How Important is it to Be 100% Financially Independent?

[Bingo-Player]

A non negotiable as a man by late 20's is having his own place.

By 30 even house sharing is pushing it you have too be able to stand on your own 2 feet in your own accommodation that is the bare minimum 90% of women are going to expect to take you seriously

The rest then really depends on the woman , My GF is pretty self sufficient and likes to pay her share of stuff even though I will sometimes treat her to things

Other women will expect the whole ten yards paid for by you , IMO this can become tiring even if you can afford it too transactional for me

but I do understand the Masculine / Feminine dynamic some couples want to engage in

 

[Prepostereax]

It's absolutely imperative to be 100% financially independent, if you want to attract a gold-digger

most would consider quality based on her personality and looks

A quality woman requires more than just looks and personality.

Looks, figure, and being nice feminine company are mandatory for gold-diggers, sugar babies, and escorts.

What determines quality is character and values, which will vary in priority.
What's quality to me won't necessarily be quality for you.

To specify, my goals are:

1. Laying above average to hot girls.

2. FB above average to hot girls.

3. LTR above average to hot girls.

You can achieve any/all of the above, without a reliable source of income.

There's plenty of bubbly hotties willing to jump anything with a pulse they're attracted to.
Party girls.
Just don’t expect them to hang around for more than 3 months, or one night.

Some will even be offended if you "lead with your wallet" (.. or house/car/job etc) as they don't like to be compared to the more transactional examples above.

 

[corrector]

True story, I went on a date with a girl who came from a rich family. Literally billionaires. My pride wouldn’t let me stay with her for her money.

Her personality sucked. She sucjed at sex and was greedy in bed.

Was incredibly rude. Was a “former” cocaine addict. (I somewhat suspect that she did not stop that)

She wanted to meet my parents on our first date.

From Tinder.

Also, I was 27 and she was 36.

Could not stand her.

Don't worry...there will be other sugar momma's out there. You just have not found the right match yet.

 

[Aurora Demon]

Don't worry...there will be other sugar momma's out there. You just have not found the right match yet.

Thanks!

 

[BeExcellent]

Advice from the old lady:

A high quality girl will not be an option for LTR for you under the present circumstances. Please allow me to explain why, and address the "what if I come from a wealthy family......" crap too.

You clearly do not have your life in order as a man. Huge, monumental turn off.

Understand something. Beautiful women who have much to offer (pretty, great body, kind, smart, fun, loyal and responsible) are what EVERY man desires. So that means they can pick from men who have it all (great looking, successful, responsible, fun, in shape, etc.)

Top men are NORMAL to top tier women. So when you compare yourself to a top tier man who has his life on point.....and you are lacking in comparison?

Pass. Thanks but no thanks.

I chose from the following: Doctors, Dentists, Lawyers, Businessmen, Professional Athletes, Models, Corporate Executives, Financiers, Engineers.

If a man had a loserly life (no job or underemployed), or expected to live off Daddy & Mommy's money (Peter Pan immaturity little boy syndrome), or smoked, did drugs or drank too much (if you marry him you marry those terrible habits)....

I would not accept dates with such men, even though very good looking and very successful.

Why? The best girls essentially have unlimited choices in the mating environment. They know their value, and they choose with an eye toward marriage & family. If a man is an overgrown man child or a loser? He is a lousy husband/father candidate, and thus she will ignore him & choose a man who is better suited and ticks ALL the important criteria.

You are not a high quality man in the eyes of such women, and until you are? You are invisible. Oh sure you might find some pretty girls to bang.....but pretty is everywhere. Quality is different.

Pretty + Quality is rare. So you gotta be on point on all cylinders to attract such women. You are not there yet.

This is why you need to level up and get your life pulled together. The top women will pass on you until you do, but even before that you need to level up for yourself.

Quit the PUA stuff and get your life in order. That will solve many problems. Right now you sound like an entitled man child. Not attractive to quality women.

 

[BeExcellent]

The other important thing to point out is this:

If she has her act together and you do not? She cannot respect you as a man. She will think she knows more about life than you and you will not be able to lead the relationship. This does not get talked about enough around here, but it is super important.

A sugar mama will be controlling and will disregard you as a man, you are just a peckerwood and/or eye candy. Everyone in her social circles will know that and over time that lack of respect will erode your self esteem and emasculate you. That's a very high price to pay....but some guys do it.

Also financial independence is sufficient money of your own without needing to work. Financially responsible is having a career/job/reliable profession or vocation, but is not the same as financial independence.

@zekko has financial independence. I myself am quite close to that (and would be already if I were to downscale my lifestyle).....

You have to be able to lead a LTR, marriage & family. She must respect you. A man who is ill equiped to do this will be overlooked by wife material women.

 

[Aurora Demon]

The other important thing to point out is this:

If she has her act together and you do not? She cannot respect you as a man. She will think she knows more about life than you and you will not be able to lead the relationship. This does not get talked about enough around here, but it is super important.

A sugar mama will be controlling and will disregard you as a man, you are just a peckerwood and/or eye candy. Everyone in her social circles will know that and over time that lack of respect will erode your self esteem and emasculate you. That's a very high price to pay....but some guys do it.

Also financial independence is sufficient money of your own without needing to work. Financially responsible is having a career/job/reliable profession or vocation, but is not the same as financial independence.

@zekko has financial independence. I myself am quite close to that (and would be already if I were to downscale my lifestyle).....

You have to be able to lead a LTR, marriage & family. She must respect you. A man who is ill equiped to do this will be overlooked by wife material women.

Thanks for putting the time in to write all that advice.

Time to regain my Motivation and Ambition.

 

[BeExcellent]

Thanks for putting the time in to write all that advice.

Time to regain my Motivation and Ambition.

Good. The effort you have already put in to learning women will always stay with you, benefit you, and although at some point the skillset changes a bit in LTR/marriage territory, the essentials of being a man will remain constant.

You'll improve your whole vibe in the process of manifesting yourself fully. That's a great career path and should reward you in many ways.

Focus on studies short term. Top grades means top choices.

All the best!

 

[Aguirre]

Advice from the old lady:

A high quality girl will not be an option for LTR for you under the present circumstances. Please allow me to explain why, and address the "what if I come from a wealthy family......" crap too.

You clearly do not have your life in order as a man. Huge, monumental turn off.

Understand something. Beautiful women who have much to offer (pretty, great body, kind, smart, fun, loyal and responsible) are what EVERY man desires. So that means they can pick from men who have it all (great looking, successful, responsible, fun, in shape, etc.)

Top men are NORMAL to top tier women. So when you compare yourself to a top tier man who has his life on point.....and you are lacking in comparison?

Pass. Thanks but no thanks.

I chose from the following: Doctors, Dentists, Lawyers, Businessmen, Professional Athletes, Models, Corporate Executives, Financiers, Engineers.

If a man had a loserly life (no job or underemployed), or expected to live off Daddy & Mommy's money (Peter Pan immaturity little boy syndrome), or smoked, did drugs or drank too much (if you marry him you marry those terrible habits)....

I would not accept dates with such men, even though very good looking and very successful.

Why? The best girls essentially have unlimited choices in the mating environment. They know their value, and they choose with an eye toward marriage & family. If a man is an overgrown man child or a loser? He is a lousy husband/father candidate, and thus she will ignore him & choose a man who is better suited and ticks ALL the important criteria.

You are not a high quality man in the eyes of such women, and until you are? You are invisible. Oh sure you might find some pretty girls to bang.....but pretty is everywhere. Quality is different.

Pretty + Quality is rare. So you gotta be on point on all cylinders to attract such women. You are not there yet.

This is why you need to level up and get your life pulled together. The top women will pass on you until you do, but even before that you need to level up for yourself.

Quit the PUA stuff and get your life in order. That will solve many problems. Right now you sound like an entitled man child. Not attractive to quality women.

tl/dr edition:

Every woman is a princess with a prince detector. She will take you for granted but only because she has special princess qualities (all the usual stuff a woman assumes is unique to herself and looks) and is entitled to a great life that a prince must give her. You need to apply to be a prince and check off on at least 90% of her 500-point criteria. If you want to be a daddy you need to prove that you can first be a sugar daddy.

 

[Aguirre]

Really though, you need to improve your lot in life, as every man should and continue this improvement for your own sake. This is key to maintaining frame because success and confidence will naturally be attractive to women and you won’t need to feel as though you are the one needing to meet any woman’s ridiculous demands. It may be good to know what those demands are, but you’ll know you are successful when quality women start trying to meet your expectations instead.

 

[BeExcellent]

tl/dr edition:

Every woman is a princess with a prince detector. She will take you for granted but only because she has special princess qualities (all the usual stuff a woman assumes is unique to herself and looks) and is entitled to a great life that a prince must give her. You need to apply to be a prince and check off on at least 90% of her 500-point criteria. If you want to be a daddy you need to prove that you can first be a sugar daddy.

Incorrect my dear, your bitterness and bias are showing.....

I do agree with your second post, but your first post was unnecessary.

If a woman is beautiful, fit, intelligent, educated, kind, fun and family oriented, she will have her choice of high status men. That's how it is. Since forever. Ever notice all the men around here lamenting that 'all the good women are taken.....?' Well. They certainly get locked down post haste. There is a reason for that.

Water seeks its own level.

And yes, there is importance to the ability to provide aspect of being a man, and it is NOT princess syndrome (honestly it is a man's job to screen out legit princess syndrome).....

The provider part becomes important for men who want children one day.

You see, being a father requires your woman to be pregnant, which can be 9 months of sickness and misery, which could require bedrest, and other very real health risks for your woman. Then we have childbirth itself, which can have serious complications up to and including death (yes, even in the modern medicine west), we have after birth an infant that requires 24/7 care & feeding (preferably breast feeding), and then the kid doesn't start school until age 5 or so.

Sure, you can ask your woman to get back to work ASAP, but in that case you get to pay for childcare, and neither dad or mom is bonding with or raising the baby/young child.

Kids are extremely expensive any way you slice it, and there is a reason a stay at home mother is seen as a status symbol among bougie circles.

It takes a PROVIDER to afford his children to be raised at home by mom.

That is why a man's ability to provide is a serious matter for quality women who are family oriented. It takes resources to be a single income household.

I know. I afforded my first husband the ability to be a full time parent for 12 years when my kids were young. I provided for a family of 5 with my business because my first husband's business blew up.

No "princess" is going to do that. In fact few women can. But I did. Easily. By leveraging my education and intelligence in a STEM career.

Was that my first choice? Hell no. Our plan had been that I would drop out of the workforce to raise babies and young kids for awhile, forgoing my 6 figure income. But that was not how life went. So I had to shoulder the financial load myself. So I understand exactly what the provider role is insofar as children & family is concerned.

I've done it.

Princess my ass (ROFLMAO)!

Every woman has a pair of boobs and a pvssy. Many women are pretty. Sex is a commodity for a desirable man. Smart women are only too aware of this. The value lies not in looks or anatomy, but in character and value systems. That is where "quality women" differentiate themselves.

 

[plumber]

Can you use your own definition? For now.

financial independent = consistently spend less than you earn.
-
to get a good character woman that is sexy just address her vices, similar to how you do it with anyone else.
-
Some women filter on money. Some do not.
-
Your requirement:
3. LTR above average to hot girls.

There is always a way... for example in this case perhaps leverage your passport, if that's helpful. nothing in your requirement prevents that option. there are other ways also. if that is really your only requirement, then there are a huge number of paths to get it done.

 

[Aguirre]

Incorrect my dear, your bitterness and bias are showing.....

I do agree with your second post, but your first post was unnecessary.

If a woman is beautiful, fit, intelligent, educated, kind, fun and family oriented, she will have her choice of high status men. That's how it is. Since forever. Ever notice all the men around here lamenting that 'all the good women are taken.....?' Well. They certainly get locked down post haste. There is a reason for that.

Water seeks its own level.

And yes, there is importance to the ability to provide aspect of being a man, and it is NOT princess syndrome (honestly it is a man's job to screen out legit princess syndrome).....

The provider part becomes important for men who want children one day.

You see, being a father requires your woman to be pregnant, which can be 9 months of sickness and misery, which could require bedrest, and other very real health risks for your woman. Then we have childbirth itself, which can have serious complications up to and including death (yes, even in the modern medicine west), we have after birth an infant that requires 24/7 care & feeding (preferably breast feeding), and then the kid doesn't start school until age 5 or so.

Sure, you can ask your woman to get back to work ASAP, but in that case you get to pay for childcare, and neither dad or mom is bonding with or raising the baby/young child.

Kids are extremely expensive any way you slice it, and there is a reason a stay at home mother is seen as a status symbol among bougie circles.

It takes a PROVIDER to afford his children to be raised at home by mom.

That is why a man's ability to provide is a serious matter for quality women who are family oriented. It takes resources to be a single income household.

I know. I afforded my first husband the ability to be a full time parent for 12 years when my kids were young. I provided for a family of 5 with my business because my first husband's business blew up.

No "princess" is going to do that. In fact few women can. But I did. Easily. By leveraging my education and intelligence in a STEM career.

Was that my first choice? Hell no. Our plan had been that I would drop out of the workforce to raise babies and young kids for awhile, forgoing my 6 figure income. But that was not how life went. So I had to shoulder the financial load myself. So I understand exactly what the provider role is insofar as children & family is concerned.

I've done it.

Princess my ass (ROFLMAO)!

Every woman has a pair of boobs and a pvssy. Many women are pretty. Sex is a commodity for a desirable man. Smart women are only too aware of this. The value lies not in looks or anatomy, but in character and value systems. That is where "quality women" differentiate themselves.

Ignore my sardonic wrath. I mostly agree, but women are naturally hypergamous.

I’ll simplify my message. Gentleman, you can only pick two:

 

[Aurora Demon]

Ignore my sardonic wrath. I mostly agree, but women are naturally hypergamous.

I’ll simplify my message. Gentleman, you can only pick two:

View attachment 15091

That’s a good one.

 

[BeExcellent]

Ignore my sardonic wrath. I mostly agree, but women are naturally hypergamous.

I’ll simplify my message. Gentleman, you can only pick two:

View attachment 15091

You are a funny one my dear. Nah. I'll take all 3.

Facts.

But true enough because the reason the diagram resonates? Precisely because the ones exhibiting all 3 get locked down.

Refer to my first post in this thread.

Yours Truly, Exhibit A.

 

[Aguirre]

You are a funny one my dear. Nah. I'll take all 3.

Facts.

But true enough because the reason the diagram resonates? Precisely because the ones exhibiting all 3 get locked down.

Refer to my first post in this thread.

Yours Truly, Exhibit A.

Ladies and gentlemen, unicorns do exist!

 

[BeExcellent]

Ladies and gentlemen, unicorns do exist!

If you use your search function you can read the thread How to Spot a Unicorn. Its an old thread but a good discussion, you might find some insights there

 

[The Duke]

But true enough because the reason the diagram resonates? Precisely because the ones exhibiting all 3 get locked down.

I would say there is some truth there.

The females that exhibit all 3 qualities are extremely rare. I would bet its very rare to find men that have all 3 qualities?

 

[BeExcellent]

I would say there is some truth there.

The females that exhibit all 3 qualities are extremely rare. I would bet its very rare to find men that have all 3 qualities?

In my experience there are men who meet all three, but there are other factors as well that the diagram does not note....ambition/success is an obvious one, and to obtain success an ambitious man needs to have emotional stability in his tool box, hot heads that lose their temper (for example) will shoot themselves in the foot.....

So because men and women are complimentary rather than same I'd say the parameters might be a bit different for men.....

Because men, as a general rule, tend to be more on the rational side than the emotional side, the emotional stability thing is less important in my view, but emotional maturity? Ah. That is worth having to a woman.

And it often takes some life experience to grow into a state of emotional maturity as a man.

So if we change "Emotional Stability" to "Emotional Maturity" I think its a true enough thing. (Rareness of all three in the same man).... but that improves as men gain life experience and calibration. You cannot lead effectively without emotional maturity and as we know, the best relationships are when the man is leading.

 

[MatureDJ]

It's OVER for NotFinanciallyIndependentCels.