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WWE Crown Jewel

zekko

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WWE has been putting on wrestling shows in Saudi Arabia for the past few years (reportedly for a ridiculously large amount of money).
Last night, they had two women wrestling on their show for the first time (Natalya and Lacey Evans). This is notable since Saudi Arabia (like many Middle Eastern countries) are known for being oppressive toward women. Women are not allowed to be in public without a male accompanying them, that sort of thing.

The wrestlers were dressed with long sleeves and long pants, with a t-shirt covering. Kind of an odd look, compared to their normal attires. The crowd was surprisingly supportive of them, and gave them some of the biggest cheers of the night. It was something of an emotional moment, since it was such a groundbreaking thing for them. You could see the young girls in the crowd looked very happy, they knew what was going on. I'm not sure what the problem was previously, if women aren't allowed to perform, or to work, or to what exactly.

Anyway, I'm happy for them, I think women should absolutely be allowed to chase their dreams and aspirations. But I wonder if there's any safe way to let the genie out of the bottle. I wonder if these Muslims realize that if they flash forward 50 years, their girls are going to be skiing down cawk mountain and collecting likes on social media?
 

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samspade

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I've often found it funny how men on Sosuave simultaneously shyt on Islamic countries but promote patriarchal society in the west. By most men's standards here, men in Saudi Arabia would be considered "alpha." Guys want to turn the clock back 100 years. Guess where the clock's still stuck on 1900? I'm not saying it's wrong, I just don't get the dissonance.
 

zekko

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I've often found it funny how men on Sosuave simultaneously shyt on Islamic countries but promote patriarchal society in the west. By most men's standards here, men in Saudi Arabia would be considered "alpha." Guys want to turn the clock back 100 years. Guess where the clock's still stuck on 1900? I'm not saying it's wrong, I just don't get the dissonance.
A friend and I used to watch Star Trek after school. There was one line that used to always make us laugh. It was the episode called The Changeling, where a space probe called Nomad thought Kirk was its creator. At one point he absorbs and wipes out Uhura's memory, leaving her like a vegetable. Nomad says she was "a mass of conflicting impulses". Sounds pretty sexist by today's standards. Nomad describes Uhura at 3:12 on this clip:


Apparently women aren't the only ones with conflicting impusles, I guess our crew here has some contradictory notions.
The problem with the female gender role is not a simple one. Obviously as men we don't want to oppress them, and it's not fair to impede their growth. But it looks like once you start giving them a little power (like the right to vote), the inevitable path leads to where we are today where the gender roles are out of control. Not sure what the solution is.
 

samspade

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A friend and I used to watch Star Trek after school. There was one line that used to always make us laugh. It was the episode called The Changeling, where a space probe called Nomad thought Kirk was its creator. At one point he absorbs and wipes out Uhura's memory, leaving her like a vegetable. Nomad says she was "a mass of conflicting impulses". Sounds pretty sexist by today's standards. Nomad describes Uhura at 3:12 on this clip:


Apparently women aren't the only ones with conflicting impusles, I guess our crew here has some contradictory notions.
The problem with the female gender role is not a simple one. Obviously as men we don't want to oppress them, and it's not fair to impede their growth. But it looks like once you start giving them a little power (like the right to vote), the inevitable path leads to where we are today where the gender roles are out of control. Not sure what the solution is.
That clip is hilarious. I wonder where Nomad is today. In some prop room in a Hollywood studio lot? Or in Kevin Smith's man cave?
 

ShePays

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I've often found it funny how men on Sosuave simultaneously shyt on Islamic countries but promote patriarchal society in the west. By most men's standards here, men in Saudi Arabia would be considered "alpha." Guys want to turn the clock back 100 years. Guess where the clock's still stuck on 1900? I'm not saying it's wrong, I just don't get the dissonance.
If you can't see the difference between 2019 Islam and 1919 Western Civilization, you might be the one experiencing cognitive dissonance.
 
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Who Dares Win

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Giving power to those who can make a good use to it rather than giving power to anyone its not "oppression".

I dont believe that not giving voting rights to people living on welfare (other people money) is oppressing them in any way as much as not allowing an outsider to a privatly owned club is discrimination.

Voting rights should be based on merit and skills not age or gender.

Someone that didnt even work a single day in his life or has a criminal record will hardly vote anything different than those who will allow him to keep doing it.
 

samspade

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If you can't see the difference between 2019 Islam and 1919 Western Civilization, you might be the one experiencing cognitive dissonance.
Good point. I didn't mean that they were 100% consistent. But Islamic societies definitely keep their women in check, which is what a lot of guys on Sosuave want or claim is important. There's no feminism in these countries, let alone the radical kind we see in the west. They cook, clean, raise kids, and don't dress provocatively. I don't know in which countries they can vote or not, but that's another big deal with guys here. And in SA they only recently earned the right to drive cars.

I wonder what most men here would choose...2019 America or 2019 Saudi Arabia. Total hypothetical and false dichotomy of course.
 

samspade

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Giving power to those who can make a good use to it rather than giving power to anyone its not "oppression".

I dont believe that not giving voting rights to people living on welfare (other people money) is oppressing them in any way as much as not allowing an outsider to a privatly owned club is discrimination.

Voting rights should be based on merit and skills not age or gender.

Someone that didnt even work a single day in his life or has a criminal record will hardly vote anything different than those who will allow him to keep doing it.
Voting doesn't change anything, so it's not real power...you're not taking away anything with that.
 

ShePays

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Good point. I didn't mean that they were 100% consistent. But Islamic societies definitely keep their women in check, which is what a lot of guys on Sosuave want or claim is important. There's no feminism in these countries, let alone the radical kind we see in the west. They cook, clean, raise kids, and don't dress provocatively. I don't know in which countries they can vote or not, but that's another big deal with guys here. And in SA they only recently earned the right to drive cars.

I wonder what most men here would choose...2019 America or 2019 Saudi Arabia. Total hypothetical and false dichotomy of course.
Can't speak for anyone else, but neither.

Islam isn't going to improve with feminism. Pakistan has already had a female prime minister, and I doubt any but a few morons would wish for a US Congress packed with 435 ilhan Omars. England has had 8 ruling queens who've ruled for about 200 years combined, with the current one occupying the throne for 66 years, to date, and it's a complete cucking mess, no better off than its American cousin. (the current queen has given away the country, and is blocking attempts of her subjects to take it back)

I love women for what they are, and hate them being made into what they were never meant to be. Might as well put a 10 year old boy on the throne. It's no less a farce.
 
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samspade

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Can't speak for anyone else, but neither.

Islam isn't going to improve with feminism. Pakistan has already had a female prime minister, and I doubt any but a few morons would wish for a US Congress packed with 435 ilhan Omars. England has had 8 ruling queens who've ruled for about 200 years combined, with the current one occupying the throne for 66 years, to date, and it's a complete cucking mess, no better off than its American cousin. (the current queen has given away the country, and is blocking attempts of her subjects to take it back)

I love women for what they are, and hate them being made into what they were never meant to be. Might as well put a 10 year old boy on the throne. It's no less a farce.
I forgot about Benazhir Bhutto. Women have ruled nations since time immemorial; it's not a recent thing. I guess people are always seeking charisma in whatever form.

But I wasn't trying to say that feminism will improve Islam though. Kind of the contrary, that Islamic countries are bastions of non-feminism, which is what a lot of Sosuavers tend to pine for.
 
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ShePays

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I forgot about Benazhir Bhutto. Women have ruled nations since time immemorial; it's not a recent thing. I guess people are always seeking charisma in whatever form.

But I wasn't trying to say that feminism will improve Islam though. Kind of the contrary, that Islamic countries are bastions of non-feminism, which is what a lot of Sosuavers tend to pine for.
Have you heard of families where the parents were so screwed up that one of the children had to step up and run things? Alexander Hamilton was basically running a sugar cane plantation when he was 11. Admiral Nelson commanded a ship when he was 12. And, a teenage French girl led a rebellion against foreign rule. History is rich with these stories, but it doesn't mean we should make every 12 year old a ship's captain, nor every teenage girl the figurehead of a revolution. These stories are noteworthy because they're exceptional, not because they're commonplace or should be.

Exceptional people in exceptional circumstances are capable of exceptional accomplishments. A grandmother can lift a car off of a trapped grandchild, but we shouldn't expect a 70 year old grandmother to dominate the world's strongest man competition, any time soon.

Sexually integrating the military, unisex locker rooms in schools, trannies in the Olympics, etc. are all just evidence that society has passed its expiration date.

Personally, I'd restrict voting rights to citizens over 30 with an IQ over 100, without criminal records, and without a history of dependence on social welfare systems, but i guess that makes me a bigot...like I give a sh!t. Women? Yeah, i don't think they should vote unless they're married(to a man).
 

zekko

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Will always love the wrestling though. Nothing else quite like it.
Hey, Kenny Omega. Have you tried watching AEW? Omega's there with the rest of the Elite, Jericho, Dean Ambrose under the name Jon Moxley, plus others. They're trying to put together a viable alternative to WWE, I hope they succeed. Just two hours a week, compared with seven for WWE if you add in NXT.

As for the brand split, I like the brand split because it gives more guys a chance to be pushed. Unfortunately, the shows are horrible. But I like the concept. Originally I liked it because the two shows had the lineage of the WWE championship and the WCW championship (the big gold belt, which dated back to the NWA before that), but they've since replaced the latter.
 
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