Michael Sartain: Approaching Strangers is Dead

[BaronOfHair]

"@Solomon had made the point that this new generational wave of women is more likely to view a guy who approaches them as creepy, and/or leaving the man open for public ostracization"

One hears this around The Manosphere quite a bit, the same way it's not uncommon to read "The fundamentals of gaining and maintaining power have changed radically" in the business rags and in the Harvard Business Review. While it's entirely possible that both are true, it's more than likely what J. Pfeffer says about power

are just as applicable to dating and mating...

Some details change, in each era, but the basics remain constant. Red blooded heterosexual women never stop craving a man desiring them

 

[Vanderdonck]

If your frame is solid you can do a lot of things.

Not saying to disregard his advice but take it with a grain of salt. "Because Michael Sartain said so" is simply working in his frame and not yours.

What's worked for me isn't so much targeted public approaches as striking up conversations like a normal person. Not every interaction results in a lay nor should it so I just have fun. Social circle is also a plus. Being charismatic and opportunistic with zero fukks given is my secret sauce.

 

[CoolWave1331]

I totally agree with this, as as guy who did 3,000 approaches from 2008-2012, and also has done social circle game since College, as well as day and online game throughout the years. Social circle in my experience, is a far better way to meet women overall. It's not easy for most but the rewards are worth it not just with meeting women but also networking (I've found and got jobs that I never would have found due to this), access to exclusive parties, traveling, meeting millionaires etc.

Meeting women through friends is the safest way. There is a greater chance you will get somewhere because the woman's shield is down. If a woman introduces you to her friends or let's say you are invited to party she throws - you can freely talk to the women there because the assumption is you must be decent guy and not a creeper or weirdo.

Have to place yourself in th woman's shoes - when they get approached by some random man they don't know anything about this guy. They don't know what he's capable of - there is no way to know for sure if he is decent guy or dangerous. Most of the time they'd simply rather not deal with it because they probably have had bad experiences dealing with goofies (dumb guys who can't take hint or even worse one's who become belligerent). I grew up with two sisters - my Mother is Ukranian and they both take after her. They are both barbie types, tall, dirty blonde hair, blue eyes; I saw them get bothered ALL THE TIME and a lot of times was so embarrassing what guys do/say.

Approaching is good in order to develop confidence (if yo don't let the rejections break you) and help overcome shyness but is not super power. Cold approaching her is not going to make a difference if you are not attractive in her eyes. This is what guys need to understand. They only appreciate a guy approaching them if the guy is their type - if he is their type they will usually throw out invitation (eye contact games etc).

In perfect world yes you could run up to every attractive woman you see and she would welcme you open arms but does not work this way. You avoid a lot of head ache if actually focus on the women that actually give you a chance instead of the one's that don't want you to bother them ----> this is a waste of time. I know, someone say "but only unattractive seem to like me. they are fat girls"- sounds like personal problem. If a man only attracts "unattractive" women it means there's something wrong with his presence/look - maybe is one of these guys with belly that sticks out further than chest, wears gym shorts with like budweiser tshirt in public.

 

[Rainman4707]

In regards to creating an amazing insta profile, my personality won't allow me to do that. I would rather not participate if that is the requirements. I'm not one to show off and i'm a private person. I see it as superficial, which is'nt important to me.
Same as if I see a womans profile with superficial pics in, i swipe left.

 

[SW15]

In regards to creating an amazing insta profile, my personality won't allow me to do that. I would rather not participate if that is the requirements. I'm not one to show off and i'm a private person. I see it as superficial, which is'nt important to me.

Those 'in the know' use Instagram as a dating platform instead of the actual swipe apps.

Instagram is a difficult platform for success. I think in-person activity is better than Instagram activity.

 

[Thebestthereeveris]

A

"@Solomon had made the point that this new generational wave of women is more likely to view a guy who approaches them as creepy, and/or leaving the man open for public ostracization"

One hears this around The Manosphere quite a bit, the same way it's not uncommon to read "The fundamentals of gaining and maintaining power have changed radically" in the business rags and in the Harvard Business Review. While it's entirely possible that both are true, it's more than likely what J. Pfeffer says about power

are just as applicable to dating and mating...

Some details change, in each era, but the basics remain constant. Red blooded heterosexual women never stop craving a man desiring them

lot of yall really dismiss how dominant and big your presence is and how powerful it can be if your a competent confident person. Women love that and respond most to dominance. Dudes who cconstantly get rejected from cold approach even if they are good looking will blame it on women instead of himself.

 

[The Duke]

If your frame is solid you can do a lot of things.

Not saying to disregard his advice but take it with a grain of salt. "Because Michael Sartain said so" is simply working in his frame and not yours.

What's worked for me isn't so much targeted public approaches as striking up conversations like a normal person. Not every interaction results in a lay nor should it so I just have fun. Social circle is also a plus. Being charismatic and opportunistic with zero fukks given is my secret sauce.

This is how I operate. I enjoy myself and am happy with the results.

 

[SW15]

Meeting women through friends is the safest way. There is a greater chance you will get somewhere because the woman's shield is down.

Yes, I agree.

This forum doesn't talk about the shield enough. When women go out to bars, they are often in the market for new penis. This is good. However, they have a defense shield up and do make it more difficult for any male stranger offering his new penis to get to know them.

In non-bar settings, a shield is down but fewer women in non-bar settings are seeking new penis at any given moment.

If a woman introduces you to her friends or let's say you are invited to party she throws - you can freely talk to the women there because the assumption is you must be decent guy and not a creeper or weirdo.

True

Approaching is good in order to develop confidence (if yo don't let the rejections break you) and help overcome shyness but is not super power. Cold approaching her is not going to make a difference if you are not attractive in her eyes. This is what guys need to understand. They only appreciate a guy approaching them if the guy is their type - if he is their type they will usually throw out invitation (eye contact games etc).

There is more than attractiveness. Receptiveness is crucial. A lot of women aren't seeking new penis at a given moment.

I think a lot of my conversations fizzle out because of this. Additionally, I don't even make some approaches because some women give absolutely no body language signals. Many of the women not signaling to me are likely not seeking new penis at all.

I've had plenty of instances in grocery stores, malls, and outdoors where I made strong eye contact and smiled. I got zero response. I didn't approach.

 

[FlexpertHamilton]

How do you propose to do daygame incidentally?

Daygame is a tough endeavor, because the majority of women between ages 18-49 aren't seeking new penis at the moment they are approached in a non-bar setting. That is a major disincentive for doing daygame.

It's inefficient and high effort. It does take a lot of approaches to get something out of it.

For me approaching isn't about getting laid since idgaf about that anymore, an approach is just another lead/# in your funnel.

By incidental I mean doing it in places you already have to or want to go to like the grocery store or park or beach or whatever.

 

[optinimus]

Like others mentioned, he is just marketing his business. Of course he says cold approach is dead, so he can present his solution. Most likely social circle game is great if executed right, but you still gotta be a cool confident man at the end of the day. If you're some awkward nerd trying social circle game, that will do no good, IMO. Need that baseline of confidence & charisma.

 

[BaronOfHair]

I enjoy myself and am happy with the results.

You're similar to Anders Brevik, in that sense

 

[SW15]

By incidental I mean doing it in places you already have to or want to go to like the grocery store or park or beach or whatever.

It's possible to fit approaching into going to the grocery store. When I was doing grocery store approaching most hardcore, I found that I was lingering in grocery stores longer than if I were solely shopping.

For me approaching isn't about getting laid since idgaf about that anymore, an approach is just another lead/# in your funnel.

Approaching for me is about eventually getting laid.

 

[Thebestthereeveris]

Like others mentioned, he is just marketing his business. Of course he says cold approach is dead, so he can present his solution. Most likely social circle game is great if executed right, but you still gotta be a cool confident man at the end of the day. If you're some awkward nerd trying social circle game, that will do no good, IMO. Need that baseline of confidence & charisma.

I've met dudes who signed up for his program. Squares. They literally get models to take photos with them then don't talk to them again

 

[SW15]

I've met dudes who signed up for his program. Squares. They literally get models to take photos with them then don't talk to them again

This is good insight on Sartain's MOA program.

 

[MatureDJ]

These ideas are based on psychological determinism, which doesn't hold up in the real world. Anyone with first hand experience will tell you that every person is different, and have different requirements.

Classic example of "don't listen to the experts"




So I'm 41 years old. I'm practically only attracted to girls between 18 and 25. If cold approaching is out, then what would you do?

I'm almost 50% older, and this is my problem as well.

 

[MatureDJ]

I've met dudes who signed up for his program. Squares. They literally get models to take photos with them then don't talk to them again

Incel TV had a video about EthnicCels going to a seminar to learn how to talk to hot women (starts at about 2:00).

Incel TV Archive : IncelTV : Free Download, Borrow, and Streaming : Internet Archive

A collection of videos from the Incel TV YouTube channel, all of which have been purged.

archive.org

 

[MatureDJ]

If I were a single man in his 40s (I’m not) I’d initiate conversation with women giving me IOIs. I’d also use the gym, dating apps, work, and events of interest.

This is the best way to become a single man in his 50s.

 

[MatureDJ]

Hence this sh-t should be nailed down early, before 25 preferably, and if a man hasn’t nailed down a social circle by this age, good luck! Then it’s up to just finally meeting individual, unattached women. I’ve said it before, status mongering young women are OWNED by their cliques and seldom stray for anyone not in them, not even for good looking outsiders. Sometimes they just “date” around with all male insiders. Hence in the video one said she “dated his friend”. They’ll gladly date “his friend” than someone not yet known.

It's OVER for NoSocialCircleBeforeAge25Cels. The only time I was in a situation when gals would date friends was when I was 14, and the chicks were 12.

 

[pipeman84]

You claimed that your social circle garnered more quality women, as if there's something intrisically about social circles that spawns quality women.

If you approached those same women at a grocery store, would her quality be of any less?

So, if you meet her at the grocery store, she is of less quality than if she was in your social circle...meanwhile, it's the same fuking woman!!



Man, some of the stuff you guys say defies logic.

Let's take a 22yrs old quality girl. Cold approaching her at the grocery store as a 40yrs old man would lead to nowhere, as she'd either ignore you or give short, polite answers and would get away from you asap. That's because one of the traits of a quality girl is she doesn't talk to strangers, particularly men almost double her age trying to run game on her.

Now take the same 22yrs old girl meeting a 40yrs old man trough social circle. He's not a weirdo stranger hitting on her at the grocery store. He's Mr. XYZ, whose status has already been vetted by the social circle. Night and day situation.

 

[BaronOfHair]

That's because one of the traits of a quality girl is she doesn't talk to strangers, particularly men almost double her age trying to run game on her.

It wasn't that way, pre-Springfield