose is to take care of the children.
Blame it on the feminist movement, the Brady Bunch or whatever made women feel that they have to take this on all by themselves as if their status as a woman is dependent upon it. Once women realize that the more effort they put into making their husbands happy, the more receptive the husbands will be to helping them with the children AND doing the romantic things they did together before having a family.
Think about it, who's easier to care for, the husband or the child? The husband (even if just a little bit easier). But if she takes care of him, she can at least ask him to help her take care of his child especially if it means that he will get himself some nookie for helping out. It's just that simple.
For both mothers and fathers, having children does not mean that you have to let your looks go, you don't have to stop being sexy and attractive to your partner nor does it mean that you have to stop dating each other. Of course it is more work now but hey, if you are mature enough to decide to have children, you should be mature enough to do what's necessary to keep one another happy. Doesn't the child deserve two happy parents?
Blame it on the feminist movement, the Brady Bunch or whatever made women feel that they have to take this on all by themselves as if their status as a woman is dependent upon it. Once women realize that the more effort they put into making their husbands happy, the more receptive the husbands will be to helping them with the children AND doing the romantic things they did together before having a family.
Think about it, who's easier to care for, the husband or the child? The husband (even if just a little bit easier). But if she takes care of him, she can at least ask him to help her take care of his child especially if it means that he will get himself some nookie for helping out. It's just that simple.
For both mothers and fathers, having children does not mean that you have to let your looks go, you don't have to stop being sexy and attractive to your partner nor does it mean that you have to stop dating each other. Of course it is more work now but hey, if you are mature enough to decide to have children, you should be mature enough to do what's necessary to keep one another happy. Doesn't the child deserve two happy parents?
As a father of twins, I can tell you that kids are not the main cause of a decline in sex, but the eefects of having them are nothing short of dramatic.
Effects on the man -
1. He's got another mouth to feed. Thus, he feels pressure to work harder and longer hours to make more money. Of course, he balances with trying to spend quality time with wife and kids.
2. The wife, through little fault of her own, grows a bit heavier. her breasts get larger. This isn't always a plus, as they tend to sag quite a bit more as they can get very heavy. This does affect the libido of some men towards their mate.
3. Fatigue from lack of rest. - Only the horniest fellows feel like sex after sleeping only three hours a night.
Effects on women
There are too many to list. Suffice it to say that she's not going to feel like looking pretty for you very much anymore. She's just trying to survive! The munchkin is sucking the life out of her! If not literally, figuratively!
Hormones definitely affect her moods.
Remember, everybody is different. There's no reason why you can't work on these things and set aside some special time once a week or so for you and your woman.
Effects on the man -
1. He's got another mouth to feed. Thus, he feels pressure to work harder and longer hours to make more money. Of course, he balances with trying to spend quality time with wife and kids.
2. The wife, through little fault of her own, grows a bit heavier. her breasts get larger. This isn't always a plus, as they tend to sag quite a bit more as they can get very heavy. This does affect the libido of some men towards their mate.
3. Fatigue from lack of rest. - Only the horniest fellows feel like sex after sleeping only three hours a night.
Effects on women
There are too many to list. Suffice it to say that she's not going to feel like looking pretty for you very much anymore. She's just trying to survive! The munchkin is sucking the life out of her! If not literally, figuratively!
Hormones definitely affect her moods.
Remember, everybody is different. There's no reason why you can't work on these things and set aside some special time once a week or so for you and your woman.
"She Wants a Man, Not a Boy"
You asked her if she wanted to grab coffee. Then you asked if the time worked. Then you asked if the place was okay. Then you asked if she'd prefer tea.
Four questions. Four chances for her to say no. Four signals that you're terrified of making a decision.
Plan it. Pick the place. Pick the time. Tell her where to meet you. She'll either show up or she won't.
Either way, you look like a man instead of a scared little boy.
penkitten
Master Don Juan
the only thing it has changed with me is, NOW i must bite a pillow so i am not so loud....
gotta remember not to wake those kiddos
gotta remember not to wake those kiddos
Giovanni Casanova
Master Don Juan
- Joined
- Jan 5, 2002
- Messages
- 5,550
- Reaction score
- 18
- Age
- 47
- Location
- Hiding in Penkitten's Linen Closet
Would u do it again if u could take back time?
Thanx to all of you that replied.... but there IS one more thing that i would like to know now...
If you were to make the choice of having kids AGAIN, would you still have kids? If so, then why?
Thanx.
Laterz...
Thanx to all of you that replied.... but there IS one more thing that i would like to know now...
If you were to make the choice of having kids AGAIN, would you still have kids? If so, then why?
Thanx.
Laterz...
Sexy_Malibu
Master Don Juan
Re: Would u do it again if u could take back time?
I'm not hoping to have any more any time in near future. (Knock on wood!) But I wouldn't change my life at all. I love my kid so much and even though getting pregnant resulted in: a very painful delivery, a lack of sleep/sex/time/money, and a rocky relationship... all things are fixable, all things can get better, and I have better sex post-baby than I did pre-baby actually (that may very well be due to the change in partner, lol). I have no regrets in my life. It's hard for non-parents to get it (before I had a kid I hated kids, never wanted them, never thought I'd have one) but having a kid changes that. I'd never take it back.
Do you mean to have ANOTHER kid? Or if I could go back and change my life, would I still choose to have kids?
I'm not hoping to have any more any time in near future. (Knock on wood!) But I wouldn't change my life at all. I love my kid so much and even though getting pregnant resulted in: a very painful delivery, a lack of sleep/sex/time/money, and a rocky relationship... all things are fixable, all things can get better, and I have better sex post-baby than I did pre-baby actually (that may very well be due to the change in partner, lol). I have no regrets in my life. It's hard for non-parents to get it (before I had a kid I hated kids, never wanted them, never thought I'd have one) but having a kid changes that. I'd never take it back.
Rollo Tomassi
Master Don Juan
My wife and I only planned to have a single child, so, no, I wont be having anymore kids. That said, I did in fact want a daughter and my wife and I planned on her. We were married for 2 years before we went about getting her pregnant - and BTW 'WE' didn't get pregnant, she was pregnant, we really ought to stop deluding ourselves in this respect.
I have no regrets about having a child, however if I had it all to do again I would've put off having her for about 4 years rather than 2 after marriage. A kid DOES cramp your style with regards to a couple's sex life, there's no getting around it. Pillow biting or not, a child dictates that you have sex on a schedule and this ends up turning sex into another chore for a woman - do the laundry, get the kid to soccer practice, clean the bathroom, fvck my husband, etc. It's scheduled, and you'd better hit it before 10:30pm or she'll lose sleep because the kid has to be out the door to school by 7am. Chris Rock hit it on the head when he mentioned that after marriage (especially after a kid) a woman only sucks your d!ck to speed up the process of having sex to get on to other chores. Foreplay becomes a mechanicanism to facilitate getting on to other responsibilities.
I like what FRANSISCO said about keeping a husband happy in order to motivate him to help her with the child rearing responsibillities, it makes sense. But it doesn't circumvent a declining spontenaity in sex due to those same responsibilities. As a rule most guy's will take sex when they can get it, but we know when our partner is into it for its own sake and when it's percieved as a chore or a duty on any given occasion. And it's that interpretation that's frustrating for guys - until marriage and before kids we become used to having our partner be into it for the sole enjoyment of it, but after marriage and a kids we have to adjust to sex under conditionalities.
I have no regrets about having a child, however if I had it all to do again I would've put off having her for about 4 years rather than 2 after marriage. A kid DOES cramp your style with regards to a couple's sex life, there's no getting around it. Pillow biting or not, a child dictates that you have sex on a schedule and this ends up turning sex into another chore for a woman - do the laundry, get the kid to soccer practice, clean the bathroom, fvck my husband, etc. It's scheduled, and you'd better hit it before 10:30pm or she'll lose sleep because the kid has to be out the door to school by 7am. Chris Rock hit it on the head when he mentioned that after marriage (especially after a kid) a woman only sucks your d!ck to speed up the process of having sex to get on to other chores. Foreplay becomes a mechanicanism to facilitate getting on to other responsibilities.
I like what FRANSISCO said about keeping a husband happy in order to motivate him to help her with the child rearing responsibillities, it makes sense. But it doesn't circumvent a declining spontenaity in sex due to those same responsibilities. As a rule most guy's will take sex when they can get it, but we know when our partner is into it for its own sake and when it's percieved as a chore or a duty on any given occasion. And it's that interpretation that's frustrating for guys - until marriage and before kids we become used to having our partner be into it for the sole enjoyment of it, but after marriage and a kids we have to adjust to sex under conditionalities.
"I just moved here from Florida."
That sentence contains at least five follow-up questions she WANTS you to ask. Where in Florida? What brought you here? How long have you been in the area? What do you miss? How does it compare to here?
She handed them to you on a silver platter. And you said, "Oh cool. I come here every week. I love this band. Ummm... pretty crowded tonight."
She smiled politely. Nodded. And never texted you back.
I was that guy for years. Talking too much. Listening too little. Panicking about my next sentence while she was literally feeding me the answers.
Then I found 22 rules that fixed the whole thing. Rule number one: shut up and listen. She'll tell you exactly what to say.
Player_Supreme
Banned
Didn't stop my parents or myself when I was married! I guess it depends on which side of the tracks you came from.
Francisco d'Anconia
Master Don Juan
Back when I was a married "nice guy" I realized that if she is treated well, most good women will give their man more than what he gives her.
I learned it early in my marriage one time when my ex-wife called me at work to ask if I would pick up the little one from daycare. She had to work late ad didn't think she could pick her up by the time the daycare closed. I was planning to work late but what the hell...
I pick up the little one and since I was home earlier than usual I decided to make dinner and help the little one with her homework. By the time wifey got home, the little one had finished her homework and had eaten dinner and was getting ready for bed.
My wife was very appreciative because she was pretty tired. She offered to do the dishes but me and the little one finished them off (we had a water fight but luckily we were able to dry everything before mom got home). Anyway I was just glad that wifey could have a quiet dinner and relax.
Well, she didn't relax for long! I'll just say she was EXTREMELY appreciative! All I did was cook dinner, so I thought. Then I realized that the little things that we guys do to help out, women see as proof that we care about them, at least the good ones do. And the REALLY good ones show their appreciation, often.
Kaine
Senior Don Juan
Such a pleasant story, but I thought it was rather ironic that the women in your story is now your ex wife. So what lead to the ex wife status?
Kaine
Good question!!
I think most of you know that I would NOT have children again and would NOT get married to "that woman" (as Clinton put it) again.
However, if I had married the right woman later in life and had time to live beforehand, I might have had one and only one child.
The costs in $$$ and time and emotions are just too much nowadays. Not to mention that your wonderful kid could be arrested for armed robbery at 18 (Happened to an aquaintence of mine... true story) and then YOUR life is ruined too.
I think it is not worth the risk... unless you just love the "father knows best" lifestyle, which by the way is no longer in existence.
Dietzcoi
Good question!!
I think most of you know that I would NOT have children again and would NOT get married to "that woman" (as Clinton put it) again.
However, if I had married the right woman later in life and had time to live beforehand, I might have had one and only one child.
The costs in $$$ and time and emotions are just too much nowadays. Not to mention that your wonderful kid could be arrested for armed robbery at 18 (Happened to an aquaintence of mine... true story) and then YOUR life is ruined too.
I think it is not worth the risk... unless you just love the "father knows best" lifestyle, which by the way is no longer in existence.
Dietzcoi
I wonder why so many people are so quick to get hitched? marriage sounds like my worst nightmare? it just isnt worth the trouble these days.
http://nomarriage.com
http://nomarriage.com
"Why Women Dump the Guys Who Try the Hardest"
You paid for dinner. You drove. You said "whatever you want is fine" every single time. All the effort, no expectations.
And she left anyway — probably for a guy who makes her pick up the pizza.
Painful. Also predictable. Her mind quietly concludes that anything requiring zero effort from her is worth exactly zero. You became a free sample, and free samples get taken for granted.
The 22 Rules flip the dynamic. Small shifts that get her investing effort, money, and time in you — until SHE'S the one afraid of losing YOU.
Kaine
Senior Don Juan
Religion, societal pressure and conditioned response.
Reading these boards have really popped my bubble on marriage. I had always taken it for granted that it was just one of those milestones in life (i.e. graduating college, getting a job etc), I was only skeptical of the whole idea only through the observed breakup of my own parents. It was however an event I never really critically thought about.
I bring up the subject with male friends and aquaintances and the usual response is in fact defensive (for marriage). "It's a given, you want to be with this girl, you get married".
It's only when I bring up the observations and theories from our more mature members here that they go "Oh? Yeah there's in fact nothing advantageous for guys....". Well that is the reaction from those who can think logically and unbiasedly. I haven't heard a logical argument for, yet.
Reading these boards have really popped my bubble on marriage. I had always taken it for granted that it was just one of those milestones in life (i.e. graduating college, getting a job etc), I was only skeptical of the whole idea only through the observed breakup of my own parents. It was however an event I never really critically thought about.
I bring up the subject with male friends and aquaintances and the usual response is in fact defensive (for marriage). "It's a given, you want to be with this girl, you get married".
It's only when I bring up the observations and theories from our more mature members here that they go "Oh? Yeah there's in fact nothing advantageous for guys....". Well that is the reaction from those who can think logically and unbiasedly. I haven't heard a logical argument for, yet.