A full day of sarging! But no success closes!

[affliction]

A day of sarging. Several approaches but no success. I probably made a lot of mistakes in here. Keep in mind, I just found this site 2 months ago & I was a total AFC scared to talk to girls before this. I think I'm making good progress but I definitely need some more pointers. All advice appreciated!

I met up with my wing at about 3:00pm & we decided to check out the university library first. When we got there we spotted a 2-set isolated in the back of the library doing their homework. I said hi & sat down next to HB8, my wing took a seat next to HB6.5 and we just started chatting them up. They were both friendly & receptive at the start, laughing & asking us questions also. I talked quietly w/ HB8 for a while at the start & was getting a pretty good vibe from her. Unfortunately I started running out of things to say so I leaned forward & started addressing the entire group (it was 4 chairs, i was on the outside, both girls on the inside, and my wing on the other side) & sort of playing off my wing. I don't think HB8 liked it very much tho, cause she stopped talking & went back to doing her homework. I couldn't get much out of her so I decided to throw out a c&f line


me: so, how does it feel talking to a bunch of handsome guys like us?
HB8: who said you're handsome?
me: my grandma tells me im handsome. would she lie?
HB8: grandmas always say that.
me: does your grandma tell you you're pretty?
hb8: yea
me: she must be lying.
her: (ignore & continues doing homework)

Definitely didn't work how I had hoped. C&f is a concept I think i understand but it's difficult to predict how it will be received. A little later, I accused them both of checking me out when I was walking around the library. They laughed but it wasn't enough to get HB8 open again. Anyway, after about 15 mins or so we decided to eject. I went for the #close on hb8 but she said she doesn't give her # to strangers. I challenged that & said that we both know each other. I said give me your email then, but she wouldn't do that either. Oh well. They were sorority girls anyway, so I'm sure they're approached pretty often.

We stopped at a few other stores but I didn't see any good opportunities. My wing made a few approaches at a shoestore but didn't try to close either of them. Next approach I did was at an arts & crafts store. I noticed the cashier when I first walked into the store. A really nice looking HB8.5. Wasn't sure how I should approach so I just grabbed a little $.99 pencil & got in line. When I got to the register this is what happened. One important thing I noticed during this convo is that she didn't break eye contact even once.

Me: Hi
Her: hi (nice smile)
me: what's your name?
her: rachel
me: how old are you, rachel?
her: 16
me: that's legal (****y smile)
her: (blank stare)
me: are you single rachel?
her: no
me: boyfriend or girlfriend?
her: boyfriend
me: don't you want a better one?
her: i'm all set

I looked over at the register & realized my debit card hadn't processed when i slid it thru before even saying hi to her. She didn't notice either so I guess I had her undivided attention during the convo. I asked & she said to try again. It worked this time & she asked to see my ID. I said "you just want to know my address, don't you?" and she smiled but that was all. This approach was probably too direct, but there was a line of people behind me & I didn't see any way to build any meaningful rapport in such a short amount of time.

Next approach was at a CD store. I see a nice looking girl from the back looking through some CDs. I didn't plan on approaching since I hadn't gotten a look at her face, but some encouragement from my wing got me going. Good thing, too, cause she looked great & turned into an HB8 on close up. Here's what happened.

She is at the end of the aisle & making a u-turn to walk down the opposite side. We make eye contact & I say

Me: hi (smile)
her: hi (she smiles but keeps walking & doing the u-turn down the aisle)
me: hey hey, slow down

she stops & I get really close to her.

me: hi i'm matt
her: hi matt, i'm _____ (forgot her name)

get a nice intimate handshake since we're so close to each other. She is holding strong EC w/ a broad smile so I decide to go for the direct PU. (probably a mistake)

me: are you single?
her: no i have a boyfriend.
me: lookin to upgrade?
her: what?
me: are you looking to upgrade?
her: oh (laugh) umm i am pretty happy with it.

I would have normally ejected but it seemd like she was into me so I figured I would just chat her up anyway. Turns out she was buying a bday present for her boyfriend's brother. She asked me for some suggestions & I gave her some. she asked what kind of music I was into & we had a nice little convo. She held strong EC the whole time & was all smiles. Good IOIs from this one. I wonder if the bf thing was just a lie due to my direct approach? I wish I would've chatted her up before asking if she was single. I won't go for the fast close anymore unless I absolutely have to (like w/ that cashier).


Last approach was a quick rejection. Looking around abercrombie at the mall & I see this crazy hot girl...HB9 looking. She is walking w/ some overweight herb-looking kid. He goes into the changing room & she is standing alone so I decided to approach.

me: hey (point towards change room) is that your brother in there?
her: my boyfriend
me: (suprised look) don't you want a better one?
her: no

I ejected quickly cause I got no IOI from her. Infact she backed up everytime I talked. I just walked closer everytime though. I forgot what I said after but it turns out she was only 16. I dont know wtf is up with all these 16 year olds. They looked older!

Anyway, no success closes but I was happy to realize that rejections don't hurt at all. Honestly it means nothing to me when a girl says no. However, I still want a good #close. Kinda pissed I didn't get one. I think maybe my standards are too high. I only like approaching girls that are really hot.

 

[check_mate_kid_uk]

the inititive was there, you had the confidence to do it, it is a good start as the hardest part is finding the confidence to do it and you found that.

I think your problem was that you where asking to many questions, and also you do not need to ask her her age at first, and especialy not if she has a boyfreind. Also the C&F you used seems a bit weird, you probably scared them. There was also no rapport

dont worry thou, finding what to say is just a case of practice, like i said finding the ocnfidence for it is the hard part and you did that, so well done.

 

[squirrels]

Affliction's Guide to Seduction:

1) Say hi to girl
2) Ask for name
3) Ask if she has a boyfriend
4) If yes, offer boyfriend upgrade
5) Repeat steps 1-4 until laid.

 

[Lifeforce]

>I met up with my wing at about 3:00pm & we decided to check out the university library first. When we got there we spotted a 2-set isolated in the back of the library doing their homework. I said hi & sat down next to HB8, my wing took a seat next to HB6.5 and we just started chatting them up. They were both friendly & receptive at the start, laughing & asking us questions also. I talked quietly w/ HB8 for a while at the start & was getting a pretty good vibe from her. Unfortunately I started running out of things to say so I leaned forward & started addressing the entire group (it was 4 chairs, i was on the outside, both girls on the inside, and my wing on the other side) & sort of playing off my wing. I don't think HB8 liked it very much tho, cause she stopped talking & went back to doing her homework. I couldn't get much out of her so I decided to throw out a c&f line

me: so, how does it feel talking to a bunch of handsome guys like us?
HB8: who said you're handsome?
me: my grandma tells me im handsome. would she lie?
HB8: grandmas always say that.
me: does your grandma tell you you're pretty?
hb8: yea
me: she must be lying.
her: (ignore & continues doing homework)
>>

Not ****y & funny, more like ****y & insulting I'm afraid. How did she say "who said you're handsome?" was it cold or with humour. Do you work on looking better? That's a big factor.


>Definitely didn't work how I had hoped. C&f is a concept I think i understand but it's difficult to predict how it will be received.
>>

It will be recieved good if you have some form of rapport and it's ****y&funny, not ****y&insulting. Saying **** to the girl will not suddenly build rapport and get you laid. Think about if the girl said the same thing to you. How would you react to it?

>A little later, I accused them both of checking me out when I was walking around the library. They laughed but it wasn't enough to get HB8 open again. Anyway, after about 15 mins or so we decided to eject. I went for the #close on hb8 but she said she doesn't give her # to strangers. I challenged that & said that we both know each other.
>>

It was a sign of uninterest and it will not change with pressure.

>I said give me your email then, but she wouldn't do that either. Oh well. They were sorority girls anyway, so I'm sure they're approached pretty often.

We stopped at a few other stores but I didn't see any good opportunities. My wing made a few approaches at a shoestore but didn't try to close either of them. Next approach I did was at an arts & crafts store. I noticed the cashier when I first walked into the store. A really nice looking HB8.5. Wasn't sure how I should approach so I just grabbed a little $.99 pencil & got in line. When I got to the register this is what happened. One important thing I noticed during this convo is that she didn't break eye contact even once.

Me: Hi
Her: hi (nice smile)
me: what's your name?
her: rachel
me: how old are you, rachel?
her: 16
me: that's legal (****y smile)
her: (blank stare)
me: are you single rachel?
her: no
me: boyfriend or girlfriend?
her: boyfriend
me: don't you want a better one?
her: i'm all set

I looked over at the register & realized my debit card hadn't processed when i slid it thru before even saying hi to her. She didn't notice either so I guess I had her undivided attention during the convo. I asked & she said to try again. It worked this time & she asked to see my ID. I said "you just want to know my address, don't you?" and she smiled but that was all. This approach was probably too direct, but there was a line of people behind me & I didn't see any way to build any meaningful rapport in such a short amount of time.
>>

Whoa, this was way to direct. You got to work that rapport, I understand it's hard in a quick convo like this. However turn down your game a little. Sexual stuff like that is a huge turnoff if said without rapport and attraction. Drop that "Do you want a better one" she will not reply yes after meeting you 30 seconds. Comment on something to open up. Your game will be much better if you do not rush into it as quick. Your game remind me of those people in speeching in the classrom that went "Christophercolumbusdiscoveredamerica1492andsincetheneverythinghasgonetohell". Slow down.

You have to learn that all scenes are not suitable places to pick up, sometimes just a kind comment can be just as good.

>Next approach was at a CD store. I see a nice looking girl from the back looking through some CDs. I didn't plan on approaching since I hadn't gotten a look at her face, but some encouragement from my wing got me going. Good thing, too, cause she looked great & turned into an HB8 on close up. Here's what happened.

She is at the end of the aisle & making a u-turn to walk down the opposite side. We make eye contact & I say

Me: hi (smile)
her: hi (she smiles but keeps walking & doing the u-turn down the aisle)
me: hey hey, slow down

she stops & I get really close to her.

me: hi i'm matt
her: hi matt, i'm _____ (forgot her name)

get a nice intimate handshake since we're so close to each other. She is holding strong EC w/ a broad smile so I decide to go for the direct PU. (probably a mistake)

me: are you single?
her: no i have a boyfriend.
me: lookin to upgrade?
her: what?
me: are you looking to upgrade?
her: oh (laugh) umm i am pretty happy with it.

I would have normally ejected but it seemd like she was into me so I figured I would just chat her up anyway. Turns out she was buying a bday present for her boyfriend's brother. She asked me for some suggestions & I gave her some. she asked what kind of music I was into & we had a nice little convo. She held strong EC the whole time & was all smiles. Good IOIs from this one. I wonder if the bf thing was just a lie due to my direct approach? I wish I would've chatted her up before asking if she was single. I won't go for the fast close anymore unless I absolutely have to (like w/ that cashier).
>>
Normally you shouldn't intrude too much before you have rapport and attraction going. Women have a tendancy to close up if you do. My recommendation is to loose the wan't to upgrade routine. If she shows disinterest or says she have a boyfriend, bail. It's my tip.

>
Last approach was a quick rejection. Looking around abercrombie at the mall & I see this crazy hot girl...HB9 looking. She is walking w/ some overweight herb-looking kid. He goes into the changing room & she is standing alone so I decided to approach.

me: hey (point towards change room) is that your brother in there?
her: my boyfriend
me: (suprised look) don't you want a better one?
her: no

I ejected quickly cause I got no IOI from her. Infact she backed up everytime I talked. I just walked closer everytime though. I forgot what I said after but it turns out she was only 16. I dont know wtf is up with all these 16 year olds. They looked older!
>>

Ehm, if they mention they have a boyfriend, don't bother. Especially if they mention they have a boyfriend in the vicinity! If she backs away, it's a good sign of IODis-I. :]


>Anyway, no success closes but I was happy to realize that rejections don't hurt at all. Honestly it means nothing to me when a girl says no. However, I still want a good #close. Kinda pissed I didn't get one. I think maybe my standards are too high. I only like approaching girls that are really hot.
>>

Do you have the same standards on yourself? Otherwise it's not congruent. The problem you have is that you rush it too much, you force on over indicated disinterest, you need to build rapport more, tone it down so it's more casual. And as CMUK says ask less questions. Otherwise she may feel interogated. It's better to comment on something for an opener.

 

[Dee-Zy]

ok, thank squirrels for this cuz I would of never been in here if it wasn't for him.


Here are a few pointers.


STOP ASKING IF THEY HAVE BOYFRIENDS!!! Chances are, they will tell you they have one even if they don't just to get you to stop harassing her. ESPECIALLY if the first words out of your mouth after you said your name is that.

ALWAYS assume that they don't have a boyfriend. Besides, its very insensitve from me, but girls are like monkeys - they don't let go of a branch until they get a grasp on another. So whether they have a boyfriend is irrelevant. Asking for it is asking for trouble because as soon as you know a girl has a boyfriend you get all shooked and it brings your game down.

I could go on and on but just focus on this problem for now.


On a positive note, at least you have the guts to approach strangers. thumbs up.

 

[Dee-Zy]

Originally posted by squirrels
Affliction's Guide to Seduction:

1) Say hi to girl
2) Ask for name
3) Ask if she has a boyfriend
4) If yes, offer boyfriend upgrade
5) Repeat steps 1-4 until laid.

Oh god, I actually laughed out loud.

Come on man, that's just too mean.



oh and no, you don't have the concept of being C+F, you have the concept of being ****y but your neg hits are not negs they are blatant insults.

That grandma lying this is an insult not a heg hit buddy.

 

[affliction]

check_mate: Noted. Although I think I did create some pretty good rapport with hb8 at the library & hb8 at the cd store. I just ****ed up on the cdstore one cause i didn't get rapport until after the rejection. And the uni library girl, who i though i was vibing with, became disinterested over something I can't quite recall. In hindsight, I think I should've just been playful & friendly w/ the 8.5 cashier & then gone back a week later to see her again.

squirrels: I'm not writing a guide, i'm asking for advice! Besides, in my post from a few days ago about my first approach, your advice for asking the uni girl what other classes she's taking is what helped me to connect w/ the library hb8 this time. More stuff like that would be good. Also, my formula is not what you described. I've done 5 approaches and only 2 of them ended up like that. I don't write out every piece of dialogue I have with these girls...only the stuff I'm unsure about.

Lifeforce: Good insights there. And yes, I do work on looking better. I'm in the gym 4 times/week. I do have a lot of scars on my face from teenage acne, though. But if I was a girl I would definitely fukc me. I think I'm gonna drop the c&f for now though.

Dee-Zy: Ok...no more asking if they're single.

 

[uniassign]

me: so, how does it feel talking to a bunch of handsome guys like us?

You started with a C&F line after you have been talking to her. Were you C&F during your conversation? If not, then it is OUT OF CHARACTER for you and she tested your TRUE character by asking:

HB8: who said you're handsome?

Instead of continuing with the C&F frame, you answered:

me: my grandma tells me im handsome. would she lie?

If you start a C&F frame, you must continue it - no matter how much she disses you. Chicks do that ALL the time. I tell them that Cameron Diaz and Nikki Hilton and that chick who walked past all have secret crushes on me. They tell me that I am delusional, and I argue my way out of it. They end up laughing and just believe me.

The thing is when you are in a C&F frame, you have to TURN everything around so that your environment fits into your frame. So when you asked her how it feels to talk to handsome guy like you and she asked you who says you are handsome, you should have said:

EVERYONE!!! Look, she wants me, Cameron Diaz wants me blah blah blah.

She would probably roll her eyes or indicate that she doesn't believe you. Then you turn it around and say "Oh, what's wrong with you? Too much studying?"

Remember whoever with the strongest frame wins.

HB8: grandmas always say that.

She found out who you really are.

me: does your grandma tell you you're pretty?
hb8: yea
me: she must be lying.
her: (ignore & continues doing homework)

You insulted her.

Me: Hi
Her: hi (nice smile)
me: what's your name?
her: rachel
me: how old are you, rachel?
her: 16
me: that's legal (****y smile)
her: (blank stare)
me: are you single rachel?
her: no
me: boyfriend or girlfriend?
her: boyfriend
me: don't you want a better one?
her: i'm all set

Mate, you hit on her before you have demonstrated anything of value to her. It is like trying to sell an unknown, unproven car to a person already driving a nice car who have stopped at the traffic lights. Not going to happen dude.

Try talking to her for about twenty minutes, not just lame a$$ conversation, before asking her to upgrade.

 

[DJBen]

Lose the C+F. As lifeforce said, that isnt C+F.

Forget C+F and just be friendly. Be social. It's the best thing that I learnt when I started out.

Blokes or girls, if you're social thats a solid basis. Then you can spark up a convo, get the ball rolling, see how it's going. Then maybe do a bit of C+F [not INSULTS]. I'm not big on canned C+F. You can see it's pre-planned, I dont think it's really worth it.

 

[ScrewIt]

I think your line openers were too straightforward and almost desperate implying that you could be the next bf. you didnt make her laugh or anything like so. it's almost like walking up to a stranger and asking them if they got change.
but all those took guts to do, which was good.

What you need to do is practice with your social skills more in general with girls and guys. even if you're not trying to hit on the chick, just converse with them.

What you shouldve done with those PU approaches was start off with a witty comment, then introduce yourself. Do a little fluff talk, then after making a good impression, understay your welcome and tell her you gtg and you'd like to keep in touch (this is where u get her #)

as simple as that.

 

[Dee-Zy]

Originally posted by uniassign
me: so, how does it feel talking to a bunch of handsome guys like us?

You started with a C&F line after you have been talking to her. Were you C&F during your conversation? If not, then it is OUT OF CHARACTER for you and she tested your TRUE character by asking:

HB8: who said you're handsome?

Instead of continuing with the C&F frame, you answered:

me: my grandma tells me im handsome. would she lie?

If you start a C&F frame, you must continue it - no matter how much she disses you. Chicks do that ALL the time. I tell them that Cameron Diaz and Nikki Hilton and that chick who walked past all have secret crushes on me. They tell me that I am delusional, and I argue my way out of it. They end up laughing and just believe me.

The thing is when you are in a C&F frame, you have to TURN everything around so that your environment fits into your frame. So when you asked her how it feels to talk to handsome guy like you and she asked you who says you are handsome, you should have said:

maybe it's just me but I thought that was his funny comment. Sarcasm

I thought that followed the frame ... I agree with the rest though, that C+F was trully out of character.

 

[AlwaysExcel]

I agree with Dee-zy. I thought the first part of the Grandma line was C&F, as long as you grinned or winked or said it in a sarcastic or playful tone. In fact, I'm going to try to remember to use it sometime because I liked it. You followed it too logically though. You should've responded to her grandma comment with, "Awww. You callin' my grandma a liar!? What's up punk, put your dukes up! NO ONE talks mess on grandma!!" Say it all play offended like, put your fists up, punch her softly, and dance back and forth like a boxer. Draw her into physical play and wrestle around.

So you screwed up a C&F line and didn't affect her state. Don't worry too much. It's just C&F, a small part of seduction. Just keep working on what people respond to and your C&F instinct will get better. That's awesome the rejections don't hurt. Practice is the shyt.

 

[AlwaysExcel]

Or even funnier. Say "Talking **** on Grandma?" Put your fists up and slowly look at each one as you say, "these dukes are your hazards!" ROFLOL! I saw that shyt on Will and Grace tonight. Had me crackin' up for a minute!

 

[wolfie]

I agree with the ppl who say you are being too direct. While directness is good, you're trying to get the number too early. Try having a conversation, being social and creating rapport first.