Any woman over the age of 25 needs to give you a good reason on why she is still single

[Doctor Europeo]

That should be the first question answered if you plan on taking any woman seriously. If she fails then put her in the ONS, FB category and let it rot it out. Fair or extreme?

Fair

 

[Divorced w 3]

Women think this way too. I was dating a coworker who was in her early twenties and I was a decade older. We had just started dating. She asked me ‘what is wrong with you that you’re not married?’ I got angry and shut her down. She called me up later in tears and apologized.
She wound up being my longest LTR and we almost got hitched. We’re still friends today.

Exactly because it’s a question women ask, not men. Anyone asking this question should go ask what’s really on their mind, ‘how many guys have you slept with?’

Not to mention it’s incongruent: A later in life bachelor has basically two ways to come off; a confident, nonchalant man who is going his own way and welcoming life for the ride… or, someone willing to ask a conflict creating question, willing to put someone unnecessarily on the defensive, ie a personality issue ridden, multiple times passed over, not good enough for someone else so why good for me type guy… anyone asking this question is running the second option and immediately going to set off a subconscious or worse, conscious set of crimson red flags

any man that asks this question is going to get eaten alive for lunch by whoever he asks it to

 

[BackInTheGame78]

No offense but I see far more women with their sh!t together at age 25 than I do men these days. Probably 2-3x as many if I am being honest.

Perhaps they should be the ones making the demands if it's coming from a "what are you bringing to the table" discussion.

 

[Clockwerk50]

A divorced man carries baggage, has broken the marriage vows, has demonstrated poor judgement in picking his wife.
How the heck is this increasing his SMV in the eyes of any sane woman who doesn't have a truckload of baggage herself?

I'm simply speaking about divorced men here, removing the woman variable from this analysis.

Why would a woman choose to invest time in a man who is indecisive, has commitment issues, or lacks clarity about what he wants?

Older, never-married men often have a pattern of short-lived, unstable relationships and seem perpetually dissatisfied. Either they’re unwilling to commit, or others aren’t willing to commit to them.

 

[BaronOfHair]

That should be the first question answered if you plan on taking any woman seriously. If she fails then put her in the ONS, FB category and let it rot it out. Fair or extreme?

After hearing one chick recount spending the past decade naked and chained up in the DIY dungeon of a dishonorably discharged Marine, who enjoyed The Story Of O a little TOO much, I chose to refrain from asking this question

Some may find dwelling in such memories an aphrodisiac though. To each their own

 

[CheekyMonkey101]

No offense but I see far more women with their sh!t together at age 25 than I do men these days. Probably 2-3x as many if I am being honest.

Perhaps they should be the ones making the demands if it's coming from a "what are you bringing to the table" discussion.

Why do you think this is?

 

[Mike32ct]

A divorced man carries baggage, has broken the marriage vows, has demonstrated poor judgement in picking his wife.
How the heck is this increasing his SMV in the eyes of any sane woman who doesn't have a truckload of baggage herself?

I was just making an observation. Having had quite a few female friends, I’ve personally known women north of 35 (and mostly 40s) gravitate towards divorced guys more so than unmarried guys.

I wasn’t making a judgement on who they should or should not date.

 

[SW15]

It does appear that, all else being equal (height, hair and $), for over 40 guys, the divorced guy has an SMV edge over the single never married guy.

The divorced man may have an advantage, since he has already committed once, there is a likelihood he will commit again. In contrast, the single, never-married man may be less likely to commit, or even if he did want to, the women he dated might not have been interested in his commitment. Some of these men are often referred to as “serial daters.”

Women are more likely to play the odds, favoring men who have already demonstrated the capacity for long-term commitment.

A divorced man carries baggage, has broken the marriage vows, has demonstrated poor judgement in picking his wife.
How the heck is this increasing his SMV in the eyes of any sane woman who doesn't have a truckload of baggage herself?

It's worth examining these quotes from the perspective of 35-47 year old females evaluating 35-47 year old males.

@pipeman84 's comment is accurate and logical. However, women 35-47 in the USA (and most Westernized countries) don't think that way.

Most females 35-47 years old who are on the market have a decent amount of baggage. Even a 35-40 year old Millennial woman who has never married and is childless often has a decent amount of baggage from riding the penis carousel and putting up notches or having multiple failed longer term relationships (typically 1-5 years) over a 20 year period.

Most women and most men 35-47 years old are looking for monogamous, pair bonded type LTRs.

Women in that age range tend to think that divorced men are better bets because they have shown the capacity to commit. Divorced men can sometimes lose points in the eyes of some childless women due to a messy co-parenting situation (most co-parenting situations are some degree of unpleasant). Many childless women want to avoid that if they can.

With 35-47 year olds, a very common pairing is a divorced, single dad and a divorced, single mom. Since I have never been a divorced, single dad and have few interactions with divorced, single moms (I try to avoid those women), I can't speak from direct experience about this pairing.

Why would a woman choose to invest time in a man who is indecisive, has commitment issues, or lacks clarity about what he wants?

Older, never-married men often have a pattern of short-lived, unstable relationships and seem perpetually dissatisfied. Either they’re unwilling to commit, or others aren’t willing to commit to them.

This is true because of female desire to pair bond in her 30s-40s. This must be considered as women are the gatekeepers to sex.

I am an early 40s never married and childless man. I think some women would judge me negatively for that. I haven't felt too much negative feedback from being late 30s/early 40s, never married, and childless. Most of my interactions in recent years have been with 30 something Millennial women who are also never married and childless. I have perceived that these women consider my status as never married and childless an asset.

I have had short-lived, and unstable relationships. I have been unwilling to commit in certain circumstances and there have been other times where women were unwilling to commit to me.

I could have gotten married by now. I perceive that if I had gotten married prior to this point in life, I would be divorced by now. The combination of divorce statistics, personal history in interactions, and family history are the reasons that I arrived at the conclusion that I would be divorced.

 

[Divorced w 3]

A divorced man carries baggage, has broken the marriage vows, has demonstrated poor judgement in picking his wife.
How the heck is this increasing his SMV in the eyes of any sane woman who doesn't have a truckload of baggage herself?

It's ironic that a 40 year old, never married man, thinks he has more SMV than a divorced single father

 

[pipeman84]

Having had quite a few female friends, I’ve personally known women north of 35 (and mostly 40s) gravitate towards divorced guys more so than unmarried guys.

That's exactly my point ... by definition, those women are full of baggage and therefore will gravitate towards guys with baggage. They're invisible for any sane man looking for a serious relationship and commitment.

I'm simply speaking about divorced men here, removing the woman variable from this analysis.

Why would a woman choose to invest time in a man who is indecisive, has commitment issues, or lacks clarity about what he wants?

Older, never-married men often have a pattern of short-lived, unstable relationships and seem perpetually dissatisfied. Either they’re unwilling to commit, or others aren’t willing to commit to them.

And how's a few short lived relationships PLUS a divorce increase his SMV? It's not like all divorced guys have zero relationship history - they married their high-school girlfriend and divorced when they reached 40.

In my view a 40yrs old never married guy who has his shyt together mentally, emotionally and LMS wise is the equivalent of the 20yrs old virgin woman. Something rare and precious.

 

[BackInTheGame78]

Why do you think this is?

Because men are increasingly immature until after age 30, if they mature at all...

Too many Peter Pans living in Neverland where they don't want to ever grow up

 

[CheekyMonkey101]

Because men are increasingly immature until after age 30, if they mature at all...

Too many Peter Pans living in Neverland where they don't want to ever grow up

Why do you think it's men and it's not really seen in women?

 

[BackInTheGame78]

Why do you think it's men and it's not really seen in women?

Because women mature earlier then men, and now more than ever increasingly earlier.

 

[nismo-4]

Most women can find sex and even committed boyfriends easily.

If an overweight woman in her 40s has no issues finding boyfriends, then imagine what it must be like for a fit, 30 year old woman to find sex or a boyfriend.

Does that overweight woman in her 40s have children?

Women have their dating lives on easy mode. Children and extra pounds notwithstanding.

Women are the gatekeepers of sex. Men are the gatekeepers of commitment, supposedly.

Women can get sex easily at any age. It won't guarantee commitment. Most men couldn't get a commitment for a relationship within a month of trying. Sometimes I think women are the gatekeepers of commitment. Hell, I dated a realtor who was 62. She had some good box and was attractive. I snooped in her phone and saw guys offering to take her to Nobu and Fogo De Chão. She flaked on a date with me and ghosted me till she got married to some Atlanta Falcons player, even had the nerve to send me the video of her kissing the guy in Hawaii for the wedding and said she hoped we could still be friends.

For a man's power to have some impact, he has to be high value. Or be the woman's type sexually. If you were the guy that would've fixed her CVT on her Nissan for free and you ghost/ hit her with an invoice, she'll be mad she can't use you. A guy seen only south of romance who refuses that position doesn't make that guy alpha, it shows the guy refuses to be beta. It won't raise his dating experiences however.

 

[nismo-4]

I have no studies to back this up. Just an observation and gut feeling.

It does appear that, all else being equal (height, hair and $), for over 40 guys, the divorced guy has an SMV edge over the single never married guy.

Give a never married guy 5 million dollars, a Bentley, a poppin blue-checked IG with 100k followers, and a mansion in the suburbs. He'll be sleeping with a NE Patriots cheerleader that night.

 

[Clockwerk50]

That's exactly my point ... by definition, those women are full of baggage and therefore will gravitate towards guys with baggage. They're invisible for any sane man looking for a serious relationship and commitment.

And how's a few short lived relationships PLUS a divorce increase his SMV? It's not like all divorced guys have zero relationship history - they married their high-school girlfriend and divorced when they reached 40.

In my view a 40yrs old never married guy who has his shyt together mentally, emotionally and LMS wise is the equivalent of the 20yrs old virgin woman. Something rare and precious.

I think your biggest misconception is assuming a man’s SMV automatically rises with age, without recognizing that both men’s and women’s SMV tend to decline over time, and the dating pool decreases in quality and quantity on both sides.

If you’re in your 40s and solid emotionally, mentally, and LMS-wise, relationship status is irrelevant, in theory. However, value isn’t what you say about yourself; it’s how others respond to you. You’re only as desirable as the desire you create.

If an unmarried man hasn’t been locked down because women aren’t trying to, or he isn’t trying to be, that reflects his true market value, not just his opinion.

Plenty of unmarried men in their 40s call themselves “high value,” yet remain single, blaming women or the market because they’re not being chosen. That’s low demand.

 

[BeExcellent]

I have some skin in the game on this one, lol as an over 25 woman who married a never married/no kids man in his 40s.

Random thoughts:

1. Divorced dads are cool because they understand the frame of reference about being married (and the level of committment that entails) as well as parenting (and the level of responsibility that requires). So that is a pro for divorced dads. Never married childless men do not "get it." although they will get up the learning curve on the marriage commitment level if they do marry. Parenting not so much.

BUT

With never married childless men you aren't dealing with ex-wife drama or with drama from the guy's children either. Many parents fail to properly manage themselves, the co-parent (ex) and the kids. So that's a pro for never married childless men.

2. Another pro for the divorced dad is that here is someone who has typically learned a level of selflessness in being previously married & having children.

Never married childless people of either gender become more set in their ways and are more inherently selfish (at least self focused) than previously married people. It is harder for them to accept that marriage (with or without kids) ain't all about you. Marriage is an exercise in accomodation and compromise. It isn't a 'my way or the highway' deal.

I do think in today's world plenty of GenZ women may not have robust dating lives, especially if they are more focused on advanced degrees or higher education. I know women myself personally (collegues, direct reports) who are more introverted, were not in Party U sororities etc. who are more bookish and don't go much to bars. There are plenty of women like this in the woodwork. Not every girl is a carosel riding party girl. That filter/assumption is silly & often does not fit more studious/serious/introverted type women.

 

[The Duke]

That should be the first question answered if you plan on taking any woman seriously. If she fails then put her in the ONS, FB category and let it rot it out. Fair or extreme?

And what's your response when she asks you the same question?

That should be the first question answered if you plan on taking any woman seriously. If she fails then put her in the ONS, FB category and let it rot it out. Fair or extreme?

I think this is extreme. Perhaps it would have been an acceptable expectation pre-1950.

I don't ask pointed questions like this that cause people to get defensive when I'm trying to get them to tell me who they are and how they got to where they are.


According to the United States Census Bureau, in 2024, the median age for a first marriage was 30.2 for men and 28.6 for women—a slight increase from 28.4 for women (and no change for men) from the previous year. Since 1950, these numbers have consistently trended upward; 75 years ago, men were married at 22.8 and women at 20.3. For decades, cultural shifts have driven these changes, as societal views around the institution of marriage has evolved.

What Is the Average Age of Marriage in the U.S. in 2025?

Over the past few decades, the average age of marriage in the U.S. has gradually trended upward. Here, a psychotherapist breaks down all of the factors that are contributing to this upswing. Get all of the details here.

www.brides.com

.

 

[Solomon]

Men under 35 in 2025 aren't the ***** beggars like boomers, x'ers and older millennials are. Yes there are but lots of these dudes will not settle and marry these modern women.

I think this is the first generation of men (genz and 1990s millennials) who are standing up in droves to the onslaught of horrible women by simply letting them have their cake and eat it to. Its the first kids that hit puberty with high speed pron.

I totally agree with this I have posted numerous studies and links in the past that show various reasons as to why Gen-Z men aren't dating their counterparts
Also Gen-Z men are the most conservative generation in nearly a 100 years


Also I can't blame Gen-Z men have you ever dealt with a Gen-Z woman? most of them are parrots for liberal gender identity politics slop and a lot of them don't look as good as women from previous generations. Plus ,the lack of femininity. Obviously I'm generalizing

 

[BeExcellent]

I totally agree with this I have posted numerous studies and links in the past that show various reasons as to why Gen-Z men aren't dating their counterparts
Also Gen-Z men are the most conservative generation in nearly a 100 years


Also I can't blame Gen-Z men have you ever dealt with a Gen-Z woman? most of them are parrots for liberal gender identity politics slop and a lot of them don't look as good as women from previous generations. Plus ,the lack of femininity. Obviously I'm generalizing

My son agrees with you at almost age 23. His wife is 21. He has been telling me for awhile how conservative he & his friends are.

Even my 20 year old daughter (who does tend to spout liberal goobledegook) is very sexually conservative. One 4 year LTR, body count of 1. Not boy crazy but has friends of both genders. Very family oriented but artsy.