Dating Career Women

SW15

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Most female attorneys are not attractive. My ex was one of the rare exceptions. And I think most "careerist" women are on average less attractive than non-career women - the legal profession is no exception. But there are always outliers.
What do you think is the difference between a woman with a job and a careerist woman? I wrote a little bit about what I think the differences are earlier in this thread. Most of us are dating women who have jobs and are past the education phase in their lives.

I also think non-career women are more attractive. This is true in terms of physical attractiveness and their personalities.

And yes - her looks definitely kept me in that relationship for longer than I should have been. And she was cluster B - so the makeup sex was mind blowing. Naturally, I was a sucker for that.
I believe that. Many men would be. There's always a strong market for a woman with good looks and suspect mental health.
 

Barrister

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What do you think is the difference between a woman with a job and a careerist woman? I wrote a little bit about what I think the differences are earlier in this thread. Most of us are dating women who have jobs and are past the education phase in their lives.

I also think non-career women are more attractive. This is true in terms of physical attractiveness and their personalities.
I think the primary difference is a woman who is puts her job as the absolute priority vs. one who will put her relationships with other people first. The former is the "career woman" archetype. You can still have women who are highly educated and successful even but not fall into that category if she is willing to put her husband and family first. At the end of the day, the career for her takes a backseat even though it is still her livelihood. The career woman likes having a man and maybe even "wants" a family, but those thing are still not going to come first between them and her profession. The profession is number 1 for them.
 

SW15

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I think the primary difference is a woman who is puts her job as the absolute priority vs. one who will put her relationships with other people first. The former is the "career woman" archetype.
The only way to truly assess that is with time. Job title alone won't indicate that, but it can hint at it.

I do think it is good for most men seeking a woman with good girlfriend/wifely qualities and not a careerist to avoid the following women...
  • Women with advanced degrees (anything higher than a bachelor's)
  • Women who earn more than he earns (it doesn't take more than 1-2 dates to make a good, educated guess on this.)
There's a lot of gray area that those bullets don't cover though. Not all women with jobs fall into one of those two categories.

I try to date women with less demanding occupations and roles within organizations. This is not easy to do as a lot of those women are in LTRs and married because they are in demand.

You can still have women who are highly educated and successful even but not fall into that category if she is willing to put her husband and family first. At the end of the day, the career for her takes a backseat even though it is still her livelihood. The career woman likes having a man and maybe even "wants" a family, but those thing are still not going to come first between them and her profession. The profession is number 1 for them.
It can be challenging to assess that a woman puts her career #1, but it always shows up in time. There are also women who put career first that often have some really alluring characteristic, like your lawyer ex who rated HB 8.5.
 

SW15

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How unpleasant would it be to be married to a female attorney who practiced family law? It's her daily occupation to mess up men's lives in family law proceedings.
 

BeExcellent

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Advice from the old lady:

My marriage failed really as a direct result of this dynamic. My plan originally had been to drop from the workforce, support him in his business & endeavors and happily be a wife & mother. I did out earn him from the get-go, and my father warned me about this before we married. My thought was that he sells drinks and the ability to sell drinks is unlimited compared to my ability to sell my time, which is very limited. I expected to step away from the work force for the time period while my children were young at least & then expected to consider getting back to work if needed later on.

My 3 sisters each did this. Even though two of them hold masters degrees. My mother with a law degree herself dropped her career to be a wife & mother. My father, God rest his soul REQUIRED this of my mother, and she harbored resentment about that even as she complied.

My life & marriage did not go according to plan. Life hit hard and my husband lost his business and foundered. I was able to support us and we agreed we wanted us raising the children rather than a daycare. We considered taking an enormous lifestyle hit so I could be the one at home but it made no sense to introduce financial suffering with him trying to support us on 40K working long hours bartending when I worked from home and made almost 200K. It made no sense to squander being financially comfortable but it eroded the marriage over time, that backwards dynamic and I lost respect for him eventually.

Meanwhile I built a passive income portfolio designed to replace my income so that I am not obligated to a career at all soon, but I know on the surface I appear very careerist indeed, but I’m a high level “Have to” rather than “Want to”. That isn’t observable at first.

I still work from home when not traveling, and have studiously avoided management roles because I do not want the long hours or the responsibilities. I’m a well paid hired gun in my chosen field and that gives me high income, high flexibility and reserves time in my life for my relationship to be number 1.

I also have learned not to bring work home, I listen & support my man in his pursuits and I enjoy the fact that my life is arranged to allow me to do that.

I do out earn my guy now, but it is not a substantial disparity and I’m fine pulling my weight and he checks the rest of the boxes so it’s workable. We are able to do what we choose to within reason and that is nice. I have nice things and enjoy them, but I’m kinda over it. I defer to him as the man in most things except my real estate portfolio decisions, my work & parenting. Even on those things I listen & consider his input, should he offer it.

Men don’t want a careerist. They want the feminine energy and charm of a woman.

Now. Time to make coffee & go spoil my man.

Cheers.
 
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Ricky

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Rich Cooper outlines the con's of dating a career woman. I found these issues to be my experience as well.

Cons:
1. She doesn't know how to shut off her competitive mindset she used to battle men all day in her job. She becomes disagreeable, argues more, and her submissiveness evaporates. Women aren't very good at compartmentalizing like men. She will bring it all home and you will get to hear all about it.

2. She puts in long hours. Skips lunch. Stop working out. Stops eating right. Falls asleep easily. Is wiped out at the end of the week. Her work erodes into her personal life. She will be headed to an airport Sunday afternoon so she can be at some convention/meeting first thing Monday morning. She will get back late Friday evening tired from her trip. She will work on Sunday. She won't use all her allotted vacation.

3. They age prematurely due to the stress. I saw the wrinkles come on and her face change in the 2yrs.

4. They internalize female power and bring that into your relationship.

5. They don't need a husband/boyfriend. They need a wife/girlfriend.

6. They don't even have time for their own personal interests/hobbies outside of work, much less your interests. Her job is #1, her personal interests are #2 when she finds time. You will be #3.

7. I also noticed she started approaching sex like a man. No charm, no feminity......just I need some sex can you come fuhk me. Blunt and abrupt. That intimate connection dries up and it feels a little transactional.

I've never been needy, never needed much from my significant other, but being with a career woman is a very unnatural position for the man and woman to be in. In these relationships the woman becomes the man, or as in my case, the man gets tired of the battle and checks out.

For the first two years my girl wasn't this way, but she became this. I'll never date another. Hopefully this will serve to warn others. They might be a decent choice for something casual, but not for a serious relationship.
I haven't had to deal with this.. but a woman who has to travel alot could be a challenge. On the positive note it gives you some free time when she is gone (to do what you want or who you want lol)
 

Ricky

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That sounds like a like law school female who takes law school too seriously or an actual lawyer. Someone who goes to those lengths to debunk a flirty joke isn't a great relationship prospect.

There are married female lawyers and female lawyers in multi-year, committed non-marital relationships. Who dates these female lawyers for years or marries them and has children with them? It's typically some office worker type beta male or another lawyer who is beta/blue pill on relationships. In the case of a male lawyer-female lawyer pairing, it's likely they met in law school before both were lawyers. I'm sure some female lawyers also end up with their undergrad boyfriends.

It's difficult for me to imagine a 27 year old female lawyer who is 2 years out of law school getting into a relationship with a plumber or auto mechanic.

There are also many female lawyers who struggle in the dating lives.

Thinking about and discussing the dating lives of female lawyers is often more interesting than going on a first date with a female lawyer. This is often due to reasons that @The Duke mentions. Female lawyers on early stage dates won't shut off work mode and regularly talk about work. Work dominates their lives and they often don't have a lot of hobbies.

I have noticed far more female lawyers on swipe apps than out in the real world. I've only approached two lifetime. I was at a private event once in a bar and the woman with an amazing tan who looked feminine walked in. She was a lawyer. I couldn't believe it. In her 30s. I once approached a woman in an Oakland Raiders t-shirt in the gym who turned out to be a lawyer. I also didn't expect that. This was before the team moved to Las Vegas. This also occurred far from Oakland or California. I asked her about why she chose to wear a Raiders t-shirt to the gym and if she was from Northern California. The Raiders t-shirt gave me an easy opener. I did not end up arranging a date with either of these women or asking for their phone numbers.

Most men who approach strangers exclusively are not likely to end up on a date with female lawyers.

@Barrister has dated a female lawyer and interacted with numerous female lawyers.





There are career women who are plates to top tier guys and nothing more than that.

Involuntary solitude (insol, credit to Heartiste for this term) status is common with career women in their 30s and 40s. Insol women have no problems getting laid if they want to get laid. The problem is that these women have problems with committed relationships. A lot of these women are in situationships/casual sex arrangements that last 6 months or less.

There are some career women who are lesser insols/serial monogamist types that have many 1-4 year long relationships and don't marry.

I don't know a lot of career women in law and medicine. I know more career women in business-related roles since I have a business-related role.

Their husbands are seemingly quite beta.
I've known a few female physicians who have house husbands. I am not sure how happy either party is with that arrangement.
 
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Since I live in a high cost of living area, I was after career women when I started dating again last year. I found that there was very little I wanted from them aside from their income. I now choose to date women who have a more ‘artistic’ side. It is so much more fun and I’m actually enjoying their company
 

2rings

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I think at the core of this discussion lies the fact that career women are Busy.

busy people are not easy to seduce at all.

As an example: when i was at the library i saw a bunch of otherwise hot looking career women sitting at a laptop working, busy busy busy. No smile on their faces, just Busy. No chance of seducing them in any way

busy = anti seduction

another example: when i go have coffee on the affluent side of town, the women are all rich so they basically have unlimited free time. They are open to being seduced. They actually sit around cafes checking guys out

because they are not BUSY
 

Pierce Manhammer

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Spot tf on.

My marriage failed for precisely this reason in hindsight. I cannot tell the story on this public board, but suffice to say I dropped my career to pursue something else - my ability to outearn my wife was in the multiple six figure area when we agreed on it as a couple.

Our marriage issues in retrospect began then, even after I returned to my previous career after years gone and earned twice her income the damage had been done.

All the kings horses and all the kings men…

Advice from the old lady:

My marriage failed really as a direct result of this dynamic. My plan originally had been to drop from the workforce, support him in his business & endeavors and happily be a wife & mother. I did out earn him from the get-go, and my father warned me about this before we married. My thought was that he sells drinks and the ability to sell drinks is unlimited compared to my ability to sell my time, which is very limited. I expected to step away from the work force for the time period while my children were young at least & then expected to consider getting back to work if needed later on.

My 3 sisters each did this. Even though two of them hold masters degrees. My mother with a law degree herself dropped her career to be a wife & mother. My father, God rest his soul REQUIRED this of my mother, and she harbored resentment about that even as she complied.

My life & marriage did not go according to plan. Life hit hard and my husband lost his business and foundered. I was able to support us and we agreed we wanted us raising the children rather than a daycare. We considered taking an enormous lifestyle hit so I could be the one at home but it made no sense to introduce financial suffering with him trying to support us on 40K working long hours bartending when I worked from home and made almost 200K. It made no sense to squander being financially comfortable but it eroded the marriage over time, that backwards dynamic and I lost respect for him eventually.

Meanwhile I built a passive income portfolio designed to replace my income so that I am not obligated to a career at all soon, but I know on the surface I appear very careerist indeed, but I’m a high level “Have to” rather than “Want to”. That isn’t observable at first.

I still work from home when not traveling, and have studiously avoided management roles because I do not want the long hours or the responsibilities. I’m a well paid hired gun in my chosen field and that gives me high income, high flexibility and reserves time in my life for my relationship to be number 1.

I also have learned not to bring work home, I listen & support my man in his pursuits and I enjoy the fact that my life is arranged to allow me to do that.

I do out earn my guy now, but it is not a substantial disparity and I’m fine pulling my weight and he checks the rest of the boxes so it’s workable. We are able to do what we choose to within reason and that is nice. I have nice things and enjoy them, but I’m kinda over it. I defer to him as the man in most things except my real estate portfolio decisions, my work & parenting. Even on those things I listen & consider his input, should he offer it.

Men don’t want a careerist. They want the feminine energy and charm of a woman.

Now. Time to make coffee & go spoil my man.

Cheers.
 

SW15

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Most career women are insufferable to be around at work and outside of work.

Every conversation with them is an ego driven conversation. Its like there tying to pretend to be something their not.
This has been my experience with career women.

I now choose to date women who have a more ‘artistic’ side. It is so much more fun and I’m actually enjoying their company
It is better to date a woman who isn't a careerist. Any woman who views her job as something she does only to not be homeless. The best women for relationships are the ones who do the bare minimum if they work a corporate job or some who do something meaningful to them but have work-life balance.

I've known a few female physicians who have house husbands. I am not sure how happy either party is with that arrangement.
I'm trying to think of a way that a man would enjoy it. I can't think of it.

It might be cool to not have to work and spend all day at the gym getting shredded. I can't imagine a super fit dude like that coming home to a female lawyer or female physician and listening to feminist talking points in the evenings.
 

SW15

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Career woman are majority of the time the biggest sluts in disguise.
They have a lot of failed first dates but you have a valid point. If they get past the whole "first date, no sex, no second date" thing, they tend to be big time penis carousel riders. Due to female abundance, they can have 300 options, go on dates with 20, and have sex with 3 quite easily. If a woman keeps doing that over multiple years, she can put up a high notch count.
 
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