Article: Men are lost. Here’s a map out of the wilderness.

[Pierce Manhammer]

A long read:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2023/07/10/christine-emba-masculinity-new-model/

Except:

I started noticing it a few years ago. Men, especially young men, were getting weird.

It might have been the “incels” who first caught my attention, spewing self-pitying venom online, sometimes venturing out to attack the women they believed had done them wrong.

 

[BadBoy89]

This excerpt got my attention:

Because men still dominate leadership positions in government and corporations, many assume they’re doing fine and bristle at male complaint. After all, all 45 U.S. presidents have been male, and men still make up more than two-thirds of Congress. A 2020 analysis of the S&P 500 found that there were more CEOs named Michael or James than there were female CEOs, period. Women are still dealing with historical discrimination and centuries of male domination that haven’t been fully accounted for or rectified. Are we really worrying that men feel a little emasculated because their female classmates are doing well?

But millions of men lack access to that kind of power and success — and, downstream, cut loose from a stable identity as patriarchs deserving of respect, they feel demoralized and adrift. The data show it, but so does the general mood: Men find themselves lonely, depressed, anxious and directionless.

———

The above excerpt is the foundation of the problem.

The men who are in power, who have the money, who make the rules, it is BENEFICIAL for them to WEAKEN the average man by giving economic, social, and legal power to women along with the other groups. Combine that with chastising men for showing any sexual urges, chastising men for wanting to have sex with a woman, or for wanting offspring and wanting a family.

It’s a tough road for men.

 

[CornbreadFed]

But millions of men lack access to that kind of power and success — and, downstream, cut loose from a stable identity as patriarchs deserving of respect, they feel demoralized and adrift. The data show it, but so does the general mood: Men find themselves lonely, depressed, anxious and directionless.

my GF or female friends can’t understand this either. The top of men do not downstream their resources to other men at all. Both of us have to compete for resources and potential against the same top men. Women just get a ladder to help them climb in to higher positions while the vast majority of men get Jack shvt.

 

[The Duke]

So how do you think the men that have power and success got there? And what segment are you referring to? Politicians, CEO's?

You think they all came from rich families? Families that have political connections?

What keeps you from being one of those if that is your goal?

 

[MatureDJ]

my GF or female friends can’t understand this either. The top of men do not downstream their resources to other men at all. Both of us have to compete for resources and potential against the same top men. Women just get a ladder to help them climb in to higher positions while the vast majority of men get Jack shvt.

It's OVER for DownstreamCels.

 

[zekko]

So how do you think the men that have power and success got there?

Men are competitive, they compete against each other. It's the 80/20 rule. There's always going to be that top 20% that succeeds. That leaves the other 80% mired in mediocrity, or worse. Underperforming women have far more support systems.

 

[CornbreadFed]

So how do you think the men that have power and success got there? And what segment are you referring to? Politicians, CEO's?

You think they all came from rich families? Families that have political connections?

What keeps you from being one of those if that is your goal?

Luck does come in to play rather it be your parents/network or everything you do aligning perfectly together. A good example for me is the pandemic happening really opened up some avenues for me that weren't present previously. My hard work and dedication helped me seize the day on these opportunities, but it could've been pointless and a burnout.

 

[MatureDJ]

Men are competitive, they compete against each other. It's the 80/20 rule. There's always going to be that top 20% that succeeds. That leaves the other 80% mired in mediocrity, or worse. Underperforming women have far more support systems.

Captain, it's logically OVER for 80%Cels.

 

[MatureDJ]

A long read:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2023/07/10/christine-emba-masculinity-new-model/

Except:

I started noticing it a few years ago. Men, especially young men, were getting weird.

It might have been the “incels” who first caught my attention, spewing self-pitying venom online, sometimes venturing out to attack the women they believed had done them wrong.

The author is one of the few progressive authors that supports family values - and she's quite cute to boot.

“And the first question this kid asked me is just … ‘What the heck does good masculinity look like?’”

my opinion: https://www.amazon.com/Meditations-Penguin-Classics-Marcus-Aurelius/dp/0140449337

 

[Bokanovsky]

So how do you think the men that have power and success got there? And what segment are you referring to? Politicians, CEO's?

You think they all came from rich families? Families that have political connections?

What keeps you from being one of those if that is your goal?

I would say that discrimination against men is making it more difficult for many (but not all) men to get to the top. And yes, having wealth and connections is becoming increasingly more important if you're male (and particularly if you're a white male).

Take elite colleges as an example. At one time, the vast majority of Ivy League college students were while males. Some were from rich families, some were legacy admissions but there were also a lot of middle class kids and even students from "working class" backgrounds who were there on a scholarship. Go to Harvard, Yale, Princeton etc. today and you will be hard pressed to find a white males who is not from a rich family or a legacy admission. Middle and working class white students have all but disappeared and were replaced with females and minorities.

The same thing is happening outside of academia. Men from elite backgrounds are more or less holding on thanks to wealth, family connections, etc. But middle and working class men are getting wiped out.

 

[zekko]

Captain, it's logically OVER for 80%Cels.

I'm sure Kirk was in the top 20% of sentient beings getting laid throughout the galaxy.

 

[Bokanovsky]

Men are competitive, they compete against each other. It's the 80/20 rule. There's always going to be that top 20% that succeeds. That leaves the other 80% mired in mediocrity, or worse. Underperforming women have far more support systems.

It only works like that in a meritocracy. Modern western society is no longer a meritocracy.

 

[DonVariously]

I liked the article. The question 'what the heck does good masculinity look like?' is a valid one. Women not being attracted to feminist men resonated, I was like that when I was younger (even had long hair) and had trouble getting girls. I think it starts with being physically strong, it's easy to do and shows discipline and that you care. Mental fortitude is up there as well. Anectodetally, I remember my ex telling me she liked I was like a rock. I'd say taking initiative is a masculine virtue as well, and intuitively women understand this. I mean, women expect the men to initiate the conversation/sex. Risk-taking is an interesting one, it should not be done carelessly but even when it fails it can pay off. Although not an exhaustive list, leadership is the one I'd like to end with.

 

[CornbreadFed]

It only works like that in a meritocracy. Modern western society is no longer a meritocracy.

it was never one here in the US for sure.

 

[Bokanovsky]

it was never one here in the US for sure.

It was never purely meritocratic (a virtual impossibility) but historically the U.S. was more meritocratic than just about any other country. This has mostly to do with how the country was settled. European immigrants who settled North America were generally not from elite backgrounds and it took a while for local elites to form. And because of ongoing westward expansion, there were always abundant opportunities for those willing to take risks and work hard. That era is pretty much over.

 

[MatureDJ]

The author is one of the few progressive authors that supports family values - and she's quite cute to boot.

my opinion: https://www.amazon.com/Meditations-Penguin-Classics-Marcus-Aurelius/dp/0140449337

I should say that I got the author mixed with another progressive author; I most certainly do not say that Christine Emba is cute, and am not so sure about her attitude toward family values, although I do know that she is not a whacko.

 

[CornbreadFed]

It was never purely meritocratic (a virtual impossibility) but historically the U.S. was more meritocratic than just about any other country. This has mostly to do with how the country was settled. European immigrants who settled North America were generally not from elite backgrounds and it took a while for local elites to form. And because of ongoing westward expansion, there were always abundant opportunities for those willing to take risks and work hard. That era is pretty much over.

You are forgetting that this only applied to men classified as "white". A large chunk of Americans have grandparents that are still alive today that were institutionally discriminated against from voting, civil rights, housing, fair due process, and etc. Yeah that era for white men to enjoy a steep hill advantage over groups of people is over, I agree. Do not get triggered over my post, go foam over a US history book if you have a problem with it.

 

[zekko]

You are forgetting that this only applied to men classified as "white". A large chunk of Americans have grandparents that are still alive today that were institutionally discriminated against from voting, civil rights, housing, fair due process, and etc. Yeah that era for white men to enjoy a steep hill advantage over groups of people is over, I agree. Do not get triggered over my post, go foam over a US history book if you have a problem with it.

There have been plenty of POC who have worked their butts off and succeeded.

 

[CornbreadFed]

There have been plenty of POC who have worked their butts off and succeeded.

Who said there wasn't? Doesn't change anything this country's past.

 

[RazorRambo24]

I can tell you right now, being here or more than half a year, I can say without a doubt that majority of men on Sosuave are CLUELESS when it comes to women and game. Sadly, even some of the guys people respect on here and tag on here in their posts, these guys say some stuff that really ousts them as inexperienced or severely lacking.

With that being said, what I see outside in the real world is far different than what I see and hear on the internet. Of course, the environment and people i'm around are capable/ confident men who have on average a good to moderate level of success in their life.. and are well polished in most areas of their life.