Aaron Clarey: Short Men Must Go Overseas

[FlexpertHamilton]

Sigh. Another thread about height. I’m barely 5’4” and I’ve banged more women than most of my friends. My current gf is taller then me and my last gf was taller then me. Short men can get women.

Okay but if you were 6'2 would you have to work as hard? If everything else was equal but you were 6'2 would you get the exact same quality and quantity of pvssy?

 

[Hamurabimbi]

Okay but if you were 6'2 would you have to work as hard? If everything else was equal but you were 6'2 would you get the exact same quality and quantity of pvssy?

I have a friend who is 6’2” but not very attractive facially. He’s a White guy who managed to get his looksmatched Asian woman. I’m taller than YoungOG, but still on the short side (5’6”-7”). I do fine with women. As a thought experiment. I’ve concluded that if my 6’2” friend was my height, he’d be an incel. If I were his height. I’d be dead. Having drowned in pu$$y years ago. So yes. height is important. Everything is important. Maximize everything.

 

[FlexpertHamilton]

I have a friend who is 6’2” but not very attractive facially. He’s a White guy who managed to get his looksmatched Asian woman. I’m taller than YoungOG, but still on the short side (5’6”-7”). I do fine with women. As a thought experiment. I’ve concluded that if my 6’2” friend was my height, he’d be an incel. If I were his height. I’d be dead. Having drowned in pu$$y years ago. So yes. height is important. Everything is important. Maximize everything.

I'm 6' and good looking but if I was average height and average looks i'd almost certainly be a black pilled incel.

 

[Hamurabimbi]

I'm 6' and good looking but if I was average height and average looks i'd almost certainly be a black pilled incel.

Average looking. average height guys get women. I’m literally out at this moment and see plenty of average folks paired.

 

[FlexpertHamilton]

Average looking. average height guys get women. I’m literally out at this moment and see plenty of average folks paired.

I have a working theory about most "couples" that have normal/average looking men.

Modern women have massive insecurities with pathologically inflated egos. They don't want a tall rich Chad with charisma and rock solid frame. They cannot control him, their only choice is to submit and they don't want that even for a top .1% man. They want "average" guys that they can control under the guise of a 50-50 relationship or in some cases a completely spineless guy they psychologically dominate. That's why the majority of married men are utterly dominated by their wives. Do a survey of 100,000 white families in the US and ask them "who runs the household, the husband or wife?" 90% of them will say the wife. Maybe more than 90%.

 

[Hamurabimbi]

I have a working theory about most "couples" that have normal/average looking men.

Modern women have massive insecurities with pathologically inflated egos. They don't want a tall rich Chad with charisma and rock solid frame. They cannot control him, their only choice is to submit and they don't want that even for a top .1% man. They want "average" guys that they can control under the guise of a 50-50 relationship or in some cases a completely spineless guy they psychologically dominate. That's why the majority of married men are utterly dominated by their wives. Do a survey of 100,000 white families in the US and ask them "who runs the household, the husband or wife?" 90% of them will say the wife. Maybe more than 90%.

certainly possible.

 

[Young OG]

But how fat are these women you're banging?

I’ve banged all kinds of varieties. Most were not fat. My current gf is Asian. I’ve noticed that Asian and Latina women seem to care about height less then white women do.

 

[Young OG]

Okay but if you were 6'2 would you have to work as hard? If everything else was equal but you were 6'2 would you get the exact same quality and quantity of pvssy?

I’m sure if I was 6’2 but the same face then I would probably be considered a Chad and I would be banging a lot of women. I have an above average face which helps.

 

[SW15]

I’ve noticed that Asian and Latina women seem to care about height less then white women do.

I agree with this. This has been unfortunate for me as a White male most interested in White females. The majority (95%) of my interactions have been with White females. I do find Hispanic/Latina women attractive though.

Being 5'10" and a White man pursuing White women isn't ideal. White women are the ones most likely to demand 6'0"+ men.

I'm 6' and good looking but if I was average height and average looks i'd almost certainly be a black pilled incel.

Your height has been a large part of why you have achieved what you have achieved. I'm sure your face and overall fitness level has likely helped as well.

I have a working theory about most "couples" that have normal/average looking men.

Modern women have massive insecurities with pathologically inflated egos. They don't want a tall rich Chad with charisma and rock solid frame. They cannot control him, their only choice is to submit and they don't want that even for a top .1% man. They want "average" guys that they can control under the guise of a 50-50 relationship or in some cases a completely spineless guy they psychologically dominate. That's why the majority of married men are utterly dominated by their wives. Do a survey of 100,000 white families in the US and ask them "who runs the household, the husband or wife?" 90% of them will say the wife. Maybe more than 90%.

I disagree with you that women don't want a tall, rich top tier guy with a good frame. Women want that. The problem is that most women cannot get that type of man to commit to her longer term. A top tier woman in looks (typically 8-8.5+) has a chance to get this sort of commitment from a man, especially if she locks him down earlier in life. This will typically happen for women somewhere in the 18-29 age range when they are in that 8-8.5+ looks range.

The issue is that most women are not good looking enough to get the top tier man. What do they do?

There are some that end up riding the penis carousel for a long time, choosing to have sex with alpha males. At best, they get shorter term commitments from time, typically lasting one year or less. Often times, they end up in casual sex situationship type arrangements with these top tier men.

A lot of the more average looking to slightly above average looking women find commitments with someone near their level. These are women finding relationships with middle of the bell curve men in looks and maybe even semi-successful men financially. These men aren't elite looking men to be in the top tier on looks/money and they haven't adopted the personality tactics of the Manosphere/red pill (think Rollo Tomassi/Iron Rules of Tomassi or lessons from Rich Cooper's videos or Unplugged Alpha book). These are typical males, commonly called beta males or Average Frustrated Chumps (common term from the late 1990s-2000s era pickup community).

At the bottom of this post, I've linked an article and a video. I have linked an article from 2012 from Caleb Jones (aka Alpha Male 2.0 or Blackdragon in the past). In 2022, he turned about 90% of the content of that article into a YouTube video.

Jones identifies 3 types of women: Dominants, Submissives, and Independents. Dominant women tend to have strong personalities and try their best to dominate the frame of relationships. One type of dominant woman is the Girl Boss degreed and career-oriented woman. Submissive strongly respond to and prefer a male leader in their relationships. Independents tend to be outcome independent women who do not desire to dominate the frame of relationships and boss men around in a relationship. He has theorized that 60% of Western women are Dominants, 30% are Submissives, and 10% are Independents.

If you think his categorization of the quantity of women is accurate, then you start to see the common interactions. It's been said many times that 80-85% of men are betas/omegas and 15-20% of men are alpha/sigmas.

There are a lot of pairings with a Dominant type woman and beta male. That's the most common pairing and what @FlexpertHamilton calls "the average guys they can control under the guise of a 50-50 relationship or in some cases a completely spineless guy they psychologically dominate". The majority of married men now are beta males who don't know or follow Iron Rule of Tomassi #1 (Frame is Everything and control it). A beta male with a Dominant woman will produce a relationship where the woman controls the frame of the relationship. Given that this is the most common pairing in a Western nation, this is why there are a lot of mediocre to subpar marriages with Dominant women dictating the terms of the interaction. Much of this depends on the degree to which a woman is Dominant and the degree to which a man is beta. Dominant and beta behaviors are exhibited on a continuum.

The women who tend to end up with alphas and sigmas in longer term relationships would be Submissives and Independents. While all relationships do erode in quality over time (I've long believed in a common shelf life of goodness of about 5 years), sometimes what remains after the quality erosion is good enough to warrant continuing on and it has a reasonable degree of quality. When this happens (less common), the more common type of pairing would be an Alpha/Sigma male and some Submissive/Independent woman.

The Three Types of Women - Alpha Male 2.0

Enable Dark Mode Enable Light Mode Get Free Email Updates! Join us for FREE to get instant email updates! -By Caleb Jones Listen to Audio Version Download PDF Version Listen to Extended Audio Content In our last post we talked about the three types of men. Now let’s talk about women. Women are...

alphamale20.com

 

[Hamurabimbi]

I agree with this. This has been unfortunate for me as a White male most interested in White females. The majority (95%) of my interactions have been with White females. I do find Hispanic/Latina women attractive though.

Being 5'10" and a White man pursuing White women isn't ideal. White women are the ones most likely to demand 6'0"+ men.

5’10” is not a negative. I’m shorter than you. Two of my last 4 GFs have been White. The girl who took my V-card was White. And I live in an area which is 35% White. Luckily I don’t really have a racial preference. Though I find Black women incredibly sexy.

 

[Hamurabimbi]

I agree with this. This has been unfortunate for me as a White male most interested in White females. The majority (95%) of my interactions have been with White females. I do find Hispanic/Latina women attractive though.

Being 5'10" and a White man pursuing White women isn't ideal. White women are the ones most likely to demand 6'0"+ men.



Your height has been a large part of why you have achieved what you have achieved. I'm sure your face and overall fitness level has likely helped as well.



I disagree with you that women don't want a tall, rich top tier guy with a good frame. Women want that. The problem is that most women cannot get that type of man to commit to her longer term. A top tier woman in looks (typically 8-8.5+) has a chance to get this sort of commitment from a man, especially if she locks him down earlier in life. This will typically happen for women somewhere in the 18-29 age range when they are in that 8-8.5+ looks range.

The issue is that most women are not good looking enough to get the top tier man. What do they do?

There are some that end up riding the penis carousel for a long time, choosing to have sex with alpha males. At best, they get shorter term commitments from time, typically lasting one year or less. Often times, they end up in casual sex situationship type arrangements with these top tier men.

A lot of the more average looking to slightly above average looking women find commitments with someone near their level. These are women finding relationships with middle of the bell curve men in looks and maybe even semi-successful men financially. These men aren't elite looking men to be in the top tier on looks/money and they haven't adopted the personality tactics of the Manosphere/red pill (think Rollo Tomassi/Iron Rules of Tomassi or lessons from Rich Cooper's videos or Unplugged Alpha book). These are typical males, commonly called beta males or Average Frustrated Chumps (common term from the late 1990s-2000s era pickup community).

At the bottom of this post, I've linked an article and a video. I have linked an article from 2012 from Caleb Jones (aka Alpha Male 2.0 or Blackdragon in the past). In 2022, he turned about 90% of the content of that article into a YouTube video.

Jones identifies 3 types of women: Dominants, Submissives, and Independents. Dominant women tend to have strong personalities and try their best to dominate the frame of relationships. One type of dominant woman is the Girl Boss degreed and career-oriented woman. Submissive strongly respond to and prefer a male leader in their relationships. Independents tend to be outcome independent women who do not desire to dominate the frame of relationships and boss men around in a relationship. He has theorized that 60% of Western women are Dominants, 30% are Submissives, and 10% are Independents.

If you think his categorization of the quantity of women is accurate, then you start to see the common interactions. It's been said many times that 80-85% of men are betas/omegas and 15-20% of men are alpha/sigmas.

There are a lot of pairings with a Dominant type woman and beta male. That's the most common pairing and what @FlexpertHamilton calls "the average guys they can control under the guise of a 50-50 relationship or in some cases a completely spineless guy they psychologically dominate". The majority of married men now are beta males who don't know or follow Iron Rule of Tomassi #1 (Frame is Everything and control it). A beta male with a Dominant woman will produce a relationship where the woman controls the frame of the relationship. Given that this is the most common pairing in a Western nation, this is why there are a lot of mediocre to subpar marriages with Dominant women dictating the terms of the interaction. Much of this depends on the degree to which a woman is Dominant and the degree to which a man is beta. Dominant and beta behaviors are exhibited on a continuum.

The women who tend to end up with alphas and sigmas in longer term relationships would be Submissives and Independents. While all relationships do erode in quality over time (I've long believed in a common shelf life of goodness of about 5 years), sometimes what remains after the quality erosion is good enough to warrant continuing on and it has a reasonable degree of quality. When this happens (less common), the more common type of pairing would be an Alpha/Sigma male and some Submissive/Independent woman.

The Three Types of Women - Alpha Male 2.0

Enable Dark Mode Enable Light Mode Get Free Email Updates! Join us for FREE to get instant email updates! -By Caleb Jones Listen to Audio Version Download PDF Version Listen to Extended Audio Content In our last post we talked about the three types of men. Now let’s talk about women. Women are...

alphamale20.com

I think a man has to be willing to walk away and end it. She should know this. And. She should know he can get another woman. She should be slightly jealous & suspicious all the time.

 

[CornbreadFed]

As a guy that is 6ft 1, I am about to blackpill y'all heightcel folks. 5ft 9 1/2 - to 6ft 3 is basically tall to most women of average height or below. Your average 5ft 4-5ft 7 woman cannot tell the difference between these heights. Any height under 6ft 4 isn't tall because you can easily go to a place and feel average height. If you are 5ft 10 and losing to guys that are under 6ft 3 than it is your game, not your height.

 

[tightgrp]

Maybe if one is short with an average or below face.

Confidence and perceived wealth make a man plenty tall.

 

[RangerMIke]

Nah... no need to flee the country. If a man happens to be shorter than average, all it means is the percentage of women that finds him attractive will be lower. Plenty of women don't care how tall you are.... women who will only date men taller than them have already screened themselves out... therefor to a shorter man... they don't exist.

The only way this actually hurts a man is if he let's this get inside his head and he starts worrying about it. Improve what you can: forget about that which you can not change. Keep trying to make dates and things will work themselves out.

 

[Bingo-Player]

I feel a lot of these complaints and in fact the entire black pill community is built upon men trying to punch WAY out of their ball park , the dude in the video is no oil painting yet I bet the majority of rejections he's had are from girls WAY out of his leauge

There's this 33 year old dude in my gym he's a gym bro and on gear

BUT and this is a big fvcking BUT

The guy is 5ft 5 , bald and has ginger type freckly skin , not only that but the way he talks to people is so wierd

I watch him charging around the gym like a bull in china shop expecting every woman to be falling at there knees for him

He has been labelled a creep by a lot of females in there , this has started to show in his personality he is very bitter, always angry and hating on chicks

Look I keep saying women are not stupid they can sense when a guy gets no pu$$y , THEY JUST KNOW

it really really turns them off you have to be cool about it

Worst part is most of these guys CAN get pu$$y its just probably not the pu$$y they think they deserve and that is what's causing all this whining and moaning

Another one of my mates is about 5ft 5 and built like a twig , he's just settled with a HB4 she's overweight and a bit wierd but he has accepted that he cannot compete in deeper waters

He's taken what he can get and to be fair they look fairly happy together

 

[Pierce Manhammer]

Worst part is most of these guys CAN get pu$$y its just probably not the pu$$y they think they deserve and that is what's causing all this whining and moaning.

This. This is true of most women as well, which is why the dating market is in its current state. The difference is the men aren't getting laid at all and the women get repeatedly hardware treatment from higher value playahs: Screw, Nut, Bolt.

 

[MatureDJ]

Average looking. average height guys get women. I’m literally out at this moment and see plenty of average folks paired.

But the "average" woman these days is a fat single mommy.

 

[SW15]

5ft 9 1/2 - to 6ft 3 is basically tall to most women of average height or below. Your average 5ft 4-5ft 7 woman cannot tell the difference between these heights.

I disagree. A woman can tell the difference between 5'9.5" and 6'3".

White women in general demand 6'0" men. That's the common refrain. Plenty of 5'0"-5'7" White women make that demand.

If you are 5ft 10 and losing to guys that are under 6ft 3 than it is your game, not your height.

I disagree. Height is a part of looks. Looks is most important. Plenty of 5'10" men are losing out to 6'1"-6'2" guys, especially with 5'6"+ women.

 

[MatureDJ]

This. This is true of most women as well, which is why the dating market is in its current state. The difference is the men aren't getting laid at all and the women get repeatedly hardware treatment from higher value playahs: Screw, Nut, Bolt.

It's OVER for BetaBoltCels.

 

[BadBoy89]

In order to get large gaps, money can make the difference. Think of a 38-42 year old man pursuing a 23-25 year old woman. The 25 year old woman can date plenty of 25-28 year old men. The 38-42 year old man can offer more money to the 23-25 year old woman than the 25-28 year old men. The difference in money can be strongly appealing in these circumstances. Great photos/videos for Instagram on lifestyle if she's on a boat, going on amazing vacations, etc.

Here you are talking multi millions. Generally men do ok between 38-42 but most don’t have multi millions with boats and 1st class hotel and plane rides and Mercedes and stuff. Once you get into that ballgame, then yes, a certain type of girl 23-25 will take it.

But that’s not the type of girl you want to bring home to mom, An average 23-25 year old is going to want an educated, taller, full set of hair 23-27 year old guy. If she’s looking for the millionaire 38 year old, shes the Instagram actress type. The type you have fun with, then move on.