Dissolving My Marriage

[BackInTheGame78]

It's easy to tell someone else to risk half their stuff and money forever. It's much harder to do so yourself.

Everyone agrees that marriage is a bad bet for men, but then they give me grief for wanting out of it. Ridiculous.

Other people don't create a crisis in their own mind then try to figure a way out of it.

 

[EyeBRollin]

It's easy to tell someone else to risk half their stuff and money forever. It's much harder to do so yourself.

Everyone agrees that marriage is a bad bet for men, but then they give me grief for wanting out of it.

Everyone who gets married knows this. At least, they should know it beforehand. The whole point of the union is sharing with another person. By all means, those who want to die alone with 100% of their shvt are free to do so and should stay single.

 

[Money & Muscle]

Everyone who gets married knows this. At least, they should know it beforehand.

And if you didn't know this beforehand?
That's me. I got married at 22. I knew nothing.

those who want to die alone with 100% of their shvt are free to do so and should stay single.

I could also die alone with <50% of my sh*t, while single - and I have no say over that.

 

[Money & Muscle]

What I'm missing is when did you start to "get your head straight", as I think you put it?
1, 2, 3 years ago?

It was an incremental process. About 3-4 years ago I realized something was wrong, but I couldn't put my finger on it. I chose willful ignorance at the time.

About 2 years ago I realized I wasn't being the kind of person I want to be and that life wasn't adding up to how I wanted it to go.
The short version of that is when I saw a 60-something year old couple having a full-blown sh*t throwing argument in the gym parking lot; literal screaming, Jerry Springer style. Then they just got in the same car and acted like nothing just happened.
I realized in that moment that I'd rather be dead or alone, than deal with that. I didn't know what to do with this revelation, but I knew something had to change - I just didn't know how or what.

About a year ago I found the answer on how to do this. First by just being calm during an argument, and watching my wife go ballistic because she wanted emotional validation that I wasn't giving her. Then I realized during a different argument over literally nothing - that I was living the life of those 60 year olds in the parking lot. Shortly after, I found the red pill and started unplugging - though it was in a very roundabout way.

One digression, some of the stuff you've posted about marriage in this thread reads as a rationalization.
Comes across as something deeper is happening than you've admitted, perhaps even to yourself.

Would I like to resolve things in my relationship and stay with my wife/daughter for the rest of my life? Yes.
Do I believe that this change can happen? I'm not sure. I'm hopeful, but not naiive.
Do I believe that my wife will be a kind person if either of us want to divorce? No.
Does that ^ effectively make me trapped? Yes.

She is free to leave whenever she wants - no strings attached. All I want is the same.
"The only power a man has in a relationship, is the power to walk away." - means a lot less when exercising that power costs $5,000 a month for the rest of my life.

 

[Ricky]

I skimmed this pretty quickly so apologies if this question has been asked before.

Are you aware of anyone who has successfully divorced their wife in this manner but kept the relationship with her going on his terms?

I am not but i would be interested to know a bit more about where you might have gotten this idea other than from talking to lawyers.

 

[EyeBRollin]

I could also die alone with <50% of my sh*t, while single - and I have no say over that.

It will be more than 50% but we will split it and call it even 50%. Life is about the people you have in it. None of the material stuff is worth a damn at the end of the day.

 

[Money & Muscle]

Are you aware of anyone who has successfully divorced their wife in this manner but kept the relationship with her going on his terms?

Nope. It's unlikely to wind up that way.

i would be interested to know a bit more about where you might have gotten this idea other than from talking to lawyers.

I pulled it out my own *ss. If alimony didn't exist, I wouldn't even want a divorce... so with that in mind, getting divorced before the government, but not before God and family - sounds like I'm just kicking the government out of my marriage. My vows won't change. I don't even want my relationship to end, but the risk of paying >50% of my take-home for life to someone who probably hates me - is absurd.

I don't blame my wife for my current situation. I blame the government's sh*tty divorce laws, and myself.

 

[Money & Muscle]

It will be more than 50% but we will split it and call it even 50%. Life is about the people you have in it. None of the material stuff is worth a damn at the end of the day.

And if I could trust that a post-nuptial agreement would actually hold up in court - I'd be doing that. But it wont hold up.

 

[Canadian_Man]

It was an incremental process. About 3-4 years ago I realized something was wrong, but I couldn't put my finger on it. I chose willful ignorance at the time.

About 2 years ago I realized I wasn't being the kind of person I want to be and that life wasn't adding up to how I wanted it to go.
The short version of that is when I saw a 60-something year old couple having a full-blown sh*t throwing argument in the gym parking lot; literal screaming, Jerry Springer style. Then they just got in the same car and acted like nothing just happened.
I realized in that moment that I'd rather be dead or alone, than deal with that. I didn't know what to do with this revelation, but I knew something had to change - I just didn't know how or what.

About a year ago I found the answer on how to do this. First by just being calm during an argument, and watching my wife go ballistic because she wanted emotional validation that I wasn't giving her. Then I realized during a different argument over literally nothing - that I was living the life of those 60 year olds in the parking lot. Shortly after, I found the red pill and started unplugging - though it was in a very roundabout way.

Right, so it is relatively recent and has been brewing for a while.

As for arguments, there's something to be said about the importance of peace of mind

Perhaps your situation would be very difficult to salvage at this point, and while you've tried for the past year, it might also be you haven't tried the right things

On a related but different point, I don't know how much of your recent journey has taken you down the path of better self awareness + healthier thought processes, that's mostly where my version of the journey led.

The idea in this video utilizes some of that in the context of arguments with women:

(The disclaimer in that is a large part of the process requires good vetting of the women initially, and, a takeaway message is you need a lot of inner peace yourself first to navigate the issue)

It was an incremental process. About 3-4 years ago I realized something was wrong, but I couldn't put my finger on it. I chose willful ignorance at the time.
Would I like to resolve things in my relationship and stay with my wife/daughter for the rest of my life? Yes.
Do I believe that this change can happen? I'm not sure. I'm hopeful, but not naiive.
Do I believe that my wife will be a kind person if either of us want to divorce? No.
Does that ^ effectively make me trapped? Yes.

She is free to leave whenever she wants - no strings attached. All I want is the same.
"The only power a man has in a relationship, is the power to walk away." - means a lot less when exercising that power costs $5,000 a month for the rest of my life.

I think that part, wanting to "financially divorce", is more likely to lead to what @The Duke suggested earlier:

You pull the financial rug out from under a woman you have been married to for several years that is a stay at home mom and you will decimate every bit of security she has about the relationship. Its like saying, hey I don't really trust you and want to protect myself incase you decide to screw me later down the road.

You think you have problems now, you will fuel the fire. Don't ever fuel the flames of discontent with a woman. When they feel hurt, they don't fight fair. They shut off what little rational logic they have and will become ruthless.

 

[Money & Muscle]

The idea in this video utilizes some of that in the context of arguments with women:

I literally watched that video last night. I've actually been spam-watching his videos both yesterday and today.
These are all tools that I will be using, and I absolutely need to grow from this experience - my hope is to use these tools with my current wife, and get our relationship to the point I believe it can get to. I wish I'd started with this single tool long ago... I may have found myself in a very different position than where I am today.

I think that part, wanting to "financially divorce", is more likely to lead to what @The Duke suggested earlier:

I think it is quite likely the outcome, but I am hopeful that it isn't. Maybe I'm delusional, idk and idc. If she loses her mind about this, it would only be the 1,000th thing she has lost her mind over - but the first thing where that was actually a warranted response.

For perspective, 2 weeks ago she told me she was going to go line dance at a bar (I work nights so I cannot go with her).
I told her I wasn't comfortable with this, but would allow it if she texted me when she got there, when she left, when she got home, and sent me a picture of what she was wearing before she got inside. This was so I had reasonable check-ins to know that she was okay, and that if she missed one - I could show the picture to the people at the bar and we could check security cameras for her.
She lost her mind, threatened divorce (half-heartedly), and didn't talk to me for 3 days.

(I'm aware this could by symptomatic of infidelity, but I think it is unlikely considering how active we are in the bedroom).

So whether what I'm looking for is reasonable or not, I am not dealing with a reasonable woman (as if such a thing existed). I cannot entrust my future with such a person, and no person in this thread giving me grief over my decision would do so either. The white knighting present here is ludicrous.

 

[EyeBRollin]

So whether what I'm looking for is reasonable or not, I am not dealing with a reasonable woman (as if such a thing existed). I cannot entrust my future with such a person, and no person in this thread giving me grief over my decision would do so either. The white knighting present here is ludicrous.

We’re not trying to save her. We are trying to save you. Divorce court not going to be pleasant.

 

[Money & Muscle]

We’re not trying to save her. We are trying to save you. Divorce court not going to be pleasant.

I misunderstood where you guys were coming from.

I know divorce court won't be pleasant, I just do not see the point in allowing myself into a situation where that unpleasantness follows me for life, instead of just the next 4 years.

If the last 8 years are an indication of what the next 8 years will be like, I don't want to make it to next year.

 

[Canadian_Man]

I literally watched that video last night. I've actually been spam-watching his videos both yesterday and today.

He's one of the best people I came across a year or two ago when going through a phase of watching dating/relationship content.

Lots of great insights from him.


Another which I never dove into, but suspect might have good insights, is the guest in this interview (the content of which might not particularly apply to your specific situation, been a while since watching it ... disclaimer, his approach is attachment theory, not RP):

I'll be taking a closer look at Adam's content sometime in the future.

I believe that some sort of blending of RP-like dating advice (without some elements of it) and attachment theory would be a fruitful approach to dating, relationships, and general well-being.

These are all tools that I will be using, and I absolutely need to grow from this experience - my hope is to use these tools with my current wife, and get our relationship to the point I believe it can get to.

Sounds like a good plan.

A 'detox' of sorts from all of this is also probably a good idea if your "financial divorce" scenario goes poorly for you.
Take a step back, reset for a while.

Partial reasoning:
I've found it's relatively easy to "overdose" on personal growth materials
Too much focus on it in a short period of time paradoxically can cause its own problems.

I think it is quite likely the outcome, but I am hopeful that it isn't. Maybe I'm delusional, idk and idc. If she loses her mind about this, it would only be the 1,000th thing she has lost her mind over - but the first thing where that was actually a warranted response.

So whether what I'm looking for is reasonable or not, I am not dealing with a reasonable woman (as if such a thing existed). I cannot entrust my future with such a person, and no person in this thread giving me grief over my decision would do so either.

Perhaps your focus should be more on your daughter through this process rather than your wife, if you do indeed go through with it.

 

[EyeBRollin]

I misunderstood where you guys were coming from.

I know divorce court won't be pleasant, I just do not see the point in allowing myself into a situation where that unpleasantness follows me for life, instead of just the next 4 years.

If the last 8 years are an indication of what the next 8 years will be like, I don't want to make it to next year.

And that’s the honest answer. In that case, release yourself and your wife. Get the lawyer and start planning best case scenarios for your daughter.

 

[Money & Muscle]

I hope they stream it. Can someone local to this please get within the proceedings with some sort of video cam. Going to be phenomenal

You sound like a fun guy to be around.

Literally cheering for someone's suffering, classy stuff.

 

[Pierce Manhammer]

Also, given everything you have is community property now, if this turns into a bloody divorce the fees for her attorneys will come out of the community’s assets. Something to consider.

I guess the biggest disconnect here is that everything that has accrued since the marriage began is a community asset, EVERYTHING, because contrary to your belief and that of many others here is that it’s not “your house”, “your money”, “your assets”, its community property. You seem to think it all belongs to you, solely, which it does not. This is magical thinking.

This will not end well. For you or your daughter.

If you think she’s not going to go for the jugular you’re wrong. Who the petitioner is in PRC does not matter and holds no value in the process, and the reason for it is also of no importance as it’s a no fault divorce state.

 

[JackTripper]

Probably hire a detective to confirm whether or not she is cheating.

Travel out of town for a few days and let a detective monitor her activity back home. If the detective does not find any cheating then point blank ask her what’s up.

I think a cheating wife is more severe of a relationship problem compared to a non-cheater who just behaves badly.

 

[Money & Muscle]

If you think she’s not going to go for the jugular you’re wrong.

And my argument is that i think in any case of divorce - she would still go for the jugular. Whether it happens today or in 20 years.

She can have half my assets. My concern is if she comes for half my pay. Again, 4 years of paying this is far more preferable to 40. This is the only way I have a say in that matter.
If the last 8 years are at all predictive of what the next 8 years will be like - I do not want to make it to next year.

 

[Money & Muscle]

Probably hire a detective to confirm whether or not she is cheating.

It wouldn't matter if she was, to be totally honest. The state doesn't care. She could sleep with 3 dudes a night and I'd still owe her alimony and child support.

Why I would put myself in a position to endure this for a lifetime, is beyond me. As many have said, I should not have gotten married in the first place. I've spent the last year+ trying to fix that, and now I'm at a point where I don't have the faith I can fix it before having to risk lifelong financial commitment to someone who hates me.

 

[Gamisch]

Chiming in late.

Been reading the thread and thinking about it. Interestingly and ironically enough this situation is "the endgame" while it all just begins. Dating-steady- living together- engagement- marriage with children.

Especially USA type marriages where you might end up paying for an ex.

Tbh, an argumentative woman = hell. If I could give any advice about this to my younger self, it would be to ALWAYS be the bigger man. And yes,that gets old really quick. Sometimes you REALLY want and need her to be the "second captain on the ship" and that's the problem: a ship only has place for one captain....

Most experienced men here who been through it all, know that an argumentative woman can become WAY more vindictive once you make her feel like she'll lose somehow. You thought you've seen her worst? Nah, she can turn it up MANY notches, and once she knows you feel trapped don't expect her to have sympathy for you.

I know what you go through man. You should try a heart to heart, but don't mention you wanna divorce (yet, aka showing literally your hand). Just see if there are things that bother her ,find out if there's anything new to learn.

Meanwhile PLAN an exit strategy in SILENCE. Lawyer up and act rapidly, because as you say, the clock is running, big change shyte won't improve, and if it would ( temporarily) improve and gets worse you'll just lose more time untill you are indeed STUCK for many years to come.


The latter won't make you a happier person in any way shape or form.