Conversation is getting increasingly difficult in the social media age

[SW15]

Yes most people these days lack social skills and are borderline autistic.

Yes, this is true.

I have examples of this from my friend's wives.

One male friend has a wife. They met in college circa 2010. Circa 2010, in her early 20s peak, I would have rated her a 7. I first met her in 2011. At one point in the 2nd half of the 2010s, she claimed that no man had ever hit on her in a grocery store. Neither my friend nor I actually believed her claim. The more likely instance is that she got approached in a grocery store, but was so socially inept that she couldn't figure out that it was an actual approach. It's likely that some guy started a conversation with her in a grocery store, but since he wasn't a Top 20% guy and she already had a boyfriend, he was probably invisible to her and conversation didn't even last one minute. While this woman was borderline cute/hot (around a 7) when we met in 2011, by 2015 her looks were declining. This is because she wasn't an exercise enthusiast. It's a shame that she showed looks-based declines by her late 20s. In the last few years, she would have rated above a 5-5.5. A 5.5 would have been a very generous rating 18-24 months ago.

A male acquaintance got together with a female from the general social circle. This female was some co-worker to a few guys in the general social circle/sphere. I had my eye on this woman as I had seen her on Facebook posts (remember this is the early to mid 2010s). I saw her at a party and when I approached, she had such an off putting vibe for no reason, demonstrating a lack of social skills and borderline autist behavior. When I described this incident to a different male friend (not the one mentioned in previous block of text), he indicated that he had tried to converse with her before and got a similar vibe. Anyway, so one of our mutual acquaintances got with her. That guy is taller and better looking than both of us, but I'm not bad looking myself. That taller, better looking acquaintance didn't win a special prize with this girl. Even at her peak, she was only maybe mid-tier cute (6-6.5). If I had gotten her on a date, it would not have worked out because I've heard she's quite sexually frigid and doesn't put out quickly. She probably would have gotten pissed with my attempts to escalate had she not been so autistic in our initial interaction. I still don't like ever seeing her at broader social circle gatherings. Fortunately, I don't see her more than 1-2 times a year in person.

There's another acquaintance with a wife who is thin, has a mediocre face, and has an advanced level degree. Her social skills are borderline autistic too. None of the men in the social circle have ever said one positive word about her. She was already the girlfriend of that acquaintance by the time she got introduced to everyone, so none of the males in the social circle ever made a play on her.

Yep. It's at the point where cold approaching a woman turns awkward because the woman just flat out doesn't know how to respond to it anymore. I've had much success back in the early to mid 2000s cold approaching. Now it's not the norm.

I've had the experience of approaching women in various daygame venues and it was apparent that they couldn't process what was going on and didn't know how to respond to it. This was happening as far back as points in the 2010s well before the pandemic was a thing.

 

[Who Dares Win]

I believe that the dating process broke when it stop being connected to the common environment and setting.

Men and women really have not much in common nowadays and once you remove inside jokes and familiarity its a struggle against the odds.

Teenage dating and your 20s dating work much better not only cause of higher attraction and better mental health but also cause of common everyday life ground where two can relate.

Regarding about the phone brands that @SW15 talks about I can relate, the women using android phones are much more down to earth...it's also beyond my understanding how a middle class girl would invest an entire monthly salary on a phone despite the impressive camera quality.

 

[SW15]

I believe that the dating process broke when it stop being connected to the common environment and setting.

Men and women really have not much in common nowadays and once you remove inside jokes and familiarity its a struggle against the odds.

Yes, I agree. This would explain most non-bar approaches, bar approaches, social media DM slides, and swipe app interactions. The least connected of those are the swipe apps and the social media DMing.

Even with the in-person approaches, how much does it really matter that I'm at the same supermarket as a woman at the same time? Think about the mall or a bookstore too. Does it matter that I'm at Urban Outfitters or H&M when she is? Also, when I'm at the mall, this is likely an extended approach sessions well disguised. Does it matter that I'm at the same bookstore doing a well disguised approach session.

Teenage dating and your 20s dating work much better not only cause of higher attraction and better mental health but also cause of common everyday life ground where two can relate.

Most of common everyone life ground in those years is high school and college for those fortunate enough to attend college.

It's a common path to finish college at 22-23, so even most of one's 20s is spent fighting it out in areas not connected to the common environment and setting.

Regarding the phone brands that @SW15 talks about I can relate, the women using android phones are much more down to earth...it's also beyond my understanding how a middle class girl would invest an entire monthly salary on a phone despite the impressive camera quality.

Agree that women using Android phones will be more down to Earth than iPhone users. Women using Androids typically will not be as good looking. There will be more obesity, more single motherhood, and less attractive facial aesthetics. Also, some female Android users might be less social adept, even in this era when attractive women can be borderline autist as @Zimbabwe and I illustrated with stories about the wives of male friends/acquaintances.

 

[Hal9000]

I've run into women who came across as smart and witty via text but once we actually meet they've got no personality at all. Totally clam up. And this wasn't a situation where we met and they didn't like me, they wanted things to continue but they had nothing going for them personality wise in person. Bet there are a lot of people like that out there these days.

 

[Dr.Suave]

If they're exhibiting a great personality over text, then chances are they have a great personality in person too.

I mean they either have a great personality or they don't.

What's happening imo is, since the birth of dating apps and SM, many people have come to rely on these methods of communication and developed social anxiety as it relates to in-person meets. Immediately before the date and during.

I happen to think this is one of the main reasons for so much flaking on initial in-person meets, especially when scheduled in advance.

The communication and connection is there while texting, it's fun, engaging, comfortable and safe.. Or it can be if they have decent text game and know how to converse.

But as the date approaches, suddenly there's a shift. People (both men and women, but perhaps more women) start over-thinking, becoming nervous, anxious; I've witnessed people actually start panicking! So they flake.

When there is VERY high interest developed over text, which imo is rare, they will push through the anxiety and meet.

This happened with myself and hubs. I very nearly flaked myself due to extreme anxiety but I had such HIGH interest and attraction, I pushed through it and we met, immediately clicked and I felt comfortable.

I've seen this happen with other people as well.

With regard to good communication, over text and in person, when there is high interest and a genuine connection NOT based on the superficial like looks, money, status etc, it's natural and easy.

Problem is, at least what I'm witnessing in today's dating environment, there is so much superficiality on both sides versus a genuine connection of spirits being made.

Prioritizing looks, money, status, thirst over a true connection of minds and spirits, the latter of which many people have never experienced and probably think I'm some weird new-age whacko. Lol

Looks and physical attraction are definitely important as are intelligence and type of career as their choice of career speaks to who they are as a person.

Those things "add to" the overall attraction you're feeling and mutual connection.

Status I could give two shyts about although I realize this is important to many women which is a big part of the problem imho.

For men it's their thirst for the V.

Sadly, people aren't truly connecting. And they wonder and complain why they can't have a decent conversation with each other.

Not sure what the answer is, it is what it is as they say. How dating has evolved or perhaps more accurately, devolved.

Last time I was single I dated this girl. She wouldnt shut up on texts but in person she was very quiet. I ghosted her.

 

[Dr.Suave]

Why do you think she was quiet in person?

It could be a number of reasons. I just wasnt feeling it and I was not going to go to go through the motions just to get a lay. Maybe she wasnt feeling it either or maybe she picked up on the fact that I was not really into her.

 

[anonymous12345]

Can relate. One reason cold approaches are hard is that they talk less. I cold approached an indian girl (I'm in Sweden) and she was amazed and said I'm changing her perception of swedes (girl, I haven't changed the swedes, you're just experiencing me).

The switch to social media/phone is also noticeable. I asked a girl (21ish) if she wanted to hang out, we had attraction and she was interested, but despite that she wanted to text. Sigh.

In all, I miss the old days, before social media. It was way more interactive and girls had an appreciation for men. I haven't changed, have a higher SMV now, but still there's simply no interest. I think it's instagram. Every girl has a 200 likes on her bikini picture, so validation/attention/dopamine is already through the roof. Have a nice crisis post wall.

I think it was in Swedish media that statistics show people have less sex, despite the (primarily digitally) sexualized society we have.

 

[kavi]

Its not social media imo. Its just a general societal breakdown and negativity. Young ppl are under a lot of pressure from society esp education jobs and relationships.

The older generation and political elites havent done enoug to foster a positive social environment for young ppl. The rich continue to get richer and so for them evrything is fine.

The world was a better place in the 90s. Atleast ppl were more optimistic. Since then evry aspect of society had declined while the rich continue to get richer.

Normies at the bottom are in a tough world not conducive to positive social interaction. This feeds into the an earlier thread comparing higher status 'beautiful' women vs lower status 'sexy' women.

Those higher status women had the social and economic advantages that fostered greater confidence and positivity. Those below upper middle class are left to suffer.

I have worked at high end parties and social functions and i have seen those ppl from childhood receiving social support and positivity that is never given to those middle class and below.

The reason for the interview style dates is that these women dont wanna waste time in a dating market that they dont enjoy so they just wanna find the guy who is good on paper so they can settle down. Its all very clinical and goal oriented

You cant meet a guy and be confident positive open and fun when your entire life and social circle is negative and unhappy.

Our society hasnt fostered positive relations between women, nor between men. Its just competing for partners and jobs in ever harsher markets. That is not the recipe to appreciate positive interactions rather how do i win or what can i get out of this with minimal effort.

 

[DoubleBarrel]

Guys, if your conversation skills are lacking, just know it's not entirely your fault.

Ask yourself when was the last time you had a flirtatious conversation with a woman over the phone..... I'm willing to bet it was a long while ago....

The last time I had a flirtatious phone conversation was probably around 2013......

That's because around 2014 smartphones were becoming more affordable and everybody had one - from middle school kids to illegal immigrants - everybody had a smartphone and everybody preferred texting over phone conversations....

Now we're living in the social media age where 70% of all social interactions are digital...... people are no longer accustomed to interacting with each other in person anymore....

This means that both men AND women possess poor conversation skills these days.

But as a man, society dictates that the onus falls on your shoulders to lead and maintain the conversation. Women get a pass, and they're comfortable just sitting back and being a passenger.....

But conversation is a team effort, if she ain't contributing anything more than single word answers ("yeah" "no" "sometimes" "maybe" "idk" "not really"), then of course the conversation will be stale, but she'll blame you for being "boring".....

This is the main reason why when (on the rare occasion) a guys scores a date, the conversation inevitably feels like a job interview because neither side knows how to relax and speak naturally - it's just a barrage of questions and one-word answers, and both sides feel awkward.

Truthfully though, if we were to strip away a woman's beauty and observe her in an objective manner, we would see that a lot of women are pretty Godd@mn boring as well.....


I rarely meet a woman that has anything interesting to say or have any humor or have any interesting life experiences.....

Most women in their 20s, 30s and 40s talk about the same childish bullsh!t that high school kids talk about - it's nothing but gossiping, bragging about what they bought, or complaining....

Guys, if you're on date and the conversation runs stale, don't beat yourself up over it...... it's not entirely your fault....

Nope, I would take full responsibility. The man with people skills doesn't have any of the problems you've elucidated on here. If you're experiencing them, your conversation skills need improvement.

 

[mikedee]

Girls nowadays don't have anything to say. They don't have any opinion, any particular tastes (music, art, cinema, fashion, etc.), they don't know what happens in the world (news), general culture is inexistent, not interested in learning anything (skills, knowledge). They have very bad judgement and in terms of ethics, no comment. They are all generic and self-centred. They are stuck in their virtual social media world, they don't know what to say during "real" interactions.

I've been on countless date during the last 3 years, only a few girls were cool/interesting. I'm a good conversationalist, they are not so I try to ask questions, to spike their interest with topics they like. Nothing, they have nothing interesting to say, they don't really care actually.

Browsing instagram, shopping clothes online, chatting men on OLD, getting their nails done while looking at meaningless stuff of their iPhone. That's pretty much what they do.

 

[Zimbabwe]

Nothing, they have nothing interesting to say, they don't really care actually.

The real issue is is that most times men do all the heavy lifting when it comes to conversation, this means they never develop their own social skills it's why a lot of women come off as borderline autistic.

Women at my office would just gossip or talk about reality TV all day.

Browsing instagram, shopping clothes online, chatting men on OLD, getting their nails done while looking at meaningless stuff of their iPhone. That's pretty much what they do.

That's EXACTLY what they do all day, how many girls do you know that have actual hobbies?

 

[anonymous12345]

Go to university or art school guys

 

[anonymous12345]

I'm the opposite. I'm tired of elaboration, I just want to cuddle and have sex, etc. But what builds connection might be complex even though the resulting connection is simple.

 

[mikedee]

Go to university or art school guys

I'm currently in university, and studied photography and education before (95% women). No difference.

 

[BadWatermelon]

Girls nowadays don't have anything to say. They don't have any opinion, any particular tastes (music, art, cinema, fashion, etc.), they don't know what happens in the world (news), general culture is inexistent, not interested in learning anything (skills, knowledge). They have very bad judgement and in terms of ethics, no comment. They are all generic and self-centred. They are stuck in their virtual social media world, they don't know what to say during "real" interactions.

And they vote.

 

[BadWatermelon]

I'm naturally introverted and have noticed something about myself recently. Nearly all of my friends are extroverts and good conversationalists. When I meet new people, I will be kind of quiet and passive after a little while, and it's not even something I really give much thought, but it filters out the people who aren't good at carrying on a good conversation.